[01:01] <qengho> Sigh. If "bzr commit" ever adds a "-a" parameter that does something awful, them I am so so so screwed.
[03:13] <TheMuso> 3~/c
[04:53] <hikiko> Hi
[04:54] <TheMuso> Hey hikiko.
[04:54] <hikiko> :-)
[05:47]  * ricotz wonders how the numerous harfbuzz releases were missed
[06:17] <pitti> Good morning
[07:04]  * TheMuso -> EOD.
[07:46] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[07:46] <seb128> had to make xchat-gnome accept invalid ssl to connect today
[07:52] <seb128> ricotz, harfbuzz, easy, we follow Debian and they didn't update
[07:52] <pitti> bonjour seb128 !
[07:53] <seb128> salut pitti! ça va bien ?
[07:53] <pitti> seb128: oui, et toi ?
[07:53] <seb128> très bien merci !
[07:53] <willcooke> morning seb128 pitti
[07:53] <pitti> hey willcooke!
[07:53] <seb128> hey willcooke
[08:20] <Laney> meow
[08:21] <willcooke> morning Laney
[08:22]  * pitti tosses some yarn to Laney
[08:27] <seb128> hey Laney
[08:28] <seb128> having fun in London?
[08:29] <Laney> hey willcooke pitti seb128
[08:29] <Laney> sunny today!
[08:29] <Laney> I even left my coat back at the hotel
[08:29]  * Laney is brave
[08:29] <seb128> how long is the walk? ;-)
[08:30] <Laney> reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally far
[08:32] <seb128> :-(
[08:32] <Laney> that's a lie
[08:32] <Laney> it's like 2 minutes
[08:35] <seb128> I was unsure
[08:35] <seb128> got job Mr Lane, you got me :p
[08:35] <seb128> watch you, next time it's my turn!
[08:35] <seb128> got->good
[08:36] <seb128> how is the hackfest otherwise? getting useful things for xenial in shape? ;-)
[08:36] <seb128> did ximion convince you to take the new generator yet? ;-)
[08:45] <Laney> yeah got to fix this extra 20 minutes of runtime that I added
[08:45] <Laney> #fail
[08:45] <Laney> not quite yet, I'll let him find all the bugs in debian first
[08:51] <willcooke> anyone know about Macs, and specifically creating Ubuntu USB installers?
[08:52] <willcooke> popey perhaps? ^
[08:53] <davmor2> willcooke: there is a wiki page dedicated to it I think it is covered on there one second
[08:53]  * seb128 bououou at willcooke
[08:53] <willcooke> davmor2, right, the web team are asking me questions about it, and I know zero about Macs.  I've never used one
[08:54] <willcooke> seb128, not booo!!  ^ ;D
[08:54] <seb128> :-)
[08:54] <seb128> good!
[08:54] <willcooke> Do I look like I own a scarf?
[08:54] <willcooke> ;p
[08:54]  * seb128 pictures willcooke with a scarf
[08:54] <seb128> no, doesn't really fit
[08:54] <willcooke> lol
[08:55] <seb128> willcooke, joke aside, http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop/create-a-usb-stick-on-mac-osx ?
[08:55] <davmor2> willcooke: ah okay
[08:55] <Laney> burning a CD
[08:55] <willcooke> Questions are:
[08:55] <willcooke> * do users need to install refind to work on newer macs?
[08:55] <willcooke> * do users need to pre-partition their drives to run alongside mac?
[08:55] <willcooke> * will mac osx updated mess up refind?
[08:55] <Laney> good luck with that
[08:55] <willcooke> I don't even know what a refind is
[08:55] <willcooke> (also:  don't care)
[08:56] <seb128> same here
[08:56] <Laney> xnox: can you please look at glib2.0's tests on s390x? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/+bug/1561698
[08:56] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1561698 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "Build hangs on s390x" [Undecided,New]
[08:56]  * Laney is annoyed that they got disabled
[08:56] <davmor2> willcooke: oh so this is installing it not having it on usb then
[08:57] <willcooke> davmor2, installing it from USB
[09:00] <davmor2> willcooke: you might not need refind on newer systems but the documentation still needs to be there for older macs https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MactelSupportTeam/AppleIntelInstallation you'd need someone with a new mac to test
[09:03] <xnox> Laney, yes.
[09:03] <Laney> thanks
[09:37] <seb128> willcooke, http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/04/how-to-create-a-bootable-ubuntu-usb-on-windows-mac-and-linux
[09:37] <seb128> seems they heard you
[09:41] <willcooke> woah!
[09:41] <willcooke> thanks seb128
[09:47] <davmor2> willcooke: you mean you're not scared by the fact that a random reporter is righting articles on things that happen to be in your head (Start twilight zone music)
[09:47] <willcooke> :)
[09:47] <davmor2> writing even
[09:54] <popey> willcooke: now ask how to win the lottery please
[09:58] <willcooke> :D
[10:36] <attente> seb128: willcooke: thinking about what to do re: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1565865. is this something update-manager can handle or does it have to be gnome-software?
[10:36] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1565865 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu patches make applying firmware updates not possible" [High,New]
[10:37] <willcooke> attente, thanks
[10:37] <willcooke> it's a tricky one I expect
[10:38] <attente> there are two issues as pointed out there: 1. we don't initiate the fwupd GetUpdates() and 2. we explicitly hide the "Restart & Install" button in GS
[10:40] <attente> a simple solution might be to re-enable gnome-software's daemon mode and re-show the button
[10:45] <willcooke> does that bring offline updates back in to play?
[10:50] <attente> yes
[10:50] <willcooke> seb128, thoughts? ^
[10:51] <willcooke> fwupdate functionality is v. important
[10:58] <Laney> we just discussed it and know what to do I think
[10:59] <attente> yeah, we're going to revert those two commits, add functionality upstream to show the "restart & install" button with more appropriate text depending on what kind of updates are available
[11:04] <willcooke> nice one, thanks attente Laney
[11:07] <attente> an added advantage to leaving it running in the background is that a lot of those UI crashers might go away
[11:08] <attente> (i suspect)
[11:33] <Sweet5hark> seb128: as for libreoffice sponsoring: unless there is a desaster 5.1.2 rc2 will be declared final on thursday. I have the package ready already, so we should be good to go then ...
[12:17] <Sweet5hark> aaand .... reviewed 14 patches upstream (merged 8).
[12:17] <andyrock> Trevinho: https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/unity/lp-1552537/+merge/290976
[12:18] <andyrock> Trevinho: do you want me to prepare a mp for unity/wily too?
[12:19] <andyrock> Trevinho:
[12:19] <andyrock> Trevinho: also for trusty
[12:28] <seb128> Sweet5hark, great, let me know when it's good for upload
[12:29] <Sweet5hark> seb128: willdo
[12:29] <seb128> willcooke, attente, offline updates are not implemented in aptdaemon though?
[13:12] <attente> seb128: does that mean we can't really implement this in gnome software anyways?
[13:12] <seb128> attente, "this"?
[13:12] <attente> seb128: aptdaemon not being able to do offline updates
[13:12] <seb128> attente, I don't know how the firmware thing works
[13:13] <seb128> superm1 probably knows better
[13:13] <attente> i thought it was done through the fwupd service, but haven't really looked into it that much
[13:13] <seb128> is that going through packagekit offline updates?
[13:13] <seb128> k
[13:13] <seb128> so maybe it's a different thing
[13:13] <seb128> and we just need to reboot
[13:13] <seb128> is fwupd doing its thing through a systemd job or such?
[13:14] <seb128> or does it need to hit a special boot target?
[13:15] <superm1> seb128: fwupd doesn't use package kit offline updates
[13:15] <superm1> but that button for "update" issues updates for all the various gnome-software plugins
[13:16] <seb128> superm1, how does fwupd work? does it detect files downloaded in a location when booting?
[13:17] <seb128> or does it do it live from the active session?
[13:17] <superm1> so in order to invoke the update it calls gs_plugin_app_update on all plugins: gs_plugin_app_update
[13:17] <superm1> seb128: both
[13:17] <superm1> depends on what kind of firmware you are updating
[13:17] <superm1> UEFI firmware happens during next boot
[13:17] <superm1> DFU and colorhug firmware are done immediately live
[13:17] <seb128> k
[13:18] <superm1> there will be more firmware types coming in future fwupd updates too
[13:18] <seb128> well then it seems we don't need offline updates to get firmware updates
[13:18] <seb128> but we need a way to show a reboot button when there is one of those pending reboot
[13:18] <seb128> is that right?
[13:18] <superm1> well but you still need 2 things
[13:18] <superm1> 1) a way to tell it to download the updates
[13:19] <superm1> that happens normally in the background as a refresh
[13:19] <superm1> and I think that's what packagekit deems an offline update
[13:19] <superm1> the file is fully cached and you hit the update button and everything is processed
[13:20] <superm1> 2) a way to activate the update
[13:20] <superm1> which is currently the update all buttn on the updates tab
[13:20] <seb128> so what do we miss?
[13:21] <seb128> from your bug description it looks like that the firmware update currently work but you need to
[13:21] <seb128> - click manually on the refresh button
[13:22] <seb128> - reboot once it's downloaded
[13:22] <seb128> ?
[13:22] <superm1> No, not fully correct
[13:22] <superm1> the refresh button does cause them to download
[13:22] <attente> apparently it's packagekit writing to /system-updates (?) and systemd on next boot is reading it to run some scripts to finish the installation
[13:23] <superm1> No you still don't have a way to actually mark them for installation
[13:23] <seb128> what does "marking them for installation" means in actual backend actions?
[13:23] <superm1> That's what the update all button does
[13:23] <seb128> k
[13:23] <superm1> No you still don't have a way to actually mark them for installation
[13:24] <seb128> so basically we would just need to display a button "reboot & apply firmware update" when there is one of those downloaded?
[13:24] <superm1> No you still don't have a way to actually mark them for installation
[13:24] <seb128> lol
[13:24] <seb128> you said that 3 times now :p
[13:24] <superm1> Incorrect, you still need a way to mark for installation
[13:25] <seb128> hum
[13:25] <superm1> seb128: incorrect, you still need a way to mark for installation
[13:25] <seb128> wth?
[13:25] <superm1> and that's what the update button does
[13:25] <attente> :/
[13:25] <seb128> right, I got that
[13:25] <seb128> but does that action requires offline updates support in packagekit
[13:25] <superm1> seb128: incorrect, you still need a way to mark for installation
[13:26] <seb128> that's getting weird
[13:26] <seb128> superm1, sorry, do you feel like I'm going in circle that you keep pasting the same thing again and again?
[13:26]  * seb128 is a bit lost about what's going on there
[13:26] <attente> seb128: yeah, i'm seeing it too
[13:27] <seb128> attente, we don't do offline updates, but I guess we should re-label that button and display it when firmware updates are downloaded
[13:27] <seb128> like change it from "Reboot & upgrade" to "Reboot & install new firmware"
[13:28] <superm1> sorry for lots of messages, IRC seemed to drop me
[13:28] <attente> seb128: why can't we do offline updates?
[13:29] <seb128> attente, I'm guessing we can't, maybe I'm wrong
[13:29] <seb128> attente, but my understanding was that we needed packagekit support
[13:29] <seb128> and we
[13:29] <superm1> yes
[13:29] <seb128> - don't install packagekit
[13:29] <seb128> - aptdaemon doesn't have support
[13:29] <superm1> netsplit i think is going on
[13:29] <seb128> - we would need to update packagekit from 0.8 to 1.0
[13:29] <superm1> my messages not going through
[13:29] <seb128> superm1, we can read them
[13:30] <attente> ok. so what should we do re: the GS daemon and the button
[13:30] <superm1> seb128: netsplit
[13:30] <attente> because it seems like restoring that functionality still doesn't get us fwupd updates
[13:30] <seb128> it doesn't?
