[00:50] <habys> installing over the network for uefi seems to require chainloading grub. It seems to have the location of grub.cfg hard coded in it. Is there any easy way to change that? I already have an ipxe menu, I'd rather not also have to go through a grub menu only for the UEFI installations.
[00:54] <sarnold> I thought the default grub config was no menu and you've got to hold down shift or something to even see the choices
[01:02] <habys> that may be the case, but considering I have several UEFI targets, and the grub config seems to be hardcoded, I need a way to tell grub to read a different config
[01:03] <habys> off the bat, I need different targets for amd64 vs arm64, server vs desktop, and more. If I can't instruct grub from ipxe to choose a different config, then I can't automatically install things anymore (with ipxe target files)
[01:04] <habys> for some reason I don't need to chainload grub to boot BIOS.. kernel+initrd and the right kernel parameters and you are off to the races
[01:04] <sarnold> you may be better served without grub at all?
[01:05] <habys> for some reason UEFI just crashes when it tries to set the ISO as root. I could only get it to work by chainloading grub. Not sure why that is the case
[01:05] <habys> yeah I wish I could get rid of it. No idea why all the boot documentation uses it.
[01:08] <habys> I could try to build grubx64.efi myself and hard code a different config path for each binary, referring to each from ipxe
[01:08] <habys> but man it would be so much easier if I could just `chain http://blah/grubx64.efi target=desktop` or something similar
[01:12] <habys> https://ubuntu.com/server/docs/install/netboot-amd64 was useful to get this working, but this basically assumes you don't have any other pxe targets..
[01:13] <sarnold> that might be worth clicking the 'help improve this document inthe forum' link on the page
[01:14] <habys> I'll give it a shot, I don't have a clear solution though
[01:14] <habys> ha that link says "use IRC for support questions" >_>
[01:15] <sarnold> sure :)
[01:49] <habys> https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2483456&p=14128774#post14128774
[01:50] <sarnold> somehow that doesn't feel like a 'forums' kind of thing to me; I'd expect the server discourse or askubuntu to do a better job collecting answers
[01:50] <habys> well the server discourse says no tech support questions
[01:51] <habys> there's just not a lot of hope for me huh
[01:51] <sarnold> I certainly think you're out in unusual territory
[01:51] <sarnold> but there's loads of folks who do funny things :) hehe
[01:52] <habys> yeah... trying to network boot OSes.. I feel like I'm from a different planet
[01:53] <arraybolt3> habys: That error you showed in the forums post looks like it can't find an initramfs.
[01:53] <arraybolt3> Maybe that's what's wrong?
[01:54] <habys> I usually see that error when it can't find the iso
[01:54] <habys> but I'll double check my syntax for the initrd
[01:54] <habys> ty for looking seriously!
[01:54] <arraybolt3> Sure thing!
[01:55] <arraybolt3> habys: Whatever loads the kernel should also load an initramfs that the kernel can mount and use to help boot, at least that's how it works when booting a disk. I assume it would work the same way when booting over the network, though I've only ever booted Debian over the network so I'm not sure.
[01:56] <habys> oh yeah, it definitely can find the inird. you can see ipxe downloading it
[01:56] <arraybolt3> Hmm... perhaps the compression used on the initrd isn't supported by the kernel?
[01:56] <arraybolt3> I've had that happen once (trying to use an old kernel with a newer version of Ubuntu).
[01:56] <habys> yeah, brand new and matching kernel + initrd + live server.iso
[01:57] <habys> I saw that same error when I was setting up server to boot in BIOS mode, and I had put the wrong path in for the ISO
[01:57] <habys> but I've got BIOS working fine, and it's going to be the same kernel+initrd+iso for bios or uefi
[01:57] <arraybolt3> Weird. All I know is I see that exact error (I think) every time the initramfs goes missing. Maybe it also applies to the ISO missing, but that's what I've seen in the past.
[02:04] <habys> I think the initramfs only serves to pull down the iso and use it as the root for the netbooted filesystem. I'll keep trying stuff. Not sure if I should give up on trying to make this work without GRUB, but that would be great..
[06:33] <alkisg> habys: see my code there for how to pass variables from ipxe to grub: https://github.com/alkisg/ltsp5-uefi/blob/main/ltsp.ipxe#L73
[06:34] <alkisg> I haven't read the rest of this chat, I only read part of what you uploaded to the forum link above
[12:45] <yaleb> hi what's the easiest way to get ssh using a cert so I don't have to type the password each time
[12:45] <yaleb> it's getting complicated with ~20 different logins lol
[12:46] <yaleb> some with "secure" passwords that are different for the same user between two different servers
[12:46] <yaleb> but that's less important as they're hardly accessed via cli
[12:46] <yaleb> no need for complicated public cert shares/intermediaries etc heh
[12:47] <yaleb> just basically to remember the login for X days
[12:48] <yaleb> I did think I could make some little services that connect automatically with passwords in plaintext since it's using FUKS or similar anyway
[12:48] <yaleb> and then just connect a terminal to those as needed
[12:48] <yaleb> but... kinda stupid just because I don't know how to do what I describe heh
[12:49] <yaleb> if anyone knows or can point me in the right direction, i'd appreciate it
[13:01] <konstruktoid> ansible vault can be an option yaleb
[13:03] <konstruktoid>  * <del>ansible vault can be an option</del> wrong channel
[13:03] <konstruktoid> but a perhaps hashicorp vault, but the "remember the login for X days" part is done via pam. and an ssh connection will only be held open for the current connection
[13:10] <yaleb> as I say i'm pretty sure I can just generate a private user key and copy that over to the host?
[13:10] <yaleb> and connect with that instead of the user/pass combo
[13:10] <yaleb> I try to add as little extra software as I can haha
[13:19] <konstruktoid> ah sorry, then lineinfile your ssh key to the user authorized_keys
[13:20] <konstruktoid>  * ah sorry, then copy your ssh key strings to the user authorized_keys
[13:20] <konstruktoid> or append is perhaps the correct term
[13:20] <konstruktoid> but do you need a separate key for each user?
[13:26] <yaleb> aha yesss that was exactly right and I have done it per user with the help of the DO guide below ^_^
[13:26] <yaleb> https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-set-up-ssh-keys-on-ubuntu-20-04
[13:26] <yaleb> it was pretty much what I thought but in reverse haha
[13:26] <yaleb> safe passwordless accounts now yay
[13:27] <yaleb> thanks for the tip <3
[13:58] <ahasenack> I'm building a package in a ppa, lunar, proposed disabled, and it builds fine
[13:58] <ahasenack> then I do the same in a lxd container, lunar, also proposed disabled, and it fails because something is injecting `-Wall` in the CFLAGS :/
[13:58] <ahasenack> cc1: all warnings being treated as errors
[13:59] <ahasenack> I can't think of what it would be
[13:59] <ahasenack> I'll just start over
[14:24] <habys> alkisg: the installer for ubuntu changed since 18.04, thanks though
[16:45] <ahasenack> kanashiro[m]: that corosync-blackbox script is just a 3-line shell script
[16:46] <ahasenack> kanashiro[m]: we could also patch it to check if qb-blackbox is installed, and if not, tell the user to install libqb-tools
[16:46] <ahasenack> but that would need checking with the consumer of this script if it is prepared for such a response and exit status
[16:47] <ahasenack> funny, it uses $(date +%s) twice to name a file, instead of calling it once and storing the timestamp in a var
[16:47] <kanashiro[m]> ahasenack: and add libqb-tools as Suggests
[16:47] <ahasenack> the way it is, it's quite possible the two dump files it creates will have different names
[16:47] <ahasenack> kanashiro[m]: yeah
[16:48] <kanashiro[m]> right, we can do that
[16:48] <ahasenack> maybe also check in the upstream docs where and in which cases they recommend to run corosync-blackbox
[16:49] <ahasenack> but the path of less surprises right now is still a recommends, and bring libqb-tools into main, if that's possible
[16:50] <ahasenack> let me write that up in the MP
[17:08] <ahasenack> oh, about that rsyslog build failure, I bet I know what it is
[17:08] <ahasenack> it's the presence of .git in the source
[17:09] <ahasenack> since I'm building from a git branch, there is a .git, and I bet the build system interprets that as "oh, we have ourselves a developer here, let's enable some devel flags"
[17:09] <ahasenack> # Running from git source?
[17:09] <ahasenack> in_git_src=no
[17:09] <ahasenack> AS_IF([test -d "$srcdir"/.git && ! test -f  "$srcdir"/.tarball-version], [in_git_src=yes])
[17:09]  * ahasenack shakes fist at it
[18:13] <lenovo> Hi all, My squid proxy is not hitting anything in the access.log, what can I be missing?
[18:14] <yaleb> idk that provides very little detail
[18:14] <yaleb> what have you tried/checked?
[18:15] <lenovo> is supossed to be fully configure, working only on memory, but all I get is TCP_tunnel TCP_miss
[18:16] <lenovo> no TCP_HIT
[18:30] <sdeziel> lenovo: can you share your squid.conf via a paste service?
[18:32] <lenovo> difficult to copy via SSH, any specific detail/parameter you would think?
[18:32] <yaleb> how is it difficult to copy via ssh
[18:32] <yaleb> literally just cat it into another file haha
[18:32] <yaleb> or a network share to your main pc
[18:33] <yaleb> or use the gist/pastebin cli client even
[18:33] <yaleb> so many good options!
[18:33] <ravage> cat /etc/squid/squid.conf|nc termbin.com 9999
[18:38] <lenovo> https://pastebin.com/My4h9V9c
[18:42] <ravage> lenovo: https://termbin.com/x2zl9
[18:42] <ravage> this is your actual config
[18:43] <ravage> if i read it correctly there is a general deny for everything except some local IPs
[18:45] <lenovo> you mean http_access deny all?
[18:45] <ravage> yes
[18:46] <ravage> https://termbin.com/e6uo
[18:46] <lenovo> standard squid proxy config after the particulars are permitted
[18:47] <ravage> this one works for me
[18:47] <ravage> but i have have additional firewall rules
[18:47] <lenovo> and it still seems to read other request, just doesn't cache'em
[18:50] <lenovo> you are caching in drive, I am trying to have it work in memory only
[18:52] <lenovo> might that be the reason?
[18:55] <sdeziel> lenovo: anything in /etc/squid/conf.d/?
[18:58] <lenovo> yes debian.conf with #http_access allow localnet
[18:58] <lenovo> shall that be uncommented?
[18:59] <sdeziel> lenovo: if it's commented out, it's not important
[19:00] <sdeziel> lenovo: the localnet ACL definition looks weird. I'm not entirely sure which CIDR you'd like to allow but possibly this: `acl localnet src <IP_ADDRESS>/25`
[19:00] <sdeziel> or maybe the more common `/24`
[19:04] <yaleb> I cannot reply to someone named "lenovo"
[19:04] <yaleb> my core ideals go against it
[19:05] <lenovo> hahahah
[19:05] <yaleb> talk to my 10th gen intel rig that can't get wifi networking on any major linux distro about it if any querires
[19:05] <yaleb> it's available to chat if you google chatgpt
[19:06] <lenovo> how old are you?
