[12:11] <Yagisan> tseng: yep. seems like braindead makefiles. linpng is another that ignores CC
[12:11] <Yagisan> s/linpng/libpng
[12:11] <tseng> yeah
[12:11] <tseng> that will be a huge problem
[12:15] <Yagisan> tseng: well, at least I can patch that, butthis is taking a bit of the fun out of it. I should start mass filling bugs on apps that ignore CC, CFLAGS and kin
[12:16] <tseng> you could
[12:16] <tseng> but it would take a lifetime to actually get results
[12:16] <tseng> this is why pappy- patched the specfiles
[12:17] <tseng> to default ssp and pie
[12:21] <Yagisan> tseng: so, I'd need to file bugs on apps that ignore CFLAGS to turn off SSP then ;)
[12:21] <tseng> no
[12:21] <tseng> we could turn it off
[12:23] <Yagisan> tseng: ideally, I'd like to see the core libs protected, then as it is shown they work, progressively add other applications
[12:24] <tseng> i need to find the eclass i wrote for ssp
[12:24] <tseng> http://mirror.etf.bg.ac.yu/gentoorsync/eclass/flag-o-matic.eclass
[12:25] <tseng> search for fstack
[12:32] <Yagisan> tseng: I need to head out now, I'll investigate more of the makefiles from hell when I get back
[12:32] <Yagisan> tseng: feel free to nitpick anything on my research page
[01:10] <bddebian> Heya gang
[01:23] <bddebian> Heya crimsun_
[01:25] <crimsun_> 'lo bddebian
[01:39] <bddebian> crimsun_: Got a minute by any chance?
[01:41] <bddebian> Anyone have a minute to explain install ... vs. <pgk>.install vs dh_install?  I should say when to use what?    What's the matter?
[02:00] <raphink> bddebian: about celestia, I think all you have to do is install this .desktop in celestia-common rather than celestia
[02:00] <raphink> tritium: I'd like to understand
[02:00] <bddebian> tritium: He has no money afaiui
[02:00] <tritium> bddebian: that's no reason to give up membership
[02:00] <Tonio_> I must say it is a bit hard to understand....
[02:01] <bddebian> raphink: All I did was add celestia-glut.desktop to the celestia-glut package as far as I know
[02:02] <Tonio_> I hope he will does what he needs to be as ine as possible, but....
[02:02] <crimsun_> bddebian: sorry, I'm at a LUG meeting hacking on ALSA
[02:02] <raphink> ah?
[02:02] <bddebian> crimsun_: No worries, I'm starting to think I'm helpless anyway :-(
[02:04] <tritium> Well, my thoughts are with \sh...
[02:08] <jah_raztah> the Gnomebaker in ubuntu repositories are built with gstreamer0.8-mad for mp3 support in gnomebaker, the gstreamer0.8-mad has some problems and issues, thus is it possible for gnomebaker to use another library for mp3, preferably the gstreamer.10-ugly packages which is also used by rhythmbox and sepertine
[02:24] <crimsun_> bddebian: bah, hardlfy
[02:24] <crimsun_> hardly^
[02:24] <bddebian> ?
[02:24] <crimsun_> "helpless"?
[02:24] <bddebian> Ah
[02:28] <ajmitch> oh dear
[02:28] <ajmitch> who went overboard on launchpad css?
[02:30] <raphink> huhu
[02:30] <raphink> you don't like the aqua style ajmitch ? ;)
[02:31] <ajmitch> raphink: no, and it breaks middle-click for new tab
[02:31] <raphink> ah!
[02:32] <jah_raztah> hello
[02:33] <raphink> hi jah_raztah
[02:33] <jah_raztah> raphink, is there any other alternatives to getting mp3 support in gnomebaker rather then using gstreamer0.8-mad
[02:33] <raphink> jah_raztah: I'm not a GNOME user
[02:34] <jah_raztah> ok
[02:34] <jah_raztah> anyone else here that knows please feel free to answer
[02:35] <raphink> jah_raztah: I'd say for such a question asking on #ubuntu might be a better idea
[02:49] <Unfrgiven> ajmitch: im not a fan of the new launchpad header either
[02:50] <Unfrgiven> btw hi everyone :)
[02:50] <ajmitch> hi
[02:50] <Unfrgiven> ajmitch: how r u?
[02:52] <ajmitch> good, how are you?
[02:54] <Unfrgiven> good good. just wrapping up my madwifi-ng package :)
[02:54] <Unfrgiven> its been quite an experience packaging kernel modules!
[02:56] <Unfrgiven> ajmitch: got a question for you about module loading. if you modprobe blah and blah exists in multiple /lib/modules/<KVERS> directories, which one does it choose first?
[02:56] <Unfrgiven> ajmitch: does it go based on alphabetical traversal of the directory?
[02:57] <bddebian> Heya Unfrgiven
[02:57] <Unfrgiven> bddebian: hey dude, how r u?
[02:58] <bddebian> Stupid as ever thanks.  You? :-)
[02:58] <ajmitch> Unfrgiven: no, it only goes for the version matching the current kernel version
[02:58] <Unfrgiven> ok let me explain the scenario
[02:59] <Unfrgiven> linux-restricted-modules provides madwifi drivers. i've packaged madwifi-ng drivers. but i cant make my madwifi-ng package conflict with l-r-m because l-r-m also provides other things such as nvidia and ati drivers
[03:00] <ajmitch> ok
[03:00] <Unfrgiven> so for the moment my madwifi-ng installs modules to a different /lib directory than l-r-m
[03:00] <Unfrgiven> so in essence there are two .ko files in the same /lib/modules/kernel-version/...
[03:01] <Unfrgiven> now i want to make sure that if madwifi-ng and l-r-m is installed, by default madwifi-ng drivers will be picked up
[03:01] <ajmitch> that'll be a bit harder, I think
[03:01] <Unfrgiven> so im trying to find out how modprobe works
[03:01] <ajmitch> and is not something I can answer
[03:02] <Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ok no probs. you understand my problem though right?
[03:04] <bddebian> Unfrgiven: So add nvidia and ati to your and do a Replaces :-)
[03:04] <Unfrgiven> bddebian: well thats not a good longterm solution IMO
[03:05] <Unfrgiven> i have a feeling (and I need to confirm this) that modprobe, traverse /lib/modules/KVERS alphabetically
[03:05] <Unfrgiven> so it should find /lib/modules/KVERS/blah/abc.ko before /lib/modules/KVERS/blah2/abc.ko
[03:07] <bddebian> ah
[06:55] <Yagisan> Unfrgiven: just reading scrollback here, but could dpkg-divert let you replace the l-r-m module with yours ?
[07:04] <Yagisan> tseng: while trying to get my shopping done, I thought of another possible way to get ssp going. I'll patch gcc-defaults to only use 4.1.x gcc as default, then patch build-essential to add libssp0-dev.   I say the latter.
[07:10] <crimsun> it's for a11y
[07:19] <Unfrgiven> Yagisan: if i used dpkg-divert, how would i revert the old module back?
[07:25] <Lure> Can somebody explain me this build failure: http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/659068
[07:25] <Lure> this is for kpowersave: https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/185614
[07:26] <Lure> package builds fine in pbuilder, but fails due to Rosetta on buildd
[07:34] <Yagisan> Unfrgiven: undo the divert in post-rm. It's been a while since I used it, but I think it would do exactly what you want
[07:35] <Yagisan> Unfrgiven: IIRC pentium-builder is a working example of how to use dpkg-divert
[07:36] <chillywilly> howdy
[07:36] <Yagisan> G'day chillywilly
[08:28] <lucas> hi
[08:45] <Unfrgiven> Yagisan: thanks for that, ill look into it!