[13:30] <seb128> would be nice if superm1 was not lagging
[13:31] <attente> sorry, offline updates i mean
[13:31] <seb128> we don't care about offline updates
[13:31] <superm1_not_auth> seb128: my IRC cloud is failing me
[13:31] <seb128> hey superm1_not_auth
[13:31] <superm1_not_auth> sorry for the repeated messages
[13:31] <seb128> no worry
[13:31] <seb128> we could read you
[13:31] <seb128> but you seemed to lag
[13:31] <attente> seb128: what should we do about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1565865?
[13:31] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1565865 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu patches make applying firmware updates not possible" [High,In progress]
[13:32] <seb128> attente, I'm trying to understand the problem
[13:32] <attente> superm1_not_auth: ^
[13:32] <seb128> superm1_not_auth, do you still lag?
[13:32] <seb128> or is that one ok?
[13:32] <superm1_not_auth> on webchat.freenode.net i'm not lagging
[13:32] <superm1_not_auth> this one is ok
[13:32] <seb128> k, good
[13:32] <attente> superm1_not_auth: it seems like even if we restore GS's run-in-background functionality, we still can't apply firmware updates
[13:33] <superm1_not_auth> because?
[13:33] <attente> without the packagekit offline update support
[13:33] <Laney> ????????????????
[13:33] <seb128> are those the same thing?
[13:33] <superm1_not_auth> well packagekit isn't used for the firmware updates
[13:33] <Laney> who said that?
[13:33] <superm1_not_auth> just disable the package kit offline update functionality
[13:33] <superm1_not_auth> but leave the button there
[13:33] <seb128> what I suggested was
[13:33] <seb128> we don't do offline updates, but I guess we should re-label that button and display it when firmware updates are downloaded
[13:33] <seb128>  like change it from "Reboot & upgrade" to "Reboot & install new firmware"
[13:33] <seb128> since that's what it would do
[13:33] <seb128> it wouldn't apply package updates
[13:34] <seb128> but firmware updates don't got through packagekit offline updates
[13:34] <superm1_not_auth> yeah that would work too
[13:34] <seb128> they go through fwupd
[13:34] <Laney> we said that here this morning
[13:34] <Laney> why this discussion?
[13:34] <superm1_not_auth> attente: firmware updates are applied via the fwupd's plugin methods for update: https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-software/tree/src/plugins/gs-plugin-fwupd.c#n744
[13:35] <seb128> Laney, attente seems confused ... aren't you guys at the same hackfest?
[13:35] <Laney> yes
[13:35] <Laney> I'm wondering why this current confusion is happening
[13:35] <Laney> because he knew what to do earlier
[13:36] <attente> maybe i don't understand... because i thought applying the firmware updates required an offline update
[13:36] <seb128> I don't think they do
[13:36] <Laney> via a different mechanism
[13:36] <Laney> not a packagekit one
[13:36] <attente> what's the alternative mechanism?
[13:37] <Laney> fwupd
[13:37] <superm1_not_auth> they behave "simliarly" to packatekit offline updates in that they get downloaded in the background from the refresh mechanism
[13:37] <seb128> call the fwupd method
[13:37] <seb128> and trigger a normal reboot
[13:37] <seb128> if I understood correctly
[13:37] <seb128> that doesn't rely on the packagekit offline update target
[13:37] <superm1_not_auth> Yep
[13:37] <superm1_not_auth> correct
[13:37] <seb128> good
[13:37] <seb128> so yeah, just relabel the button
[13:37] <seb128> and display it only when a firware has been downloaded
[13:38] <seb128> not when there are normal deb/snap updates
[13:38] <seb128> and we should be good
[13:41] <seb128> attente, Laney, I guess you are sorting it out by direct talk and it's all good now?
[13:41] <Laney> :X
[14:08] <pitti> didrocks: oh, so that ffmpeg issue was a seccomp restriction in snappy after all?
[14:09] <pitti> didrocks: not helpful that this doesn't get logged in dmesg anywhere :/
[14:09] <ogra_> hmm, seccomp denials usually go to syslog
[14:11] <didrocks> pitti: the issue was on vlc
[14:11] <didrocks> pitti: ffmepg was another one
[14:11] <didrocks> (many others ;))
[14:11] <pitti> ah, ok; it sounded very close to what you were looking into a few weeks ago
[14:12] <didrocks> yeah, but I'm having this issue without any security filtering
[14:12] <didrocks> like install an ubuntu server, run the command -> works
[14:12] <didrocks> put the exact same command as a systemd service -> fails
[14:12] <didrocks> so, it's really systemd-related, no apparmor/seccomp here
[14:12] <didrocks> (or not snappy related)
[14:13] <pitti> ah right, I remember, you tracked that down to missing $HOME or so
[14:13] <didrocks> it's not that one, in the end
[14:14] <didrocks> (it was when I tried to sneak the users, but in the end, unrelated)
[14:14] <didrocks> really, it's systemd doing something I don't understand
[14:14] <didrocks> but well, not enough time to spend more time on this and didn't really get any help on this, so abandonned :/
[14:16] <pitti> didrocks: I'm less ridiculously swamped now, so if this is important for something and you need me to take a look, please sub me to the bug report
[14:18] <didrocks> pitti: ah, excellent! will do then (but in a week, leaving for holidays tomorrow midday)
[14:19] <pitti> didrocks: oh, profiter tes vacances ! où allez-vous voyager ?
[14:21] <didrocks> pitti: en Ireland !
[14:21] <didrocks> merci :)
[14:21] <pitti> didrocks: très bien ! Dublin aussi ?
[14:21] <pitti> nous connaisons Dublin de quelques UDSes
[14:22] <pitti> mais peut-être Julie ne le connait pas
[14:22] <didrocks> pitti: oui, Dublin et l'ouest :) (non, Julie ne connait pas du tout)
[14:23] <seb128> didrocks, vous partez combien de temps ?
[14:23] <didrocks> seb128: une semaine (on revient mercredi en 8)
[14:24] <seb128> cool, profitez en bien !
[14:25] <didrocks> merci ;)
[14:46] <larsu> hello friends :)
[14:47] <Laney> hey larsu
[14:47] <Laney> we were talking about you earlier
[14:47]  * Laney wept
[14:47] <Laney> how's it going?!?!?!?!
[14:47] <larsu> Laney: awww, sorry :)
[14:48] <Laney> I was trying to get attente to ask you something :P
[14:48] <larsu> very good!  Sehr gut danke! How are you?
[14:51] <pitti> larsu: very well, tahnks
[14:51] <larsu> seb128: on the side ;) I kind of want to drive getting cockpit into debian and have a ppa for people to try in ubuntu
[14:51] <larsu> seb128: (I am still running ubuntu, too ;) )
[14:52] <seb128> larsu, if you have packaging questions feel free to ask, we have a few people around knowing about that ;-)
[14:54] <larsu> seb128: the package works (but could be "improved" according to a dd who is helping out a bit)
[14:54] <larsu> seb128: but launchpad doesn't do anything when I dput a source package
[14:54] <larsu> not even an email telling me what I did wrong
[14:54] <seb128> where do you dput to?
[14:55] <larsu> I tried ~cockpit-project/ubuntu/cockpit
[14:56] <seb128> syntax?
[14:56] <Laney> I use ppa:user/ppa
[14:56] <larsu> I put that into .dput.cf
[14:56] <Laney> dput ppa:laney/ppa blah_source.changes
[14:56] <larsu> like it says on https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA/Uploading
[14:56] <Laney> works with the default configuration
[14:57] <larsu> does launchpad require some things? It's a native package right now...
[14:57] <seb128> no
[14:57] <larsu> and I haven't signed it (missing the cockpit private key on my machine)
[14:57] <larsu> but dput has a "allow_unsigend_uploads" option, so I guess that should work...
[14:57] <Laney> nein
[14:57] <Laney> launchpad requires it to be signed
[14:57] <larsu> ah!
[14:58] <larsu> damn
[14:58] <Laney> by the key of someone in the team which owns the ppa
[14:58] <didrocks> weird that you didn't get email from this though
[14:58] <didrocks> maybe to avoid spamming
[14:58] <seb128> yeah
[14:58] <didrocks> hey larsu :)
[14:58] <Laney> not weird
[14:58] <larsu> and can I dput it even though it's for debian unstable? Or do I have to change the distribution?
[14:58] <Laney> it would email the person that signed it
[14:58] <seb128> you might want to ask on #launchpad if that's normal
[14:58]  * didrocks dput to ppa:laney/blah
[14:58] <larsu> didrocks: hello! How are you?
[14:58] <Laney> but if nobody then nobody to email
[14:58] <larsu> ugh
[14:58] <didrocks> larsu: busy as hell, but okish, tomorrow is holidays! :)
[14:58] <seb128> larsu, you need to use an ubuntu serie
[14:59] <seb128> otherwise launchpad wouldn't know what distro to target
[14:59] <larsu> Laney, seb128: thanks a lot
[14:59] <seb128> xenial? trusty?
[14:59]  * larsu could have figured..
[14:59] <larsu> seb128: hm, so I need to maintain two debian dirs?
[15:00] <seb128> larsu, you can probably hack the .changes
[15:00] <seb128> have a script to do that for you
[15:00] <Laney> you can override this when uploading to ppas
[15:00] <Laney> it's under "Using packages from other distributions"
[15:00] <Laney> but I don't know if that works with the ppa: syntax
[15:00] <larsu> ah
[15:00] <larsu> thanks
[15:01] <larsu> it's a bit confusing
[15:01] <larsu> it will be even more when I try to do this automatically from the release scripts, because they run on fedora machines ;)
[15:01] <larsu> which have all the packaging things for debian, which is awesome, but not dput
[15:02] <Laney> probably possible to build dput there
[15:02] <larsu> yeah it's not big
[15:03]  * Laney just unfucked appstream.ubuntu.com
[15:04] <Laney> OOOOOOOOOOOOOPS
[15:04] <Laney> ah only one of the machines
[15:05] <Laney> This Is Devops
[15:06] <seb128> lol
[15:07] <larsu> haha
[15:07]  * larsu misses this channel
[15:07] <larsu> should come by more often
[15:07] <seb128> indeed you should!
[15:10] <Laney> larsu: I'm in the redhat london office atm
[15:10] <Laney> cool snacks here
[15:11] <larsu> oh cool! How is that?
[15:11] <larsu> and ........... why?
[15:11] <seb128> don't get used to the haribo too much
[15:11] <Laney> pretty nice
[15:11] <Laney> gnome-software sprint
[15:11] <larsu> oh nice! Who's around?
[15:11] <Laney> the reception people at the ground floor leave at 6pm
[15:11] <seb128> larsu doesn't read g+ :p
[15:11] <Laney> so we had to go down to the loading area and leave through some shady door
[15:12] <larsu> seb128: that thing still exists? :P
[15:12] <larsu> Laney: haha - did you hack all night again like in Brussels?
[15:12] <seb128> larsu, https://plus.google.com/u/1/+RobertAncell/posts/ZQ4ge5C86fy?pid=6269736736094251298&oid=117099795522230536585
[15:13] <seb128> can see Laney!
[15:13] <seb128> and he's smilling
[15:13] <Laney> aruiz and attente and kalev and hughsie and ximion and jrocha and alex and ramcq and some others
[15:13] <Laney> yeah those guys
[15:13] <seb128> Laney, did you guys hide attente's cokes for the picture?
[15:13] <larsu> oh how cool!
[15:14] <larsu> seb128: lol
[15:14] <Laney> he's been on the tango so far
[15:14] <ogra_> so the talk about weeping over larsu was all lies ?!?
