[01:17] <spayne> night all
[01:30] <Kyral> Something very wierd just happened, yet fixed my VLC somehow...
[01:33] <ivoks> happt journey everyone
[01:33] <ivoks> happy
[01:34] <ivoks> have a good time at UBZ!
[01:41] <zakame> now I wish I could be at UBZ
[01:45] <crimsun> Kyral: heh, I didn't think there was anything mysteriously broken in the vlc I uploaded that I don't already know about (hotkeys)
[01:48] <Kyral> Yah...but I don't understand how activating it though SSH would fix it...
[01:51] <crimsun> did you ever get an strace?
[01:51] <crimsun> (the old one's irrelevant since it's for an older version)
[01:51] <Kyral> No....thats how I found out
[01:51] <Kyral> I go to strace it, and I was surpised not to have a sgfault
[01:52] <Kyral> so I do a vlc -vvv normaly and the remote interface fires up
[01:52] <Kyral> So I get a copy of that, and when I got back to my room, it was working normally
[01:56] <Kyral> Maybe the Remote connection somehow bypassed the part that was causing the segfault and allowed VLC to generate the files it needed to run locally
[02:02] <crimsun> still doesn't explain why it's hitching on /usr/lib/vlc/, though
[02:02] <Kyral> It isn't anymore
[02:02] <crimsun> but it did.
[02:02] <crimsun> can you reproduce it when you mv ~/.vlc ~/.vlc.working ?
[02:03] <Kyral> I did install vlc-plugin-sdl and vlc-plugin-svgalib.....
[02:03] <Kyral> Gimme a couple mins, I'm watchin' Ai Yori Aoshi ;P
[02:09] <Kyral> moved that dir
[02:09] <Kyral> fires up find
[02:09] <Kyral> err
[02:09] <Kyral> fine :D
[02:09] <crimsun> great, I'll chalk it up to PEBKAC ;-)
[02:10] <Kyral> PEBKAC?
[02:10] <crimsun> problem exists between keyboard and chair
[02:10] <Kyral> *falls down*
[02:10] <Kyral> Thanks a lot.....
[02:11] <crimsun> otherwise I'll punt the probs to bddebian ;-)
[02:11] <Kyral> lol
[02:12] <Kyral> Now, more Ai Yori Aoshi
[02:26] <dholbach> sleep tight
[02:43] <Kyral> Oh...I forgot.....this means that Backports are happening again
[03:24] <ecobuntu> i would like to help out with xubuntu...either packaging or maintaining.  i've already add some proposed packages on the website
[03:25] <ajmitch> best to talk to crimsun or janimo :)
[03:25] <crimsun> ecobuntu: we tend to discuss general packaging/maintainership issues here
[03:25] <crimsun> (yep, he's in #xubuntu)
[03:26] <ecobuntu> oh
[03:54] <bddebian> Heya folks
[03:54] <ajmitch> hi
[03:55] <Kyral> Yo!
[03:55] <bddebian> Heya Kyral
[03:55] <Kyral> Mmmmm, the sounds of Dapper goodness
[03:56] <Kyral> and the sound of Backports being made
[03:56] <bddebian> Heh
[03:57] <Kyral> It makes me feel important when someone asks for a package and I just pbuilder it and say "Here you go!"
[03:57] <Kyral> Note to self: Convince Mez to let me onto the BackportTeam
[03:58] <Kyral> ajmitch, you are da man
[03:58] <bddebian> ajmitch: I hear ya there buddy :-)
[03:58] <Kyral> If I can go a day without being criticized by you its a good day ;P
[03:59] <chillywilly> he's a nazi ;)
[03:59] <bddebian> Heh, heya chillywilly
[03:59] <chillywilly> whaddup ppl?
[03:59] <ajmitch> Kyral: haha
[03:59] <bddebian> Just got home from work so now I'm playing NWN :-)
[03:59] <ajmitch> Kyral: I hardly criticise! :)
[03:59] <chillywilly> anyone running Dapper right now?
[03:59] <Kyral> I am :D
[04:00] <chillywilly> :P
[04:00] <chillywilly> ajmitch: pbuilder chroot?
[04:00] <ajmitch> if I could
[04:00] <Kyral> Have there been like no posts to the Ubuntu-Devel list in the past few hours?
[04:00] <chillywilly> why can't ya?
[04:01] <ajmitch> because I was getting 404 errors last time i tried a dist-upgrade
[04:01] <Kyral> Or is my email just ****ed up
[04:01] <chillywilly> ajmitch: doh
[05:09] <Kyral> Hey is there any way to tell if emails have been bouncing from my account (Like emails from the Mailing Lists)
[05:13] <Lathiat> Kyral: if too many bounce i think mailman unsubscribes you
[05:15] <Kyral> Well, I haven't gotten the past few emails (Think my Inbox filled up even though I have been downloading them) and I just deleted alll the Trash
[05:15] <Kyral> Yet I'm still listed as being on the lists
[05:20] <Kyral> Maybe my school's email is just being f***ed up
[05:29] <Kyral> or maybe they saw the vast amount of traffic from the emails and decided to block them as spam
[05:33] <minghua> my school email used to do that
[05:33] <minghua> but part of them was real spam
[05:33] <minghua> that's mails from a list for me to moderate
[05:34] <Kyral> Yah I think the flood from lists.ubuntu.com triggered a filter
[06:13] <Yagisan> G'day all
[06:16] <Yagisan> could someone do me a quick favour. Can someone ping eyagi.bpa.nu and tell me if http://eyagi.bpa.nu/~jamie/doomsday.html loads
[06:17] <Yagisan> I'm getting complaints in the forums that "teh doom site iz down"
[06:18] <LaserJock> I can't load it
[06:18] <Yagisan> LaserJock: that's odd - I can see it now. Thanks - I'll check out the server
[06:19] <LaserJock> ping times out too
[06:20] <Yagisan> LaserJock: what IP address does it resolve to in the ping ?