[19:07] <sdeziel> lenovo: that said, despite that weird ACL, if you are seeing TCP_TUNNEL and TCP_MISS, it means you are allowed to poke it. Maybe you are trying to fetch some resources that is not cache-able by your config. Do you have a sample URL of something you'd like to be cached?
[19:08] <lenovo> sdeziel, not really, but there is not hit at all, browsing simple cnn.com bbc.com
[19:08] <sdeziel> lenovo: I think those sites use HTTPS making them harder to cache
[19:09] <lenovo> any sure to be cached website you suggest?
[19:09] <sarnold> or they employ 'cache-busting' curls like tacking on ?t=<unixepoch> or similar nonsense
[19:09] <sdeziel> lenovo: cause when you flow an HTTPS connection through squid (with your current config) it will behave as a TCP proxy and won't be able to see whatever gibberish is passing through that TCP connection
[19:10] <sdeziel> lenovo: with your current squid config, you'd need to hit a HTTP site so that squid can observe the "objects" flowing through it
[19:11] <sdeziel> lenovo: and then, if those objects have specific headers indicating squid that it's OK to cache them (Cache-Control, Expiry, etc), then it would keep a copy and serve it to the next client requesting the same data
[19:11] <sdeziel> lenovo: assuming the cached copy didn't go stale between the first and second requests
[19:12] <lenovo> sdeziel, not matter it is working only with memory?
[19:13] <sdeziel> lenovo: no, the caching backend type shouldn't change anything
[19:13] <sdeziel> lenovo: with the modern web being like 95% HTTPS (yay!) running a caching proxy isn't trivial anymore
[19:14] <lenovo> suggest a sure to be cached site
[19:14] <lenovo> I am checking also chistes.com, no difference
[19:14] <sdeziel> http://httpforever.com/
[19:15] <sarnold> :D
[19:15] <sarnold> http://neverssl.com/
[19:15] <lenovo> :)
[19:15] <sdeziel> lenovo: and from that page, it seems that only the .js is cache-able http://httpforever.com/js/init.min.js
[19:16] <lenovo> TCP_MISS all
[19:16] <sdeziel> http forever have links to JS libs hosted on Cloudflare using HTTPS oh the irony
[19:16] <lenovo> no haha, we got a hit
[19:17] <lenovo> TCP_IMS_HIT/304 282 GET http://httpforever.com/
[19:17] <lenovo> nah, is https then the problem here?
[19:18] <sdeziel> IMS means a 304 revalidation was done
[19:18] <lenovo> neverssl can also hit
[19:18] <sdeziel> lenovo: HTTPS isn't a problem in and of itself but it makes it hard to cache
[19:19] <sdeziel> lenovo: there are ways around it but it's hard to do it in a secure way
[19:22] <lenovo> well, at least is proved that it is working
[19:23] <lenovo> sdeziel, sarnold yaleb ravage thank you all
[19:23] <sdeziel> lenovo: there is one place where a HTTP caching proxy is still quite useful IMHO: apt proxy :)
[19:23] <sdeziel> np
[19:23] <yaleb> yeee thank me even though I did basically nothing
[19:23] <yaleb> >:D
[19:23] <lenovo> forgot to mention, this server is also running pi-hole
[19:24] <yaleb> lenovo pi-hole
[19:24] <lenovo> not sure how they affect each other
[19:24] <yaleb> coming 2023
[19:26] <sdeziel> lenovo: pi-hole does ad filtering/blocking at the DNS level so if your squid is configured to use it to resolve domains, it should block ads and that even on HTTPS sites
[19:30] <lenovo> well the ideal is that to work, and what is not blocked by dns to be cached when possible
[19:37] <yaleb> fwiw
[19:37] <yaleb> if you hard block all ads at the network level
[19:38] <yaleb> a lot of stuff around the web is designed to basically just <hang forever>
[19:38] <yaleb> ads don't load? nothing for you!
[19:38] <yaleb> or more commonly
[19:38] <yaleb> ads don't load?
[19:38] <yaleb> ...
[19:38] <yaleb> ..
[19:38] <yaleb> ...
[19:38] <yaleb> ..
[19:38] <yaleb> ad infinit
[19:55] <sdeziel> lenovo: with the prevalence of HTTPS and embedded ads, I think ad blocking is best done on the client side with ublock origin for example... but that's getting off topic
[19:56] <lenovo> might be, but I have two soon to be teenagers that are about to challenge me
[19:56] <lenovo> so the 4 pcs at home need
[19:56] <lenovo> CONTROL
[19:57] <patdk-lap> 4?
[19:57] <sdeziel> lenovo: ah, then squid might be your friend cause even for HTTPS sites, you can decide if the proxy will authorize or not the connection
[19:58] <lenovo> yeah only 4 of some, two more on weekends for games
[19:58] <patdk-lap> ya, ublock on all browsers + dns blocker + block all dns-over-https and redirect all port 53 to local dns server
[19:58] <sdeziel> lenovo: even if the bulk of the HTTPS connection is encrypted, the connection initiation has some clear text info revealing the host where the HTTPS connection is directed to. You can tell squid to use that information to allow/deny access
[19:58] <lenovo> it might be, other problem is to find specific porn blacklists
[19:58] <patdk-lap> each of my kids have 3 each it seems :(
[19:58] <patdk-lap> though the 5year old only has two
[19:58] <patdk-lap> that is simple
[19:59] <lenovo> only two :) hehe
[19:59] <patdk-lap> https://apaste.info/WeKu
[19:59] <sdeziel> lenovo: some DNS providers do have filtered feed (cloudflare for family or something similarly named). You can tell your squid to use those
[20:00] <sdeziel> lenovo: this way, if you make the proxy a mandatory hop to exit your network, you will have your control point
[20:00] <patdk-lap> yep, use cloudfare ones at work
[20:00] <arraybolt3> I've heard of the Cloudflare things, that should be easy to set up.
[20:00] <sdeziel> lenovo: and then your kids will use their LTE connection to bypass it all... human nature :)
[20:00] <lenovo> :)
[20:00] <arraybolt3> Who says kids need cellphones? :D
[20:00] <patdk-lap> I have no cell coverage here :)
[20:00] <lenovo> yes, guess there is a limit for everything
[20:01] <sdeziel> yep
[20:01] <patdk-lap> my son learned how to vpn really quick after the dns filter was installed
[20:01] <arraybolt3> You probably still want a network-wide adblock even if you do use Cloudflare's blocker, since Google ads can be shockingly bad.
[20:01] <sdeziel> I think some safeguards are appropriate but for the rest, education is the only option... my 2cents
[20:02] <sdeziel> arraybolt3: yeah, I also do DNS level ad removal for the network otherwise the Internet looks ugly
[20:06] <lenovo> nah all saying good bye here
[20:06] <lenovo> thank you again
[20:06] <arraybolt3> o/
[20:06] <arraybolt3> sdeziel: Personally I just use client-side blocking on everything, but then again I don't have anyone on the inside actively trying to defeat it so the protections I need are far more minimal.
[20:07] <sdeziel> arraybolt3: yeah, but I have a bunch of iphones here :/
[20:08] <arraybolt3> Oh blah. iPhones are junk.
[20:09] <mybalzitch> 100%
[20:31] <kanashiro[m]> ahasenack: I ran check-mir script in libqb and apparently there is no extra dep requiring promotion in order to promote libqb-tools. Do you think I need to file a bug and subscribe the MIR team to demote libqb-dev and promote libqb-tools? Or is this straightforward enough to get in touch with an AA directly?
[20:41] <ahasenack> did you find the original MIR bug? If there is one?
[20:43] <kanashiro[m]> yes, let me grab the link
[20:44] <kanashiro[m]> but it is an old one, not much info: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libqb/+bug/1202737
[20:44] -ubottu:#ubuntu-server- Launchpad bug 1202737 in libqb (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libqb" [High, Fix Released]
[20:48] <ahasenack> kanashiro[m]: did you see the rationale? Point 2 :)
[20:50] <ahasenack> the demotion of -dev should be quasi-automatic, if nothing else pulls it in main
[20:50] <ahasenack> (or maybe fully automatic)
[20:52] <kanashiro[m]> ahasenack: I think we can upload it with libqb-tools as Recommends and once the component-mismatch appears we ping an AA to replace libqb-dev
[20:52] <ahasenack> ok
[20:53] <ahasenack> let me pull/refresh
[21:03] <yaleb> sdeziel: I mean
[21:03] <yaleb> even with a network gateway filtering things [probably using ublock or similar]
[21:03] <yaleb> it's still a good idea to run it on each machine as well
[21:03] <yaleb> errr sorry wrong chan I think
[21:04] <sdeziel> yaleb: I agree on the need to do both network and client level filtering
[21:30] <moha> Is it secure to install `net-tools` package on a production server as it has been deprecated for years?
[21:37] <sarnold> "secure", sure; it just can't do the things iproute2 can
[22:01] <patdk-lap> heh?
[22:02] <patdk-lap> iproute2 never supported arp, and it deprecated the little support it did have
[22:06] <patdk-lap> "For those who insist on such a thing, there is support for creating and deleting proxy ARP entries with ip neighbor, although this has been deprecated." and the iproute2 tells you to use arp instead :(
[22:10] <sarnold> patdk-lap: 'ip neigh'
[22:10] <sarnold> oh hah
[22:42] <patdk-lap> the support I forget exactly, didn't work for some reason


[00:00] <TheMuso> RAOF: Quick question for you re GNOME stable updates. Do we have a definitive list of what packages fall under the GNOME stable updates umbrella?
[00:01] <RAOF> TheMuso: I don't know, actually.  That's an excellent question :).  I'd guess at everything in core gnome, and I'd guess that there's a list somewhere on gnome.org for that.
[00:02] <TheMuso> RAOF: Right, I am dealing with bug 773763 and am wondering whether I need to get rodrigo_ to fill out the full SRU paperwork.
[00:02] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 773763 in evolution-rss "evolution freeze on startup with the plug-in "evolution-rss"" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/773763
[00:03] <TheMuso> The branch itself checks out as ok.
[00:06] <TheMuso> I suspect evolution-rss is not core gnome.
[00:30] <RAOF> TheMuso: Bah, sorry.  irc bouncer decided to suspend.
[00:32] <RAOF> TheMuso: Anyway - I can't actually find documentation of the gnome exception.  I don't think evolution-rss counts, though.  A bit more formal SRU work would be wanted anyway - at least to have a natty task and to have the oneiric task marked as fixed.
[00:33] <TheMuso> RAOF: Right, I asked for such in the bug.
[00:49] <cyphermox> TheMuso: evo-rss crash?
[00:50] <TheMuso> cyphermox: Yes.
[00:50] <TheMuso> Something along those lines.
[00:51] <cyphermox> heh
[00:52] <cyphermox> 0.2.2 to 0.2.5 seems steep... especially since IIRC I had already fixed something in evo-rss to keep it from crashing?
[00:56] <TheMuso> I didn't look that much into it myself, just reviewed the branch and the bug.