[15:14] <seb128> :-)
[15:14] <Laney> the weeping was in person
[15:14] <Laney> in borough market over a pieminister
[15:14] <larsu> ogra_: never trust Laney's weeping
[15:14] <ogra_> :)
[15:14] <larsu> aww
[15:14] <Laney> not enough salt in those things
[15:17] <seb128> Laney, so the tango thing explains why attente got confused over the offline updates thing
[15:17] <seb128> he needs the real drink
[15:17] <attente> seb128: now the tango thing is confusing me
[15:18] <seb128> because you though you were drinking something else? ;-)
[15:18] <attente> wait a minute. this isn't a coke
[15:19] <seb128> lol
[15:19] <larsu> attente! What's up?
[15:20] <attente> larsu: hey, in your office :P
[15:20]  * larsu looks around
[15:20] <seb128> larsu, quick, put a tshirt on!
[15:21] <seb128> working from home ftw :p
[15:21] <larsu> seb128: was just in a video call, so I'm already wearing a shirt ;)
[15:21] <larsu> but pants..........
[15:24] <attente> lol
[15:24] <seb128> :-)
[15:26]  * Laney thinks pants are something else
[15:26]  * Laney goes blind
[15:27] <larsu> trousers?!
[15:27] <Laney> phew
[15:29] <willcooke> laney, attente - you guys around for the meeting?  I'm expecting not.
[15:29] <willcooke> also LARSU!!
[15:29] <willcooke> glad you can make the meeting :)
[15:30] <qengho> Put larsu in the queue.
[15:30] <willcooke> :D
[15:30] <larsu> willcooke: hi man! How are you?
[15:30] <larsu> haha
[15:30] <willcooke> larsu, ya know, gettin' by
[15:30] <willcooke> :)
[15:30]  * larsu slowly steps away from the keyboard
[15:30] <willcooke> no trousers required for our meetings
[15:30] <larsu> how about shirts?
[15:31] <willcooke> nope, free and easy
[15:31] <willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-05
[15:31] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Apr  5 15:31:11 2016 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[15:31] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[15:31] <willcooke> Roll call:  andyrock (classes), attente (sprint), desrt (hols),  dgadomski (out), fjkong, happyaron, hikiko (out), laney (sprint), qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
[15:31] <seb128> hey!
[15:31] <Sweet5hark> heya
[15:31] <larsu> o/
[15:31] <Trevinho> yay
[15:31] <Trevinho> :)
[15:32] <seb128> oh, good morning Trevinho!
[15:32] <Trevinho> seb128: lol :-D
[15:33] <willcooke> Gonna skip over laney and attente since they're busy
[15:33] <Trevinho> seb128: i actually got awake quite early this morning...
[15:33] <willcooke> so on to...
[15:33] <willcooke> #topic andyrock
[15:33] <willcooke> # I've been working to use Alt+space to open the Hud. Atm I'm
[15:33] <willcooke> refactoring a bit libwnck to make it possible to get a GMenuModel
[15:33] <willcooke> instead of a GtkMenu for the window menu.
[15:33] <willcooke> # Proposed a branch to fix a bug that allow to unlock legacy
[15:33] <willcooke> lockscreen (gnome-screensaver running on unity) without password
[15:33] <willcooke> # Reviews
[15:33] <willcooke> #topic fjkong
[15:33] <happyaron> hey
[15:33] <willcooke> Hmm, no fjkong
[15:33] <willcooke> #topic happyaron
[15:33] <willcooke> hey happyaron!
[15:34] <willcooke> this time sucks for you guys now even more than it did
[15:34] <happyaron> can I write a bit later? still typing...
[15:34] <willcooke> happyaron, sure
[15:34] <happyaron> ty!
[15:34] <willcooke> #topic hikiko
[15:34] <willcooke> * ezoom:
[15:34] <willcooke> - done: I fixed the transformations needed to switch coordinate systems and apply the compiz ezoom scale and translation in the unity space. As a result, the desktop components get the correct position and scale.
[15:34] <willcooke> - in progress: I try to fix the artifacts that are caused by the way we damage regions and rectangles before drawing. The components are transformed but the regions and rectangles we damage on nux/unity side are not and so, only parts of them are redrawn. The proper way to fix the problem is to transform the dirty regions and rectangles too using the scale factors and translations we extract from compiz. As a first and easier approac
[15:34] <willcooke> h, I mark the whole screen as dirty every time that we have a non identity ezoom transformation (=> we have scaled and moved the desktop) so that the whole screen is redrawn. When I fix all the artifacts with that approach, I am going to optimize that code and add the proper transformations for the regions/rectangles.
[15:34] <willcooke> EOF
[15:34] <willcooke> #topic qengho
[15:36] <willcooke> he was here a moment ago, suspect lagging
[15:36] <willcooke> hey FJKong
[15:36] <FJKong> hi
[15:36] <willcooke> #topic FJKong
[15:36] <FJKong> coding and testing skin for new feature
[15:36] <FJKong> half day for going to Embassy of Czech handing material
[15:36] <FJKong> one day holiday
[15:36] <FJKong> that's all
[15:36] <willcooke> is the visa all ok FJKong?
[15:36] <andyrock> hey all
[15:37] <willcooke> hey andyrock, I did yours for you.  That was a quick class :)
[15:37] <seb128> hey andyrock
[15:37] <FJKong> willcooke: yes
[15:37] <willcooke> great!
[15:37] <FJKong> waiting for it
[15:37] <willcooke> qengho, when you're back, shout
[15:37] <willcooke> #topic seb128
[15:38] <seb128> was on holiday, back since yesterday, mostly backlog

[15:38] <willcooke> :)
[15:38] <willcooke> thanks seb128
[15:38] <seb128> yw!
[15:38] <willcooke> #topic seb128
[15:38] <willcooke> er
[15:38] <seb128> was on holiday, back since yesterday, mostly backlog
[15:38] <seb128> :p
[15:38] <willcooke> lololol
[15:38] <willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
[15:38] <Sweet5hark> - regression fixes
[15:38] <Sweet5hark> - code reviews and patch merging
[15:38] <Sweet5hark> - put doko changes for dropping jdk in git
[15:38] <Sweet5hark> - prepared bump to LibreOffice 5.1.2 in xenial this week (ready)
[15:38] <Sweet5hark> EOF
[15:38] <willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark
[15:38] <willcooke> #topic TheMuso
[15:39] <willcooke> * Started implementing a solution for 16.04 to allow mate and GNOME to have accessibility profiles. I've created new profiles for each environment, and packaged them separately, so those profiles for that single environment will be seeded and installed separately, but are co-installable. Its not optimal, but doesn't require any new code other than in ubiquity, and even then the code changes are 2 lines or so.
[15:39] <willcooke> * Was informed about, and reproduced an issue with USB braille displays not functioning when connected. Have started debugging, will resume once a11y profile work above is done.
[15:39] <willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
[15:40] <tkamppeter> - cups-filters: PDFs withh filled forms (and other non-static things in PDF) do not print correctly directly, print only from evince or similar. Investigated the case and possible solutions via Ghostscript (works, but not good for mobile) and Poppler (needs more deveopment, Poppler has no PDF output).
[15:40] <tkamppeter> - Auto-downloadable printer drivers: Working on how to replace the removed LSB support.
[15:40] <tkamppeter> - Phone: The Upstart overrides for printing are merged in now.
[15:40] <tkamppeter> - Bugs.
[15:40] <willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
[15:40] <willcooke> #topic Trevinho
[15:40] <Trevinho> · Fixed frame extents request causing windows mis-placing (Java apps mostly)
[15:40] <Trevinho> · Fixed unity script to support upstart-managed unity7
[15:40] <Trevinho> · Improved the caching for unity textures
[15:40] <Trevinho> · Added support for loading from themes all the unity textures
[15:40] <Trevinho> · Various dash/hud resizing improvements
[15:40] <Trevinho> · Improved BAMF child views signals
[15:40] <Trevinho> · Reviews
[15:40] <Trevinho> · Did a new bamf/compiz/unity landing
[15:41] <willcooke> thanks Trevinho
[15:41] <willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
[15:41] <willcooke> - GNOME Software fixes / improvements
[15:41] <willcooke> - appstream-glib update
[15:41] <willcooke> - LightDM 1.18.1 release
[15:41] <willcooke> - LightDM bug triaging
[15:41] <willcooke> #topic happyaron
[15:41] <happyaron> 1. translation stuff, continued from last week
[15:41] <happyaron> 2. sogoupinyin: 1) new build for the libstdc++ change 2) new dict db 3) reconfirm status with new PM
[15:41] <happyaron> 3. update packages for ubuntukylin
[15:41] <happyaron> 4. sru: open-gram
[15:41] <happyaron> EOF
[15:42] <willcooke> thanks happyaron
[15:42] <willcooke> #topic qengho
[15:42] <willcooke> are you back with us qengho
[15:43] <seb128> ...
[15:43] <willcooke> strange
[15:43] <willcooke> #topic any other business
[15:44] <willcooke> Sprint is fast approaching.  My mail re: lightning talks... is that something you guys are happy to do?
[15:44] <willcooke> I will assume yes.
[15:44] <willcooke> great!
[15:45] <qengho> sorry!  one sec.
[15:45] <willcooke> #topic qengho
[15:45] <qengho> - snap for chromium, and snappy and snapcraft hacking.
[15:45] <qengho> ^ that's prety much it.
[15:45] <willcooke> thanks qengho
[15:45] <willcooke> #topic AOB
[15:46] <willcooke> The upgrade issue from 14.04 -> 16.04 is mostly squashed now I think.  I did a successful upgrade yesterday. Thanks to everyone who help with tracking that down
[15:46] <seb128> small presentations of what we did this cycle could be good, worth giving it a try ;-)
[15:47] <seb128> @upgrade, great news!
[15:47] <meetingology> seb128: Error: "upgrade," is not a valid command.
[15:47] <willcooke> ha
[15:47] <willcooke> Anyone got anything the want to share?
[15:47] <seb128> not me
[15:48] <willcooke> oki
[15:48] <willcooke> #endmeeting
[15:48] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Apr  5 15:48:14 2016 UTC.
[15:48] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2016/ubuntu-desktop.2016-04-05-15.31.moin.txt
[15:48] <willcooke> thanks all
[15:48] <seb128> thanks
[16:06] <willcooke> attente, is there an "update all" button in g-s?
[16:07] <willcooke> as in, I see I have 11 updates but I can't be bothered to update them 1 by 1
[16:07] <willcooke> I know we have software updater for that job, but just wondering
[16:07] <attente> willcooke: yes, but we disable it because that's also for offline updates
[16:07] <willcooke> ah, right
[16:07] <attente> willcooke: i'm working on fixing this now though
[16:07] <willcooke> cool! thanks attente
[16:08] <Laney> RIGHT NOW
[16:08] <Laney> I just looked over his shoulder and saw this
[16:10] <willcooke> :D
[16:26] <willcooke> seb128, notebook themeing, specifically for Terminal...
[16:26] <seb128> willcooke, why being specific?
[16:27] <willcooke> the actions bar is the thing on the right hand side which has a + icon and a drop down for choosing the active tab
[16:27] <willcooke> it's a bit buggy
[16:27] <willcooke> and seems to have hard-coded paddings
[16:27] <seb128> :-/
[16:27] <willcooke> I cant get it to look nice
[16:27] <willcooke> and I'd quite like to just get rid of it.
[16:27] <willcooke> Wondered what you thought
[16:28] <willcooke> IMO, it's not useful enough to live with the ugly it causes
[16:28] <willcooke> and the theme headaches
[16:28] <willcooke> and I have a patch to get rid of it ;)
[16:28] <willcooke> I say patch, I commented out one line
[16:28] <seb128> getting rid of the padding? or the buttons?
[16:29] <willcooke> the buttons and the whole "actions bar"
[16:29] <seb128> I never use it but I'm unsure how representative that is
[16:29] <willcooke> well, 100% of people I asked dont care for it
[16:29] <willcooke> ;D
[16:30] <seb128> did you ask me only? ;-)
[16:30] <willcooke> what?