[06:20] <LaserJock> <IP_ADDRESS>
[06:21] <Yagisan> LaserJock: that's the right ip
[06:25] <Yagisan> LaserJock: found the error, the iptables script wasn't getting called when my link changed state
[06:25] <Yagisan> LaserJock: thanks for your help
[06:26] <LaserJock> Yagisan: no problem
[06:27] <Yagisan> LaserJock: I now have a nice collection of "doodz I can't find teh doom site" complaints now
[06:28] <Yagisan> LaserJock: I can't wait until they realise I haven't updated it too breezy yet :)
[06:28] <LaserJock> Yagisan: lol
[06:28] <Kyral> I'm already in Dapper :D
[06:28] <Kyral> but night all
[06:29] <LaserJock> well, I got a chroot in dapper
[06:29] <Kyral> I have a Chroot in Breezy ;P
[06:29] <Kyral> So I can Backport ;P
[06:30] <Kyral> Anyway bedtime
[06:30] <Yagisan> I be building my u604 chroots latter, to go with my u504, and d3.1
[06:31] <Yagisan> ajmitch: did distcc work for you ? I still haven't been able to test my k6, I keep getting md5sum errors for breezy-security
[07:40] <LaserJock> hi tritium
[07:40] <tritium> hi LaserJock
[07:40] <LaserJock> how's it going?
[07:41] <tritium> Not bad.  Yourself?
[07:41] <LaserJock> trying to write a research proposal, but other than that OK
[07:42] <tritium> For what?
[07:42] <LaserJock> a DOE sensor fellowship
[07:42] <tritium> Oh, I think I've heard of that
[07:43] <LaserJock> it might be DOD but I can't remember right now
[07:43] <tritium> I think it is
[07:44] <LaserJock> anyway, it is a pain in the butt but I need the money ;-)
[07:44] <ajmitch> hi tritium, LaserJock
[07:44] <LaserJock> hoa ajmitch
[07:44] <tritium> hi ajmitch
[07:44] <LaserJock> s/hoa/hola/
[08:24] <pef> hello
[09:24] <dholbach> good morning
[09:25] <ajmitch> morning daniel!
[09:30] <_Tonio_> morning everyone
[09:30] <ajmitch> hello
[09:43] <Mortas> morning
[09:52] <syouth> morning it is
[09:53] <ajmitch> hi \sh
[09:53] <\sh> moins
[09:53] <\sh> well...a bad morning...all my nightmares become true
[09:54] <dholbach> \sh: what's up?
[09:54] <ajmitch> eek
[09:54] <\sh> dholbach: hehe...nagra fucked up
[09:54] <ajmitch> I really wish I could burn this breezy cd
[09:54] <ajmitch> but everything seems to have broken
[09:55] <\sh> yesterday evening I was talking to our engineer about this damn smartcard provisioning problem...if the customer smartcards are ready this morning around 6am
[09:56] <\sh> but, after at least 100k cards * average 4 commands to send == drum console which mixes the mpeg streams + the EMM streams together was crashing..
[09:56] <Treenaks> \sh: ouch
[09:56] <ajmitch> you'll be happy to get away from there for a week or two ;)
[09:56] <\sh> nagra engineers from switzerland are working...but strangewise they don't know their system
[09:57] <\sh> so..finally 100k customers with special dtv services are f'uped
[09:57] <Treenaks> \sh: that's always the problem with engineers
[09:57] <\sh> and we don't know how long it takes to fix this issue
[09:57] <Treenaks> \sh: external ones
[09:57] <\sh> Treenaks: they wrote the application
[09:58] <Treenaks> \sh: I used to work at a telco, we knew more about the DSLAMs than the companies who made them
[09:58] <\sh> Treenaks: and it's running for bigger tv providers around the world...but only in our company it's always crashing, fucking whatever, because we don't pay them to upgrade our software
[09:58] <\sh> sorry for the bad words...but it's really hard to stay calm about those issues
[09:59] <\sh> status meeting...brb
[09:59] <Treenaks> \sh: good luck
[10:03] <Yagisan> Treenaks, I'm an engineer - where not all incompetent
[10:03] <Treenaks> Yagisan: the ones I met were :)
[10:04] <Treenaks> Yagisan: they couldn't even handle the command line on their own devices
[10:04] <Yagisan> Treenaks: I've met that kind too, but some of us are good
[10:05] <Treenaks> Yagisan: I believe that :)
[10:07] <Treenaks> Yagisan: but the don't send those to small telcos
[10:15] <sivang> Morning all
[10:16] <spayne> hey sivang
[10:16] <dholbach> morning you two
[10:18] <Mortas> hmm I should really pay more attention to what's happening
[10:18] <Mortas> didn't even notice dapper opening :)
[10:18] <Mortas> doh
[10:18] <dholbach> haha :)
[10:21] <Mortas> ah yes, more coffee and then to figure out what to start with
[10:33] <ajmitch> so I guess by the end of UBZ I'll have made my first upload to dapper :)
[10:33] <_Tonio_> dholbach: little question concerning revu
[10:34] <_Tonio_> do we now have to upload dapper packages ?
[10:34] <dholbach> oh come on... let's do some nice merges ;)
[10:34] <ajmitch> dholbach: sure, I've only got 1 more day before I fly
[10:34] <dholbach> _Tonio_: yeah, can't upload to breezy no more
[10:34] <ajmitch> no time to get started on merges :)
[10:34] <dholbach> just fix vim and lintian ;)
[10:34] <ajmitch> vim?
[10:34] <_Tonio_> dholbach: okay, changes required in the dput config I assume ?
[10:34] <spayne> when does UBZ start>
[10:35] <ajmitch> no dput changes needed
[10:35] <ajmitch> spayne: sunday
[10:35] <spayne> are you going ajmitch?