[08:46] <Unfrgiven> Seveas: just to let you know, lilo did setup my cloak. thanks for your help
[08:47] <ivoks> 'morning
[09:45] <cbx33> ok guys, anyone around?
[09:46] <cbx33> the kill binary.....
[09:48] <freeflying> cbx33: hi
[09:48] <cbx33> hey freeflying
[09:49] <cbx33> i've uninstalled procps
[09:49] <cbx33> which provides the kill binary
[09:49] <cbx33> but on running the kill command i still get a usage summary
[09:49] <cbx33> y?
[09:51] <freeflying> cbx33: purge it , and try
[09:51] <cbx33> ok
[09:51] <cbx33> nope still there
[09:52] <cbx33> is it provided with bash
[09:52] <cbx33> yup it is
[09:52] <cbx33> ok is this a bug
[09:52] <cbx33> after i've installed the procps package I would expect the kill command to use the new kill binary
[09:53] <cbx33> but it doesn't it still uses the built in command
[09:57] <pygi> slomo: around?
[10:31] <slomo__> pygi: yes
[10:32] <pygi> slomo__: thanks for package :)
[10:32] <pygi> now UVFe? :)
[10:32] <slomo__> pygi: np :) UVFe? what do you mean? it's already in dapper with a bunch of fixes :)
[10:33] <pygi> slomo__: damn, then I haven't updated :-P sorry :)
[10:34] <phanatic> hi people
[10:35] <ivoks> we should sync sylpheed-claws-gtk2 from debian
[10:35] <ivoks> the one in dapper is broken
[10:35] <ivoks> and UVF was granted 2 months ago :/
[10:36] <pygi> ivoks: uh,huh :-/
[10:36] <slomo__> pygi: ok :) tell me if something else is broken ;)
[10:36] <slomo__> ivoks: so just sync it or ask for another UVF exception for the current version ;)
[10:36] <ivoks> version didn't change
[10:37] <ivoks> uhm... shouldn't elmo sync from debian?
[10:37] <ivoks> (/me wasn't here last couple of months :)
[10:37] <slomo__> ivoks: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources#syncs
[10:38] <ivoks> ok
[10:38] <ivoks> slomo__: thanks
[10:48] <cyberserver> Hi people. flashplugin-nonfree gone from the multiverse repository?
[10:48] <cyberserver> My apt-cache is not listing it
[10:51] <cyberserver> Forget-it.. multiverse was not enabled in my sources.list
[11:04] <cyberserver> I think flashplugin-nonfree is not being able to fetch macromedia's flash
[11:05] <cyberserver> This is a repackaged ubuntu installer... maybe we can have sucess using debain standart one?
[11:14] <slomo__> Natja: ping?
[11:16] <cyberserver> ok, debian package has the same problem
[11:16] <cyberserver> are these contrib packages taken care by someone of ubuntu (out of motu) that we should contact?
[11:18] <Natja> slomo__: pong
[11:19] <cyberserver> ?!? Macromedia does not have the package available at all...
[11:19] <slomo__> Natja: just wanted to tell you that motu-uvf is not responsible for syncs that import a new upstream version but were approved already and syncs that only import a new debian revision :)
[11:20] <ivoks> slomo__: lol
[11:20] <ivoks> nice comment on bug 39536
[11:20] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 39536 in sylpheed-claws-gtk2 "UVF exception: Sync request from sid" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/39536
[11:20] <Natja> slomo__: ok, sorry
[11:22] <slomo__> Natja: np... nobody was killed ;) but thanks for looking at all the new bugs and assigning them somewhere when needed :)
[11:24] <Natja> ;)
[11:24] <ivoks> gnje... i still have one bug open on one of my uploads :/
[11:24] <ivoks> but i think i will reject it
[11:24] <ivoks> in a month or two
[12:07] <phanatic> hi raphink
[12:08] <raphink> hi phanatic
[12:29] <tseng> Yagisan: you can set global CFLAGS on sbuild somehow
[12:38] <tseng> Yagisan: ah you can just do an export right in pbuilderrc
[12:52] <Toadstool> heya MOTUs
[12:53] <ivoks> do we have security team for universe? :)
[12:54] <tseng> we did
[12:54] <ivoks> :)
[12:54] <tseng> i dont think anyone is actively working on it atm
[12:54] <ivoks> ok, how can we upload security fixes to breezy?
[12:54] <ivoks> we should
[12:55] <tseng> you make a release XubuntuY.1
[12:55] <tseng> with the changelog [SECURITY]
[12:55] <tseng> mention all CVE's that apply
[12:55] <tseng> and send the source package to pitti
[12:55] <ivoks> source.changes :)
[12:55] <ivoks> ok
[12:57] <slomo__> is someone on amd64 here and could test to build something for me? (it will take maybe some hours and a lot of ram)
[12:58] <ivoks> sorry, no
[12:58] <ivoks> (meaning i have no amd :)
[01:00] <Toadstool> slomo__: yep
[01:00] <slomo__> Toadstool: ok cool :) latest ikvm from debian/unstable
[01:01] <Toadstool> ok, let's go :)
[01:01] <slomo__> our current version doesn't build on amd64... and the debian version builds on amd64 for some reason
[01:01] <Toadstool> <IP_ADDRESS>-1 ?
[01:01] <slomo__> yes
[01:03] <Toadstool> ok slomo__, building
[01:03] <slomo__> doko: what should be used for compiling java stuff? ecj(-bootstrap) or something else?
[01:16] <slomo__> Toadstool: is it compiling?
[01:16] <Toadstool> yep, still compiling
[01:16] <slomo__> at least something :)
[01:16] <slomo__> the previous version failed instantly
[01:17] <Toadstool> I've got a few BUILD SUCCEEDED so I'm confident :)
[01:18] <Toadstool> gij-4.1 is eating a huge amount of cpu and ram ^^
[01:19] <slomo__> yes... unfortunately... if this fails later we could try compiling with gcj instead of ecj... maybe it works better
[01:45] <Toadstool> slomo__: wow, it takes a *huge* amount of time to compile the classpath jars ^^
[02:16] <slomo__> Toadstool: i know :) is it finished?
[02:16] <Toadstool> nope
[02:16] <slomo__> uh... mine was faster :)
[02:17] <Toadstool> slomo__: well, it's freezing on "exec /usr/bin/ecj-bootstrap -g -1.5 -nowarn -cp mscorlib.jar:System.jar @allsources.lst"...
[02:18] <Toadstool> but gij is still running
[02:18] <slomo__> Toadstool: yeah that is the part that takes ages ;) does it still use your cpu for something?
[02:18] <Toadstool> yep, gij is eating 99% of my cpu :)
[02:19] <slomo__> ok... so probably the gij JIT for x86 is much better than the amd64 one
[02:19] <Toadstool> yeah probably
[02:30] <phanatic> hi people
[02:45] <Toadstool> slomo__: still building...
[02:46] <slomo__> :/
[02:49] <Toadstool> i've never seen a package that long to build on my amd64 box :)
[02:49] <slomo__> try openoffice :)
[02:50] <Toadstool> haha
[02:50] <Hobbsee> slomo__: ugh, yeah.  or koffice...
[03:36] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:59] <Toadstool> slomo__: still building ikvm and gij-4.1 is still eating a lot of CPU...
