[15:23]  * SpamapS drops pin, hears it bounce 3 times
[15:40]  * penguin42 picks up the pin and sticks it in SpamapS thumb
[16:50] <vrum> a somewhat paranoid question: do maintainers for packages in main/universe have access to upload binaries compiled by themselves?
[16:51] <vrum> or do ubuntu/canonical utilize some kind of a buildfarm (with strict access control) that compiles all packages found in these repos?
[16:51] <Nafallo> the latter
[16:51] <vrum> cool
[16:52] <penguin42> although they can stuff binaries into the packages in some cases - e.g. ia32-libs is done like that
[16:53] <Nafallo> well, that's still a sourcecode upload though :-)
[16:57] <Ampelbein> Hmm, I have a weird deja-vu feeling right now. vrum, did you ask that question before?
[16:57] <vrum> Ampelbein: yep, in debian-devel, i'm contemplating debian vs ubuntu
[16:57] <Ampelbein> vrum: Ah, ok. So I'm not crazy after all. ;-)
[16:58] <Nafallo> Ampelbein: ... or at least not as obviously ;-)
[16:58] <vrum> was always a debian user, but knowing of ubuntus usage of the hardening wrappers + this makes ubuntu sound promising
[16:59] <Ampelbein> vrum: debian has adopted hardening flags as a release goal, http://wiki.debian.org/ReleaseGoals/SecurityHardeningBuildFlags
[17:01] <vrum> yea i've been reading about that; sounds hopeful
[21:21] <nullie> Hello. Does indicator development belong to app-devel channel?
[21:34] <trinikrono> nullie: ask maybe in motu since no one seems to be in
[23:47] <vrum> are the md5/sha*-fields in Packages optional?
[23:48] <vrum> referense: http://dangertux.wordpress.com/2011/11/29/trusted-respitories-not-so-trustworthy/
[23:48] <vrum> seems rather laughable if the only thing needed to distribute malicious packages is to compromise a mirror and change/remove those fields for said package
[23:50] <penguin42> vrum: Ouch
[23:50] <ion> Huh. Isn’t the signature of Packages checked?
[23:52] <elmo> the signature of Releases is checked, and it contains hashsums of the Packages files
[23:53] <elmo> so, I'm not sure how they managed (or claims to have managed to) alter the Packages file without apt freaking out
[23:53] <stgraber> yeah, that example simply can't work without showing a warning (either md5 mismatch or signature mismatch or "unsigned packages")
[23:54] <stgraber> unless he signed it with another key that's added ot his apt keyring (apparently not the case)
[23:54] <stgraber> I know apt isn't complaining a lot when it's the first time you add a repository that's not signed though, but that's definitely not the case of security.u.c
[23:58] <vrum> okay, will try myself when i sober up a bit. sounds quite strange/pointless to sign anything package-related if it'd work though
[23:58] <broder> what about stripping the signatures from the Release file, though?
[23:59] <broder> does apt yell in the same way about unsigned Release files that it does for Release files signed with a key you don't have?
[23:59] <stgraber> IIRC it complains heavily if you do it once it already knows the repository
[23:59] <stgraber> so if you add a new unsigned repository, it won't complain about it


[00:02] <sebsebseb> bbc 2  just got intterupted a little while ago with the news
[00:03] <sebsebseb> was showing some rubbish thing or whatever that was anyway, wasn't really watching it
[00:04] <zleap> with any luck our dopey EU MP's will now actually ACT
[00:04] <sebsebseb> zleap: by doing what?
[00:05] <zleap> maybe agree on how to stabalise syria
[00:05] <sebsebseb> zleap: ok, but did you see the other news about syria etc?
[00:05] <zleap> not sure
[00:06] <zleap> but there is a plan by russia that involves some sort of transition of power in syria and elections
[00:06] <zleap> so maybe we need to act and decide exactly what strategy we want
[00:06] <zleap> imposing OUR idea of a leader has failed multiple times,
[00:10] <zleap> sebsebseb: no idea what the answer is, but surely it involves all parties working together for a solution,  keep pouring arms in to the area is failing IS are getting hold of US anti tank weapons
[00:17] <zleap> sebsebseb: anyway i am off,  lets see what is in the news tomorrow,  so far france has a state of emergency and all borders are closed
[10:30] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[10:38] <popey> yo
[10:39] <brobostigon> morning popey
[10:40] <brobostigon> i noticed something interesting at the jc the other day, they seem to be using an ubuntu/canonical version of firefox on their client machines.