[10:35] <ajmitch> yes
[10:35] <spayne> woo!
[10:36] <_Tonio_> ajmitch: okay
[10:36] <_Tonio_> I think compiling kde packages fails at this time so I'll wait a bit
[10:36] <spayne> how many normally attend>
[10:36] <ajmitch> heh
[10:36] <_Tonio_> problem with kdelibs4-dev
[10:36] <ajmitch> spayne: hard to say what is 'normal'
[10:36] <spayne> ajmitch: well, how many attend UDU?
[10:36] <ajmitch> hm
[10:37] <ajmitch> 60-70?
[10:37] <dholbach> 70, on the first day 110?
[10:37] <ajmitch> yeah
[10:37] <ajmitch> first day was busier I think
[10:37] <ajmitch> first day of UBZ will be mad
[10:37] <Treenaks> hm, need to buy DV tapes then :)
[10:37] <dholbach> yeah, i should think so
[10:37] <dholbach> Treenaks: dv tapes?
[10:37] <syouth> anyone knows when new amarok hits breezy?
[10:37] <ajmitch> dholbach: so he can interview you
[10:37] <ajmitch> syouth: when it's done
[10:37] <Mithrandir> syouth: never.
[10:37] <Treenaks> dholbach: yeah, for all the "Hi, I'm X and I use Ubuntu" things
[10:37] <dholbach> syouth: breezy is closed
[10:37] <Mithrandir> syouth: breezy is released.
[10:38] <ajmitch> syouth: it won't be in breezy, but breezy-backports
[10:38] <dholbach> Treenaks: that will be brilliant
[10:38] <ajmitch> assuming that someone gets it in there
[10:38] <dholbach> Treenaks: "my name is nico and i speak ubuntu" :)
[10:38] <syouth> tehee
[10:38] <ajmitch> "Hi, I'm Jeff Waugh".. ;)
[10:38] <dholbach> ahha
[10:38] <spayne> ajmitch: rotfl
[10:38] <syouth> thanks... 1.3.5 was released yesterday
[10:38] <dholbach> "my name is larry wall and i use gentoo ... no no nononono..."
[10:39] <Treenaks> dholbach: ;)
[10:39] <ajmitch> hm
[10:39] <ajmitch> daniels put the xgl server in dapper
[10:39] <Treenaks> I don't want 50 people saying "Hi, I'm Jeff Waugh"
[10:39] <ajmitch> I wonder how many users we'll have trying it out in the next few days ;)
[10:40] <spayne> Treenaks: or 25 saying "Hi, I'm Mark Shuttleworth"
[10:40] <Mortas> Treenaks: just ask for the old and way too funny ID card of jeff :)
[10:40] <Treenaks> spayne: did you see Jono?
[10:41] <spayne> Treenaks: no, why?
[10:41] <Treenaks> spayne: no I mean his video
[10:41] <colinl> Hi guys. I've got a few questions about the package updating process in Breezy and Dapper. First one is, are the packages versions in breezy frozen (security updates only), or is it possible to push new upstream version in breezy-updates?
[10:41] <spayne> Treenaks: whivh video?
[10:41] <spayne> colinl: first one, yes
[10:41] <ajmitch> colinl: no new upstream versions in breezy-updates
[10:42] <dholbach> colinl: no new upstream versions for ...
[10:42] <dholbach> :)
[10:42] <Treenaks> spayne: see #lugradio :)
[10:42] <spayne> colinl: packages can be backported from Dapper if possible
[10:42] <ajmitch> except where absolutely required for security fixes
[10:42] <colinl> thanks
[10:42] <ajmitch> eg firefox got new upstream versions in hoary-security because it was hard to hack out the security patches
[10:42] <syouth> Can I update package db with breezy-backports in sources.list already?
[10:42] <ajmitch> no
[10:43] <syouth> aww
[10:43] <colinl> so, it's still possible to get new upstream releases for Dapper? I read somewhere it was frozen too for a greater stability, but is it only for Main packages or does it also include Universe?
[10:43] <ajmitch> colinl: currently we're getting new upstream versions synced automatically from debian, and it's a period of open development
[10:44] <ajmitch> the upstream version freeze will be earlier though
[10:44] <ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperReleaseSchedule has the general proposal
[10:45] <colinl> ajmitch: ok, thanks.
[10:45] <colinl> ajmitch: I'm interested in particular examples, too, namely sylpheed-claws-gtk2
[10:46] <colinl> upstream releases are late in debian because our packager is sponsored. How should I go about building packages for it and pushing them to dapper's universe?
[10:46] <dholbach> if there are very good reasons, we can push it through breezy-backports
[10:46] <syouth> So when I can't sync against breezy-backports, then how's the best way for me to use new amaroK?
[10:46] <dholbach> build dapper source on breezy
[10:47] <colinl> dholbach: this was an answer to syouth ?
[10:47] <ajmitch> once there's new amarok source in dapper :)
[10:47] <ajmitch> colinl: it's possible for the debian packager to get the packages into dapper first, although it's not ideal
[10:48] <ajmitch> colinl: how long does it take for them to get sponsored?
[10:48] <colinl> ajmitch: I don't really know. He's already sponsored, but his sponsor's slow :)
[10:48] <ajmitch> right
[10:48] <colinl> We released 1.9.15 three weeks ago and debian doesn't have it yet :)
[10:49] <ajmitch> 3 weeks isn't long if someone is busy
[10:49] <syouth> So when I change breezy in sources list to dapper I get like unstable/testing system?
[10:49] <colinl> true, true :)
[10:49] <ajmitch> syouth: you'd get to keep all the pieces
[10:50] <syouth> Oh. I wish I could use packages.mask like in Gentoo :)
[10:50] <colinl> syouth: I think you can use apt-pinning, but I don't really know how
[10:50] <sivang> so guys, do we already have dapper deboostrap packages?