[01:01] <cyphermox> ok
[01:02] <cyphermox> well, worst case I guess rodrigo can instead backport just commit 536a117, which seems to be the exact issue, but there are a fair amount of other bugs fixed
[01:02] <TheMuso> Right.
[01:33] <TheMuso> 5~/c
[02:56]  * TheMuso -> lunch
[04:15] <pitti> RAOF: thanks for confirming
[04:15] <pitti> good morning
[04:20] <TheMuso> Morning pitti.
[04:26] <RAOF> Morning pitti.
[05:56] <pitti> ok, images are as ready as they will be, so we may as well lift the freeze
[06:22] <didrocks> good morning
[06:28] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[06:49] <didrocks> pitti: hey, (didn't see your ping), how is alpha2 coming? :)
[06:50] <pitti> didrocks: pretty well indeed; I lifted the soft freeze already
[06:50] <pitti> now preparing images, announcements, errata, etc.
[06:50] <didrocks> excellent! Time to do some uploads then :)
[06:55] <RAOF> Hm.  I should probably add mesa 7.11 to the release notes.
[06:58] <pitti> RAOF: ah, please do
[06:59] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[07:00] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[07:00] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
[07:01] <pitti> pretty well, thanks! smoothest alpha ever
[07:02] <RAOF> Helloooooo chrisccoulson!
[07:02] <chrisccoulson> hi RAOF!
[07:02] <chrisccoulson> pitti - are we unfrozen yet?
[07:02] <pitti> chrisccoulson: go wild
[07:03] <pitti> chrisccoulson: not released yet, but the images are fixed now
[07:03] <chrisccoulson> pitti - excellent, thanks!
[07:04] <didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
[07:04] <chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
[07:04]  * didrocks tries to race to upload Qt before chrisccoulson :p
[07:04] <didrocks> but 25 minutes to create the source package :/
[07:05] <chrisccoulson> lol
[07:24] <RAOF> robert_ancell: I've finally managed to update my radeon box and reproduce that lightdm “nothing draws after log out” bug.  Hah!
[07:24] <robert_ancell> RAOF, any ideas?
[07:25] <desrt> didrocks: time for a faster computer
[07:25] <didrocks> desrt: I would say, faster hard drive rather in the Qt case :)
[07:26] <RAOF> robert_ancell: I'd guess it's something in the accel code being messed up.  I'm investigating.
[07:29] <desrt> didrocks: SSD is totally worth it
[07:30] <didrocks> desrt: I think I'll choose one soon. But still first to find what's wrong with my server which died during the really (power, motherboard or CPU?)
[07:31] <desrt> didrocks: just buy a new one
[07:31] <desrt> it's a great excuse for the upgrade and you can argue that any potential cost savings need to be offset against the cost of your time to debug the problem
[07:32] <desrt> (for purposes of self-justification)
[07:32] <didrocks> desrt: that's quite right, but still, as the motherboard has some leds lightened, I still want first to avoid that if I can just change my power with another machine I don't use
[07:33] <desrt> no fun :)
[07:44] <desrt> didrocks: btw.  do you know the proper process for registering 'official' freenode channels?
[07:45] <didrocks> desrt: I think http://blog.freenode.net/2008/04/registering-a-channel-on-freenode/ it quite still up to date
[07:46] <desrt> didrocks: i mean specifically ubuntu 'official' channels (those starting with #ubuntu, not ##ubuntu)
[07:46] <didrocks> desrt: oh, I don't remember, at the time, we just sent an email to canonical legal presenting our loco, but this was in 2005 :)
[07:47] <Tm_T> desrt: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/CreatingChannels
[07:47] <desrt> ahah.  that is what i was looking ofr indeed
[07:47] <desrt> thanks
[07:58] <seb128> hey
[07:58] <didrocks> salut seb128
[08:01] <robert_ancell> didrocks, are there indicator .vapi files?
[08:01] <seb128> lut didrocks
[08:01] <seb128> hey robert_ancell!
[08:01] <robert_ancell> seb128, hello
[08:01] <seb128> robert_ancell, libappindicator3-dev: /usr/share/vala/vapi/appindicator3-0.1.vapi
[08:01] <seb128> ?
[08:01] <didrocks> robert_ancell: there are for some indicator, like appindicator, soudindicator
[08:02] <didrocks> not sure about everything though
[08:03] <seb128> robert_ancell, you should review the xubuntu patches in launchpad for your next upload if you can, seems having the way to use an alternative config is a blocker for them
[08:03] <robert_ancell> seb128, didrocks, I need the ones for libindicator-dev.
[08:03] <robert_ancell> seb128, it's on my list.  I have a big list
[08:04] <seb128> ;-)
[08:05] <didrocks> robert_ancell: didn't find any for this one, forward your request to ted I would say
[08:05] <seb128> robert_ancell, I will check for you today with the u.s guys and drop you an email
[08:05] <robert_ancell> seb128, k, thanks.  It's not a big deal, I can write my own just for the functions I need
[08:06] <seb128> robert_ancell, what do you need? (just curious)
[08:06] <robert_ancell> seb128, copying the code out of ubiquity for the greeter
[08:07] <seb128> ok
[08:08] <seb128> robert_ancell, did you have a nice flight back this time btw?
[08:08] <seb128> robert_ancell, how is your jetlag? ;-)
[08:08] <robert_ancell> seb128, much easier than last time
[08:08] <robert_ancell> all back to normal
[08:09] <seb128> great
[08:09] <robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_ and I got upgraded to premium economy which made it easier too
[08:10] <didrocks> seb128: in unity 2.0, we had an indicator.vapi, not sure how uptodate it is, but maybe it can be of interest for you?
[08:10] <seb128> lucky you ;-)
[08:10] <seb128> didrocks, njpatel has a libindicator vcs with a vapi as well
[08:10] <seb128> didrocks, but I prefer to check with ken and ted why they don't build one, they probably have a technical reason or had issues
[08:11] <didrocks> I think it's just that you have to ship it manually and update it yourself :)
[08:11] <seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~njpatel/libindicator/vala
[08:11] <seb128> but that's old
[08:11] <robert_ancell> didrocks, yeah, that sounds likely :)
[08:12] <seb128> but do you need a vapi?
[08:12] <seb128> or do you need a typelib?
[08:12] <njpatel> seb128, you just need  a vapi for most things
[08:13] <njpatel> didrocks, seb128 I can update it if you want?
[08:13] <didrocks> njpatel: what, do you have spare time? :-)
[08:13] <seb128> njpatel, robert_ancell needs it for lightdm
[08:13] <seb128> but I think he said he can ship a copy for the function he needs
[08:13] <seb128> I was just curious of why the libindicator has no gir or vapi
[08:13] <njpatel> didrocks, what? I mean no, no, I can't do it <looks around shifty>
[08:13] <njpatel> :)
[08:13] <robert_ancell> I only need a few function calls
[08:14] <njpatel> robert_ancell, seb128 didrocks can do it sometime today so will be ready tomorrow, sound good?
[08:14] <seb128> works for me
[08:14] <robert_ancell> sounds good to me!
[08:14] <njpatel> hopefully ted hasn't completely broken libindicator ;p
[08:14] <seb128> njpatel, thanks
[08:14] <njpatel> np :)
[08:15]  * njpatel tests out if vga/displayport works with his laptop now with edgers
[08:15] <didrocks> thanks njpatel ;)
[08:16] <njpatel> damns it
[08:17] <seb128> bah, it's annoying that segfaults on exit bugs always get priority raise because they get duplicates
[08:17] <seb128> we need to find a way to filter those out
[08:17] <RAOF> njpatel: You'd want to be trying the Oneiric kernel for that.
[08:17] <njpatel> RAOF, i'm in oneiric + xorg edgers, but neither work :(
[08:18] <njpatel> neither = VGA or displayport
[08:18] <RAOF> njpatel: Sadness.
[08:18] <njpatel> both get detected with a 1024x768 monitor (though the monitor is way larger than that), X thinks it's brought up the screen, but the monitors don't get a signal
[08:18] <njpatel> sorry, brought up the monitor (i.e. it extends the desktop)
[08:19] <rodrigo_> morning
[08:19] <njpatel> RAOF, this is x220...any idea?
[08:19] <njpatel> RAOF, (sandy bridge)
[08:20] <njpatel> RAOF, just got this from the display settings http://pastebin.com/6GryKjPt
[08:21] <RAOF> njpatel: I've not seen anything suggesting that it's a known problem upstream; dmesg and /var/log/Xorg.0.log are most likely to contain interesting debugging info.
[08:22] <njpatel> RAOF, dmesg has a million of "[ 4412.963511] [drm:intel_dp_i2c_aux_ch] *ERROR* too many retries, giving up"
[08:22] <RAOF> Ah.  That suggests it's failing while trying to retrieve the EDID, which would be consistent with X thinking it's a 1024x768 monitor.
[08:23] <njpatel> RAOF, should I be worried? :/
[08:23] <njpatel> RAOF, this happened with stock O as well as edgers
[08:24] <seb128> pitti, hey, can I upload today? ;-)
[08:24] <seb128> (new glib and gtk available)
[08:24] <pitti> seb128: yes, see #u-devel topic -- freeze is lifted
[08:24] <RAOF> Depends on what you mean by ‘worried’.
[08:24] <njpatel> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/791169
[08:24] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 791169 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "Picture disappearing when Display Port is connected" [Undecided,Incomplete]
[08:24] <seb128> \o/
[08:24] <seb128> pitti, danke
[08:24] <njpatel> RAOF, will it ever work? :)
[08:24] <njpatel> RAOF, or, can I fix it?
[08:25] <RAOF> njpatel: Looks like it might; there's a patch series on intel-gfx@ with some DP fixes which Keith says makes his x220 work better :)
[08:25] <njpatel> aaah, nice
[08:26] <njpatel> RAOF, okay, i can wait for whenever that lands, thanks!
[08:28]  * njpatel updates bug
[08:29] <didrocks> ahah, I was just getting blocked on bug #806661, nice timing :)
[08:29] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 806661 in python-imaging "[oneiric] python-imaging needs to be multiarch-aware" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/806661
[09:09] <pitti> mvo: *hug* for the doc-base update!
[09:09] <pitti> mvo: so we can close the bug now?
[09:12] <seb128> so who want to do some updates today?
[09:13] <mvo> pitti: I think so, but I want to wait until it hits the archive to be sure that my test-case runs fine then. I did not manage to reproduce it manually, only in the full ubuntu->ubuntu release upgrade
[09:13] <pitti> mvo: ah, makes sense; thanks!
[09:20] <seb128> rodrigo_, hey ;-)
[09:20] <seb128> rodrigo_, do you have some slots for updates still today or do you want to get work done on other things?
[09:23] <rodrigo_> seb128, I am working on infrastructure in g-c-c for lots of our bugs, but will have some slots for sure, so what do you want me to upload?