[18:20]  * p42phone waits for a bus that's about 10m away but traffic is stationary


[19:33] <s0rceress0> ahh, you fixed yourself Che :)
[19:34] <che__> Yep :)
[19:34] <che__> Hey guys
[19:58] <tomswartz07> whats up folks?
[20:04] <che__> hey tomswartz07, just waiting for the meeting
[20:07] <s0rceress0> Hi tom :) nice to see you
[20:16] <tomswartz07> whens the meeting start? another hour?
[20:21] <che__> 10pm UK time as far as I know
[20:25] <tomswartz07> ok cool thats what i thought
[20:52] <s1m0nsk1> Hi everybody! I see people are starting to gather
[20:53] <tomswartz07> hey s1m0nsk1
[20:53] <s0rceress0> Hi :D
[20:53] <che__> hey slm0nsk1
[20:53] <s0rceress0> The meeting gave me a chance to play with my virtual box
[20:54] <s0rceress0> that...didn't sound right.
[20:54] <che__> I was gonna say lol
[20:54] <che__> :)
[20:54] <s1m0nsk1> was wondering what that meant...
[20:55] <tomswartz07> what, are you running an irc client in a vb client?
[20:56] <che__> She's running Kubuntu in virtual box
[20:59] <c7p> hello all
[20:59] <s0rceress0> Hi :)
[20:59] <che__> hey c7p
[20:59] <s1m0nsk1> Hi
[20:59] <herat> hi
[21:01] <c7p> how are you ?
[21:01] <che__> Good
[21:01] <tomswartz07> getting along
[21:01] <s1m0nsk1> can't complain, mustn't grumble...
[21:02] <tomswartz07> who'd listen to the complaints anyway? :)
[21:02] <c7p> :P
[21:02] <che__> :)
[21:03] <c7p> we will wait a bit (5-10 mins) so as everyone join us :)
[21:03] <hannie> okay
[21:03] <senthil_prime> Hi all
[21:04] <c7p> hi senthil !
[21:04] <senthil_prime> Hi c7p
[21:04] <s1m0nsk1> Hi!
[21:06] <c7p> hi Brian
[21:07] <peredo> Hello
[21:07] <s0rceress0> Hi peredo :D
[21:07] <che__> hey peredo :)
[21:07] <s1m0nsk1> Hello peredo
[21:07] <c7p> i guess this "meeting" is an opportunity for you to meet each other :D
[21:08] <peredo> Hi everyone!
[21:08] <tomswartz07> hey all
[21:08] <herat> hi all
[21:08] <senthil_prime> hello peredo!
[21:09] <s1m0nsk1> c7p: that was the intention, wasn't it?
[21:10] <c7p> yeah of course
[21:10] <c7p> the first goal of this gathering
[21:10] <c7p> the next was to answer any questions
[21:12] <c7p> #startmeeting
[21:12] <MootBot> Meeting started at 16:12. The chair is c7p.
[21:12] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[21:12] <c7p> hey all
[21:12] <c7p> raise your hands
[21:12] <hannie> ready
[21:12] <che__> ready
[21:12] <s1m0nsk1> ready
[21:12] <c7p> o/
[21:12] <herat> ready
[21:12] <s0rceress0> ready
[21:13] <peredo> ready
[21:13] <c7p> ok we are ready
[21:13] <tomswartz07> ready
[21:13] <hannie> http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/FlHgLlkX27
[21:13] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/FlHgLlkX27
[21:13] <c7p> rick won't be able to attend the meeting
[21:14] <c7p> thx for the agenda hannie
[21:14] <hannie> and what about Kevin?
[21:14] <c7p> Kevin must be on his parents
[21:15] <c7p> so
[21:15] <hannie> ok, how about letting authors introduce themselves?
[21:15] <c7p> #topic Introduce yourselves authors !
[21:15] <pfjapPaco> Hello
[21:16] <pfjapPaco> Well, I'm Paco
[21:16] <pfjapPaco> I do hope everybody is still here haha
[21:16]  * c7p waves :)
[21:16] <che__> I'm Che, from Ireland and I'm working on Thunderbird
[21:16] <hannie> pfjapPaco, which chapter/section are you working on and what's the progress?
[21:17] <pfjapPaco> I've been assigned to help edit the Ubuntu Desktop section I believe
[21:17] <hannie> pfjapPaco, any section in particular?
[21:17] <tomswartz07> My name is Tom Swartz, Im from Pennsylvania, USA. I have a BS in Physics, and have been using Ubuntu for the past 5 years. Ive been following the Manual Project since the start, and only recently stepped in to help author. Im working on the Instant Messaging section.