[16:30] <willcooke> I have to go now
[16:30] <willcooke> ;))
[16:30] <seb128> lol
[16:30] <seb128> maybe Laney and larsu have an opinion on that?
[16:30] <willcooke> seb128, I'll send you a couple of screenshots about it
[16:30] <seb128> just listing people who actually touched to that project code/interacted with upstream recently
[16:33] <larsu> actions bar?
[16:33] <seb128> larsu, the icons on the right of the tabs in g-t it seems
[16:33] <seb128> the + for new tab
[16:33] <larsu> ah, I think that's also used for overflowing when there are too many tabs
[16:33] <seb128> with the dropdown
[16:33] <larsu> would be bad if you can't access those anymore
[16:34] <larsu> we should make the '+' symbolic, maybe
[16:34] <seb128> willcooke, ^ good point
[16:34] <willcooke> ah yes
[16:34] <larsu> ah, no, it still overflows with < and > buttons
[16:34] <Laney> but you can't read the titles then
[16:34] <larsu> I think I like that menu though
[16:34] <Laney> so the dropdown is useful
[16:34] <larsu> I seldom use it, but when I do, I'm *really* happy it's there
[16:34] <larsu> yeah exactly Laney
[16:35] <Laney> I wouldn't mess with it at this point personally
[16:35] <larsu> willcooke: what exactly is hardcoded?
[16:35] <willcooke> larsu, some padding around the buttons I think
[16:35] <larsu> oh, you're leaving :/
[16:36] <willcooke> nah, I was messing with Seb
[16:36] <larsu> ah :)
[16:36] <larsu> do you want to make the whole bar thinner?
[16:36] <larsu> looks like the padding comes from the height of the tab bar
[16:37] <Laney> there is some hardcoded padding and margin around those buttons
[16:39] <willcooke> http://imgur.com/xlNQXRb
[16:39] <willcooke> you can see the + icon bleeding over on to the tab
[16:39] <willcooke> (dont worry about the colours)
[16:42] <willcooke> if you want to try the css in the inspector:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/15633442
[16:45] <larsu> oohh
[16:46] <willcooke> I wonder if I can work around it by making the :last tab have a bigger border
[16:47] <larsu> good question...
[16:48] <larsu> looks to me like the button is drawn over the tab bar, without respect to the size of the tab's css box
[16:48] <willcooke> yeah
[16:48] <larsu> do you know how adwaita handles this?
[16:49] <willcooke> I don't know what the CSS looks like, but it has a bigger space between the last tab and the actions bar
[16:50] <larsu> ah, probably that makes this a non-issue for them
[16:50] <larsu> is that too ugly for us to copy?
[16:50] <larsu> ("us" hehe)
[16:50] <willcooke> :)
[16:50] <willcooke> trying to work out how to do that in CSS now...
[16:51] <larsu> does giving the last tab a margin work?
[16:51] <willcooke> just trying
[16:51] <willcooke> why wont my selector work?!?!?!?!?
[16:55] <larsu> welcome to css :(
[16:55] <larsu> willcooke: could ne that pseudo selectors don't work on tabs yet
[16:56] <larsu> there was a lot of work in 3.20 to make stuff like this work
[16:56] <willcooke> s'probably me
[17:05] <willcooke> meh
[17:05] <willcooke> the odd selector works, but last does not
[17:05] <willcooke> so maybe its a bug
[17:06] <willcooke> and margin does nothing
[17:09] <qengho> willcooke: will you debug my wordpress site next?
[17:09] <qengho> (Hah hah)
[17:09] <willcooke> :D sure.  Hope you like pictures of cats
[17:09] <qengho> Dang
[17:14] <Laney> willcooke: do you know when the community wallpapers are going to appear?
[17:14] <willcooke> Laney, I'll chase nhaines now...
[17:14] <Laney> thx
[17:15] <willcooke> he's not on IRC, so I've emailed
[17:15] <willcooke> thanks for the reminder
[17:15] <Laney> no worries
[17:15] <Laney> something made it appear in my brain box
[17:16] <willcooke> heh
[17:22] <willcooke> ok, so it's not padding on the tab
[17:22] <willcooke> it's padding on the .notebook itself
[17:22] <willcooke> .notebook {padding-right: 3px}
[17:22] <willcooke> fixes the overlap
[17:23] <willcooke> but introduces extra padding on the rest of the notebook, so that all the way down the right hand side of the page there is now a 3px padding
[17:27] <seb128> :-/
[17:30] <willcooke> I might try and fix it in the code
[17:31] <willcooke> shit's gettin real now
[17:31]  * sarnold takes off his sunglasses
[17:32] <willcooke> lol
[17:40] <willcooke> ha, oddly appropriate.. http://i.imgur.com/P83qejg.gifv
[17:46] <larsu> haha
[17:46] <larsu> *scary*
[17:48] <sarnold> why is a -guy- holding that down?
[17:48] <sarnold> don't they have heavy things there that aren't alive?
[17:48] <willcooke> :))
[17:49] <larsu> the first thing I wondered was why there's a guy throwing that in the first place...
[17:52] <sarnold> huhn. I didn't think to question that.
[17:53] <larsu> wouldn't be a gif if that hadn't happened, eh? ;)
[17:54] <sarnold> hehe :)
[18:04] <dobey> lol
[18:05] <dobey> i guess a heavy object holding the mower down possibly wouldn't also be able to hold the throttle open
[18:06]  * dobey wonders how to make empathy combine contacts
[19:59] <willcooke> night all


[05:03] <edlik> I am trying to install gimp 2.7.5 on 11.10 and I am having a problem getting past some issues. Trying to install 2.7.5, can someone help me resolve this issue. http://pastebin.com/ChNp5ndw
[05:04] <JoseeAntonioR> edlik: Try with sudo apt-get -f install
[05:07] <edlik> same problem....The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[05:07] <edlik>  gimp : Depends: libgimp2.0 (>= 2.7.5) but it is not going to be installed
[05:07] <edlik>         Depends: libgimp2.0 (<= 2.7.5-z) but it is not going to be installed
[05:07] <edlik> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
[05:08] <philipballew> edlik, what version of ubuntu you runnin?
[05:08] <edlik> 11.10
[05:09] <philipballew> hum. i assume you already know about the ppa?
[05:09] <edlik> yes
[05:09] <philipballew> i saw this type question on askubuntu a while ago
[05:11] <edlik> i installed all ppa from matthaeus
[09:05] <WilsonBradley> Trying to figure out how to turn off Firewall in Ubuntu , to see if that is the problem..
[09:21] <dsenator> hi all, cant get permission to root my android after saving the 51- files
[09:27] <dsenator> any help?
[09:27] <WilsonBradley> I think you need to add a chmod 57 (don't remeber exactly) to the folder/file
[09:32] <dsenator> chmod: changing permissions of `/etc/udev/rules.d/51-android.rules': Operation not permitted
[09:32] <dsenator> thats what i did as per instruction online here https://github.com/GalaxyICS/android/wiki/How-to-install-ADB-(Android-Debug-Bridge)-on-Linux
[09:33] <dsenator> williammanda,
[09:33] <dsenator> WilsonBradley,
[09:34] <WilsonBradley> Trying to use Deluge . I have UpnP enabled on Router and Deluge, but still getting a Red! when clicking-check Port..  My GTK theme doesn't work.
[11:21] <aluex> Would anybody help me? Thanks in advance.
[12:17] <s-fox> Hello.
[13:31] <edlik> Im trying to install gimp 2.7.5 but apparently I am holding broken pakages, can someone help me fix this?  http://pastebin.com/ChNp5ndw
[13:33] <DiegoTc> ./ join #ubuntu-hn
[13:51] <geirha> edlik: what does   apt-cache policy gimp   say?
[13:58] <geirha> I seem to remember there was a gimp ppa that had packaged gimp a little bit different than in the main repositories.
[13:58] <geirha> To install it, you had to remove the old gimp package, including libgimp* first, then install the new gimp.
[14:00] <edlik> geirha:  http://pastebin.com/0XQVNa3R
[14:10] <geirha> Right, so try  sudo apt-get remove gimp libgimp2.0
[14:11] <geirha> Then sudo apt-get install gimp
[14:11] <philinux> edlik: does this help http://askubuntu.com/questions/113870/help-installing-gimp-2-7-5-on-ubuntu-11-10
[14:15] <edlik> philinux: that looks promising, I will give it a try, thanks
[16:53] <glune> hi all
[16:53] <s-fox> Hello glune , how are you?
[16:55] <glune> Does any person know i is if 10.04.4 avialable for download is kept current as to security updates or will i need to update rgiht after install?
[16:56] <holstein> glune: i would expect updates
[16:56] <holstein> updates are released more often that point revs are upgraded for sure
[16:57] <holstein> how many? depends.. are they important? i wouldnt lose sleep over them if i didnt apply them all, but ideally, you are up to date on things like flash and the kernel
[16:58] <glune> ok thanks...
[16:59] <glune> also..........having hard time sending crash reports
[17:01] <glune> Thanks again holstein
[17:56] <s-fox> Going running, goodbye
[20:35] <earthling_> Anyone know how to change default browser?
[20:35] <earthling_> I wanted to set chromium for update manager links
[20:38] <jalcine> earthling_: You should be able to set Chromium as the default web browser in its preferences.
[20:38] <earthling_> I'll check
[20:40] <earthling_> I can't find that
[20:47] <jalcine> Hmm, not under Tools -> Preferences?
[20:49] <earthling_> oh yes I see default, I just wanted it for update manager, hmm
[20:49] <earthling_> how do I change it back to firefox if I don't like it?
[20:51] <jalcine> I think then you'd set that in Firefox.
[20:51] <jalcine> I don't know of a front-end in Gnome that permitted that.
[20:51] <jalcine> I only noticed that you'd have to manually select that.
[20:51] <jalcine> GNOME 3.2 has that setting in its Control Center, though.
[20:52] <earthling_> I think I have older version of gnome
[20:52] <earthling_> I guess I could undo the setting on chromium
[20:52] <earthling_> guess I can't heh
[20:53] <earthling_> no option for unduing
[20:53] <jalcine> Yeah, you'd have to go into another browser and select it as default :/
[20:53] <earthling_> actually it still goes to Epiphany
[20:53] <earthling_> in update manager


[14:26] <Nivex> any idea when 12.04.1 is expected to hit the wire?
[20:18] <akgraner> Nivex - it should be in a couple of hours - I think they are waiting for the last of the images to spin (or so I have been told by reliable sources)
[20:22] <Nivex> cool!


[12:07] <Viper550> Hi
[07:44] <cbx33> ping troy_s
[07:45] <troy_s> go
[07:45] <troy_s> here cbx33
[07:46] <cbx33> hey dude
[07:46] <cbx33> howz it going
[07:46] <cbx33> gimme 2 secs and i'll be back
[07:46] <cbx33> sorry
[08:51] <msikma> Almost done with my Ubuntu Human theme improvement suggestions..
[09:01] <msikma> Anyone else working on Ubuntu-art related stuff now?
[09:03] <troy_s> yes
[09:03] <troy_s> but we can't do anything until production officially presses forwards.
[09:03] <troy_s> which means franks decisions on the various elements
[09:04] <troy_s> but there are quite a few productivity issues being resolved right now.
[09:09] <msikma> PS can we have shadows underneath scroll bars or is this impossible?
[09:10] <msikma> Also, yeah, I totally have lost track of the process since I went away on a holiday and no longer really know what's going down, but this is just for that wikipage that has been started that allows you to give feedback.
[09:30] <troy_s> um shadows under scrollbars?
[09:30] <troy_s> msikma, explain that a bit?
[09:31] <troy_s> i dont' know the actual implementation... if it is a transparent png then it would be possible.