[10:50] <ajmitch> syouth: you'd still have to wait for a package to get into dapper
[10:50] <ajmitch> sivang: yes
[10:51] <ajmitch> sivang: kamion uploaded a new debootstrap
[10:51] <sivang> ajmitch: cool, is it available from the deboostrap howot on the wiki? (as it was with breezy)
[10:51] <syouth> ajmitch: You mean when Dapper gets stable?
[10:51] <colinl> syouth: http://jaqque.sbih.org/kplug/apt-pinning.html
[10:51] <minghua> Hmm, in debian they say you get to keep BOTH pieces :-)
[10:51] <ajmitch> minghua: here you get to keep them all
[10:51] <ajmitch> sivang: it's available in dapper
[10:52] <ajmitch> so you can get it from there if you want
[10:52] <syouth> colinl: Thanks. Looks like something I need.
[10:52] <colinl> ajmitch: thanks for the answers. I guess I'll rely on our debian packager and sponsor :)
[10:53] <syouth> colinl: Yeah. I'll try that out and see, if it works in Ubuntu too.
[10:55] <colinl> one day or another I'll bug you about my idea to replace the default Ubuntu mailer, which is Evolution, with Sylpheed-Claws. Although that sound unlikely to succeed :)
[10:57] <Mortas> that will need a lot of convincing :)
[10:57] <colinl> I guess so :)
[10:57] <syouth> breezy is stable, then dapper is unstable? what is testing?
[10:58] <colinl> syouth: I think there's no testing, but I may be wrong
[10:58] <minghua> syouth: as far as I understand, ubuntu doesn't work like debian
[10:59] <minghua> they develop in a branch and release that branch, so there is no need of testing
[10:59] <ajmitch> minghua: correct, we don't have an intermediate branch to stabilise
[11:00] <colinl> Mortas: in fact, what's the rationale with having Evolution as default mailer, apart the fact it's the GNOME mailer?
[11:01] <Mortas> I think that would be the main rationale, but I can't help you with that :)
[11:01] <colinl> ok :)
[11:02] <ajmitch> hi slomo
[11:03] <slomo> hi ajmitch :)
[11:03] <colinl> Mortas: do you think I should try to bribe Mark Shuttleworth? :)
[11:03] <ajmitch> slomo: uploaded the rest of universe yet? ;)
[11:03] <slomo> ajmitch: how's your todo list? shrinking? ;)
[11:03] <ajmitch> colinl: what incentive is there to switch?
[11:03] <ajmitch> slomo: I wish :(
[11:04] <slomo> ajmitch: no... now i must wait for xsp to get to main and tseng to upload monodoc... after that the rest will come
[11:04] <ajmitch> slomo: I got a few items knocked off the list, still got a few more to go
[11:04] <ajmitch> & only 1 day left before I fly
[11:04] <colinl> ajmitch: It looks like Evolution doesn't fit everyone, judging on the forum posts. But then, I guess S-Claws wouldn't either. I'm only half-serious here
[11:05] <slomo> ajmitch: hm... defer my packages to post-ubz time
[11:05] <ajmitch> slomo: or during-UBZ time ;)
[11:05] <slomo> ajmitch: yes... but that's low priority :P xsp for example is more important ;)
[11:05] <colinl> ajmitch: the main thing is that Evolution is a full-blown PIM whereas S-Claws is just a mailer.
[11:06] <colinl> ajmitch: some people seem to propose making the default mailer Thunderbird in Ubuntu
[11:06] <colinl> ajmitch: I just wanted to propose mine :)
[11:06] <syouth> colinl: seems logical when the default browser is FF
[11:06] <syouth> :)
[11:08] <Mortas> how do I get the new debootstrap with dapper stuff? do I need to switch my apt.sources to dapper or is that a bit suicidal?
[11:09] <slomo> colinl: oh please no ;) better get epiphany as default instead of firefox :P
[11:10] <colinl> slomo: I don't want TB as a default either :)
[11:11] <syouth> colinl: that how-to you gave me work. But I have no effect yet, because dapper has 1.3.1 of amaroK... I don't know any packages to test that have newer version in Dapper than Breezy.
[11:11] <syouth> , but seems like it works.
[11:12] <syouth> only this -ubuntu4 > -ubuntu5 ...
[11:12] <slomo> colinl: why? what is better with TB?
[11:14] <colinl> slomo: http://claws.sylpheed.org/ - although that's just my opinion :)
[11:15] <ajmitch> prefs window on the screenshots page looks incredibly busy
[11:16] <slomo> colinl: sylpheed is lightweight but a usuability nightmare imho ;)
[11:16] <colinl> ajmitch: this is true
[11:16] <colinl> slomo: yup, as we're reaching 2.0 i'm working on that, I don't know how far I can get in this regard
[11:17] <ajmitch> colinl: the target audience for a default email client isn't going to be one who wants to tweak it until it shines
[11:17] <syouth> ok.... must go and work some for food!
[11:17] <syouth> bye!
[11:18] <colinl> ajmitch: right
[11:18] <colinl> ajmitch: I'm considering registering on openusability.org, I think only good things could come out of it
[11:18] <colinl> (apart maybe, lots of work for me :))
[11:18] <ajmitch> :)
[11:20] <slomo> colinl: yes, that's definitly a good idea
[11:23] <sivang> ajmitch: I need to probably dist-upgrade my breezy chroot for that, since I cannot have the package before installing it using dapper sources, no? :)
[11:24] <ajmitch> sivang: just grab the package directly from the mirror & install it
[11:24] <ajmitch> it has very few dependencies, none versioned
[11:26] <slomo> bbl
[11:27] <sivang> ajmitch: doh! right :)
[11:34] <colinl> see you guys, and thanks
[12:03] <bhuvan> tseng: ping
[12:05] <bhuvan> conversion of packages from debian unstable -> breezy is automated or manual ?