[09:23] <seb128> rodrigo_, don't bother, there is no hurry, better than you get the bugs count down a bit ;-)
[09:24] <rodrigo_> seb128, I can do some updates anyway, no problem
[09:24] <seb128> if you get bored gnome-utils or gedit should be easy
[09:24] <rodrigo_> ok
[09:24] <seb128> I'm doing the glib, gtk3 updates
[09:29] <pitti> seb128: I'll push the multiarch changes of gobject-introspection to Debian, and will then look into the upgrade
[09:29] <seb128> pitti, danke
[09:30] <seb128> pitti, do you want to look at the dbus update as well when you have a free slot?
[09:30] <pitti> yes
[09:30] <seb128> thanks
[09:30] <pitti> added to pad
[09:38] <pitti> ah, Debian doesn't have glib 2.29 yet, can't update in Debian
[09:56] <rodrigo_> need a reboot, bbiab
[10:00] <pitti> hm, dbus is a rather complex merge, that'll take me a bit
[10:05] <seb128> didrocks, do you have any clue about bug #806888
[10:05] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 806888 in gnome-session "can only login "classic"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/806888
[10:06] <seb128> hum bug #788710
[10:06] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 788710 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon crashed with SIGSEGV in exit()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/788710
[10:06] <seb128> session restart, brb
[10:17] <didrocks> seb128: answered on the bugmail
[10:18] <seb128> didrocks, thanks
[10:19] <seb128> didrocks, did we figure what happened to nvidia that required to jockey if off and on again?
[10:19] <seb128> or did everybody workarounded it this way and ignored the bug from then on?
[10:19] <didrocks> seb128: I pinged the Xorg guy for it, I didn't get any feedback about it
[10:20] <seb128> ok
[10:20] <seb128> great, gtk build done
[10:20] <seb128> time to reboot with the new glib and then with the new gtk
[10:20] <seb128> be back in a few
[10:20] <slomo> seb128: the gstreamer packaging will be in git soon btw, not sure if that helps anybody in ubuntu but if you use git too it should make merging new debian versions easier ;)
[10:26] <Laney> it would be so good if there were official ubuntu git hosting
[10:26] <Laney> debian merges between git branches are really nice
[11:03] <seb128> re
[11:04] <pitti> ok, I'm happy with dbus; let's upload and break the world!
[11:13]  * soren holds off on upgrading his laptop to Oneiric for another couple of days
[11:13] <mvo> pitti: hi, a gtk3 porting question, it appears that for gtk_text_iter_forward_search() I get a tuple as the return but I would expect a triple actually (found, start, end) - and it crashes for me in update-manager, but that might be releated actually I guess. I will write a test case next
[11:15] <pitti> mvo: right, for (return_bool, match_start, match_end)
[11:15] <pitti> mvo: do you happen to have a small reproducer? or that's what you are writing right now?
[11:15] <mvo> pitti: I'm writing it now
[11:26] <rodrigo_> in the last couple of cycles (natty and oneiric), I always have my eth0 connection shown as unmanaged by NM
[11:26] <mvo> pitti: can it be as simple as http://paste.ubuntu.com/639423/ ? testcase is here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/639424/
[11:26] <pitti> mvo: that looks very plausible indeed
[11:26] <mvo> pitti: I wonder if match_start, match_end also need to be nullified? but none of the other code seems to do that, its a bit puzzling that I get apparently valid types back that then crash when trying to access them
[11:27] <pitti> pygobject should care about passing initialized pointers
[11:28] <mvo> ok
[11:28] <pitti> mvo: hm, the return type in the gir looks correct, though
[11:28] <didrocks> rodrigo_: it seems you pushed gnome-destkop3 to lp:ubuntu/gnome-desktop3 (with some diff from the actual tarball). Can you refresh lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop/ubuntu rather?
[11:28] <pitti>       <method name="forward_search"
[11:29] <pitti>         <return-value transfer-ownership="none">
[11:29] <pitti>           <doc xml:whitespace="preserve">whether a match was found</doc>
[11:29] <pitti>           <type name="gboolean" c:type="gboolean"/>
[11:29] <mvo> pitti: hm, does the test case work for you? or also crashes?
[11:29] <rodrigo_> didrocks, oh, I thought we used the ubuntu branch for that one
[11:30] <rodrigo_> didrocks, updating the u-desktpop branch now
[11:30] <pitti> mvo: yes, it crashes, and only returns two items
[11:30] <didrocks> rodrigo_: thanks :)
[11:30] <pitti> mvo: thanks for the test! looking into it now
[11:30] <mvo> thanks pitti
[11:30] <mvo> pitti: you are right, the gir looks good indeed
[11:32] <pitti> meh, can't built gtk head, needs glib 2.29 and pango 1.29
[11:32]  * pitti builds older version
[11:32] <mvo> when a match is found it does not crash (unsuprisingly I guess)
[11:33] <pitti> mvo: oh, so the returned textiters ought to be None?
[11:33] <pitti> but the C function might not actually write stuff into the result values
[11:33] <mvo> yeah, that is what I suspect
[11:33] <rodrigo_> didrocks, hmm, I think the ubuntu-branch is for gnome-desktop2
[11:33] <mvo> still, makes me wonder why match is not returned
[11:33] <rodrigo_> didrocks, sorry, the ubuntu-desktop branch
[11:33] <pitti> mvo: i. e. when the return code would actually work, one could avoid the crash by checking it
[11:34] <pitti> mvo: aah -- it's overridden
[11:34] <pitti> blatant bug there
[11:34] <didrocks> rodrigo_: oh, you're right, why not creating a debian/ only for gnome-destkop3?
[11:34] <didrocks> so that we have the same workflow everywhere
[11:35] <pitti> mvo: I see the problem, hang on
[11:35] <mvo> pitti: aha, nice. thanks, once you have the fix, please give me the diff so that I can build it locally to continue my porting :)
[11:35] <rodrigo_> didrocks, not sure, let's ask seb when he's back
[11:35] <mvo> pitti: no rush
[11:35] <didrocks> rodrigo_: I think he's more found of no full source :)
[11:35] <pitti> (False, <GtkTextIter at 0x193aad0>, <GtkTextIter at 0x193ab70>)
[11:37] <mvo> !!!
[11:37] <pitti> mvo: the override was done to not actually return a success value
[11:37] <pitti> mvo: so in the real fix it'd return (None, None) instead
[11:38] <pitti> apparently that was done to be more pygtk compatible, or more Pythonic
[11:38] <pitti> mvo: would that work for you?
[11:38] <mvo> sure
[11:38] <mvo> that is the old behavior, if no match is found it would return None iirc
[11:38] <pitti> mvo: can you please patch /usr/share/pyshared/gi/overrides/Gtk.py with http://paste.ubuntu.com/639428/ ?
[11:41] <mvo> pitti: works now, but iirc the old behavior was a single None, I don't changing that though
[11:41] <pitti> mvo: oh, can do as well
[11:41] <pitti> haven't committed yet
[11:41] <mvo> pitti: hold n a sec, I will double check with the old code
[11:42] <pitti> mvo: hmm, http://www.pygtk.org/docs/pygtk/class-gtktextiter.html#method-gtktextiter--forward-search doesn't specify
[11:43] <mvo> pitti: yeah, I noticed that as well
[11:43]  * pitti tries with old gtk in ipython
[11:44] <mvo> pitti: just started the old u-m, there its a single "None"
[11:44] <pitti> confirmed
[11:45] <pitti> >>> iter.forward_search("h", 0, end)
[11:45] <pitti> (<GtkTextIter at 0x1277f20>, <GtkTextIter at 0x1277ed0>)
[11:45] <pitti> >>> iter.forward_search("foo", 0, end)
[11:45] <pitti> >>>
[11:47] <pitti> mvo: http://git.gnome.org/browse/pygobject/commit/?id=fc5c869486c7f6929e285ea7a86623ec41ecd9bd
[11:50] <pitti> mvo: cherrypicked into 2-28 branch as well
[11:50] <pitti> mvo: how soon do you need this in oneiric?
[11:52] <mvo> pitti: there is still a bit of work to make u-m go, so not too soon
[11:55] <pedro_> FYI: seb128 is having issues connecting to IRC he's coming back shortly
[12:10] <rodrigo_> hey pedro_
[12:11] <rodrigo_> pedro_, so, what's needed for having a gnome-control-center bug fixing day?
[12:11] <pedro_> hello rodrigo_
[12:11] <pedro_> rodrigo_, bug fixing day? or a bug day?
[12:11] <rodrigo_> hmm, hopefully both
[12:12] <rodrigo_> both at the same time :)
[12:12] <pedro_> we just need to schedule it
[12:13] <pedro_> rodrigo_, what about next thursday?
[12:13] <pedro_> just checked at the planning page and there's nothing scheduled for it
[12:13] <rodrigo_> pedro_, sounds perfect
[12:13] <pedro_> ok i'll go ahead and schedule it for now
[12:13] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, maybe we should include firefox also?
[12:13] <pedro_> i'll ping you back later to set up the instructions
[12:14] <pedro_> like what would you like to do to bugs with patches etc
[12:18] <rodrigo_> ok
[12:20] <rodrigo_> time for lunch, bbl
[12:22] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, a firefox bug fixing day?
[12:22] <chrisccoulson> you mean that there are bugs in firefox? ;)
[12:22] <njpatel> didrocks, I've updated the indicator vala bindings in my branch, so robert can grab them there
[12:23] <pedro_> chrisccoulson, well compared to unity there's probably none :-P
[12:23] <chrisccoulson> lol
[12:23]  * pedro_ runs and hide
[12:24] <njpatel> pedro_, WHAT!
[12:24] <didrocks> njpatel: oh excellent! nice work dude :)
[12:24] <mvo> pitti: my next pygi question, http://paste.ubuntu.com/639447/ does not produce a popup for me when it should and I'm staring at it with no idea what is wrong. I noticed the popup() itself is no longer used, but popup_for_device
[12:25] <pitti> mvo: pygobject has an override to implement popup()
[12:25] <pitti> so both should work
[12:25] <pitti> and c-j uses it too, so it works in general
[12:26] <seb128> yeah, back!
[12:28] <pitti> wohoo!
[12:28] <pitti> seb128: FYI, james_w | pitti, should be up to date in a few minutes
[12:28] <seb128> pitti, great!
[12:32] <pitti> mvo: hmm, boggle -- by and large the same code works for computer-janitor..
[12:32] <pitti> mvo: except that there are some actual widgets involved
[12:34] <didrocks> wb seb128
[12:34] <didrocks> seb128: pedro was telling that you were slacking ;)
[12:34] <seb128> didrocks, re ;-)
[12:34] <seb128> oh, first he kicks in my door and now he calls me a slacker!
[12:34] <didrocks> heh :-)
[12:35] <didrocks> seb128: about gnome-destkop3, we have no branch up to date in ~ubuntu-desktop. Is it wanted? (only lp:ubuntu/gnome-desktop3, which contains ful source)
[12:35] <didrocks> full*
[12:36] <didrocks> I would be in favor to create a debian/ only one in ~ubuntu-desktop
[12:36] <seb128> didrocks, we are on sync with debian, it's annoying to mainain a vcs for those
[12:36] <seb128> didrocks, do you need to patch it for something?