[09:31] <troy_s> but i know not... probably a scaled drawing so shadows are probably out.
[09:31] <msikma> Well, just kind of a sort of shadow-like gradient.
[09:31] <troy_s> also, considering the lack of shadows everywhere else (minus xgl) it would probably seem out of place... but worth looking into.
[09:31] <troy_s> google it.
[09:31] <msikma> But it probably wouldn't work out too well anyway
[09:31] <msikma> Well, the buttons and such have small shadow-like gradients too, so I thought that it _might_ look good.
[09:31] <msikma> Let's see...
[09:32] <troy_s> right now the process is heading into producting, which means that once frank sorts out the elements we all get to mix and match the components
[09:32] <troy_s> well it is possible perhaps to accentuate the grad?
[09:32] <troy_s> that might be a good idea
[09:32] <troy_s> what we really need are franks final palette direction and gtk integrations.
[09:33] <troy_s> so that we can finalize the palette directions for the edgy specs
[09:33] <troy_s> and i think he is sorting out the svg repository for the icons as well.
[09:36] <msikma> I do some slight palette changes in this proposal
[09:36] <msikma> The orange is slightly more brownish
[09:36] <msikma> That allows for a slightly better contrast on the top bar.
[09:36] <msikma> It's a little more saturated.
[09:37] <troy_s> i think Frank is going to pull the palette more into the range of the default wallpaper
[09:37] <troy_s> the rich browns
[09:37] <msikma> Elements such as the combo boxes and check buttons have a slight hue gradient applied on them, the top parts being yellowish and the bottom parts being reddish. It looks a little fresher this way, I would say.
[09:37] <msikma> It's too bad I missed a whole phase of the design process
[09:37] <troy_s> indeed... we could have used your help.
[09:38] <troy_s> but there will be plenty of work needed for production.
[09:38] <troy_s> the various compositional directions etc.
[09:38] <msikma> Yeah, I'll just contribute with that
[09:38] <msikma> Then maybe I can suggest fancy other stuff for the next cycle.
[09:39] <troy_s> the good news is that we are on schedule, so there is a good chance for some changes to be included.
[09:40] <msikma> That's nice. I remember the stress from last time. Well, you guys were probably more stressed than I was since I was relatively new.
[10:17] <fschoep> troy_s: ping
[10:18] <msikma> Hi Frank
[10:18] <fschoep> Hi Michiel,
[10:19] <msikma> Want to see what I am currently working on?
[10:19] <fschoep> Sure, let me see.
[10:19] <cbx33> Hey fschoep
[10:19] <msikma> Okay, it's still very WIP though
[10:20] <fschoep> Hello Pete, the sound engineer I suppose?
[10:20] <cbx33> fschoep, indeed
[10:20] <msikma> http://www.gamingw.net/pubaccess/28695/themews.png
[10:20] <cbx33> wow feels good to be called that
[10:20] <msikma> cbx33: that is very cool
[10:20] <msikma> :)
[10:20] <msikma> I've always wondered how you guys do your work.
[10:20] <cbx33> msikma, hehe
[10:20] <msikma> Like, with what software and such
[10:20] <cbx33> the doing the work is easy
[10:20] <cbx33> it's the coming up with it in the first place that's hard
[10:21] <cbx33> msikma, it's all ubuntu software :p
[10:21] <msikma> Hmm...
[10:21] <cbx33> I'll show you sometime :p
[10:21] <msikma> That PNG looks a lot brighter than in Photoshop
[10:21] <fschoep> msikma: looking good, you did that all on your own?
[10:21] <msikma> Awesome, cbx33!
[10:21] <fschoep> I mean: is it a theme or pixel pushing?
[10:21] <msikma> Oh, I used the window edges from a theme someone made called Chiro, but edited it a little. The rest is a Photoshop mock-up.
[10:22] <fschoep> I see :) I thought you had just surpassed my theme editing skills yet.
[10:22] <msikma> Hmm... why is it showing up so bright in the browser, though? That's kind of odd.
[10:22] <msikma> Hehe, I wish
[10:22] <fschoep> It doesn't look bright here though.
[10:23] <fschoep> The progress bar blends in perfectly with the radio and checkboxes.
[10:23] <msikma> Thanks. I'm glad you like it thus far. Now to get that other drop down menu working...
[10:24] <msikma> A JPEG with ICC profile embedded is slightly darker, but still not the same as in Photoshop. http://www.gamingw.net/pubaccess/28695/themewsjpg.jpg
[10:24] <fschoep> "That other drop down menu"?
[10:24] <msikma> Er
[10:24] <msikma> GtkCombo
[10:24] <msikma> To the left
[10:24] <fschoep> Ah, I see.
[10:25] <fschoep> Did you also round the buttons a bit more?
[10:25] <msikma> I'm also considering making the slide bars in the middle (above "Move In Harmony") orange, at least to see how they look like.
[10:25] <msikma> Yeah, with a radius of one or two pixels more round.
[10:25] <fschoep> Looks awesome.
[10:25] <msikma> The shadow is also slightly larger.
[10:25] <cbx33> fschoep, you got a sec in pm?
[10:25] <msikma> I'm going to try and round the window theme...
[10:25] <fschoep> cbx33: sure, didn't notice :)
[10:25] <msikma> Might look better, and it seems there's consensus that it should be round anyway
[10:25] <fschoep> msikma: Try "outdoors" in dapper, looks great.
[10:26] <fschoep> Even without antialiasing it conveys the spirit of Ubuntu I think.
[10:26] <msikma> Yeah, it uses the SmoothEngine, or something, right?
[10:26] <fschoep> I'm not sure yet, I just choose "Outdoors" as the window border and it works nicely.
[10:26] <msikma> Oh, I guess I'll have another look at it, then.
[10:27] <msikma> My laptop is currently encoding video without X loaded.
[10:27] <msikma> So I'll check later.
[10:27] <fschoep> OK, I'm sure you'll come to like it.
[10:40] <fschoep> I scared him away.
[10:41] <fschoep> :)
[10:41] <fschoep> Before I do any more damage I'll be leaving now, talk to you soon. Good night everyone.
[11:02] <msikma> bwaha


[00:01] <silverarrow> yeah, you are not the only one it seems
[00:02] <silverarrow> with regular ubuntu the upgrade will not take either
[00:02] <wxl> upgrades in general? because i was able to update packages
[00:03] <silverarrow> no, sorry, upgrade to beta 12.10 I mean
[00:03] <wxl> well that's what i was trying to do
[00:03] <wxl> that's what do-release-upgrade does
[00:03] <wxl> but it can't find the update
[00:03] <wxl> if you mean update from an iso that's a different thing from what i'm tlaking about
[00:03] <silverarrow> it doesn`t work in regular Ubuntu either it seems, the feed pack there is "broken packages"
[00:04] <silverarrow> no, I am talking about terminal or update manger in booted system
[00:04] <silverarrow> from 12.04 runnig
[00:04] <silverarrow> running
[00:05] <wxl> yeah that's what i mean
[00:05] <wxl> have you seen this in a bug report somewhere?
[00:05] <silverarrow> someone wanted to try the gimp version in quantal, but could not get the upgrade to take
[00:06] <silverarrow> I don` think it was reported
[00:06] <wxl> so they wanted the quantal gimp, and because of this they wanted to upgrade to quantal?
[00:06] <wxl> if this is on the forums, you should tell those people to report bugs!
[00:06] <silverarrow> i was on a the ubuntu+1 channel yesterday
[00:06] <wxl> everything needs to be reported or the devs don't really notice
[00:06] <silverarrow> it got as far as initiating the upgrade but halted "broken packges"
[00:07] <silverarrow> yes, but it wasn`t me was it
[00:07] <wxl> yeah i didn't even get to that
[00:07] <wxl> it just said none found
[00:07] <silverarrow> we tired different commands
[00:07] <silverarrow> lots of paste bin logs
[00:08] <wxl> this is true even on my intel machine
[00:08] <wxl> !
[00:08] <silverarrow> maybe ubuntu+1 is logged?
[00:10] <silverarrow> did you try sudo do-release-upgrade -d
[00:11] <wxl> indeed i did
[00:11] <wxl> and i just get the old "checking for new Ubuntu release"/"no new release found"
[00:11] <wxl> maybe it has to be an rc first
[00:11] <silverarrow> it`s not working then
[00:11] <silverarrow> the upgrade is not available through teminal
[00:12] <silverarrow> not heard a word about it from any though, not i mail list or on the forum
[00:13] <wxl> strange
[00:13] <wxl> well usually the testers aren't upgrading their systems by means other than iso
[00:13] <wxl> and even then the upgrade testcase is almost hidden from view way at the bottom of the list
[00:15] <silverarrow> the  past is still up http://paste.ubuntu.com/1201798/
[00:16] <silverarrow> not sure I dear try it
[00:16] <silverarrow> dare
[00:16] <silverarrow> lol
[00:16] <silverarrow> total mess !!
[00:16] <wxl> heh
[00:17] <silverarrow> do I get a y/n option ?
[00:17] <wxl> n
[00:17] <wxl> XD
[00:17] <silverarrow> I will let it be then lol
[00:20] <wxl> you're telling me i'm supposed to read "devel" and interpret "stable?"
[00:20] <wxl> oops wrong channel
[00:20] <wxl> AGAIN
[00:40] <silverarrow> what?
[00:46] <silverarrow> wxl, what do you make if this ? http://paste.ubuntu.com/1203831/
[00:46] <silverarrow> I tried the upgrade too
[00:47] <silverarrow> have you gone to bed?
[00:49] <wxl> about ready to leave for the day -- end work time here
[00:49] <silverarrow> cant find expected packages in release file
[00:49] <wxl> cursory look suggests you should try again and see if you have the same problem
[00:49] <silverarrow> oh you are in us
[00:49] <silverarrow> I see
[00:49] <wxl> yep. until later
[00:50] <silverarrow> have a nice evening then
[00:51] <silverarrow> my network is up and running though
[00:51] <silverarrow> fine on the hp
[00:51] <silverarrow> I shall keep at it
[00:51] <silverarrow> or stay with it
[00:51] <silverarrow> not sure what`s correct
[01:53] <silverarrow> upgrade to quantal from terminal is not working
[01:54] <silverarrow> I keep getting suggested to check my network, but it is working
[13:44] <smartboyhw> kanliot: PING
[13:47] <kanliot> helllo world
[13:47] <kanliot> smartboyhw,
[13:47] <smartboyhw> kanliot: You written me a testimonial and you don't put it on my wiki????\
[13:47] <kanliot> yea
[13:47] <kanliot> i sent it through email
[13:47] <smartboyhw> Put it in if not it does not count:)
[13:48] <kanliot> if you want to thank me
[13:48] <kanliot> change yer steve jobs pic
[13:48] <smartboyhw> Put it in my wiki page please:) If not it certainly doesn't count at all
[13:48] <kanliot> your profile is personal
[13:48] <kanliot> you do it
[13:48] <smartboyhw> ........
[13:48] <kanliot> i wouldn't want you editing mine
[13:49] <smartboyhw> Grrrrrr
[13:49] <kanliot> GRRRRAWWR
[13:49] <smartboyhw> lol
[13:49] <kanliot> lol
[17:52] <elfy> cjohnston: assuming you're cjwatson on LP - if I'd have known I'd have asked in here about grub2 and recovery menu instead of wasting time witha bug report
[18:01] <cjohnston> :-(
[18:01] <elfy> sorry and all that
[18:01] <cjohnston> :-)
[18:01] <elfy> :)
[18:02] <cjohnston> elfy: you do want cjwatson, though he appears offline
[18:03] <elfy> aah - so there is a good reason for being elfy - no-one can get confused:D
[18:03] <cjohnston> tab fail wins in here alot
[18:03] <elfy> :)
[18:04] <elfy> of course if I'd looked then Chris and Colin look a whole lot different :)
[18:04] <cjohnston> true
[18:04] <elfy> but I shall use the I am tired excuse :p
[18:04] <cjohnston> I have debated changing to chrisjohnston, but cjwatson said just leave as is and laugh at people
[18:06] <elfy> lol


[00:09] <Slavic> jea, never
[00:09] <Slavic> what do you discuss there?