[21:17] <c7p> this is how we'll introduce ourselves 1) we say things about ourselves 2) we say that we have finished 3) quesions from others
[21:18] <c7p> Paco wasn't assigned to any section specifically, right pfjapPaco ?
[21:19] <pfjapPaco> Yes, sorry about the wait, I just went to check myself
[21:19] <herat> I am Herat and I am from India. I am working on Using Ubuntu Center.
[21:20] <s1m0nsk1> Hi, I'm Simon. I'm from England and I've been using Ubuntu for about 3 years. I'm doing the Ubuntu One section.
[21:21] <senthil_prime> I am senthil. I am from India but right now I am in the US. I have been using Ubuntu for a little over 1 year now. I am working on the microblogging section of the manual.
[21:21] <c7p> i'm John, i'm following the project since the begining, i step down to help for the greek translation of it and then i started contributing for the main manual. I'm author of the Ubuntu Desktop chapter, specifically on the sections that touches Dash, Launcher, etc
[21:22] <c7p> hey Chris :D
[21:22] <ChrisWoollard> evening
[21:22] <ChrisWoollard> I forgot. Sorry
[21:23] <c7p> no worries we introduce ourselves
[21:23] <s0rceress0> I'm S0rcy, I've been using Ubuntu for about a year now and still learning about it. I'm an editor and am not yet assigned any particular work yet.
[21:23] <peredo> Hello, I'm Brian. I live in California and I will be writing the Viewing and Editing Photos section. I've been using Ubuntu since Breezy. I plan on finishing the section today.
[21:23] <hannie> I'm Hannie. I am a member of Ubuntu Dutch Translators. And I work for the manual als an author (ubuntu-desktop) an editor (Prologue and learning more)
[21:24] <hannie> hi ChrisWoollard
[21:24] <ChrisWoollard> Right...... Ok..... ermm......
[21:24] <hannie> Are you all familiar with this: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/
[21:24] <ChrisWoollard> I am Chris.
[21:25] <pfjapPaco> Hello Chris.
[21:25] <ChrisWoollard> I have been invloved with this project since lucid e1
[21:26] <ChrisWoollard> I know a bit of Latex. I tend to do editting. and fixing things that are broken in the bzr branch
[21:26] <ChrisWoollard> What else do i do?
[21:26] <ChrisWoollard> Generally whatever in
[21:26] <ChrisWoollard> i thank
[21:26] <ChrisWoollard> s/thank/think
[21:27] <c7p> ok i think we are done, or not ? anyone else who wants to introduce his/her self ?
[21:28] <hannie> c7p, is there an aneiric sheet instead of this one: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?authkey=CNDambUJ&key=0AtkeORuPIMxsdGtWRXlvdHB4bktTNkF5LTNwWU5KQnc&hl=en_US&authkey=CNDambUJ#gid=0
[21:28] <hannie> *oneiric
[21:29] <hannie> I think every author/editor should be able to access and it
[21:29] <hannie> *change
[21:29] <c7p> this isn't for oneiric, but yes there is a simple sheet with assignments: http://bit.ly/ok0sKk
[21:31] <hannie> c7p, nice!
[21:31] <c7p> eveytinh is in there :P
[21:31] <c7p> well almost
[21:31] <che__> I don't see s0ceress0 listed as an editor?
[21:31] <c7p> yeah
[21:31] <c7p> many editors are on another sheet "available editors"
[21:32] <che__> ah ok
[21:32] <c7p> those editors aren't assigned to specific chapter or section
[21:32] <hannie> Why aren't these sheets accessible for everybody?
[21:32] <c7p> when we assign them work, they 'll be added too :)
[21:32] <c7p> cause it contains e-mail addresses :D
[21:33] <c7p> i don't think this sheets should be accessible
[21:33] <c7p> to the generall public
[21:33] <hannie> If you save those addresses somewhere else everybody can see what progress is made by others
[21:34] <pfjapPaco> Well, there is a way to protect sheets so that only specific people can see them
[21:34] <c7p> this is a solution, but we have to spend many time on sheets
[21:35] <c7p> edit sheets for public, for private use etc
[21:35] <c7p> even this sheet was time consuming
[21:35] <hannie> at this moment I cannot add anything to the Oneiric sheet, but I could in the Natty sheet
[21:35] <c7p> btw if you want to discuss this subject let's leave it for the end of the meeting
[21:35] <hannie> c7p, ok
[21:36] <c7p> [TOPIC] Basic outlines on how the project works
[21:36] <MootBot> New Topic:  Basic outlines on how the project works
[21:36] <c7p> firstly the project is always open to new members
[21:37] <c7p> any member can contribute as it cans/wants
[21:37] <c7p> even if you follow the project you are member of the project
[21:37] <c7p> now
[21:38] <c7p> the project uses bazzar to share its work
[21:38] <ChrisWoollard> We will always do our best to help each other out.