[12:37] <seb128> didrocks, that and the source is small enough that fetching the source is ok
[12:37] <pitti> something that we could patch in Debian, too?/
[12:37] <didrocks> seb128: are we in sync? 3.1.3-0ubuntu1
[12:37] <mvo> pitti: yeah, I tried to put it on a treeview, same result, I looked at the c-j code and can't spot a difference (that is significant)
[12:37] <seb128> didrocks, that's because we started on 3.1 before them
[12:37] <seb128> didrocks, but we have been in sync until we updated and we plan to sync again when they update
[12:37] <pitti> mvo: the menu items aren't connected to anythign, but that should hardly make a difference
[12:38] <seb128> didrocks, it's annoying to keep a vcs uptodate when we switch between sync and updates
[12:38] <seb128> didrocks, it means we have to manually commit all debian updates while we are on sync
[12:38] <mvo> pitti: yeah, in my real code (in u-m) they are and I get the same behavior
[12:38] <didrocks> seb128: well, same story for most of packages we had in ~ubuntu-desktop then, most of the branchs were just because we were ahead debian. If the politic changed, I'm ok with no vcs
[12:38] <didrocks> would just prefer it was announced :)
[12:38] <pitti> mvo: hm, and can't test with gtk2 :/
[12:38] <seb128> didrocks, not true, most packages have a least a lpi diff
[12:39] <seb128> didrocks, well feel free to update lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop3/ubuntu
[12:39] <didrocks> seb128: I don't care, just that we should have a coherent story there
[12:39] <seb128> or is it lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop/ubuntugtk3?
[12:39] <seb128> didrocks, we will not have a coherent story until everybody use UDD
[12:40] <mvo> pitti: ha! I think I have it, its a ref count issue, if I assign it to something like self.menu its fine
[12:40] <pitti> until then, maintaining Vcs-Bzr: is the best we can do, I think
[12:40] <pitti> mvo: aah
[12:40] <pitti> mvo: because "menu" goes out of scope right after the handler
[12:40] <pitti> mvo: that's why it works in c-j
[12:40] <mvo> yeah
[12:40] <mvo> exactly
[12:40] <mvo> d'oh
[12:40] <seb128> pitti, well the question there is, should everything we change for desktop be in ~ubuntu-desktop or can we use some UDD sources
[12:41] <pitti> we already use UDD for some bits
[12:41] <seb128> pitti, which didrocks seems to have an issue with because it's not consistant
[12:41] <pitti> I think in general the ~u-desktop ones are still more comfortable, but for the situation you described UDD migth be better
[12:41] <pitti> the ~u-desktop ones suck for merging
[12:41] <didrocks> seb128: just that some branches have to be pushed at some place, some not
[12:42] <pitti> I need to leave now, early start/early finish day
[12:42] <pitti> see you tomorrow!
[12:42] <seb128> yeah, we have a mix of UDD and team vcses in the archive
[12:42] <didrocks> seb128: and you really told a lot "I don't want to download the full source everytime because of network bandwidth", but if you changed your opinion on it, it's ok, just tell it clearly :)
[12:42] <seb128> pitti, see you!
[12:42] <didrocks> see you pitti
[12:42] <pitti> UDD just sucks differently
[12:42] <mvo> see you pitti
[12:42] <pitti> it's better for merging, and worse for anythign else IMHO
[12:43] <seb128> didrocks, right, and that's still the case
[12:43] <seb128> didrocks, but gnome-desktop3 is
[12:43] <seb128> - small
[12:43] <seb128> - on sync with debian most of the time
[12:43] <seb128> - can be downloaded by apt-get source, and uploaded the old way without vcs
[12:43] <didrocks> ok, now I know it, that's all, I wasn't aware that we will have to check for those :)
[12:44] <seb128> we don't have good stories for things we sync
[12:44] <didrocks> better explicit than implicit
[12:44] <didrocks> right
[12:44] <seb128> we have a gnome-desktop3 vcs for it
[12:44] <seb128> I just can't be bother to commit each debian sync there
[12:44] <seb128> if you want to do it by my guess
[12:44] <seb128> guest
[12:44] <didrocks> no need to be angry, it was just a question…
[12:45] <seb128> I'm not angry, it just seems a lot of talking and I don't get what you want from the discussion
[12:45] <seb128> the vcs is still in the ubuntu-desktop namespace with debian dir only
[12:45] <seb128> it just got outdated because we went on sync with debian
[12:45]  * mvo is angry at pygi
[12:45] <seb128> which flushed the control vcs info
[12:45] <didrocks> an answer to my question? "about gnome-destkop3, we have no branch up to date in ~ubuntu-desktop. Is it wanted? (only lp:ubuntu/gnome-desktop3, which contains ful source)"
[12:45] <didrocks> so I guess I have it now
[12:45] <seb128> which is unfortunated but I've no reply on how to handle those
[12:46] <didrocks> that's it, no need to make such a lenghty discussion for it…
[12:46] <seb128> short reply "I don't care either way, I want it back in sync with debian when we can"
[12:46] <seb128> ;-)
[12:46] <seb128> if we want a vcs it should be lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop/ubuntugtk3?
[12:46] <seb128> -?
[12:47] <seb128> but I'm fine updating it with apt-get source, dput the old way while we break the syncs because we update before debian
[12:47] <seb128> which is what we have been doing there
[12:48] <didrocks> so ok, just wanted that everyone is on the same page to chase for commits :)
[12:48] <mvo> is it possible to forward from LP to bugzilla now? bug #806949 is a candidate
[12:48] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 806949 in gtk+3.0 "Refcount problem with pygi" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/806949
[12:49] <seb128> mvo, define "forward"? you have for sure a bugzilla account and file GNOME bugs before?
[12:50] <seb128> mvo, or you mean "click a button and get lp to do that for you"? in which case "no" and "we don't want that, it would mean any user could spam bugzilla easily with low quality bugs"
[12:50] <mvo> ok, fair enough, then I will manually forward :)
[12:51] <seb128> mvo, thanks ;-)
[12:52] <Sweetshark> pitti: ping?
[13:03] <seb128> mvo, how is your example working?
[13:03] <seb128> mvo, i.e what do I do to see the issue?
[13:03] <seb128> mvo, ignore me, got it
[13:03] <seb128> it doesn't display the menu as it should
[13:04] <didrocks> seb128: btw, with your super bleeding fast internet, dconf-qt is in new, apart from the qmake -> cmake dep change and the typo you noticed, it should be the same
[13:04] <mvo> seb128: yeah, it should display it, but it only does if I keep a reference to menu
[13:04] <mvo> took me a good while to figure that out
[13:04] <seb128> mvo, right, I can confirm with yesterday's tarballs so feel free to forward it
[13:04] <seb128> didrocks, ok
[13:04] <seb128> didrocks, is there any hurry?
[13:04] <mvo> if I now find out why my gtkbuilder UpdateManager.ui has a odd resize behavior I'm *mostly* done with the port I think
[13:05] <didrocks> seb128: not at all, you have at least 2 weeks I would say :-)
[13:05] <seb128> mvo, \o/
[13:05] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, for once, it's not urgent ;)
[13:05] <seb128> didrocks, great, I will just restart my session once now, if everything works ok I upload gtk3, glib, pango
[13:05] <seb128> then I look at it
[13:05] <seb128> brb
[13:05] <didrocks> seb128: dbus and gtk/gtlib in the same upgrade? I want that! :-)
[13:06] <didrocks> glib*
[13:06] <seb128> ;-)
[13:06] <seb128> didrocks, we need to make those users complaning that oneiric is too stable happy
[13:06] <seb128> ;-)
[13:06] <seb128> brb
[13:06] <didrocks> seb128: agreed, time to push compiz as well!
[13:06] <didrocks> good reboot :)
[13:41] <seb128> pedro_, I cleaned a bit the desktop-bugs subscriptions list
[13:42] <mterry> Anyone feel like NEWing itstool?
[13:43] <seb128> hey mterry
[13:43] <seb128> mterry, can do
[13:43] <mterry> seb128, thanks!
[13:43] <pedro_> seb128, cool, did you added a new one? like telepathy,etc?
[13:44] <seb128> pedro_, not yet
[13:44] <pedro_> seb128, just wondering in case i need to update the 'other packages' page
[13:44] <seb128> pedro_, but I can do that next
[13:45] <seb128> didrocks, dconf-qt newed
[13:45] <didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
[13:49] <seb128> mterry, NEWed
[13:49] <seb128> mterry, is that used in GNOME3.1?
[13:49] <mterry> seb128, yeah, it's used for yelp-tools, which is replacing gnome-doc-utils
[13:49] <seb128> ok
[13:50] <mterry> I'll file a MIR once I get yelp-tools in.  So if you can stick around to NEW that too...  ;)
[13:50] <seb128> ;-)
[14:11] <mterry> seb128, yelp-tools ready for NEW
[14:11] <seb128> mterry, ok
[14:24] <seb128> didrocks, ^ do you have time for a NEW review? just did two and I want to finish some of the updates I'm working on
[14:25] <seb128> will take it in a bit otherwise
[14:25] <didrocks> seb128: sure
[14:25] <seb128> thanks
[14:27] <rodrigo_> heh, just used brasero for burning an iso and it worked
[14:28] <seb128> tell it to pedro_ he keeps saying it's broken!
[14:28] <rodrigo_> yeah, pedro_ ^^
[14:28] <pedro_> it worked? wow
[14:29] <pedro_> rodrigo_, was that like a release iso ? or did you make an iso of music files, etc?
[14:29] <pedro_> for the reports i've seen people complain about the making projects thing, like adding normal data instead of selecting an image and burn it
[14:31] <didrocks> mterry: how did you determine the copyright? there is no header, and GPL2.1+ and LGPL2.1+ are both shipped
[14:31] <rodrigo_> pedro_, a distro iso
[14:31] <mterry> didrocks, from looking at the .in files in tools/
[14:31] <rodrigo_> pedro_, in fact, I remember having problems burning a music iso
[14:31] <pedro_> rodrigo_, ah that's why it worked :-P
[14:31] <mterry> didrocks, only thing with a header.  The COPYING files seem copied from gnome-doc-utils (very obvious if you look at the COPYING file itself)
[14:32] <pedro_> rodrigo_, yeah things like that aren't really working 'that' fine
[14:32] <pedro_> not smooth as k3b for example
[14:32] <didrocks> mterry: waow, interesting that's in a .in file ;) even licencecheck ignore it :)
[14:32] <didrocks> mterry: Format: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/dep/web/deps/dep5.mdwn?op=file&rev=166
[14:32] <didrocks> is that wanted? I remember you chasing me to use the old url :p
[14:33] <mterry> didrocks, that's the spec'd url isn't it?
[14:33] <mterry> (though I do think it's ugly)
[14:34] <didrocks> mterry: I think there is a shorter now (and that one point on nothing)
[14:34] <didrocks> one sec
[14:34] <didrocks> http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5 ?