[04:00] <slomo__> Toadstool: :(
[04:15] <trappist> bugs filed against hoary that are fixed, but not necessarily in hoary - should I close em?
[04:58] <Amaranth> trappist: yes (late)
[04:59] <trappist> Amaranth: thanks
[05:00] <trappist> forgot what bug I was looking at, but that'll be helpful in the future :)
[05:00] <trappist> Amaranth: ditto for breezy?
[05:00] <Amaranth> yep
[05:00] <Amaranth> if it's fixed in dapper close it
[05:00] <trappist> cool
[05:00] <trappist> that's a lot of bugs
[05:00] <Toadstool> slomo__: I hate gij, that's so slow :)
[05:01] <siretart> hey folks!
[05:01] <Toadstool> hi siretart
[05:02] <bddebian> huhu siretart
[05:03] <siretart> heyho Toadstool, hi bddebian
[05:19] <slomo__> Toadstool: still compiling? :)
[05:19] <Toadstool> yes
[05:19] <slomo__> omg
[05:19] <Toadstool> :)
[05:20] <slomo__> maybe gij has no JIT at all for amd64 but only an interpreter ;)
[05:20] <Toadstool> :D
[06:08] <sivang> has anyone seen dholbach ?
[06:08] <bddebian> I think he said he was out until after Easter but don't quote me on that :-)
[06:10] <sivang> bddebian: I see, I guess that goes for everyone or so
[06:10] <sivang> everywhere the ubuntu universe things look too quite for a friday afternoon :)
[06:10] <bddebian> Except you, me, Toadstool, and slomo__ aparently :-)
[06:10] <Toadstool> :)
[06:10] <sivang> yes, apparently :)
[06:11] <slomo__> Toadstool: still compiling? =)
[06:11] <Toadstool> yes :)
[06:12] <bddebian> Hello jaldhar
[06:12] <Toadstool> slomo__: I think i'm going to beat the world longest compile time record :)
[06:18] <kelmo> hi siretart
[06:19] <bddebian> Toadstool: Nothing beats build glibc on GNU/Hurd, trust me! ;-)
[06:19] <Toadstool> heh
[06:19] <crimsun> it's compilable?  /me ducks
[06:19] <Toadstool> :D
[06:24] <bddebian> crimsun: touche' :-)
[06:24] <bddebian> Heya tritium
[06:24] <tritium> Hi there bddebian :)
[06:29] <siretart> hey kelmo
[06:30] <ivoks> :((((((((
[06:30] <Mithrandir> bddebian: that takes more than a week on top-notch hardware?
[06:30] <ivoks> man... i'm so angry and sad
[06:31] <tritium> ivoks: about what?
[06:31] <kelmo> siretart: did you have your break yet?
[06:31] <ivoks> tritium: about newest IT news in croatia
[06:31] <siretart> kelmo: I just returned home :)
[06:31] <bddebian> Mithrandir: Nah, my longest is only about 2 days so far :-)
[06:31] <tritium> ivoks: I've not heard.  What happened?
[06:31] <LaserJock> hi bddebian and tritium
[06:31] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock
[06:31] <tritium> Hi LaserJock
[06:31] <ivoks> tritium: company that has 60% of Internet in croatia buyed other company (wich has 30%)
[06:31] <Mithrandir> bddebian: try axiom on m68k some day. :-P
[06:31] <tritium> Oh...
[06:32] <ivoks> so.. now we have one ISP
[06:32] <siretart> kelmo: fortunately, there was a nice neighbor of the hotel, who offered a unsecured wireless ap, which I used for a ssh or to to read & answer some emails :)
[06:32] <ivoks> and that's the worst one
[06:32] <tritium> ivoks: :(
[06:32] <kelmo> siretart: i noticed ; )
[06:32] <siretart> :)
[06:32] <kelmo> siretart: trust the trip was a good one then
[06:32] <siretart> hi ivoks!
[06:32] <siretart> ivoks: nice to see you back. and in action :)
[06:32] <ivoks> siretart: hi yeah...
[06:33] <ivoks> siretart: things can changes since prices will go up now :)
[06:33] <siretart> the trip to vienna was nice. very nice city, charming people, we had a great time :)
[06:35] <bddebian> OK damnit, why can't scilab find Xaw3d and Xmu?
[06:37] <ivoks> bddebian: it looks for them in /usr/X11R6?
[06:38] <bddebian> ivoks: I changed configure.in and did an autoreconf so it shouldn't ??
[06:38] <azeem> check the config.log
[06:45] <bddebian> azeem: Bah, that's like work :-)
[07:20] <v3rmap> I'm trying to install gtk2 dev libs on Dapper flight 6, but hit some errors:http://pastebin.com/659830
[07:20] <v3rmap> Any suggestions on what to try to fix the problems?
[07:21] <azeem> v3rmap: you're trying to install breezy's libgtk2.0-dev
[07:23] <v3rmap> azeem, I need the dapper version of the lib. I had breezy and I upgraded. Is there something else I should try?
[07:23] <azeem> maybe apt-cache policy libgtk2.0-dev
[07:24] <azeem> see whether that gives you some hints
[07:24] <azeem> or try apt-get install libgtk2.0-dev=2.8.16-1ubuntu1 or something
[07:24] <azeem> I'm off, bye
[07:24] <v3rmap> bye, thanks.
[07:48] <Toadstool> slomo__: still building... :/
[07:50] <slomo__> Toadstool: unbelievable... would be interesting to know whether this finishes at all or just sits in a endless loop
[07:51] <Toadstool> yep... but no output at all and I can't see a way to diagnose what's going on...
[07:51] <slomo__> me neither... but that's normal
[07:53] <Toadstool> i think i'm going to kill the gij process and see what I can do to get a more verbose output
[07:56] <Toadstool> slomo__: http://pastebin.com/659958 <-- end of the buildlog
[07:57] <slomo__> after you killed it?
[07:57] <Toadstool> yep
[07:57] <slomo__> ok... everything normal ;)
[07:57] <Toadstool> 24592.9 seconds <- nice ^^
[07:57] <slomo__> that's not normal :P
[07:58] <Toadstool> heh
[08:08] <Toadstool> slomo__: trying to build with verbose output
[08:09] <slomo> Toadstool: thanks :)
[08:09] <Toadstool> np, I have cpu cycles to share ;)
[08:11] <slomo> Toadstool: you could also try to run it for the next week ;)
[08:11] <Toadstool> heh
[08:17] <siretart> slomo: hey sebastian!
[08:17] <slomo> siretart: hi :)
[08:18] <Toadstool> slomo: according to the verbose output, it's really building something but really really slowly :D
[08:20] <slomo> Toadstool: so my guess was probably right... only interpreted on amd64 :/
[08:20] <Toadstool> yep :/
[08:22] <slomo> want to write a decent JIT? ;)
[08:22] <Toadstool> huhu :)
[08:24] <Toadstool> I definitely ban Java and .NET/Mono from my known languages :p
[08:27] <slomo> why? ;)
[08:32] <trappist> somebody spelled definitely right.  that always makes my day.
[08:35] <crimsun> I can definately misspell wurds.
[08:37] <trappist> I notised
[08:57] <LaserJock> trappist: haha, are you going to start checking all the changelogs for spelling/grammar?
[08:57] <trappist> I'll leave the changelogs alone.  but I've started my campaign to fix config file comments, man pages, error messages, etc.