[12:05] <Mithrandir> breezy is closed and released.
[12:05] <ajmitch> sid->dapper is automatic for packages we haven't touched
[12:05] <bhuvan> ok
[12:06] <ajmitch> anything we have made changes to in breezy, we have to merge for dapper
[12:06] <bhuvan> oh, ok
[12:06] <bhuvan> how many such packages are there (approx.) ? how many volunteers are involved (approx.) ?
[12:06] <bhuvan> i meant, packages in which we made changes to in breezy
[12:07] <ajmitch> > 1000 packages
[12:07] <ajmitch> about 30 of us
[12:07] <ajmitch> for universe
[12:07] <slomo> ajmitch: do you know when MoM will start to fill bugreports?
[12:08] <ajmitch> slomo: when it starts ;)
[12:08] <ajmitch> slomo: sorry, I'm not the all-knowing oracle ;)
[12:08] <slomo> ajmitch: but you're near at it ;)
[12:09] <bhuvan> ajmitch: can you point me to a link which explains the process involved in packaging. i'm used to debian packaging. i wish to know the process involved in migration breezy->dapper
[12:10] <ajmitch> if you're used to debian packaging, then it's really not much different
[12:10] <bhuvan> ok
[12:11] <ajmitch> the main things to keep in mind are versioning & setting the distribution to dapper
[12:11] <bhuvan> oh, ok
[12:11] <bhuvan> my current job is somehow related as well :)
[12:11] <ajmitch> mine isn't
[12:13] <bhuvan> url (or wiki page) which explains the status of ongoing migration process ?
[12:13] <ajmitch> dapper just opened
[12:13] <ajmitch> there's nothing to see yet
[12:13] <ajmitch> for breezy we had a list of merge bugs in bugzilla
[12:13] <ajmitch> filed automatically
[12:14] <bhuvan> oh, ok. but, atleast as you said the list(>1000) where can i find the info ?
[12:15] <ajmitch> that was a quick guess based on using grep-dctrl to look for versions with ubuntu in them ;)
[12:15] <bhuvan> ok
[12:17] <bhuvan> thankx. i'll go through the bugs mentioned in bugzilla, bugzilla.u.c
[12:17] <ajmitch> and not all of those will need merged
[12:17] <bhuvan> yeah, i understand
[12:17] <ajmitch> ok, 1211 by looking at breezy's universe sources
[12:18] <slomo> and the current to-merge list in bugzilla is leftover from breezy
[12:18] <bhuvan> oh great! is there any other document other than the couple at wiki.u.c/MOTU* ?
[12:40] <tseng> bhuvan: yes?
[12:45] <tseng> someone please fix the access list =/
[12:51] <spayne> tseng: what's up with the access list?
[12:51] <tseng> i am not saying
[12:53] <spayne> oh well :)
[12:55] <dholbach> that's better
[12:56] <dholbach> we shouldn't need ops in here
[12:56] <ajmitch> no it's not
[12:56] <spayne> what's the problem?
[12:56] <dholbach> bhuvan: what's your problem?
[12:57] <dholbach> bhuvan: if you don't stop that script, i'll ban you from the channel
[12:57] <dholbach> we only use ops for people who abuse the channel
[12:58] <siretart> ack
[12:58] <dholbach> bhuvan: if you don't play by our rules, you're banned
[12:58] <dholbach> everybody in favor?
[12:59] <spayne> dholbach: i think so :)
[12:59] <tseng> i dont think he is present
[12:59] <tseng> to be fair
[01:00] <Mithrandir> he can ask to be let in when he returns, then
[01:00] <tseng> works for me.
[01:00] <Mortas> post a 'poke me if you don't like it' in the kick message
[01:00] <dholbach> i'll send a private message
[01:00] <Mortas> that usually gets people to reply
[01:01] <sivang> dholbach: what did he do?
[01:02] <dholbach> can somebody tell bhuvan how to teach centericq to deop?
[01:03] <dholbach> sivang: he op'ed himself, even after 3 people de-oped him; and we just don't need ops in here
[01:04] <bhuvan> seems my account creates some problem, i dont know what it is! i'll unsubscribe for now and see what was the issue
[01:04] <slomo> ok... bbl :) bye bye
[01:04] <ajmitch> hm
[01:05] <ajmitch> looks like it's about head crash time
[01:09] <centericq-user> hrm, this account doesn't op itself
[01:09] <bhuvan> ?
[01:14] <ajmitch> night all
[01:14] <ajmitch> time to sleep
[01:14] <dholbach> night ajmitch
[01:14] <siretart> gn8 ajmitch
[01:18] <schweeb> hiya dholbach
[01:18] <dholbach> hey schweeb
[01:18] <dholbach> man... long time no see
[01:18] <dholbach> how are you?
[01:18] <schweeb> been damn busy
[01:19] <schweeb> work work work
[01:19] <schweeb> which is, incidentally, why I'm up right now
[01:19] <dholbach> but you're alright?
[01:20] <schweeb> yep
[01:20] <dholbach> cool, nice to hear that :)
[01:20] <schweeb> I'll be helping a bit more this release
[01:21] <dholbach> ROCK... so we can all take it slow :)
[01:21] <schweeb> there much MOTU stuff to fix yet?
[01:21] <dholbach> stuff to merge, lots of bugs, ... :)
[01:22] <dholbach> the usual :)
[01:22] <schweeb> cool
[01:22] <schweeb> bbiaf, shower time
[01:22] <dholbach> have fun
[01:36] <schweeb> dholbach: get your thesis or whatever all done?
[01:37] <dholbach> yeah, it's over... finally :)
[01:37] <dholbach> thank you
[01:37] <schweeb> all graduated and gainfully employed yet?