[00:16] <jea> depends on the meeting
[00:16] <jea> there have been a few release parties
[00:16] <jea> and one or two events to promote ubuntu, like an installfest
[00:32] <Slavic> jea, where does it usually take place? Universities?
[00:35] <jea> universities, libraries, pubs/cafes
[00:35] <jea> depending on what it is


[03:06] <wxl> hopefully this is not too late but i just marked lubuntu alternate amd64/i386 as ready for alpha2
[06:21] <pitti> infinity: I just uploaded an SRU for bitcoin in precise; any idea why it landed in NEW?
[06:21] <pitti> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+queue?queue_state=0
[06:21] <pitti> wgrant: ^
[06:21] <pitti>  bitcoin  | 0.3.24~dfsg-1 | precise/universe | source
[06:21] <pitti>  bitcoind | 0.3.24~dfsg-1 | precise/universe | amd64, armel, armhf, i386, powerpc
[06:21] <pitti> is that because it doesn't exist in any other release?
[06:22] <pitti> but I suppose accepting it in NEW won't put it into UNAPPROVED, like that it's just not visible to the SRU team
[06:23] <wgrant> pitti: Totally new override code was deployed a few hours ago, so probably a regression there. Investigating now -- please don't touch it just yet.
[06:23] <pitti> wgrant: thanks; no, I won't -- if I would accept it it would already go into -proposed, and I'm not in ~ubuntu-sru any more
[06:25] <infinity> Definitely a regression.
[06:25] <infinity> wgrant: HEY, YOUR CODE HAS A REGRESSION.
[06:25] <infinity> wgrant: YOU WANTED ME TO TELL YOU.
[06:25] <infinity> wgrant: THIS IS ME NOTICING.
[06:26] <wgrant> Ahh
[06:26] <wgrant> It's the resurrections-must-hit-NEW case going wrong.
[06:27] <wgrant> The most recent precise pub is a rejected SRU that is now Deleted.
[06:27] <wgrant> So it sees the most recent pub is Deleted and decides it needs NEWing again.
[06:27] <wgrant> I guess in this case I should look for non-Deleted ones first.
[06:32] <wgrant> infinity: Opinions on precedence for binaries? We need to fall back to other archs and also to deleted pubs, but in which order should the combinations be tried?
[06:33] <wgrant> Like, should an amd64 binary fall back to i386's overrides before a deleted amd64 pub?
[06:34] <pitti> I think "yes", from my POV
[06:34] <pitti> in general it's really awkward to have builds for different arches be in different components
[06:34] <pitti> and I'm inclined to say that every such case is queue pilot error instead of deliberate
[06:35] <infinity> wgrant: arch-before-deleted, I'd say.  Since arches should match in the Ubuntu case anyway.
[06:35] <infinity> wgrant: We don't tend to mismatch.
[06:35] <infinity> wgrant: We *can*, but we don't, cause it breaks our tiny little AA minds (and some of our tools).
[06:36] <infinity> We should probably revisit that some day, so we can do different arch priorities, but yeah, we don't today.  Today, we override the tools instead of the pubs.
[06:36] <wgrant> infinity: That's where I was leaning to as well, yeah.
[06:37] <wgrant> The only thing that can sanely differ is priority, I guess.
[06:37] <wgrant> And who cares if that goes slightly wrong.
[07:17] <Riddell> Laney: did alpha 2 get released? I see nothing on ubuntu-devel-announce?
[08:15] <Laney> Riddell: no, kylin hadn't readied before I had to leave
[08:15] <Laney> let me check on it now
[08:16] <Laney> yes, looks good, doing it
[08:20] <Riddell> gotcha
[08:32] <Laney> jamespage: do you know if anyone other than utlemming can publish cloud images?
[08:32] <jamespage> Laney, rcj can as well but they are both not around until later
[08:33] <jamespage> Laney, prob smoser as well
[08:33] <Laney> ha
[08:33] <jamespage> again +3 hrs or so
[08:33] <Laney> sure, don't really want to wait for that
[08:33] <Laney> I'll just say "will shortly be available"
[08:37] <Laney> syncing out now
[08:41] <jamespage> Laney, ack
[09:02] <Laney> jamespage: ah, maybe they're already done: http://cloud-images.ubuntu.com/releases/utopic/alpha-2/
[09:08] <jamespage> Laney, awesome
[09:09] <jamespage> that does look to be the case
[09:09] <Laney> so all good
[09:09] <Laney> move along people, nothing to see here
[09:22] <pitti> the new debhelper is being held back in -proposed by the new broken gem2deb version in -proposed, but it's not the new debhelper's fault; can you please hint this?
[12:48] <smoser> Laney, i can.
[12:49] <smoser> and, yeah, rcj.
[13:32] <Laney> smoser: It'd be good to have someone in the eu who can do it too
[13:33] <smoser> Laney, talk to utlemming to get someone on that team.
[13:34] <Laney> utlemming: consider yourself talked to :-)
[14:31] <Chipaca> seb128: please re-review https://code.launchpad.net/~chipaca/gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas/just-the-touch-settings/+merge/228317
[14:45] <seb128> Chipaca, k
[15:12] <Nivex> Curiosity is getting the better of me. What's the blocker for do-release-upgrade from 12.04.4 to 14.04.1 ?
[15:58] <wgrant> pitti, infinity: That NEW bug is fixed on prod now.
[17:14] <utlemming> Laney: working on that question today, incidently.


[12:13] <NineTeen67Comet> g'day all . does anyone have the default contents of /etc/apache2/sites-enable handy? I seemed to have tossed the one that I needed .. 000 something I think ..
[12:19] <NineTeen67Comet> P.S. What is a suggested FTP server app to run to allow users to their www directories .. Normally from my experience it was very hard to give ftp users access to anyplace but their home directory OR their web directory .. (could the follow simlinks?) ..
[01:19] <storkme> how does one forcibly remove a package
[01:21] <foo> apt-get remove <package> doesn't work?
[01:24] <storkme> nevermind, got it
[01:24] <storkme> had to remove the init script, reboot, purge, and reinstall
[01:25] <storkme> g'nightr
[01:25] <foo> ah
[08:50] <dsdg> halo, anyone running apache2 in ubuntu dapper?
[08:51] <dsdg> i have a problem where it's not including modules
[08:51] <dsdg> eventhough they are in the mods-enabled directory (symlinked)
[08:53] <dsdg> funny thing is mod include isnt in the modules list..
[08:54] <dsdg> so how will that include statement in the apache.conf even work :(
[09:15] <infinity2> dsdg: mod_include has nothing to do with includes in the conffile.
[09:15] <infinity2> dsdg: It's for shtml includes.
[09:31] <dsdg> hey infinity2 i see that mod_auth_mysql is wacked man! different config values...
[09:32] <dsdg> i have added _ to some of the values and then it works...struggeling to find the correct values here
[09:32] <dsdg> stooopid devs
[09:55] <infinity> stooopid devs?
[09:56] <infinity> Would it help you be a bit more polite if I pointed out how many times my name appears in the apache2 changelog?
[09:56] <infinity> Though mod_auth_mysql is something I generally consider worthless.
[09:59] <foo> dsdg: eh, I have to agree. Again, chill. Unless you have the time to contribute...
[10:00] <foo> ah
[10:57] <dsdg> my point is that standardization wont hurt, and again, how must i know to add _ between the values, now im stuck with this option, Auth_MySQL_UserTable - i see the web refers to this Auth_MySQL_Password_Table - but that wont work as well, so im stuck again...
[10:58] <dsdg> change Auth_MySQL_Password_Table to Auth_MySQL_UserTable
[10:58] <dsdg> Invalid command 'Auth_MySQL_UserTable', perhaps mis-spelled or defined by a module not included in the server configuration
[10:59] <dsdg> must i now guess these values?
[11:01] <dsdg> and mod_auth_mysql is great, i am trying to use it with webdav...runnign a whole projects server of dav, and putting the auth in a db makes perfect sense, but try now to get it to work...good luck!
[11:01] <infinity> I tend to use mod_auth_pam, then hand off authentication to PAM modules.
[11:02] <infinity> (Where you could still use MySQL, if you wanted to, I suppose)
[11:02] <dsdg> it's nice, cause i put my mail, ftp, apache all auth in mysql,
[11:03] <dsdg> but damn man, i whish i could just do it, instead of having to search the net for values that suppose to be standard,
[11:03] <dsdg> in gentoo those values dont even have _ in them,
[11:03] <dsdg> and thats how it reflects on the sourceforge.net page,
[11:04] <dsdg> anyways :) im just bitching becuase i can :)
[12:36] <infinity> dsdg: Right, if you're authenticating multiple sources against MySQL like that, that's why it would make more sense to use PAM.
[12:36] <infinity> dsdg: Cause they should all be able to use PAM auth, then you have a uniform backend.
[01:07] <spike> infinity: excuse me, I dont really understand your last comment, would you mind argumenting? I fail to see how postfix, vsftpd, apache all using some mod_mysql and authing against it isnt a "uniform backend"
[01:08] <spike> I can see how one could use pam for all those services, and if necessary, add libpam-mysql to the equation, but I fail to see how that would be better
[01:10] <spike> in principles I can see the difference as in: services -> pam -> mysql Vs  some services -> pam -> xyz + other services -> mysql
[01:10] <spike> but in practise judging latter inferior, uhm, not sure about that
[01:11] <infinity> Different MySQL auth stuff can sometimes want different table layouts, etc.  Using PAM allows for uniformity.
[01:12] <infinity> It's also just a bit more elegant, IMO.  And means that you don't need every service to have a MySQL plugin of some sort.
[01:15] <spike> both good points, fair enough, no need to shrug really
[02:38] <shawarma> Not really on-topic, but this is probably the place most likely to have someone who will answer positively: Does anyone happen to have either an ia64 or sparc ubuntu installation that a) they'd run a tiny experiment for me on or b) lend me access to for a little while?
[05:15] <storkme> what's the best way to install LAMP on a working 6.06 ubuntu server installation ?
[07:38] <fabbione> shawarma: i have both ia64 and sparc...
[07:39] <fabbione> shawarma: send me a mail with details of what you need.. they are both headless machines.. so no X stuff...
[07:45] <thom> storkmee: sudo tasksel and choose LAMP
[07:50] <shawarma> fabbione: Rock'n'roll. Thanks!
[07:52] <fabbione> shawarma: also.. i won't look at it today or tomorrow.. it's monday busines
[07:52] <fabbione> +s
[07:54] <fabbione> shawarma: and for access you need to ship at least another 5lt of beer :)
[07:54] <fabbione> last time was good.. this time needs to be excellent ;)
[07:56] <shawarma> Heh... If we manage to both go to a UDS at some point I'll be sure to pay my dues. :-)
[07:56] <fabbione> shawarma: eheh ok
[07:57] <fabbione> i am off...
[08:19] <storkmee> i have no tasksel command
[08:20] <thom> sudo aptitude install "~tLAMP" would also work
[08:24] <storkmee> i did it manually anyway :p


[18:26] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::OMG!Ubuntu:: Check Out GNOME Shell’s New Look in GNOME 42 @ https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2022/01/gnome-shell-theme-changes-in-gnome-42 (by Joey Sneddon)
[21:57] <Bashing-om> UWN: Issue719 up for review and final edits: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue719 .