[08:58] <Toadstool> that's a huge campaign :)
[08:58] <trappist> yeah
[08:59] <trappist> a lot of developers have a first language other than english, and a lot of others just don't care, but I think the spelling and grammar problems make for a nasty smear on the polish
[09:00] <Toadstool> agreed
[09:07] <crimsun> trappist: just be aware of regional differences
[09:08] <crimsun> for instance, American English tends to use "different from" rather than "different to"
[09:08] <trappist> crimsun: sure - I don't try to "correct" colour to color, etc.
[09:08] <trappist> crimsun: that stuff too.  all my favorite authors are british, so I can spot those.
[09:09] <trappist> I mostly go after my personal pet peeves, like its/it's, their/they're/there, your/you're, etc.
[09:10] <trappist> and of course defin[^(ite)] ly
[09:11] <Toadstool> :D
[09:54] <bddebian> slomo: What is Sivangs package on REVU??
[09:55] <slomo> bddebian: it's not on revu
[09:55] <slomo> look at the mail
[09:55] <bddebian> Oh, heh
[10:00] <bddebian> Hmm, doesn't build for me :-)
[11:11] <zul> help
[11:11] <zul> oops...heylo
[11:14] <zul> hmmm....my uploads to universe seems to be dropping for some reason..
[11:18] <Yagisan> morning all
[11:19] <Yagisan> tseng: I've actually scripted up pbuilders on tmpfs here, so I'm more likely to take either the pbuilderrc option, or script up a package like pentium-builder
[11:25] <bddebian> Heya Yagisan
[11:27] <Yagisan> morning/evening bddebian
[11:27] <Yagisan> bddebian: enjoying your break ?
[11:28] <bddebian> No, not feeling well and trying to fix bugs I can't fix :-(  You?
[11:30] <Yagisan> bddebian: just woke up today (OMG I woke up at 7am, not 2pm, the world is ending!), and thoroughly cursing the fact that most shops have shut over the easter break.
[11:32] <Yagisan> bddebian: what's wrong ? eat something you shouldn't have ?
[11:36] <bddebian> Nah, getting a cold I think :-(
[11:59] <ivoks> ok, this day will be remebered by cups hell :)
[12:01] <mitsuhiko> someone pinged me today?


[06:14] <mborzecki> morning
[06:49] <mup> PR snapd#11000 closed: snapstate: add debug message where a snap is mounted <Simple 😃> <Skip spread> <Created by mvo5> <Merged by bboozzoo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11000>
[07:03] <zyga-mbp> good morning, o
[07:28] <mborzecki> zyga-mbp: hey
[07:29] <zyga-mbp> hey mborzecki
[07:29] <mardy> hi mborzecki, zyga-mbp
[07:30]  * zyga-mbp waits for covid results :/
[07:31] <zyga-mbp> meanwhile, I'm learning about testing.T and things it has to offer in latest Go
[07:32] <zyga-mbp> I've been using check.v1 since I learned Go but perhaps it's time to get back to the roots, at least partially
[07:37] <mardy> zyga-mbp: did you fall sick, or is it just a test?
[07:38] <zyga-mbp> mardy I feel totally sick
[07:38] <zyga-mbp> mardy no smell, no taste, some fever, etc
[08:04] <mborzecki> zyga-mbp: hm t.Parallel() and then before check I used to use https://github.com/stretchr/testify
[08:05] <mup> PR snapd#10999 closed:  cmd/snap-confine: lazy set up of device cgroup, only when devices were assigned (2.53) <Created by mvo5> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/10999>
[08:07] <pstolowski> morning
[08:15] <mup> PR snapd#11004 opened: tests: give interfaces-udisks2 more time for the loop device to appear <Simple 😃> <Test Robustness> <Created by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11004>
[08:20] <mup> PR snapd#11002 closed: tests: increase timeout/add debug around nbd0 mounting <Simple 😃> <Created by mvo5> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11002>
[08:40] <sil2100> Hello everyone o/ So William pointed out to me LP: #1948838
[08:40] <mup> Bug #1948838: Snapd can no longer be imported as a Go module <snapd:New> <Snappy:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1948838>
[08:52] <mardy> anyone know how I can run one spread test (ubuntu-core-18-64:tests/core/snapd-refresh-vs-services-reboots) using a custom UC18 image (https://people.ubuntu.com/~slyon/uc18/)?
[08:59] <pstolowski> mardy: you can use qemu backend (see our hacking.md and https://github.com/snapcore/spread); then you can pass the individual test name to spread
[09:00] <mardy> pstolowski: hi! Yes, but it still will load the ubuntu-16.04 image, and install the core as a snap
[09:01] <pstolowski> ah hmm
[09:04] <pstolowski> mvo: hi, see the issue sil2100 reported ^, not sure what was the state of things re go mod in 2.53
[09:30] <pstolowski> jamesh: hi, re https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/10867#discussion_r732705276 should we just not support notifications on 16.04 given that it probably isn't an interesting desktop environment anymore (but maybe this is a wrong assumption)?
[09:30] <mup> PR #10867: desktop, usersession: observe notifications <Created by stolowski> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/10867>
[09:35] <jamesh> pstolowski: it should still usually work on 16.04. The problem is that we can't use dependencies to ensure it works.
[09:36] <jamesh> since one service is started by systemd and the other by Upstart
[09:37] <pstolowski> jamesh: hmm i see. i'm hoping for your suggestion on what to do with that, i'm afraid my understanding of the desktop is limited
[09:43] <jamesh> pstolowski: when you log into a desktop session on 16.04, both a user mode systemd and upstart instance will be run. The D-Bus session bus is managed by upstart
[09:44] <jamesh> pstolowski: the snap session agent is started on demand via socket activation. If it is started after the session bus has been started, then we can use the session bus. If it starts afterwards, then not.
[09:45] <jamesh> s/afterwards/before/ at the end there
[10:07] <pstolowski> jamesh: got it. can we get session bus by other means in the latter case (possibly by retrying), or is it game over if DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS is not set?
[10:08] <jamesh> pstolowski: upstart's dbus job writes out the session bus address to a file in $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR. And godbus already had code to check that file (that I didn't even have to write).
[10:09] <jamesh> https://github.com/godbus/dbus/blob/d379abe190d5ca3715642acec248498637629d53/conn_other.go#L51
[10:09] <pstolowski> miguelpires: hi, can you assing https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/1943987 to self (I couldn't find your LP id)
[10:09] <mup> Bug #1943987: snap disconnect <snapname>: prints a confusing error <snapd:Fix Committed> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1943987>
[10:10] <pstolowski> jamesh: that looks nice, sounds like a retry around that would do?
[10:11] <jamesh> pstolowski: what's currently in master can potentially crash if (a) session agent gets started before dbus, and (b) the notification REST API gets called
[10:11] <jamesh> with your changes, it'd crash with only (a)
[10:12] <miguelpires> pstolowski: Yes, thanks for reminding me
[10:12] <jamesh> i.e. there's already the chance of a problem, but it'd be nice to avoid making it bigger.
[10:12] <pstolowski> jamesh: yes
[10:13] <pstolowski> jamesh: how about I guard it so it not going to crash, and then propose something around tryDiscoverDbusSessionBusAddress() as a new PR?
[10:13] <jamesh> pstolowski: my suggestion would be (1) don't create the notification manager if s.bus is nil, and (2) have the REST API return an error if s.notificationMgr is nil
[10:14] <pstolowski> jamesh: yes, makes sense
[10:14] <pstolowski> miguelpires: what's your LP id btw, i already needed it before and couldn't find it ;)
[10:15] <jamesh> pstolowski: Note that that tryDiscoverDbusSessionBusAddress() function is private. But it's already being used in the code to open a session bus connection.