[14:34] <didrocks> mterry: that's what dh_make is creating
[14:35] <mterry> didrocks, but look at the actual spec (search for svn.debian)
[14:35] <mterry> didrocks, dh_make is creating an unversioned format, which the dep5 authors didn't want (they liked the rev=XXX part of the URL)
[14:36] <mterry> In reality, who cares, but it's odd that there's a disconnect there (especially that the spec'd url is a bogus one)
[14:36] <didrocks> mterry: shouldn't it be http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/dep?view=revision&revision=174 ?
[14:36] <didrocks> as 166 isn't working
[14:36] <mvo> seb128: the goal is to GIify glib and gobject as well, right? I just found that GLib.markup_escape_text() needs the len of the string, this is so un-pythoninc
[14:36] <didrocks> mterry: acking your package, I hate those url too, if you can just fix later so that it points on something which works :)
[14:37] <mterry> didrocks, but anything else wouldn't be to-spec!  :)
[14:37] <didrocks> mterry: heh ;)
[14:38] <mterry> didrocks, well, I'm serious.  I don't know as if we have any parsers right now, and they will probably be generous in what they accept, but if I start changing the URL to non-spec'd things, they will have a harder time of it
[14:38] <mterry> didrocks, the format line is more for parsers than humans
[14:38] <rodrigo_> how can I detect from code if the current distro is ubuntu? I only see /etc/debian_version
[14:39] <mterry> (i think)
[14:39] <didrocks> mterry: I let it go, but the priority should be extra IMHO
[14:39] <cyphermox> rodrigo_: lsb_release -i works
[14:39] <mvo> rodrigo_: lsb_release -i should tell
[14:39] <mvo> heh :)
[14:39] <didrocks> mterry: right, the thing is that the link it leading to an error on the vcs right now
[14:39] <cyphermox> ;)
[14:39] <rodrigo_> cyphermox, mvo: ok, thanks
[14:40] <mvo> (or -i -c if you want to get rid of prefix)
[14:40] <didrocks> mterry: I'm still puzzled about what the right format/version we should use in the url-spec
[14:40] <seb128> mvo, yes, they add overrides in pygobject when needed
[14:40] <mterry> didrocks, extra is better, thanks.  will change next upload
[14:40] <didrocks> mterry: great, I locally built the bin package and they are good, I'll ack them once built
[14:41] <mterry> didrocks, me too.  looking at the text again, it seems to not say that you must use that format it provides.  Just says "url of the spec"
[14:41] <mterry> didrocks, so if you got the spec from mycoolspecs.com, I guess you could put that in...
[14:41] <didrocks> mterry: yeah, it can be widely interpreted ;)
[14:41]  * didrocks tries mycoolspecs.com, maybe it exists!
[14:41] <seb128> mvo, hum, are the lsb tools still writen in python? wouldn't be easier to read /etc/lsb... than spawning a python interpreter?
[14:41] <mvo> GLib.timeout_add_seconds … introspectable="0"
[14:42] <mvo> *sigh*
[14:42] <didrocks> mterry: no, time to register it? ;)
[14:42] <mterry> didrocks, :)
[14:42] <mvo> seb128: well, there is "import lsb_release" and get_lsb_information() in it, that should be fine as well
[14:43] <mvo> seb128: reading the file is not ideal as it *may* change in the future (also I doubt it ever will ;)
[14:43] <seb128> mvo, well my point was that from a C file you probably to read the text file rather than running a python interpreter
[14:43] <seb128> mvo, seems way slower to run python just to get the distro
[14:44] <mvo> sure, its slower. the file format is not guaranteed that is why its not encouraged. if the speed/mem is a issue, then it should be fine to read it directly
[15:13] <mterry> didrocks, maybe I asked for NEW too soon?  yelp-tools finished building and says it is in NEW queue
[15:14] <didrocks> mterry: you are quite quick ;) I checked for binary new like 10 minutes before and it wasn't there
[15:14] <seb128> mterry, what is in NEW?
[15:14] <mterry> didrocks, oh that's a separate NEW check I guess.  itstool has same issue
[15:14] <mterry> There is a check for source + a check for binaries?
[15:14] <seb128> NEW?
[15:14] <seb128> yes
[15:14] <mterry> seb128, makes sense
[15:14] <didrocks> mterry: rightn you have source NEW, then if acked, the package build
[15:14] <seb128> that's why you hit new on soname changes
[15:14] <seb128> or when adding a binary
[15:15] <didrocks> mterry: and we have to ack for every arch
[15:15] <didrocks> (binary NEW)
[15:15] <didrocks> acked yelp-tools for i386, but still waited for the other archs
[15:17] <seb128> didrocks, don't wait too much it's arch all ;-)
[15:17] <seb128> you might still be there next year waiting otherwise
[15:17] <didrocks> seb128: no, I will keep refreshing the page! :)
[15:17] <seb128> ;-)
[15:17] <seb128> we will pick you up for UDS
[15:17] <seb128> don't worry
[15:17] <didrocks> need to be rebooted? :-)
[15:18] <seb128> lol
[15:18] <mterry> :)
[15:18] <seb128> tedg, so, how is the indicator-session user switch merge request going?
[15:18] <seb128> tedg, going to land for today's tarballs? ;-)
[15:21] <seb128> bah, another libindicator transition
[15:21] <seb128> stop those!
[15:21] <chrisccoulson> ooh, http://tech.slashdot.org/story/11/07/07/140204/Thunderbird-Unseats-Evolution-In-Ubuntu-1110
[15:21] <chrisccoulson> not that i normally read /. ;)
[15:22] <tedg> seb128, Yeah, this is the fallout from avoiding one last cycle and having two scroll functions.  A broken one and a correct one.  We're finally dropping the broken one.
[15:22] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you clearly don't have enough work if you read slashdor
[15:22] <seb128> t
[15:22] <seb128> chrisccoulson, but I can fix that for you! ;-)
[15:23] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i don't read it. m_conley tweeted it ;)
[15:23] <seb128> oh, you read tweets, that's better :p
[15:24] <seb128> tedg, ok, what about the user switching question? ;-)
[15:24] <seb128> didrocks, do you remember what error you got when trying to delete the gnome-desktop3 merge request?
[15:24] <seb128> didrocks, it worked for me
[15:25] <didrocks> seb128: no, I didn't delete it on purpose, I couldn't "reject"
[15:25] <seb128> oh ok
[15:25] <seb128> you wrote "Set it as WIP and add a comment about it as couldn't delete it." in your email
[15:25] <seb128> which got me confused
[15:25] <didrocks> seb128: I didn't delete the MR, because I think that james_w wants maybe to fix this and that we don't keep unused cruft branch
[15:25] <seb128> well it's deleted now :p
[15:25] <didrocks> argh, I'm really tired I guess :/
[15:25] <didrocks> seb128: well, there are plenty of other examples ;)
[15:25] <seb128> ;-)
[15:26] <didrocks> so that's fine!
[15:26] <mterry> didrocks, can you binary-NEW itstool too?  (ubuntu2 is now arch-all so should just need i386)
[15:26] <didrocks> mterry: well, I'll bin new them then, let me check the package
[15:27] <mterry> didrocks, if you love working on yelp-tools/itstool, have I got a MIR for you!
[15:28]  * didrocks fires up a dconf-qt MIR to protect himself :)
[15:29] <mterry> Nothing like a nice MIR arms race
[15:29] <didrocks> mterry: subscribe me to them, I'll have a look at them tomorrow morning (should be good or yelp-tools, need to look at itstool)
[15:29] <didrocks> heh, indeed :)
[15:29] <didrocks> for*
[15:29] <mterry> didrocks, done.  they are both super trivial
[15:30] <tedg> seb128, ronoc is working on the user switching.  I don't think he'll be done today, but it's in good shape.  Definitely next week.
[15:31] <seb128> tedg, you saw robert_ancell merge request right?
[15:31] <seb128> tedg, i.e conor is not redoing the work right?
[15:32] <didrocks> mterry: will do that tomorrow morning before going to the train station :)
[15:32] <mterry> didrocks, sure, no rush
[15:32] <tedg> seb128, Yes, he shouldn't be.
[15:32] <seb128> ok, great
[15:32] <didrocks> waow, I can do what I wanted to do in 4 lines of python to merge two images :)
[15:34] <seb128> hum
[15:34] <seb128> is indicator-messages not indicating what is running for others as well?
[15:34] <seb128> is the >
[15:34] <seb128> is->ie
[15:35] <mterry> seb128, yeah it's gone for me
[15:35] <cyphermox> yup, confirming
[15:35] <seb128> ok, good, not only me ;-)
[15:35] <seb128> ok, enough packaging for today
[15:35] <mterry> I see an indicator in the sound menu, so probably not a gtk3 transition issue...
[15:35] <seb128> let's take an hour of bug triage and filing
[15:36] <seb128>     self.setdata()
[15:36] <seb128>   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/duplicity/path.py", line 493, in setdata
[15:36] <seb128>     self.stat = os.lstat(self.name)
[15:36] <seb128> OSError: [Errno 107] Transport endpoint is not connected: '/home/seb128/.gvfs'
[15:36] <seb128> booubouh deja-dup!
[15:37] <seb128> mterry, deja-dup hates me
[15:37] <seb128> he does that when I click on "backup now"
[15:37] <mterry> seb128, ugh!  I've gotten reports of that error and I can't figure it out.  Are you connected to internet?
[15:37] <seb128> it does it in a consistent way
[15:38] <seb128> mterry, I guess so, can you read what I type on IRC?
[15:38] <seb128> (it's the box I'm working on)
[15:38] <mterry> seb128, :)
[15:38] <seb128> mterry, well it's doing it every time I click the button
[15:38] <seb128> so I can get you debug infos if you have questions
[15:38] <mterry> ls -l ~/.gvfs?
[15:39] <seb128> ls: cannot access .gvfs: Transport endpoint is not connected
[15:39] <mterry> OK, so it's not just deja-dup being crazy
[15:39] <seb128> is .gvfs supposed to be mounted when you didn't use gvfs?
[15:40] <mterry> (duplicity shouldn't be stat'ing that folder anyway, since we exclude it, but...)
[15:40] <mterry> seb128, I don't know.  It's maintained by gvfs-fuse I think...
[15:40] <seb128> hum
[15:40] <seb128> it works on a fresh login on my test box
[15:40] <seb128> so I guess gvfs got screwed during the course of the day
[15:41] <mterry> seb128, yeah, whenever I get a report of this, a reboot fixes things
[15:41] <seb128> so gvfs bug and duplicity,deja-dup not being robust to it
[15:41] <mterry> seb128, but haven't been able to track it down
[15:41] <didrocks> mterry: acked itstool -0ubuntu2 btw
[15:42] <seb128> mterry, ok, trivial to get
[15:42] <mterry> didrocks, thanks
[15:42] <seb128> mterry, kill gvfs-fuse and try using deja-dup
[15:42] <mterry> seb128, fascinating
[15:42] <seb128> just got it on my test box
[15:44] <mterry> seb128, sounds a bit like bug 212789
[15:44] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 212789 in gvfs "gvfs fuse mount is not functional after logout and subsequent login" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212789
[15:44] <seb128> mterry, yes
[15:45] <seb128> mterry, right, there is a gvfs issue there, but as you said deja-dup or duplicity should ignore .gvfs anyway
[15:46] <seb128> mterry, do you want a bug report or did you get some about it already?