[01:38] <dholbach> yes :)
[01:38] <schweeb> congrats
[01:38] <dholbach> yes, i'm quite happy
[01:38] <schweeb> I'm still at Chrysler for EDS
[01:38] <dholbach> and they seem to work you hard
[01:39] <schweeb> hard enough
[01:39] <schweeb> it's not really tough, but I'm proxied off from the world
[01:39] <schweeb> so I don't get to IRC from work anymore :P
[01:40] <schweeb> but yes, being on-call kinda sucks
[01:44] <schweeb> talk to y'all later
[01:45] <dholbach> see you
[01:47] <jsgotangco> hi all
[01:47] <zakame> heya
[01:49] <Nafallo> morning all :-)
[01:49] <Nafallo> Hirion: thanx for gazpacho :-)
[01:49] <zakame> Nafallo: evening here :)
[01:49] <Hirion> Nafallo: no problem ;)
[01:50] <Nafallo> zakame: midday here, but what has that to do with anything? ;-)
[01:59] <zakame> Nafallo: hahaha
[02:04] <bhuvan> i debugged my centericq, it was reporting libgssl, libgcrypt errors. i upgraded them, now it doesnt report any error atleast at my end.
[02:05] <bhuvan> wondering whether that was the cause
[02:05] <bhuvan> sorry for the inconvenience caused
[02:06] <Kyral> Mornin' all
[02:06] <Kyral> So we finally got our own version of libdvbpsi4
[02:06] <zakame> wb Kyral
[02:07] <Kyral> Well looks like my school has blocked email from lists.ubuntu.com
[02:07] <Kyral> which means I have to go route the email to my GMail account :P
[02:07] <Treenaks> Kyral: are you subscribed to the autosync list? :)
[02:08] <zakame> Kyral: awww
[02:08] <Kyral> Treenaks: I am on DapperChanges, Ubuntu-Devel, and Universe-Bugs
[02:11] <Kyral> Oh well, my GMail Account has been needing some love ;P
[02:14] <Kyral> To the tune of 500 emails a day ;P
[02:24] <Kyral> Well I saved my butt on Dapper-Changes but not on the others
[02:24] <Kyral> I'll resubscribe later, now I have to eat and class
[02:25] <Kyral> or not...
[02:25] <Kyral> Hehe I forgot I hit the Global Apply :D
[02:26] <Kyral> Anyway FOOD!
[03:31] <siretart> hi folks
[03:32] <siretart> does anyone happen to know about avidemux?
[03:32] <zakame> hi sr
[03:33] <siretart> hi Seveas, hi zakame
[03:34] <Seveas> hi
[03:34] <siretart> Seveas: I read you have some freenx packages?
[03:37] <siretart> hi lamont!
[03:38] <lamont> morning
[03:39] <sivang> morning lamont
[03:39] <Treenaks> hey lamont
[03:39] <sivang> wtf?
[03:39] <sivang> Automatix does not support ppc (powerpc) and AMD64 chipsets. If it works for u, well and good but if it doesnt, I am sorry but since Ubuntu itself does not fully support these architectures, I cannot do anything about it.
[03:39] <sivang> taken from the forums..
[03:39] <Treenaks> sivang: automatix is SCARY
[03:40] <sivang> Treenaks: yes it is, do you know if it makes midi work on soft based midi ?
[03:40] <Treenaks> Those forum guys should really discuss stuff with the "real" developers first
[03:40] <Treenaks> sivang: yes
[03:40] <Treenaks> sivang: just look in the timidity manpage ;)
[03:40] <Treenaks> sivang: it has something to do with snd-virmidi and timidity's ALSA linkthrough
[03:41] <lamont> Treenaks: forums are scary
[03:41] <sivang> lamont: lol, true
[03:41] <Treenaks> lamont: this one in particular
[03:41] <sivang> we don't support ppc/amd64? that's news :-)
[03:41] <zakame> haha
[03:42] <Treenaks> sivang: only that weird hack doesn't
[03:42] <Treenaks> sivang: it *shudder* turns on prelink as well
[03:43] <sivang> Treenaks: in general, do we have soft midi working out of the box in breezy now? (especially for laptops that's important)
[03:44] <sivang> Treenaks: from what i tested current to yesterday, we don't :)
[03:45] <Nafallo> sivang: why is that important for laptops?
[03:45] <sivang> Nafallo: well, not utterly important, but a very good nice to have :)
[03:45] <ivoks> hi all
[03:45] <sivang> hey ivoks
[03:46] <ivoks> i guess - we are loosers that won't be in montreal :)
[03:46] <Nafallo> sivang: but not on desktops? :-)
[03:46] <zakame> hey ivoks
[03:46] <Treenaks> sivang: we don't have it working anywhere out of the box
[03:46] <Treenaks> sivang: but it's 1 package & 1 modprobe away
[03:46] <sivang> Treenaks: sure, but what if you don't know that package and the modules name?
[03:47] <sivang> :)
[03:47] <Treenaks> sivang: timidity+freepats and snd-virmidi
[03:47] <Treenaks> sivang: like I said
[03:47] <sivang> Treenaks: everything is apt-get installable and you're done?
[03:47] <Treenaks> sivang: it's in /usr/share/doc/timidity
[03:48] <Treenaks> sivang: no, you have to run timidity as some kind of weird daemon
[03:48] <sivang> Treenaks: do we expect simple MIDI users on a laptop to know to do that by their own?
[03:48] <Treenaks> sivang: no, and not on desktops either
[03:48] <sivang> I pushed ubuntu to some freinds of mine who're in the midi bussiness,
[03:48] <Treenaks> sivang: but it interferes with normal audio out, as timidity will open the DSP device
[03:49] <sivang> ah I see
[03:49] <sivang> bullucks
[03:49] <sivang> they want to be able to hear their created midi files and play it for people from their laptop
[03:49] <Treenaks> (don't know about dmix)
[03:50] <Treenaks> sivang: ah, you're a lugradio listener ;)
[03:51] <sivang> Treenaks: what turned me in ? :)
[03:51] <Treenaks> 15:49 <      sivang> bullucks
[03:51] <Treenaks> (it's spelled 'bollocks', but hey)
[03:51] <sivang> haha :)
[03:51] <sivang> Treenaks: also, too much Lock Stock , Snatch etc etc..