[10:16] <miguelpires> pstolowski: miguelpires1
[10:16] <pstolowski> miguelpires: thanks
[10:17] <pstolowski> jamesh: indeed, i need to see how it's used
[10:17] <jamesh> with the session agent's exit on idle behaviour, I don't think it's a big deal if we've got a race where notifications might fail for the first 30 seconds of the session. It's just 16.04 after all...
[10:18] <jamesh> pstolowski: here's the code calling tryDiscover...(): https://github.com/godbus/dbus/blob/master/conn.go#L76-L98
[10:18] <pstolowski> jamesh: agreed
[10:22] <pstolowski> jamesh: thanks for the pointers
[10:30] <pstolowski> jamesh: actually, we are already guarding this with if c.s.bus == nil .. in postPendingRefreshNotification(), and return "cannot connect to the session bus (500)
[10:31] <jamesh> pstolowski: right. The problem is that you're introducing code that assumes s.bus is non-nil in SessionAgent.Init()
[10:31] <jamesh> that's the bit that's the problem.
[10:33] <pstolowski> jamesh: good point
[10:55] <mardy> pstolowski: so, my problem is that I don't understand how these ubuntu-core-* tests are run: in the spread they are declared with a classic distro as base (like ubuntu-16.04), and then somehow the core image is lanched from it. Maybe you know why it is like this?
[10:56] <mborzecki> mardy: whcih tests?
[11:01] <jamesh> mardy: see prepare_ubuntu_core() and setup_reflash_magic() in tests/lib/prepare.sh
[11:02] <jamesh> in essence it uses a classic Ubuntu system to build an Ubuntu Core image, writes it to /dev/sda, and reboots
[11:21] <pstolowski> jamesh: i've updated https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/10867
[11:21] <mup> PR #10867: desktop, usersession: observe notifications <Created by stolowski> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/10867>
[11:22] <jamesh> pstolowski: looking
[11:27] <jamesh> pstolowski: looks good to me
[11:30] <pstolowski> jamesh: thank you!
[11:43] <ijohnson[m]> mardy probably if you were given a uc18 image and you want to run spread tests on that image specifically, you should launch that image as a VM, then use the external backend to run the spread test you care about against your VM
[11:43] <ijohnson[m]> mardy Sergio (who doesn't seem to be on IRC ATM) can help you with that, or I can show you in a bit, i don't have all the instructions in front of me right now
[11:44] <mardy> mborzecki: the test is ubuntu-core-18-64:tests/core/snapd-refresh-vs-services-reboots, more info in LP#1949089
[11:45] <mardy> jamesh, ijohnson[m]: thanks, I'll give it a try
[11:46] <ijohnson[m]> mardy for that rest specifically, i assume foundations built you a custom core18 snap to test, you could hack up the prepare.sh script to download that core18 snap instead of whatever one we normally download
[11:47] <ijohnson[m]> *test
[11:47] <ijohnson[m]> I still think external backend is simplest though
[11:58] <mardy> ijohnson[m]: I'm trying with the external backend, if it works I'll submit a PR to make the tests/externa-backend.md document mention this use-case too
[12:01] <mup> PR snapd#9839 closed: tests: spread log analyzer that could be used for re execute failed tests <⛔ Blocked> <Run failed> <Created by sergiocazzolato> <Closed by sergiocazzolato> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9839>
[12:05] <mardy> ijohnson[m]: so, I think I'm quite close, but the test's prepare is failing: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/TzjFRwNCGg/ (I started my UC image with the same command given in https://ubuntu.com/core/docs/testing-with-qemu)
[12:36] <mup> PR snapd#10241 closed: tests: set memory limit for snapd <Simple 😃> <Created by bboozzoo> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/10241>
[12:46] <mup> PR snapd#11004 closed: tests: give interfaces-udisks2 more time for the loop device to appear <Simple 😃> <Test Robustness> <Created by mvo5> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11004>
[12:46] <mup> PR snapd#11005 opened: tests: initialize CHANGE_ID in _wait_autorefresh <Test Robustness> <Created by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11005>
[12:51] <mup> PR snapd#11001 closed: spread.yaml: show `journalctl -e` for all suites on debug <Simple 😃> <Created by mvo5> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11001>
[13:11] <mup> PR snapd#10706 closed: tests: clean up test tools <Created by sergiocazzolato> <Merged by sergiocazzolato> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/10706>
[14:21] <mup> PR core20#120 opened: spread: add spread testing for the core20 repository <Created by Meulengracht> <https://github.com/snapcore/core20/pull/120>
[15:17] <juliank> I noticed that snapd has a Recommends on gnupg, what does it use that for?
[15:18] <juliank> would it be fine with gpg; or optimally, gpgv?
[15:25]  * juliank is still in progress of reducing duplicate binaries :D
[15:57] <mup> PR snapd#11006 opened: sandbox/cgroup: freeze and thaw cgroups related to services and scopes only <Simple 😃> <Created by bboozzoo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11006>
[15:57]  * mvo hugs mborzecki
[16:27] <mup> PR snapd#10850 closed: o/snapstate: improve install/update tests <Skip spread> <Created by MiguelPires> <Merged by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/10850>
[17:37] <mup> PR snapd#11007 opened: o/snapstate: test relink remodel helpers do a proper subset of doInstall and rework the verify*Tasks helpers <Skip spread> <Created by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11007>
[19:43] <mup> PR snapd#11008 opened: tests: some improvements for the spread log parser <Created by sergiocazzolato> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/11008>


[00:54] <chrstphr> Greetings...everybody
[00:55] <_stink__> yo
[00:56] <jrwren> hello
[00:56] <chrstphr> yolo stink
[00:56] <chrstphr> what did i miss?
[00:57] <cmaloney> 4 hours of idling
[00:57] <chrstphr> idle here, idle there, it's all good!
[01:47] <_stink__> yes
[13:35] <cmaloney> morning
[13:37] <rick_h> morning
[13:37] <shakes808> morning
[13:48] <jrwren> Good morning
[14:44] <_stink__> yo
[16:11] <jrwren> more evidence that Go is written by someone who doesn't know much: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/golang-nuts/gdp1q6T0DNY  Rob doesn't understand sendfile and thinks that "it can be written in a few lines of efficient user code."
[16:11] <cmaloney> Um
[16:12] <cmaloney> That's an awesome way to get buffer-overruns if you have "a few lines of efficient user code"
[16:14] <cmaloney> Pretty sure this is a moonshot: http://stackoverflow.com/jobs/135577/director-of-product-engineering-creative-commons
[16:25] <jrwren> I think it can easily be done without buffer-overruns.
[16:25] <jrwren> sendfile exists for zerocopy. The kernel knows about hte open file and the open socket (or two sockets, or two files) and can copy data between them without copying the data to user space.
[16:26] <jrwren> I'd have expected an expert like Rob Pike to both know and understand this.
[16:26] <jrwren> The more I go down this go rabbit whole, the more I realize it really is garbage.
[16:27] <cmaloney> OK, I think I'm missing something here
[16:28] <cmaloney> So they're looking for a way in Go to use Sendfile?
[16:29] <cmaloney> or a way to replicate what sendfile does without the kernel call?
[16:29] <cmaloney> (but yeah, that R. Pike didn't know about that call is a little concerning. ;))
[16:34] <jrwren> the link i posted is 7yrs old.