[21:38] <c7p> we have a branch for every series on bazzar
[21:39] <c7p> although on this release we also give the option to authors to commit/share their work though UbuntuOne
[21:40] <c7p> this on how we share our work
[21:40] <c7p> now the process of releasing a manual is the following
[21:41] <c7p> 1) get the contributors 2) writing process (we are on it) 3) proofreading of written material 3) release of the manual
[21:42] <hannie> You can always ask questions using the mailing list<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[21:43] <c7p> the manual built from LaTeX code, Kevin (godbyk) is our Texician who faces all tex issues, fixes bugs, and helps us to get the manual out
[21:43] <ChrisWoollard> I also know Latex a bit :)
[21:43] <c7p> new authors that work on UbuntuOne and edit LibreOffice docs, of cousre aren't writing tex code
[21:44] <c7p> yeah and Chris helps a lot on fixing syntax issues etc
[21:44] <c7p> (@ new authors) Chris and Kevin are very core members of the project :)
[21:45] <c7p> so as i was saying new authors that work on UbuntuOne and edit LibreOffice docs, of cousre aren't writing tex code
[21:46] <c7p> when you finish your work, we (me, Chris, Rick, Hannie and others) will mark your text with tex code so we can build the manual
[21:46] <c7p> btw Rick is our Editor in Chief
[21:47] <ChrisWoollard> If you want to edit via Bazaar and Latex, we have a style guide http://files.ubuntu-manual.org/style-guide.pdf
[21:47] <c7p> hannie, ChrisWoollard: have i missed anything ?
[21:47] <ChrisWoollard> I can't think of anything
[21:47] <hannie> I don't think so. Maybe there are questions on what you said?
[21:47] <ChrisWoollard> If you have questiosn. Just ask or send them to the mailing list.
[21:48] <c7p> ChrisWoollard: +1
[21:48] <pfjapPaco> So we'll be editing in libreoffice?
[21:48] <pfjapPaco> primarily that is
[21:48] <pfjapPaco> correct?
[21:49] <c7p> hm
[21:49] <ChrisWoollard> At some point that will be converted to Latex and commited to the bzr branch
[21:49] <senthil_prime> And can screenshots be placed on the libreoffice docs as well?
[21:49] <pfjapPaco> ok, thank you
[21:50] <c7p> senthil_prime: it could be could to be added on a seperate folder, but there are some issues with screenshot resolution when added with latex.
[21:51] <ChrisWoollard> If you don't know Latex / Bzr then you don't need to do that.
[21:51] <che__> So should we leave out screenshots in Libreoffice or put them in?
[21:51] <ChrisWoollard> That would be for somebody like the editor in Chief
[21:52] <s1m0nsk1> I think authors should be putting them in.
[21:52] <c7p> place the screens in the docs
[21:53] <hannie> It's a good question about the screenshots. I think we should let Kevin or rick explain about this on the list
[21:53] <che__> ok
[21:53] <senthil_prime> got it..thx
[21:53] <c7p> let's leave the screenshot issue for the next meeting, if you are ok with that
[21:53] <che__> sure
[21:53] <c7p> but of course you will place sreenshots in docs !
[21:54] <senthil_prime> ok
[21:54] <c7p> any question we haven't answered ?
[21:54] <senthil_prime> if we decide to do latex, do we upload the tex file or the pdf?
[21:54] <che__> Do we have a deadline?
[21:54] <ChrisWoollard> tex
[21:55] <hannie> senthil_prime, tex files, not pdf
[21:55] <ChrisWoollard> the pdf gets generated from the tex
[21:55] <c7p> actually you get the branch to your local machine, and edit the tex file of your section
[21:55] <c7p> then you simply commit changes to the branch
[21:55] <senthil_prime> okay
[21:56] <c7p> if i remeber write you work on UbuntuOne ?
[21:56] <ChrisWoollard> before commited to bzr you should run make on the branch to make sure the main.pdf builds without error
[21:56] <senthil_prime> yeah, I am working on UbuntuOne. You have shared a tex file and a doc with me.
[21:56] <c7p> ok work on that
[21:57] <senthil_prime> cool
[21:57] <c7p> it's the tex file of the bazzar branch
[21:57] <c7p> on setting dealines we will talk a bit later
[21:58] <c7p> [TOPIC] Assignments and status of sections
[21:58] <MootBot> New Topic:  Assignments and status of sections
[21:58] <c7p> Assignments: http://bit.ly/ok0sKk
[21:58] <c7p> we saw them before
[21:59] <c7p> so what's the status of your section authors :) ?