[03:52] <Treenaks> sivang: http://wiki.lugradio.org/index.php/LUGRadio_Syndrome
[04:01] <koke> a semi-ot question. are there daylight savings in Canada?
[04:01] <koke> here the clock changes on 29 or 30, and I'm flying on 29
[04:01] <koke> I'm going to get (more) crazy
[04:05] <jsgotangco> i believe so...
[04:07] <sivang> Treenaks:  the most common word in your vocabulary is bollocks :)
[04:13] <selinium> Hi all, I have been using linux for 8 months, all of them on Ubuntu. I was looking to become more involved, but dont know how. I am looking for a mentor to show me the ropes, any advice gratefully recieved.
[04:13] <selinium> Hi Seveas
[04:13] <selinium> :)
[04:14] <Lathiat> hi selinium :)
[04:14] <zakame> heya selinium
[04:14] <Seveas> selinium, awesome
[04:14] <Lathiat> selinium: check out http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU for an introduction into the MOTU side of things
[04:14] <Seveas> selinium, www.ubuntu.com/community/participate
[04:16] <selinium> Also, I have to say, I hope I dont offend anyone, but i think the ubuntu-uk.org site is pretty poor in comparison to the likes of ubuntu-fr.org. Is there something I can do about that?
[04:17] <zakame> selinium: of course, you ought to contact the people at ubuntu-uk about that
[04:18] <jsgotangco> you might want to ask mdke
[04:19] <selinium> jsgotangco, cheers :)
[04:19] <jsgotangco> (he's the only uk guy i know besides from the other canonical people based there)
[04:20] <selinium> thanks
[04:21] <selinium> No being a Brit, I will need a cup of tea before reading about all things MOTU :)  back in 5
[04:21] <selinium> s/No/Now/
[04:23] <siretart> Seveas: around?
[04:24] <Seveas> siretart, yes
[04:24] <siretart> Seveas: can you give me an status update about freenx packages?
[04:25] <Seveas> siretart, i'm currently testing the latest kanotix packages
[04:25] <Seveas> what's in my repo now are the second-to-latest and Just Work on breezy
[04:25] <siretart> Seveas: Are they collaborating with upstream?
[04:26] <Seveas> I see the kanotix guy on the upstream ML
[04:26] <siretart> Seveas: I attended a meeting of a debian freenx team, I think Mithrandir was there too. It seems that upstream was very angry about the packages, because they did not the path layout how upstream was using
[04:27] <Seveas> which upstream? freenx or nomachine?
[04:27] <siretart> nomachine, I think
[04:27] <siretart> I'm asking you ;)
[04:28] <siretart> Seveas: are your package ready for inclusion into dapper?
[04:28] <Seveas> well, nomachine uses stupid paths
[04:28] <Seveas> old X-style everything in /usr/NX/
[04:28] <Seveas> they're not ready yet
[04:29] <Seveas> definitely not
[04:29] <siretart> Seveas: well, they use that "old X-style" for a reason!
[04:29] <Seveas> btw: the client won't even work on breezy, I hexedited the client to correct the path to xauth
[04:30] <siretart> pff
[04:30] <siretart> okay, I see
[04:30] <siretart> Seveas: get upstream to use the modular xorg 7.0 build system ;)
[04:31] <Seveas> :)
[04:31] <HiddenWolf> when is xorg 7 due?
[04:32] <Seveas> the client is non-free btw
[04:32] <Seveas> so multiverse at best for that one if the license permits it
[04:33] <siretart> HiddenWolf: it is already released, I believe
[04:33] <Seveas> RC1
[04:33] <HiddenWolf> siretart, just the beta, afaik
[04:33] <Seveas> not final :)
[04:36] <Mirno> Hello, I say
[04:36] <zakame> hi Mirno
[04:36] <Mirno> zakame: congrats for yersterday
[04:37] <siretart> hi Mirno! :)
[04:37] <siretart> Mirno: #plf is quite busy, shall we create #ubuntu-media?
[04:37] <zakame> Mirno: many thanks :D
[04:38] <Mirno> siretart: please join #freecontrib
[04:38] <siretart> zakame: you are member now? contrats from my side, too!
[04:38] <zakame> siretart: yes, just this morning PHT :D many thanks! :)
[04:38] <siretart> zakame: :)
[04:39] <HiddenWolf> ah, xorg will be final dec 7th
[04:39] <zakame> I'm looking at the lighttpd upload at REVU, it has two diffs, one gzipped...
[04:40] <Lathiat> the diff.gz woudl be the package diff.gz to the package orig.tar.gz
[04:40] <Lathiat> debian packages are distributed as a .dsc, a .orig.tar.gz and a .digg.gz (in most cases)
[04:41] <zakame> yes, but two .diffs? and the .diff file itself is 0 bytes
[04:42] <Lathiat> that diff might be a diff to the last package or something
[04:42] <Lathiat> i dunno
[04:42] <Lathiat> url?
[04:42] <siretart> slomo_: around?