[16:34] <cmaloney> right, i got that
[16:35] <jrwren> its the dismissiveness and unawaredness which concerns me.
[16:35] <cmaloney> Well, it does have a certain "BSD doesn't do that" vibe to it
[16:36] <cmaloney> or rather "huh, these kids and their system calls"
[16:36] <cmaloney> (BSD does have it, so I'm reading things wrong)
[16:38]  * cmaloney is feeling less like a programmer and more like a punter.
[16:44] <jrwren> plan9 probably has no userspace and everythig is kernel space and hence r pike's lack of understanding.
[16:51] <_stink__> hah
[17:32] <jrwren> or... apparently sendcopy is a helper function for splice. maybe rpike knew how to use splice... i'll bet not though, given his userspace comment.


[00:04] <tjagoda> ruhoh
[00:04] <tjagoda> disk sounds loud in this laptop
[00:05] <tjagoda> Might be the excuse that breaks my will and has me plunk down for an SSD =(
[00:20] <rick_h> ssd ftw
[00:25] <tjagoda> Yeah
[00:25] <tjagoda> just dont want to spend the $$ tho
[00:26] <tjagoda> Has the market leveled in terms of performance?
[00:26] <tjagoda> I remember when Intel was king of SSD's.
[00:27] <rick_h> yea, some, but I'm still hesitent to move outside of intel
[00:27] <rick_h> but I'm not a big risk taker
[00:27] <Blazeix> I like OCZ, but it can be a gamble
[00:28] <Blazeix> I happened to win that gamble, and have a really fast ssd, but i've heard horror stories about reliability
[00:28] <rick_h> yea
[00:34] <tjagoda> Does canonical tell you if they reject your app?
[00:35] <rick_h> not sure how the app process works
[00:35] <rick_h> I'd imagine they would, they're very eager to help/get people involved
[00:35] <tjagoda> It says "open," I was unsure if they actually go through and cull out the hordes
[00:35] <tjagoda> Or if they only communicate to the serious candidates
[00:36] <rick_h> not sure
[00:40] <tjagoda> Your SSD, is it your primary drive?
[00:43] <rick_h> yea
[00:43] <rick_h> on my laptop it's my only drive
[00:43] <rick_h> and on my desktop it's / and /home is a normal drive
[01:23] <snap-l> tjagoda: They'll let you know if they don't accept your app
[01:23] <snap-l> it's pretty impersonal, but at least they have a response.
[01:23] <tjagoda> oh, cool
[01:23] <snap-l> Not that I would know or anything. :)
[01:25] <snap-l> Went and looked at fish tanks this evening
[01:25] <snap-l> When it's all said and done, this is going to be rather expensive.
[01:25] <snap-l> Seems like there's a huge price increase when you hit 20+ gal
[01:30] <tjagoda> Are you investing in fish futures?
[01:30] <snap-l> Yes
[01:30] <snap-l> hopefully in their long living futures.
[02:29] <snap-l> http://openmetalcast.com/2012/01/23/open-metalcast-episode-39-catch-up-mustve-heard-and-relish/
[11:39] <snap-l> g'morning
[11:40] <rick_h> ugh
[12:09] <snap-l> That good, eh?
[12:10] <rick_h> feel like crap today, rough morning
[12:21] <snap-l> rick_h: Sorry to hear that. :(
[12:21] <mydogsnameisrudy> Morning
[12:41] <Wolfger> morning
[12:42] <Wolfger> got my thanks-but-no-thanks from Canonical
[12:43] <snap-l> Wolfger: Sorry to hear that
[12:43] <rick_h> :(
[12:43] <snap-l> On the flip side, I've gotten quite  few of those.
[12:43] <rick_h> makes you feel better I got a pair of those
[12:43] <snap-l> insert 'a" in there
[12:43] <rick_h> heh
[12:43] <rick_h> and we go for the same line
[12:44] <snap-l> rick_h: Yep
[12:44] <snap-l> Wolfger: I know exactly how you feel, though
[12:44] <Wolfger> Well, at least I know and I'm not waiting to hear. Wonder if tjagoda got his or if he's in the hunt
[12:45] <Wolfger> They were probably "Michigan, again? We need to spread it out more." :-)
[12:46] <rick_h> hah, state quota exceeded
[12:50] <snap-l> heh
[12:50] <snap-l> WE need more uruguayans
[12:52] <snap-l> http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/postgresql-for-wordpress/ <- I wish Wordpress supported PostgreSQL out of the box
[12:53] <snap-l> and without a plugin
[12:54] <rick_h> problem is scaling requires a non-crappy ORM and they just ditch it and go mysql
[12:54] <snap-l> http://codex.wordpress.org/Using_Alternative_Databases
[12:54] <snap-l> Sadly, they need someone smart like Michael to make it work
[12:55] <snap-l> (Bayer, iirc)
[12:56] <snap-l> Wow, people are really demanding of html5
[12:56] <snap-l> http://html5.please.us
[12:56] <snap-l> http://html5please.us <- rather
[12:57] <snap-l> waiting for html5makemeasandwich.us
[13:22] <rick_h> love this https://twitter.com/#!/alex_gaynor/status/161797413936431105
[13:25] <brousch> that has convinced you to switch?
[13:25] <brousch> you have a lot of porn site ideas in the queue?
[13:32] <rick_h> I just think that's a great summary for a project
[13:32] <rick_h> "we make porn and big media sites kinda easy...might help with other things to, but meh we're not following that too close"
[13:42] <snap-l> Wasn't that one of the other things that made Turbogears awesome too?
[13:43] <rick_h> yea, TG biggests site was a porn site long ago
[13:43] <rick_h> hard to put on the wall of fame to show off your framework :)
[13:46] <brousch> depends on who you're catering to
[13:46] <brousch> for instance, i would not be offended by that
[13:48] <snap-l> Just have a LOT of pixellation.
[13:50] <snap-l> "Sites using (framework): bobsfish.com, quickietshirts.com, anal-destroyers.com
[13:52] <brousch> shows it's scalable
[13:57] <brousch> speaking of anal-destroyers ...
[13:57] <tjagoda> o.O
[13:58] <tjagoda> I am opposed to this title.
[13:59] <brousch> well then you shouldn't have missed last night's meeting where it was voted on
[14:00] <tjagoda> But I was here last night, and definitely witnessed no meeting =(
[14:00]  * tjagoda smells skullduggery
[14:14] <jrwren> snap-l: is that pgsql for wordpress maintained?
[14:18] <tjagoda> Windows Live Essentials and Bing Bar are my most frequently uninstalled applications.
[14:18] <tjagoda> Blasted users.
[14:18] <jrwren> what is wrong with live essentials?
[14:19] <jrwren> i need my live writer!
[14:19] <brousch> bing bar?
[14:19] <brousch> you let your users user IE?
[14:19] <jrwren> lol, good point.
[14:19] <snap-l> jrwren: It allegedly runs up until 3.2.1
[14:20] <snap-l> has a date of 9/2011 as the last release
[14:20] <jrwren> snap-l: not bad.
[14:20] <snap-l> jrwren: It's more recent than the other attempts
[14:20] <snap-l> but I still don't trust it
[14:21] <jrwren> i like the idea.
[14:21] <jrwren> though it seems like if you are gonna do that, might as well go all the way to nosql
[14:21] <jrwren> wordpress on mongodb :p
[14:21] <snap-l> jrwren: I'm glad it exists, but I'm really hoping native PGSQL comes soon
[14:22] <snap-l> jrwren: That would be sweet.