[21:59] <c7p> peredo ?
[22:00] <che__> I'm nearly finished the Reading and Composing email section
[22:00] <herat> I have almost completed my part "Using Ubuntu Software Center".
[22:00] <senthil_prime> I should be finishing the microblogging section by tomorrow.
[22:01] <peredo> Viewing and Editing Photos - will likely finish today
[22:01] <s1m0nsk1> I've not started mine yet.
[22:01] <hannie> I have finished my sections in ubuntu-desktop
[22:01] <c7p> we fly team :D
[22:01] <c7p> s1m0nsk1: no worries
[22:02] <s1m0nsk1> Will have a crack at it this week.
[22:03] <c7p> if you need a second hand, don't hesitate to ask :)
[22:03] <c7p> so to recap on chapters status
[22:03] <c7p> Installation chapter must be finished
[22:04] <c7p> The ubuntu desktop is missing the appearance section
[22:04] <c7p> working with ubuntu chapter has 1-2 sections that need some work, the others are completed or almost completed
[22:04] <c7p> software management is half finished
[22:05] <c7p> and on Hardware, troubleshooting and advanced topics i don't know
[22:05] <c7p> the last two must be in good shape
[22:06] <c7p> do you want to say anything on this topic ?
[22:07] <hannie> Bryan is still working on Learning more
[22:07] <hannie> I don't see his name on the sheet
[22:07] <c7p> ok cool, i didn't know that so i didn't added him to the sheet
[22:08] <hannie> And I will finish Prologue, since Piratemurray hasn't got time for it
[22:08] <c7p> ok added to the sheer
[22:08] <c7p> sheet*
[22:09] <hannie> thanks
[22:09] <c7p> np
[22:09] <c7p> i guess we are finished
[22:09] <c7p> do you want to discuss anything out of the agenda ?
[22:09] <hannie> yes, I got to go. Thanks everyone for coming. See you next time.
[22:10] <senthil_prime> np
[22:10] <ChrisWoollard> thanks
[22:10] <c7p> cya hannie, thx for coming
[22:10] <che__> see you hannie
[22:10] <pfjapPaco> Ok, thanks everybody, talk to you all next time
[22:10] <c7p> cu Paco
[22:10] <c7p> thx for coming
[22:10] <s1m0nsk1> Can I ask about deadlines and timescales?
[22:11] <senthil_prime> alright guys, i am taking off too.
[22:11] <c7p> yeah
[22:11] <pfjapPaco> No problem, I'm glad to have a chance to help out
[22:11] <pfjapPaco> bye
[22:11] <herat> I also got to go. Bye.
[22:11] <c7p> cu senthil_prime
[22:11] <c7p> cheers herat
[22:11] <senthil_prime> goodbye c7p
[22:11] <ChrisWoollard> evening godbyk
[22:11] <herat> bye c7p. :)
[22:11] <c7p> that's Kevin
[22:11] <ChrisWoollard> we have just finished
[22:11] <c7p> ^_^
[22:12] <godbyk> Hello, everyone. I just got home.
[22:12] <godbyk> How was/is the meeting?
[22:12] <peredo> It was nice to meet everyone. I'll see you all at the next meeting!
[22:12] <c7p> cu peredo
[22:12] <c7p> #endmeeting
[22:12] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 17:12.
[22:12] <c7p> on deadlines s1m0nsk1
[22:13] <c7p> we don't have any right now
[22:13] <che__> Thanks everyone, see you all next time :)
[22:13] <c7p> cu che
[22:13] <che__> cu c7p
[22:13] <s1m0nsk1> OK, thanks. I'll try and get my bit done a.s.a.p so as not to delay things.
[22:14] <s0rceress0> :) Thanks much, have a good one
[22:14] <c7p> s1m0nsk1: you don't have to push yourself too much, just enjoy contributing
[22:15] <c7p> s1m0nsk1: how long do you think it will take ?
[22:15] <s1m0nsk1> Should have something ready by end of week.
[22:16] <s1m0nsk1> Is that OK?
[22:16] <c7p> ok cool, you won't hold back the release of the manual back for sure
[22:16] <c7p> yeah everyting is ok
[22:17] <s1m0nsk1> Oh good, glad about that!
[22:17] <c7p> i g2g guys too
[22:17] <c7p> see you all
[22:17] <c7p> godbyk: i wish we could talk :P
[22:17] <s1m0nsk1> I'm off too - bye!
[22:17] <c7p> good night all
[22:17] <ChrisWoollard> gn