[15:46] <mterry> seb128, I can re-open an old one
[15:46] <mterry> seb128, which process do you kill?   i don't have a fuse process running
[15:46] <seb128> mterry, gvfs-fuse
[15:46] <mterry> seb128, ah, didn't even have it installed...
[15:46] <seb128> ah ;-)
[15:48] <seb128> mterry, you can run /usr/lib/gvfs/gvfs-fuse-daemon .gvfs
[15:50] <mterry> Hrm, not sufficient to trigger.  Let me try to connect to a server
[15:52] <mterry> seb128, nope.  even after connecting to something and killing the fuse daemon, ~/.gvfs is clean for me
[15:52]  * mterry wishes he could break things like seb128 can
[15:53] <seb128> mterry, how do you kill the daemon?
[15:53] <mterry> killall
[15:53] <mterry> let me try -9
[15:53] <seb128> I did -9
[15:53] <seb128> not sure if that makes a difference
[15:53] <mterry> seb128, yup, it does  :)
[15:53] <seb128> ;-)
[16:07] <mterry> seb128, bug 794576 btw (thanks for your help, now I'll just dive into duplicity and figure out why we're stat'ing it)
[16:07] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 794576 in deja-dup "Transport endpoint is not connected" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/794576
[16:07] <seb128> mterry, thanks
[16:09] <seb128> pedro_, can you upstream bug #805311
[16:09] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 805311 in gnome-bluetooth "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_instance_get_private() (device_services_changed)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805311
[16:09] <seb128> I can confirm here
[16:09] <mvo> eh, what is wrong with using setting_name in gsettings instead of settings-name ?!? why was this restriction added?
[16:09] <seb128> mvo, consistency I guess
[16:09] <seb128> mvo, gconf was a mix of _ and - which is confusing
[16:12] <mvo> ok
[16:12] <mvo> at least there is a reaosn :)
[16:15] <seb128> pedro_, don't bother I do it
[16:15] <pedro_> seb128, i'm about to click on submit :-P
[16:15] <seb128> pedro_, ok, great ;-)
[16:19] <seb128> pedro_, the bug report was on 3.0.2 btw, not 3.0.3 but I checked it still happens
[16:19] <seb128> pedro_, the stacktrace lines might just be different
[16:25] <didrocks> jibel: thanks for your report! I'm sure it will be really useful :)
[16:27] <seb128> didrocks, stop encouraging spammers!
[16:27] <didrocks> seb128: I agree it's quite depressing sometimes, but needed :-)
[16:28] <seb128> ;-)
[16:28] <didrocks> but see, there are bugs for everyone! ;)
[16:28] <seb128> didrocks, oh, new zg and zg-datahub uploads to debian
[16:28] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, I saw that, I'll try to get the merge tomorrow (it has some reduced mem consumption)
[16:28] <didrocks> if not, would you like to handle that? :)
[16:29] <didrocks> (still feeling a little bit sick, will stop working soon)
[16:30] <jibel> didrocks, thanks for introducing bugs! at least there's something to write in the report ;-)
[16:30] <seb128> didrocks, the merge is a one liner to add one char to a build-depends ;-)
[16:31] <seb128> didrocks, if you don't manage to do it tomorrow I think I can find an hour for it :p
[16:31] <seb128> didrocks, we should ask rainct to add | to the build-depends in debian so we can sync
[16:31] <didrocks> seb128: the thing is that with all the incoming changes, it still need some testing
[16:31] <didrocks> seb128: already done, but I think he forgot about it, will try to spam him again :)
[16:31] <seb128> it will maybe fix the segfault that apport keeps reporting on loging ;-)
[16:32] <didrocks> jibel: it's just to ensure you have some work :)
[16:32] <didrocks> seb128: this one is fixed AFAIK, yes
[16:36] <seb128> didrocks, let me try the new zg
[16:36] <didrocks> seb128: oh, you want to do it now? nice :)
[16:36] <seb128> didrocks, well I can build and install it if you need testing
[16:36] <didrocks> seb128: datahub is just mterry's double patch IIRC, that could be set to debian I guess :)
[16:37] <mterry> didrocks, not the nodisplay one, that is ubuntu-specific for now
[16:37] <mterry> didrocks, (GNOME didn't want our patch to gnome-session to respect the key)
[16:38] <didrocks> mterry: hum, we can maybe put the change in debian/patches/ubuntu.series
[16:38] <didrocks> mterry: or do you want to update zg-datahub? ;)
[16:38] <mterry> didrocks, sure.  and really, they could accept the patch, it wouldn't hurt anything in debian to have nodisplay
[16:39] <didrocks> let me talk with rainct if he's there
[16:40] <seb128> ok
[16:41] <seb128> mterry, oh, they didn't want to? why?
[16:41] <didrocks> seb128: we can forget about zg-datahub, it's just an upload to make it into unstable with a bug number
[16:41] <mterry> seb128, they felt it was an overloading of the spec, that nodisplay was only for menus in the panel
[16:41] <didrocks> so if it's only zg, I can double check, should be quick
[16:42] <didrocks> seb128: just to ensure we don't duplicate the work, should I do it now? ^
[16:42] <seb128> desrt, what was the issue ricotz was having building glib during the rally? one of the gdbus tests hanging?
[16:42] <seb128> mterry, ok
[16:42] <seb128> didrocks, yes, please do
[16:42] <didrocks> rainct isn't there, I'll send him an email for the additional dep
[16:48] <didrocks> seb128: the zg change isn't the fts one, it's just doko making a build-dep change not reported to debian
[16:48] <seb128> didrocks, right
[16:49] <didrocks> ok, I was on the fts naming which diverged :)
[16:49] <seb128> I though we were speaking about the same thing when I said a one line, one char change ;-)
[16:49] <seb128> sorry about the confusion
[16:49] <didrocks> no worry, anyway, both should be in debian to enable sync
[16:49] <seb128> both?
[16:50] <seb128> is fts still required?
[16:51] <didrocks> yeah, it's used to scan documentation content
[16:52] <didrocks> but it's called zeitgeist-extension-fts in ubuntu (where it was first) and zeitgeist-fts-extension in debian
[16:52] <didrocks> so, we have a transitional package in ubuntu
[16:52] <seb128> ok
[16:56] <didrocks> session restart, brb
[17:00] <didrocks> seb128: no crash at logout \o/
[17:00] <didrocks> nautilus does, though ;)
[17:14] <didrocks> seb128: why did you assign me the bug about session saving not working? it's disabled
[17:15] <kenvandine> woot... i have a power indicator in my panel now :)
[17:16]  * kenvandine is much happier
[17:16] <chrisccoulson> heh, my power indicator will only have 1 state
[17:16] <chrisccoulson> "EMPTY"
[17:16] <chrisccoulson> ;)
[17:21] <didrocks> seb128: I added a rationale, unassigned and call for help
[17:42] <kenvandine> hey tedg
[17:44] <tedg> kenvandine, Howdy
[17:44] <kenvandine> tedg, now i just need a release tarball for indicator-power
[17:45] <kenvandine> packaging is done
[17:45] <kenvandine> tedg, i did just propose a branch which needs to be merged before releasing though
[17:45] <kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/indicator-power/packaging_fixes/+merge/67229
[18:29] <kenvandine> seb128, indicator-power uploaded, in source NEW
[18:47] <seb128> kenvandine, seems fine from a glance
[18:48] <seb128> kenvandine, but I think I will just keep the indicator stack in new for the night and get those in at the start of the day tomorrow
[18:48] <kenvandine> seb128, indeed
[18:48] <kenvandine> seb128, the whole stack is being updated again
[18:48] <kenvandine> for new libindicator
[18:48] <seb128> right
[18:49] <seb128> btw speak of libindicator
[18:49] <seb128> do you know why it has no gir or vapi?
[18:49] <kenvandine> seb128, however, the current indicator-power doesn't use the new libindicator
[18:49] <seb128> robert_ancell was asking about it this morning
[18:49] <kenvandine> nope
[18:49] <seb128> he needs it for lightdm
[18:49] <kenvandine> humm
[18:49] <seb128> njpatel said he would get one updated today
[18:49] <kenvandine> njpatel tweeted about updating libindicator vapi this morning
[18:49] <seb128> right, neil picked up on that
[18:50] <kenvandine> cool
[18:50] <seb128> still I'm wondering why there was none, i.e if there was a reason, I know there was some gir namespacing issues for some sources
[18:50] <kenvandine> didn't make the release
[18:50] <kenvandine> i think just that nobody has needed to create a new indicator in vala
[18:50] <kenvandine> i guess
[18:51] <kenvandine> tedg, ^^
[18:51] <kenvandine> seb128, libindicate-gtk still has the namespace problem
[18:51]  * kenvandine grumbles at tedg AGAIN :)
[18:52] <njpatel> seb128, it's done
[18:52] <seb128> njpatel, \o/
[18:53] <njpatel> there isn't any as it's way difficult to make it part of the build, it needs to link to the installed library to make the vapi....not sure if the gi is enoug
[18:53] <seb128> njpatel, can you drop an email to robert_ancell about it?
[18:53] <njpatel> but I'm going to see if we can patch vapigen to be more clever
[18:53] <njpatel> seb128, sure!
[18:53] <seb128> njpatel, thanks ;-)
[18:54] <njpatel> done :)
[18:58] <kenvandine> tedg, does today's indicator-session require libindicator6?
[19:00] <tedg> kenvandine, Yes
[19:00] <kenvandine> ok
[19:00] <kenvandine> damn... power just flickered here
[19:00] <kenvandine> damn thunderstorm
[19:00] <seb128> lol
[19:00] <kenvandine> if i drop off line, it is because my power went out :)
[19:00] <seb128> when you wrote that I though you were speaking about the indicator
[19:01] <kenvandine> haha
[19:01]  * kenvandine is very happy to have power displayed in the panel
[19:01] <tedg> We're going to have to get kenvandine to test the UPS features.
[19:01] <kenvandine> less happy about a power outage :)
[19:01] <seb128> we should put a "i" before the names to make clear it's indicator
[19:01] <seb128> ipower
[19:01] <kenvandine> my cable modem isn't plugged into a UPS :)
[19:01] <kenvandine> haha
[19:01] <tedg> kenvandine, I did that to my DSL modem and router.  Too many outages here.
[19:01] <pitti> Sweetshark: hello
[19:02] <kenvandine> tedg, it is really rare here
[19:02] <tedg> Laptop on battery, everything else on UPS.
[19:02] <seb128> pitti, you called it a day, go back to !work ;-)
[19:02] <kenvandine> tedg, i should though... just nothing else in the same room needing a UPS
[19:02] <pitti> seb128: still in a train :)
[19:02] <tedg> kenvandine, I picked up a cheap one when Circuit City went under.
[19:02] <seb128> pitti, 3g for the win? ;-)
[19:02] <pitti> seb128: or rather, just went into it -- before we were travelling in a car, where a laptop is impractical
[19:03] <tedg> kenvandine, Won't last long, but they don't draw much power.