[14:22] <jrwren> i don't think it is a goal at all.
[14:22] <snap-l> jrwren: From the discussion, it seems like a "yeah, we really should do this, but it's non-trivial"
[14:25] <rick_h> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=w_WW-DHqR3c
[14:25] <Raggs> hi, can Debian and ubuntu share a /home dir?
[14:25] <rick_h> I call this the successful completion of gnome do taking over ubuntu
[14:25] <rick_h> Raggs: probably wouldn't reccomend it
[14:25] <rick_h> they'll be competing over the same .gnome and such directories
[14:25] <snap-l> Raggs: At the same time? No
[14:25] <rick_h> and the software will be the different versions/etc
[14:25] <snap-l> rick_h: ++
[14:26] <Raggs> snap-l, well only one will be booted at a time
[14:26] <tjagoda> I have to let my users use IE
[14:26] <snap-l> Raggs: I'd recommend if you need files with both versions to create a shared area
[14:26] <tjagoda> Automotive supplier websites that dont work outside it
[14:26] <snap-l> and put the files that are to be shared in that area.
[14:26] <Raggs> yep, sounds like an idea
[14:27] <tjagoda> And asking them to use two browsers would frankly blow a few of their minds. =(
[14:27] <tjagoda> Dont get me wrong, my users are not mindless drones
[14:27] <tjagoda> But yeah =(
[14:33] <brousch> mine use FF for everything but those crappy sites
[14:34] <brousch> it does not hurt their minds
[14:38] <tjagoda> Do yours refer to everything as "the internet?"
[14:38] <tjagoda> or alternatively, e-mails
[14:39] <snap-l> http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/372385/ubuntu-rips-up-drop-down-menus <- Ugh
[14:40] <rick_h> ... waiting for adfarm.mediaplex.com
[14:40] <rick_h> there it goes
[14:41] <snap-l> OK, it's a little interesting
[14:41] <snap-l> but accessibility is just taking it in the neck, isn't it?
[14:42] <snap-l> Why is this going into 12.04, as well?
[14:42] <snap-l> I thought the idea was stability, quality, etc
[14:42] <rick_h> well technically it can be more accessable if it helps allow better search through menus vs hunt/peck :)
[14:42] <snap-l> Apparently it's quality, unless there's a really cool feature
[14:42] <rick_h> but yea, this is agiant whatever
[14:43] <rick_h> lol
[14:43] <rick_h> but check out Mark's blog post. They've got 90% test coverage
[14:44] <snap-l> Yeah, that's awesome.
[14:45] <snap-l> I'm just trying to figure out how to explain this new interface to my parents
[14:45] <snap-l> they're still on 10.04
[14:46] <snap-l> AS long as it degrades nicely for apps that are, well, Java, this should be pretty interesting.
[14:50] <tjagoda> I am a fan of hunt and peck
[14:50] <tjagoda> especially when I cant remember wtf the name of my program is
[14:51] <tjagoda> Most frequently happens with Libre office
[14:51] <tjagoda> whenever I need to remember what the powerpoint equiv is called
[14:52] <_stink_> even though my workflow is pretty well established, and i will likely never use any of this new GUI stuff... i have to say i'm so happy someone is pushing the envelope.
[14:52] <snap-l> I'm just pissed focus follows mouse is dead
[14:53] <snap-l> NERDRAGE!
[14:53] <_stink_> hehehe
[14:53] <_stink_> can't you just use twm?
[14:53] <tjagoda> I refuse to believe that anybody other than a reanimated Steve Jobs can advance UI design!
[14:54] <brousch> snap-l: FFM works well for me
[14:54] <brousch> also, my computer looks pretty much like 10.04
[14:56] <tjagoda> Same here
[14:56] <tjagoda> Only less orange, and more blue
[14:56] <brousch> i'm sure you could find an orangish theme
[14:57] <snap-l> brousch: Yes, I'm sure it does, but I'd have to get over a new problem
[14:57] <snap-l> mainly throwing up in my mouth every time I moused over something.
[14:57] <brousch> your prejudices are clouding your mind
[14:58] <snap-l> (slow draw) THIS IS A WINDOW.  and then run out
[15:50] <Wolfger> Oooh, HTML 5 Cookbook on dotd
[15:58] <brousch> ok, wow. copying big files through dolphin, it puts the whole file into ram
[15:58] <snap-l> Ok, I don't have that one yet.
[15:59] <snap-l> brousch: You're doing it wrong
[15:59] <brousch> copy, paste
[15:59] <snap-l> brousch: You're doing it wrong
[15:59] <brousch> :P
[15:59] <snap-l> rsync FTW
[15:59] <brousch> rsync from my camera?
[15:59] <snap-l> Yes
[15:59] <snap-l> :-P
[16:00] <brousch> i took HD video of last night's meeting. it's in 4 files of 2-3GB each
[16:01] <brousch> that 3GB is gonna be a bitch
[16:01] <brousch> i really need more ram
[16:02] <snap-l> Is it mounting the camera as a Mass Storage Device?
[16:02] <snap-l> because if so, rsync should work. :)
[16:02] <Wolfger> I have mixed feelings about this: http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/24/tech/web/judge-defendant-decrypt-laptop/index.html?hpt=hp_bn6
[16:04] <brousch> ok, i took the sd card out and tried again
[16:04] <brousch> with just sd card it does not copy the whole thing into ram
[16:05] <rick_h> Wolfger: I hate that myself
[16:05] <brousch> through camera, it does
[16:05] <brousch> the camera mounts as some goofball kind of device
[16:08] <brousch> damn, that's much quicker
[16:09] <snap-l> brousch: PTP, iirc.
[16:09] <snap-l> It's some goofy protocol they use.
[16:09] <brousch> sounds right
[16:10] <brousch> works fine for photos, but is a bitch one these videos
[16:10] <snap-l> Means it doesn't mount the device, but it's a lot slower IMHO
[16:10] <brousch> i'll just have to keep that in mind
[16:21] <krondor> brousch:  it's probably accessing the camera through PTP
[16:22] <krondor> snap-l:++ didn't see your post :)
[16:22] <krondor> my lack of reading comprehension means its time for lunch bbiab
[16:25] <snap-l> Heh
[16:31] <Wolfger> Hmm. The word "heimlich" translates to "secretly"... Gives a whole new meaning to "the heimlich maneuver"
[16:31] <Wolfger> Sounds like something I'd want those IR video recording binoculars for
[16:33] <snap-l> heh
[16:39] <snap-l> I am weak. Have barely touched the other HTML5 books, and I purchased the HTML5 cookbook
[16:39] <snap-l> Damn you, O'Reilly
[16:40] <snap-l> They're books, not Pokemon
[16:42] <Wolfger> gotta catch 'em all
[17:17] <snap-l> Oldie: http://james-iry.blogspot.com/2009/05/brief-incomplete-and-mostly-wrong.html?
[17:25] <snap-l> rick_h: Did you see this: http://bytefluent.com/vivify/
[17:25] <rick_h> nice, no
[17:25] <snap-l> Looks like the ultimate way to waste a day in vim. :)
[17:26] <rick_h> booo, doesn't update url so I can share the link
[18:10] <snap-l> fuck, I'm starting ti tile my windows
[18:10] <rick_h> bwuhahahahaha!
[18:10] <snap-l> What's happening to me?
[18:10] <rick_h> it's inevitable
[18:10] <snap-l> This keyboard? It's too quiet.