[17:27] <lain_> Hi, im having trouble fetching dist-upgrade from mirors, I tried US mirror and IN mirorr
[17:29] <lain_> The speed I am getting is in few bytes per second
[17:31] <ravage> try to download something manually via your browser
[17:31] <ravage> if you tried different mirros this sounds like a provlem on your side
[17:45] <lain_> ravage: how ?
[17:46] <lain_> I can youtube videos and downloads in browser are fast
[17:46] <lain_> So its not a problem with my connection
[17:46] <ravage> try to download http://in.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ls-lR.gz for example
[17:47] <DrDeke> That file downloaded for me in just a second or two.
[17:47] <ravage> same
[17:47] <DrDeke> Oh, sorry, I mixed the two of you up!
[17:47] <ravage> but i dont think that is the indian mirror really
[17:47] <lain_> In about 5 seconds
[17:48]  * lain_ Get:37 http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu jammy/main amd64 libgoa-backend-1.0-1 amd64 3.44.0-1ubuntu1 [128 kB]
[17:48]  * lain_ 5% [37 libgoa-backend-1.0-1 41.6 kB/128 kB 32%]                                                                                583 B/s 27d 10h 39min 22s
[17:49] <ravage> so try http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ls-lR.gz
[17:49] <lain_> same, in about 5 seconds
[17:50] <ravage> then is cant really be a problem with the mirror
[17:50] <lain_> what then ? apt configuration ?
[17:51] <ravage> possible. but that would be a topic for #ubuntu
[17:51] <lain_> thank you


[18:01] <pleia2> btw - the CC is close to a decision on licensing of the ubuntu wiki (yeah, it's really unlicensed at the moment, sigh)
[18:02] <pleia2> well, less the license, more the way we go about relicensing, darn copyright :)


[00:35] <rick_h_> woot! https://plus.google.com/116120911388966791792/posts/AzF2YfvbtoQ
[00:47] <snap-l> Just saw it
[00:47] <snap-l> That is awesome.
[01:18] <rick_h_droid> yea getting psyched to get something done. big milestone.
[01:28] <snap-l> My only reason for using Rhythmbox nowadays is to determine the length of a playlist. Congratulations, now that doesn't even work.
[01:35] <snap-l> OK, now it's working. Feh
[01:56] <jcastro__> snap-l, http://ue.logitech.com/en-us
[01:56] <jcastro__> looks like they relaunched everything
[02:20] <snap-l> http://www.jonobacon.org/2012/09/23/on-the-recent-dash-improvements/#comment-660468666
[02:22] <snap-l> jcastro__: Damnit, I hope they don't discontinue the touch.
[02:25] <snap-l> And hard-core Squeezebox fans will lament the lack of interoperability with existing Squeezebox products.
[02:25] <snap-l> Stay away.
[02:25] <snap-l> http://reviews.cnet.com/portable-audio-devices/logitech-ue-smart-radio/4505-6450_7-35419331.html
[02:25] <rick_h_> hmmm, custom fit in ear headphones...
[02:27] <snap-l> Motherfucker.
[02:28] <rick_h_> ruh roh
[02:28] <snap-l> http://www.audiostream.com/content/did-logitech-just-kill-squeezebox
[02:28] <snap-l> Apparently Logitech discontinued the Squeezebox
[02:30] <rick_h_> ugh
[02:30] <rick_h_> just been using ours a ton lately
[02:30] <snap-l> Yeah, in favor of that dippy UE radio
[02:30] <snap-l> And just after the article.
[02:34] <rick_h_> ugh, have to visit 'your local audiologist' to get impressions before you can get the fit headphones
[02:43] <snap-l> Well, I'm glad I got my article in Linux Journal this month instead of last month
[02:44] <rick_h_> yea, good timing I guess
[02:44] <snap-l> s/last/next/
[02:44] <rick_h_> yea, I gotcha
[02:44] <snap-l> http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?96188-New-Squeezebox-Radio
[02:46] <rick_h_> well at least they're addressing the UX problems
[02:46] <snap-l> And it's nice they OSSed it so if they do decide to completely drop it or braindamage it, it can be recovered by the community
[02:51] <jrwren> OH: "nice move shuttleworth"
[11:35] <rick_h_> love this https://twitter.com/alex_gaynor/status/250106469427597312
[11:35] <rick_h_> oh and morning and all that
[11:55] <snap-l> rick_h_: Mildly deprecated? Is that like "mostly dead"?
[11:56] <rick_h_> snap-l: yea, can't figure that one out. "You really shouldn't use this...it might disappear...but who can say"
[11:58] <brousch> I'm sure a DIY replacement based on rasperrypi will be out soon
[11:58] <brousch> Sorry, that was last night's squeezebox discussion
[11:59] <snap-l> brousch: Yeah, there is a pretty strong core community
[11:59] <snap-l> and one of the engineers is pretty active
[12:00] <snap-l> but I fear what happens when he gets tired and leaves.
[12:00] <snap-l> I think Logitech really boned this one
[12:01] <rick_h_> well, tbh, there's a need for a cleaner UX product in the line thugoh
[12:02] <rick_h_> it's not competing with the sonos/google tv, apple tv stuff of the world. And I know those say TV but they're music centers
[12:02] <snap-l> True, but killing the existing line is not the way to do it.
[12:02] <rick_h_> but with apps and such
[12:31] <Blazeix> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-shopping/+bug/1054282
[12:32]  * rick_h_ shuts down the internet
[12:38] <brousch> Unity has pr0n built-in now?! I'm switching!
[12:49] <snap-l> I'm of two minds on that. On the one hand, the world is not made up of your narrow minded view of what is appropriate
[12:50] <snap-l> On the other hand, if you're providing a shopping service in the OS, expect there to be minors using it.
[12:50] <snap-l> In other words: if you're an adult, grow up. If you're not an adult, you have plenty of time to find this shit out later.
[12:51] <rick_h_> my problem is in the comments. pulling out marks old comments on the wallpaper options
[12:51] <rick_h_> that's just troll feeding there
[12:51] <snap-l> Yeah, that's not appropriate
[12:52] <snap-l> And frankly, it's not in the same context
[12:52] <rick_h_> the joys of the internet
[12:52] <snap-l> It's a compelling strawman
[12:53] <snap-l> but if my mom starts typing something into her OS "Grey" and "50 shades of..." shows up, she'll be rather perplexed.
[12:54] <snap-l> at least, I hope she would be, after she went on about how some 90 year old woman in one of her clubs happened to have it on her kindle.
[12:54] <snap-l> (always the quiet ones)
[15:33] <rick_h_> bwuhahaha, and LP is faster for all
[15:37] <brousch> Go rick_h_!
[16:09] <snap-l> Is anyone else seeing 0 subscribers for their feeds on Feedburner?
[16:10] <snap-l> lococast, and all of my burned feeds are 0
[16:10] <rick_h_> dammit! amazon quit 503'ing on me and let me give you money!
[16:10] <rick_h_> snap-l: hmm, feed shows up but yea seeing the 0
[16:12] <snap-l> strange
[16:13] <snap-l> http://feedburnerstatus.blogspot.com/2012/09/known-issue-subscriber-counts-and-stats.html
[16:13] <snap-l> At least it's a known issue.
[16:32] <snap-l> btw: OLF is this weekend.
[16:32] <snap-l> Free registration ends on Wednesday.
[16:32] <snap-l> Also, we're hoping to share some space with the Ohio team, so if anyone is interested in helping out, please feel free
[16:33] <snap-l> I'd like to get a count of everyone who can volunteer so we can plan out staffing the booth.
[17:00] <rick_h_> jcastro: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=6K_n8DtDl2k is the youtube I'm watching
[17:01] <jcastro> rick_h_can you get me the embed url to that?
[17:02] <rick_h_> jcastro: https://pastebin.canonical.com/75176/
[18:49] <jrwren> rofl, i typed into my squeeze window on accident and triggered repeat
[18:49] <jrwren> i couldn't figure out why this song always had 2 min left
[18:49] <snap-l> hah
[18:49] <jrwren> snap-l: exactly
[19:03] <rick_h__> brousch: how did that make/fabric thing go?
[19:05] <brousch> rick_h_: Pretty well
[19:05] <brousch> I'm trying fabric on another project
[19:05] <rick_h__> cool
[19:05] <brousch> I'm struggling with the local/remote part of it
[19:05] <rick_h__> yea, that's the diconnect/reason to use one vs the other
[19:06] <brousch> Like I want to run create_virtualenv locally and remotely, so I end up SShing into my own localhost
[19:06] <brousch> Seems silly to me
[19:06] <rick_h__> right
[19:07] <brousch> But then I'm told that's actually useful for uncovering assumptions you've made or environment vars that you've set, like paths
[19:07] <rick_h__> yea, but you end up coding paths that change on systems perhaps while make just defaults to the cwd
[19:08] <brousch> Yeah, that's exactly what I've run into
[19:08] <brousch> With Make my paths all work, with Fabric, I have to hardcode at least 1 path
[19:08] <rick_h__> right
[19:09] <brousch> Which seems like it will break when I deploy
[19:09] <rick_h__> http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2012/09/24/14071703-airplane-windows-are-sealed-for-a-reason forget the politics...but funny
[19:09] <brousch> I haven't tried function parameters in Make, but it's not too annoying in Fabric
[19:10] <rick_h__> yea, if I've got to repeat things across 10 front end servers I'll use fabric
[19:10] <rick_h__> but all fabric will be doing is calling make commands on each machine
[19:11] <brousch> I mnea, when I wrap something like the South commands which require a specific app as a paramter
[19:13] <brousch> python manage.py migrateschema <app> <--initial|--auto>
[19:13] <rick_h__> right
[19:13] <brousch> So how would passing paramters work in Make?
[19:13] <rick_h__> so you need to use the stacking of things to setup env vars
[19:13] <rick_h__> fabric prod migrate
[19:13] <rick_h__> where prod() is a function to setup the app initial/auto
[19:14] <brousch> Well in fabric I just use the paramters thing that's built in
[19:14] <brousch> fab migrateschema:<app>,<--initial>
[19:14] <brousch> I'm wondering how Make does that
[19:15] <rick_h__> with env vars
[19:15] <rick_h__> make APP=something INITIAL=true migate
[19:15] <rick_h__> and then in your makefile you're looking for $APP and $INITIAL
[19:15] <rick_h__> or something like that
[19:16] <brousch> Ah
[19:16] <brousch> Seems clunkier
[19:16] <rick_h__> it's how I override the ini file to use. I've got a var in my Makefile BOOKIE_INI
[19:16] <rick_h__> so make BOOKIE_INI=test_bookie.ini install
[19:16] <rick_h__> will run make test, but with the BOOKIE_INI var overridden
[19:17] <brousch> I think once I understand the local/remote thing I'll like Fabric more
[19:18] <rick_h__> yea
[19:19] <brousch> Right now, I'm using it for stuff I did with Make, and the local/remote is getting in the way
[19:19] <rick_h__> right, and that's why I said your talk was good because they really are meant for two different use cases imo
[19:19] <brousch> Part of it is my dislike of SSH keys
[19:21] <brousch> I need to bite the bullet on those
[19:21] <rick_h__> dude, can't live without
[19:21] <rick_h__> ssh keys are one of the most amazing things ever
[19:21] <rick_h__> though I do wish mass management were better and I'd use more different keys I think
[19:22] <snap-l> I use different keys per machine
[19:22] <brousch> PAsswords are in my head, keys are something I have to drag around with me
[19:22] <snap-l> It's really straightforward
[19:22] <snap-l> brousch: Passwords allow anyone access who knows the phrase
[19:23] <brousch> So do keys, but the phrase is a lot longer
[19:23] <snap-l> Passwords are like having a bouncer outside of your house. SSH Keys are like having good locks.
[19:23] <rick_h__> no, they need the key and the phrase
[19:23] <rick_h__> that's two bits of info vs 1
[19:24] <devinheitmueller> SSH keys probably wouldn't get such user frustration if the OpenSSH people didn't do such a horrifically crappy job of exposing enough logging to figure out why they don't work.