[19:03] <pitti> (we went with a colleague of my wife to Leipzig, and now doing the remaining bit to Dresden with train)
[19:03] <pitti> seb128: yeah, the builtin antenna of the x201 is marvellous
[19:04] <seb128> pitti, (oh ok, are you at work tomorrow or having a day off?)
[19:05] <pitti> seb128: I'm officially at work
[19:05] <seb128> ok
[19:07] <pitti> seb128: we went a day early as the uni of my wife does a ceremony/party for this year's graduates
[19:07] <pitti> seb128: so I'll work from Dresden tomorrow
[19:07] <seb128> ah ok
[19:23] <pitti> so, see you tomorrow! good night
[19:25] <seb128> 'night pitti
[21:32] <jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: reading some back scroll...you have power indicator? yay! when do the rest of us poor slubs get one ;)
[21:38] <kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, it needs an archive admin to let it in :)
[21:38] <kenvandine> seb said tomorrow
[21:38] <jasoncwarner_> ah, ok
[21:39] <jasoncwarner_> anyone here know why I ended up in Unity-2d after my update this morning? I didn't see anything screaming at me like X/Mesa or NVidia, though, to be fair, it was a scan of the list :P
[21:39] <jasoncwarner_> happy to be in unity 2d though...reporting some bugs now!
[21:43] <cyphermox> hey jasoncwarner_
[21:43] <jasoncwarner_> what up, cyphermox
[21:43] <jasoncwarner_> ?
[21:43] <cyphermox> heh
[21:43] <cyphermox> nm-applet will create menu only when you click it?
[21:44] <cyphermox> I'm satisfied enough with the code to upload shortly
[21:45] <jasoncwarner_> say again? I click on it and the menu is created, yes
[21:45] <cyphermox> yes
[21:45] <cyphermox> usually it gets recreated every few seconds, or after we get scan results, etc
[21:45] <cyphermox> now it gets refreshed when you click on it, just before displaying
[21:49] <jasoncwarner_> oh, ok
[21:49] <jasoncwarner_> :)
[21:49] <jasoncwarner_> gotta reboot...removed nvidia drivers to see if that was problem with 3D...be back
[21:56] <bryceh> jasoncwarner_, lp #807209 perhaps
[21:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 807209 in nvidia-graphics-drivers "Lost glx after first upgrade from oneirc alpha 2 install" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/807209
[22:04] <jasoncwarner_> bryceh: yeah, looks like it
[22:04] <jasoncwarner_> and also, my system seems very laggy now....(debugging)


[00:02] <Red_HamsterX> OpenID finally makes sense!
[00:26]  * Red_HamsterX pushes an schema that should capture all needs for the server.
[00:27] <Red_HamsterX> I'm pretty sure it'll do everything, though, so that's ten hours well-spent.
[00:29] <godbyk> One can but hope. ;-)
[02:17] <Red_HamsterX> Lawl, "an schema".
[02:52]  * Red_HamsterX fixes issues, allowing the system to actually run.
[02:52] <Red_HamsterX> (Not that it does anything right now)
[04:51] <godbyk> Hey, Red_HamsterX.. for some screenshots in the future, I'd like to be able to annotate them (using numbers or arrows, etc.).  Do you think this is something Quickshot could do or help with?
[05:17] <Red_HamsterX> Not directly, but it should be easy enough to make a script that'll overlay annotations on the captured images.
[05:18] <Red_HamsterX> Like what we did to clean up the button order.
[05:19] <Red_HamsterX> Like, just draw on top of one image, then save the layer and batch-apply that to all other languages.
[05:19] <Red_HamsterX> (With exceptions for RTL stuff)
[05:19] <Red_HamsterX> I could hack that in about half an hour, with config files.
[05:22] <godbyk> Right.
[05:22] <godbyk> The only iffy part is how to handle the different languages.
[05:22] <godbyk> Not just LTR and RTL issues, but also different translations have different length words. So the offsets will vary.
[05:22] <Red_HamsterX> Oh, not just numerals?
[05:23] <Red_HamsterX> Hmm...
[05:23] <Red_HamsterX> It doesn't seem like it'd be terribly hard to do...
[05:24] <Red_HamsterX> Layer overlay for circles and stuff (since those should be similar in most languages) and (x,y) anchors for text.
[05:24] <Red_HamsterX> With smart placement rules to prevent strings from going off edges.
[05:25] <godbyk> Well creating the overlay elements is easy.
[05:25] <godbyk> But if I want to point at, say, the help icon in the panel..
[05:25] <godbyk> that x offset varies depending on the language.
[05:26] <Red_HamsterX> If processing power is a non-issue, we could brute-force-scan the image for matching pixels.
[05:26] <Red_HamsterX> (Or spend time finding a less-stupid algorithm)
[05:26] <Red_HamsterX> (Someone's probably written one)
[05:27] <Red_HamsterX> (If not, I'm decent at problems like that)
[05:28] <godbyk> well, the reason I asked about incorporating it into quickshot is because I figured quickshot could potentially record that info when it takes the image.
[05:28] <godbyk> grab the (x,y) coordinates of the center of that panel icon, for instance.
[05:28] <godbyk> using some snazzy API that someone else has already written.. whatever that may be. :)
[05:28] <Red_HamsterX> Maybe the panel exposes docklet data...
[05:29] <Red_HamsterX> But, yeah, that could be worth looking into.
[05:29] <Red_HamsterX> Though it'd complicate out-of-flow hacks.
[05:30] <Red_HamsterX> Since that sort of data would need to be stored as a tag againt the file.
[05:31] <Red_HamsterX> Can you add a list of things you might want to highlight to http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/f0VIdaLXWZ ?
[05:31] <Red_HamsterX> Anywhere's fine.
[05:32] <godbyk> Sure.
[05:32] <Red_HamsterX> It doesn't have to be a complete list. I just want to know if I should contemplate this feature as a project-specific hack or an architectural necessity.
[05:33] <Red_HamsterX> (While it's still early enough to easily add such things to the plan)
[05:36] <godbyk> Right.
[05:36] <godbyk> I just remembered when we first started taking screenshots that I wanted to annotate some.
[05:37] <godbyk> For the desktop one, for instance, I wanted to point out the panels, what the icons on the panels meant, etc.
[05:37] <godbyk> Basically, put labels on the screenshot so we don't have to come up with insane textual descriptions all the time.
[06:01] <godbyk> Okay, it's midnight here and I have a meeting in the morning, so I'm headed to bed.
[06:01] <godbyk> See you guys later!
[06:11] <humphreybc> godbyk, a meeting!?
[06:11] <humphreybc> a MEETING!
[06:11] <godbyk-android> Yep. New job = weekly meetings.
[06:12] <nisshh> humphreybc: i have a meeting tonight as well
[06:12] <nisshh> hehe
[06:13] <humphreybc> godbyk, you have a job now?
[06:13] <humphreybc> my team is falling apart! You guys can't get employed!
[06:13] <humphreybc> We rely on your hours and hours of slave labour
[06:13] <nisshh> hehe, nah its my loco meeting
[06:14] <nisshh> humphreybc: welcome back by the way!
[06:15] <godbyk-android> LOL
[06:15] <humphreybc> danke :)
[06:16] <nisshh> the break from the manual has been good, iv almost got a new release of my app out
[06:23] <humphreybc> nice
[06:23] <humphreybc> what app?
[06:39] <humphreybc> http://twitpic.com/1oj826
[06:42] <nisshh> hehe, was concetrating: https://edge.launchpad.net/pytask
[06:43] <nisshh> rick spencer was helping me with it last night
[06:45] <nisshh> humphreybc: should get a new release out by the end of this month
[06:46] <humphreybc> sweet!
[06:47] <nisshh> humphreybc: so what did you find out at uds?
[06:48] <humphreybc> lots of stuff!
[06:48] <humphreybc> everyone loves UMP and OMG
[06:48] <nisshh> cool
[06:49] <nisshh> also, check the mailing list for a few mails from various doc teams
[06:49] <humphreybc> kay
[06:49] <humphreybc> we had a pretty good session at UDS about collaboration
[06:49] <humphreybc> any email back from Matt East yet?
[06:49] <nisshh> dunno
[06:50] <nisshh> not in my hotmail...
[06:52] <nisshh> hmm, not to the list, but just a few bug reports and stuff on lp
[09:57] <thorwil> godbyk: hi, no need to bother with the making-beautiful-fonts video if you haven't already, screen is outside of camera view :/
[12:37] <ubuntujenkins> +1
[12:37] <ubuntujenkins> ?quickshot > ubuntujenkins
[12:37] <quickshotdevs> ubuntujenkins, please see my private message
[15:16] <godbyk> thorwil: thanks for the heads-up.  I don't s'pose anyone's posted the slides yet?
[15:44] <thorwil> godbyk: no. Iain is on it
[15:47] <godbyk> cool
[15:47] <godbyk> thorwil: also, totally agree with your take on the use of the word 'intuitive' in discussing usability issues.
[15:47] <godbyk> it's overused and is entirely too ambiguous to use in those conversations.
[15:48] <godbyk> having said that, however, I've actually been ignoring the ayatana emails of late because there are too many of them and they don't contain enough substance.
[15:49] <thorwil> yeah, 2 or 3 much too wordy people
[16:03]  * Red_HamsterX enjoys being loquacious. :(
[16:03] <Red_HamsterX> Hence my rediculously huge nick.
[16:03] <Red_HamsterX> ridiculosuly*
[16:04] <Red_HamsterX> (The handle I use on other networks has been abandoned for over a year on Freenode, but I have no idea who to speak to about getting it released)
[16:05] <Red_HamsterX> (And I still use this name to sign code and stuff, so...)
[16:41] <ubuntujenkins>  Red_HamsterX http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#unusednick
[16:42] <ubuntujenkins> I guess #freenode would be the place to find a staffer
[16:49] <Red_HamsterX> Ah, yes. I suppose I could have just used Google.
[16:50] <ubuntujenkins> lol I had read that page before
[16:50] <Red_HamsterX> I'm used to just knowing the ops on networks I frequent.
[16:57] <flan> Yay for shorter, less-silly-looking nicknames.
[16:58] <flan> Now I can confuse people.
[16:58]  * flan updates his Launchpad page for sanity's sake.
[16:58] <flan> Thanks, ubuntujenkins. :)
[16:59] <ubuntujenkins> flan: no more Red_HamsterX then :(
[16:59] <ubuntujenkins> I am going to get confused for a day or two :P
[17:01] <flan> Well, I could use both...
[17:01] <flan> Rename my bot or something.
[17:01] <ubuntujenkins> no its cool I will learn :)
[17:07] <flan> Handles with underscores in them are pretentious.
[17:08]  * flan self-asserts facts.
[18:37] <c7p> hey godbyk :)
[18:59] <thorwil> godbyk: heh, linux libertine used for the redone wikipedia logo: http://www.underconsideration.com/brandnew/archives/around_the_world_in_51_characters.php
[20:17] <flan> Random survey: how many people here have actually used a hex editor?