[18:11] <snap-l> My desk, I need to stand
[18:11] <snap-l> AAIIIIUUUUGGGHHHH!!!
[18:11]  * snap-l heads to shop.lenovo.com to calm down
[18:11] <brousch> snap-l: please tell me you didn't eat the tin of green M&Ms rick_h left in his desk
[18:12] <snap-l> brousch: Worse, I touched the Dr. Pepper
[18:12] <snap-l> Diet Dr. Pepper
[18:12] <brousch> noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
[18:17] <tjagoda> Do you have Das Keyboard?
[18:29] <tjagoda> omg
[18:29] <tjagoda> Got a follow up email from canonical
[18:29] <jjesse> yay>
[18:30] <jjesse> i'm sorry there are already too many canonical employees that are a member of #ubuntu-us-mi we need to share the love to more user groups?
[18:32] <tjagoda> Sounds like they want to communicate the scope and my expectations regarding the role.
[18:49] <snap-l> tjagoda: Nice!
[18:49] <snap-l> At least you got past the first hurdle
[19:00] <rick_h> tjagoda: sweet
[19:01] <rick_h> lamo, ok I feel better now https://twitter.com/#!/ganson/status/161799371313254401
[19:02] <tjagoda> Praise the lords for google, and easy time zone conversion tools
[19:06] <snap-l> rick_h: I desperately hope this is for the little children sent to buy mommy and daddy cigarettes.
[19:06] <snap-l> because if not, I weep
[19:07] <rick_h> hmmm, getting that urge to punch babies.
[19:09] <snap-l> Got root on the machine?
[19:09] <rick_h> "oh, so make runs some buildout stuff, buildout has tepmlates for bin-templates/xxx files that get put into /bin/xxx and then those get magically operated on by unicorns with directory variables back from the make files"
[19:09] <snap-l> make the directories, run chmod 0000 on them as root, and see what blows up
[19:10] <snap-l> Not elegant, but it should work
[19:10] <Blazeix> ( http://www.snopes.com/photos/signs/expresslane.asp )
[19:11] <rick_h> Blazeix: boooo quit messing with my happy bits of the day
[19:11] <rick_h> :P
[19:12] <Blazeix> heh
[19:12] <snap-l> Blazeix: It's just a matter of time until it's a real sign
[19:12] <snap-l> I firmly believe Idiocracy is a roadmap
[19:12] <snap-l> "It's got what plant's crave!"
[19:13] <snap-l> note the apostrophe usage. I feel stupider already.
[19:13] <Blazeix> that movie has forever ruined the word 'electrolytes' for me.
[19:13] <snap-l> ;)
[19:20]  * krondor contemplates an order of brawndo 'the thirst mutilator' from http://www.brawndo.com/
[19:25] <rick_h> who was it saying the path was php-> ruby ? https://twitter.com/#!/nbashaw/status/161891650166202368
[19:28] <tjagoda> Hm
[19:29] <tjagoda> I wonder how I can test my cell for inbound international calling.
[19:29] <snap-l> tjagoda: Post your cell # on reddit and see what happens.
[19:29] <snap-l> rick_h: I think that was either you or me
[19:30] <snap-l> tjagoda: Or head into Ubuntu-COmmunity-Teams and ask someone in there to call you
[19:33] <rick_h> can't believe I'm sitting down with a book on Make
[19:35] <rick_h> snap-l: tell John to quit making the staples_dash tests fail :P
[19:35] <rick_h> I must still be setup in there in jenkins, getting failed to build emails
[19:35] <snap-l> Are you still getting e-mail? :)
[19:35] <snap-l> Ugh
[19:37] <rick_h> bah, note to self. Read the OReilly email BEFORE you buy the book so that you can use the fancy discount codes
[19:37] <snap-l> whoops
[19:38] <snap-l> Did you have the ebook version or the print version registered?
[19:38] <rick_h> no, just bought a new ebook and then saw 20% off deals in their periodic email
[19:38] <snap-l> Oh, nuts
[19:39] <rick_h> yea, doh!
[19:39] <snap-l> I usually make a trip to retailmenot.com for non dotd oreilly purchases
[19:39] <snap-l> They're really good about keeping some form of special running
[19:41] <brousch> your user groups should have a discount code
[19:41] <rick_h> brousch: yea, I signed us up for it and forget to ever use it
[19:41] <snap-l> We used to(?) not sure if we still do
[19:41] <snap-l> rick_h: POst to discuss? :)
[19:42] <rick_h> umm, no :P
[19:42] <brousch> we hvae buy 1 get 1 free code DSUG2
[19:43] <rick_h> yea, that one was in the email I read after buying
[19:43] <brousch> write it down, use it
[19:43] <rick_h> and a series of 20% codes for various conferences oging on
[19:43] <rick_h> and our group code is 35% if I recall
[19:43] <snap-l> rick_h: Why not? That might be useful information (for a change). ;)
[19:45] <brousch> if i were smart i'd put them all in an evernote so i could find them easily
[19:54] <brousch> save 40% on print books and 50% on ebooks with DSUG
[20:18] <jrwren> im so happy that rick_h is going to be a make guru, now I can ask him stuff
[20:18] <jrwren> rick_h: get the autotools stuff too
[20:18] <snap-l> Yeah, rick_h, you should be able to make a configure file by hand when this is done. ;)
[20:19] <jrwren> lol @ configure by hand.
[20:19] <jrwren> that is NUTS
[20:20] <snap-l> I've written one by hand (while looking at some examples). It's not fun.
[20:21] <snap-l> I think I just gave up and tried to make the Makefile more intelligent
[20:21] <jrwren> why?
[20:21] <snap-l> been a while.
[20:21] <snap-l> jrwren: why?
[20:21] <jrwren> yes why?
[20:22] <snap-l> which why? writing one by hand?
[20:22] <jrwren> yes
[20:22] <snap-l> Stupidity? Youthful exuberance?
[20:22] <jrwren> fair enugh
[20:22] <snap-l> Not knowing about how autotools worked
[20:22] <snap-l> (that's the real reason)
[20:23] <jrwren> right
[20:23] <jrwren> that falls under stupidity and youthful exuberance :)
[20:24] <snap-l> heh
[20:24] <snap-l> Hmm... seems __del__ is not called whenever I raise an exception
[20:25] <snap-l> (python)
[20:49] <llua> http://finance.yahoo.com/news/dell-oem-solutions-makes-available-140000419.html
[20:51] <snap-l> interesting
[20:53] <snap-l> Interesting too that they're calling SUSE the first Linux vendor to the Del OEM technology Partner Program
[21:04] <brousch> i'm loving google chome apps lately. have one for evernote and google music
[21:10] <Blazeix> brousch++, me too
[21:13] <brousch> oh cool. in kubuntu i can set it to always open on a specific desktop maximmized
[21:14] <brousch> so i can pin it to desktop 9 and it'll always be there
[21:14] <Blazeix> under Awesome i basically have a tag per chrome web app, so I have my music workspace, email workspace, etc.
[21:14] <brousch> yeah, so desktop 10 is google music app, 9 is evernote app
[21:15] <brousch> by convention desktop 1 is my work browser crap, 2 is personal browser crap, 3 is pidgin, 4 is actual work
[21:31] <Blazeix> so... "intenterface"
[21:34] <brousch> eh?
[21:34] <Blazeix> http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/939
[21:37] <brousch> blah
[21:53] <mydogsnameisrudy> HUD hmmm
[22:37] <tjagoda> ohi