[19:25] <rick_h__> yea, I mean I would go nuts with every ssh/bzr/git connection needed a password
[19:28] <rick_h__> I'm only logged into 4 machines currently with about 20 pushes to repos today
[19:28] <brousch> Yeah, I have always had very few machines, so it's not been a problem for me
[20:17] <rick_h__> it shouldn't have but made me laugh http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkDz4wMI9J8
[20:18] <jrwren> anyone know nick portelli ?
[20:19] <jrwren> did you see the hitler gangnam style? i was laughing so much!
[20:20] <rick_h__> hmm, know a few nick's but don't know last names so not sure I guess. Should I know him?
[20:25] <jrwren> mid michigan, but wasn't sure if he was an ubuntu guy.
[20:27] <snap-l> name not ringing a bell
[20:28] <jrwren> plus, IMO he just trolled me pretty hard, or he is really brainwashed by his .NET dev and MSFT lov.
[20:29] <snap-l> jrwren: That had to be an epic troll of history.
[20:32] <greg-g> jrwren:  that is awesome (for others: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Nv6C25XYps )
[20:32] <greg-g> jrwren: there's a two hour version ;)
[20:35] <jrwren> greg-g: oh, i haven't seen teh extended version
[20:36] <rick_h__> that scares me that someone would put together 2hrs
[20:36] <jrwren> greg-g: that one is terrible IMO
[20:36] <jrwren> oh, maybe only the first 15 seconds was bad.
[20:37] <jrwren> wtf, there is a 10hr version?!?!?!?!?!
[20:37] <jrwren> but holy shit did they mess up the audio on this
[20:37] <greg-g> oh, it was the first one for hitler gangnam :/
[20:39] <jrwren> and apparently i wasn't logged into youtube when I watched a different one, becuase I cannot find it.
[20:40] <snap-l> FFS
[20:40] <snap-l> Apparently this is this generation's Macarena.
[20:40] <jrwren> hrm, or who let the dogs out
[20:40] <jrwren> I feel much more positive about gangnam style though.
[20:40] <jrwren> greg-g: oh yeah, this has much better audio quality: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Eo5YU_ueJc
[20:43] <jrwren> snap-l: did you read the atlantic article about gangnam style ?
[20:43] <jrwren> http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/08/gangnam-style-dissected-the-subversive-message-within-south-koreas-music-video-sensation/261462/
[20:44] <snap-l> jrwren: I listened to NPR. I know more than I ever cared about Gangnam style
[20:47] <snap-l> All I know is it got stupid when someone started mentioning Gungan style, and at that point I stopped caring.
[20:47] <jrwren> hahaha, i'd have liked to hear the npr piece
[20:48] <greg-g> yesssss https://plus.google.com/photos/108533366695714736629/albums/5791841023205899921/5791841029697780978
[20:48] <jrwren> i equate gangnam style closer to livin lavida loca
[20:49] <jrwren> The only reason to grow a beard is for the joy of shaving it and feeling cleanly shaved again.
[20:57] <jcastro> greg-g, hey hippie
[20:57] <jcastro> I got a worm inn
[20:57] <jcastro> http://www.theworminn.com/
[20:58] <brousch> That sounds like a bad thing
[20:58] <jcastro> worms are awesome
[20:59] <brousch> OH weird. You do it in your house?
[20:59] <dzho> why not?
[20:59] <dzho> they're quiet
[20:59] <dzho> not as cuddly, but less smelly, than a dog
[21:00] <brousch> I guess with 2 dogs and a 4 year old I'd be worried about the potential for disaster
[21:01] <dzho> yeah, you need a basement or something that's a little more off-limits
[21:01] <dzho> the scope for disaster is approximately that of the scope of a disaster of someone getting into the kitchen garbage
[21:01] <dzho> depending on how much worm tea you generate and let accumulate
[21:02] <dzho> because if you build up worm tea and someone tips it, that could get a little messy.
[21:02] <brousch> I have added a very sturdy wire wrap for the garbage due to dogs getting in there
[21:02] <dzho> yow
[21:32] <jcastro> dzho, so supposedly it doesn't drip much
[21:32] <jcastro> they come out fluffy with this one since it's more aerated than say, the solid ones that are made of plastic
[21:32] <jcastro> still, they recommend a bucket underneath
[21:38] <snap-l> Yeah, to catch all of the worm vomit.


[13:18] <lucasmoura> Hey everyone, do we have a script called "sbuild-it" ? I am reviewing https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/407 and one of the step is to run:
[13:18] <lucasmoura>  sbuild-it ../out/cloud-init_20.2-45-g5f7825e2-0ubuntu1~18.04.1.dsc
[13:19] <lucasmoura> Build I can't find this script in either uss-tableflip or qa-scripts
[14:06] <Odd_Bloke> I'm not familiar with it.
[14:18] <lucasmoura> Also, a question for a different issue, if the bug that I am doing the manual testing is not related to a launchpad bug, is there a convention to name that file ?
[14:36] <rharper> lucasmoura: I think blackboxsw might have that;
[14:38] <lucasmoura> rharper, ack
[14:39] <rharper> lucasmoura: there's no convention yet; I suspect git log line <commish> replacing spaces with -
[14:39] <lucasmoura> rharper, okay
[14:39] <rharper> or, we can start using gh-<pr-number>
[14:40] <rharper> Odd_Bloke: blackboxsw ^ ?   for fixes without lp bugs to match in ubuntu-sru test-cases ?
[14:44] <falcojr> is "cloud-init devel schema" supposed to work with jinja templates?
[14:45] <falcojr> I get a 'Cloud config schema errors: format-l1.c1: File jinja.yaml needs to begin with "#cloud-config"' but our docs say the first line should be the jinja comment
[14:48] <Odd_Bloke> That sounds like a gap we'll need to address as part of the schema work this cycle.
[14:48] <rharper>  falcojr you need both ##template: jinja\n#cloud-config\nruncmd: ['echo', 'Hi']
[14:49] <rharper> falcojr: oh I see; you want to schema check a template ...
[14:49] <falcojr> thanks. I had another issue with my config so wanted to verify it with that before fully launching it
[14:49] <falcojr> yeah
[14:49] <rharper> that seems like a new use-case;  as it's not*yet* fully formed
[14:49] <rharper> until you render it
[14:49] <rharper> the schema won't know what to do with {{ foo }} etc
[14:50] <falcojr> right, makes sense
[14:50] <rharper> let's file a bug/new-feature for that use-case;
[14:52] <falcojr> I can do that (hopefully ;) )
[14:54] <Odd_Bloke> rharper: falcojr: As for naming, I think we've used git-<abbreviated hash>.txt before, but I don't have a strong preference.
[14:56] <falcojr> Odd_Bloke: sorry, for naming what?
[14:58] <falcojr> bug here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-init/+bug/1881925
[14:58] <Odd_Bloke> Oh sorry, that was lucasmoura not you.
[14:59] <lucasmoura> Odd_Bloke, I have opened a PR with rharper naming suggestion. But I can rename it if the proposed convention should not be followed
[14:59] <lucasmoura> Also, if my manual test references two distinct PRs, should I include both of them in the file name or just one ? In my PR I included just one, but I don't know if that is right
[15:18] <rharper> cool
[15:51] <blackboxsw> lucasmoura: thanks for the ping, I've added a PR which adds the sbuild-it script I use for package build  and validation. it's smoser's script originally, but I think it makes sense in our uss-tableflip repo
[15:53] <blackboxsw> lucasmoura: https://github.com/canonical/uss-tableflip/pull/52
[15:53] <blackboxsw> feel free to land and merge that into uss-tableflip if it looks good.
[16:20] <Odd_Bloke> falcojr: I feel like we haven't reached consensus on my comment in https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/367/files#r434689535, gimme a shout if you want to jump on a call to get on the same page.
[16:22] <falcojr> Odd_Bloke: now works for me. Standup room?
[16:23] <Odd_Bloke> Sure, omw.
[16:57] <blackboxsw> falcojr: nice schema devel gap/bug. the CLI tools wasn't full wired to the jinja part handling. so it's rudimentary. a fix would be helpful
[17:00] <blackboxsw> landed https://github.com/canonical/uss-tableflip/pull/52
[17:00] <blackboxsw> so an update of uss-tableflip will expose scripts/sbuilt-it for package upload verification
[17:04] <blackboxsw> also eoan, xenial and bionic upload PRs are all updated for review (so we can officially kickoff the SRU process with the 'final' bits). eoan: https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/409 bionic: https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/407 xenial: https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/406
[17:04] <blackboxsw> I think lucasmoura is on #407 already and dan on #409
[18:02] <blackboxsw> lucasmoura: sorry on the sbuild-it script, that should now be landed via the following merged pull request:  https://github.com/canonical/uss-tableflip/pull/52
[18:03] <lucasmoura> blackboxsw, no worries. I have just used to build the bionic package and now I was able to build the package
[18:03] <lucasmoura> Also, I just finished reviewing the bionic PR
[18:21] <Odd_Bloke> blackboxsw: One typo in the eoan changelog, then I think it's good. Thanks!
[19:32] <blackboxsw> thanks Odd_Bloke, just pushed the changelog fix
[19:48] <Odd_Bloke> Thanks, looking now.
[19:51] <Odd_Bloke> blackboxsw: What does sbuild-it do for us other than save you from substituting the correct dist in?
[20:02] <blackboxsw> hrm, travis seems to have queued and  not run the ubuntu/<series> branches for a while.
[20:03] <blackboxsw> Odd_Bloke: sbuild-it just limits the # of params you need to pass, making it a simple sbuild-it *dsc
[20:04] <blackboxsw> just helpful to cut down on the sbuild params. not really required  or necessary
[20:05] <blackboxsw> maybe unnecessary  'sugar' as this could nearly be solved with a simple bash alias
[20:39] <blackboxsw> momousta: in landing your branch can I ammend your squashed commit  message to the following: https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/7zRn9WpMqs/?
[20:39] <blackboxsw> wanted to note that 410 is now being handle
[20:39] <blackboxsw> wanted to note that 410 is now being handled
[20:39] <momousta> Sure, please go ahead.
[20:39] <blackboxsw> excellent, and done
[20:39] <blackboxsw> thanks again
[20:40] <momousta> Thanks
[20:40] <blackboxsw> it'll be in our next upload to ubuntu groovy
[21:18] <Odd_Bloke> blackboxsw: +1 on eoan
[21:38] <Odd_Bloke> falcojr: So your PR is ready to merge, but I'm done for the day and don't have the time to write a good merge commit message (which I think is particularly important for this change).  Would you mind putting one together for me to copy/paste first thing tomorrow (or perhaps by blackboxsw later)?
[21:38] <falcojr> Odd_Bloke: Sure...I can do the squashing too
[21:56] <blackboxsw> thanks Odd_Bloke uploaded that. and thanks lucasmoura uploaded bionic
[21:57] <blackboxsw> just xenial remains for SRU upload, then I can ping the vanguard in #ubutu-devel to accept the queued uploads
[22:01] <blackboxsw> xenial is here https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/406
[22:01] <blackboxsw> and I just uploaded 20.2-45 B, E and F to https://launchpad.net/~cloud-init-dev/+archive/ubuntu/proposed
[22:01] <blackboxsw> so we should be able to test those bits directly in SRU validation
[22:16] <lucasmoura> blackboxsw, I will review the xenial release right now
[22:39] <lucasmoura> blackboxsw, we have a flake8 issue related to one of the existing patches in xenial
[22:39] <lucasmoura> I have commented the issue on the PR
[22:39] <blackboxsw> ugh thanks lucasmoura for both reviews
[22:58] <blackboxsw> lucasmoura: for tomorrow I fixed and pushed the flake error
[22:58] <blackboxsw> https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/406