[04:43] <zakame> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=379
[04:43] <zakame> lintian out-of-date, even
[04:44] <Lathiat> oh i see
[04:44] <Lathiat> its just the ungzipped diff
[04:44] <Lathiat> the diff i s0bytes
[04:45] <Lathiat> they messed up the upload
[04:45] <zakame> even the .dsc is wrong, it's from upstream
[04:45] <Lathiat> so the uplaod is totally b0rked
[04:45] <zakame> the source itself contains ./debian
[04:46] <Lathiat> right
[04:46] <Lathiat> its a native package
[04:46] <Lathiat> or something
[04:46] <Lathiat> anyway
[04:46] <Lathiat> its b0rked
[04:46] <Lathiat> and someone already commented
[04:46] <Lathiat> so we wait for them to unb0rk it
[04:46] <zakame> no, not native, since it's not from Debian, otherwise there's no need for a .diff.gz
[04:46] <Lathiat> zakame: i mean
[04:47] <Lathiat> it was uploaded as one
[04:47] <Lathiat> but its not supposed to be
[04:47] <Lathiat> i think its just f**ked
[04:47] <Lathiat> it shouldnt even have the diff.gz there if it is
[04:47] <zakame> indeed
[04:47] <selinium> Lots to read! :)
[04:54] <selinium> Is there a sandbox for newbie motu's to start packaging?
[04:55] <selinium> Sorry motu wannbe's :)
[04:55] <tseng> yes, your own box with pbuilder
[04:55] <tseng> PbuilderHowto on the wiki
[04:55] <selinium> tseng: cheers
[04:57] <keyes> hello
[04:58] <zakame> hey keyes
[05:01] <siretart> zakame: tiber is running breezy, so lintian is out of date, yes
[05:02] <zakame> siretart: ah
[05:02] <jsgotangco> PbuilderHowto is awesome
[05:03] <zakame> jsgotangco: indeed, chroot in a chroot :)
[05:04] <siretart> please report problems with the howto, I think Mirno is just on it ;)
[05:44] <slomo_> siretart: pong
[05:44] <siretart> slomo_: please join #freecontrib
[05:55] <pef> arg, the CC meeting was yesterday, I thought it was november 1st :/
[05:57] <robitaille> there is a ical feed of these meetings on the Fridge
[05:57] <pef> robitaille: fridge.ubuntu.com ?
[05:57] <robitaille> yes.
[05:58] <robitaille> the ical feed is http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event/ical
[06:00] <pef> robitaille: thank you
[06:13] <pef> robitaille: does the way I "corrected" this bug correct ? https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kzenexplorer/+bug/3576/
[06:15] <robitaille> pef, I'm actually not a motu, or a developper, so I'm not the best person to ask :)
[06:16] <pef> ok :)
[07:06] <\sh> evening
[07:06] <siretart> hi \sh
[07:06] <\sh> re siretart
[07:06] <\sh> bad day....but actually i have holiday
[07:06] <Nafallo> \sh: are you in .ca yet? :-)
[07:07] <\sh> no
[07:07] <\sh> saturday
[07:08] <\sh> i just came from work
[07:09] <Nafallo> ah :-)
[07:13] <\sh> i gow now and have a shower and after that I have to sleep a bit...tired like hell
[07:16] <LaserJock> arrrgghhh, I HATE goobox and soundjuicer. Why oh why can't cddb work!
[07:16] <LaserJock> sorry for the rant, I just had to let it out ;-)
[07:16] <slomo> LaserJock: good question... works for me ;) maybe your cd isn't there?
[07:16] <Nafallo> LaserJock: what slomo said :-)
[07:17] <LaserJock> grip and gnome-cd work fine
[07:17] <Nafallo> WFM
[07:17] <Nafallo> atleast sj and banshee :-)
[07:18] <LaserJock> sound juicer just sits there and goobox just had Audio CD
[07:20] <LaserJock> I really like goobox except for this one thing. I guess I will just have to use grip
[07:20] <Yagisan> Nafallo: I got the distcc enabled pbuilder up and running, but it seems distcc is broken
[07:20] <Nafallo> distcc is broken?
[07:20] <Amaranth> dholbach: yay, you applied my patch to pyxdg!
[07:21] <Yagisan> Nafallo: nothing compiles with distcc used :(
[07:21] <Yagisan> Nafallo: remove distcc and perfect compile
[07:21] <Nafallo> hmm
[07:22] <Nafallo> I would say that's not exactly "up and running" then ;-)
[07:22] <Yagisan> Nafallo: I tested each I my boxes individually, they can all build same apps no worries
[07:23] <Yagisan> Nafallo: heh - I didn't say working,
[07:23] <Nafallo> "up and running" means "working" in my world ;-)
[07:23] <Yagisan> Nafallo: would you mind testing my pbuilderrc over your network
[07:23] <Yagisan> Nafallo: first is up, then running, and finally working :)
[07:23] <Nafallo> I only got one machine that is able to build things :-)
[07:24] <Yagisan> Nafallo: bmonty also wanted it right ?
[07:24] <Nafallo> my server will not build amd64-things I'm already sure of ;-), and it already has enough load :-)
[07:24] <Nafallo> yepp
[07:24] <Nafallo> I just wanted a working thing to go play with PbuilderHowto ;-)
[07:24] <Yagisan> bmonty - you up ?
[07:25] <Yagisan> Nafallo: actually, I did it for my i386 pbuilder
[07:26] <Yagisan> Nafallo: I send it to you anyway, so you can see how it should look, if distcc worked.
[07:26] <Nafallo> hehe, oki :-)
[07:28] <Yagisan> Nafallo: need to uncomment the 3 lines at the bottom re distcc
[07:28] <zyga> guys, is there any way to force pbuilder to use dual core setup?
[07:28] <Yagisan> zyga: is that an offer to test it for me :)
[07:28] <zyga> Yagisan: you've got something like that READY?
[07:29] <Yagisan> zyga: add export MAKE="/usr/bin/make -j5" to the end of your pbuilderrc
[07:29] <koke> hey, this one looks nice http://www.realistanew.com/projects/alacarte/
[07:29] <zyga> Yagisan: right
[07:29] <zyga> Yagisan: isn't 5 too big? I though about 3
[07:29] <Amaranth> koke: that's already in breezy
[07:29] <Yagisan> zyga: adjust the value after -j to what floats your boat
[07:29] <Amaranth> koke: well, 0.7.5 is
[07:30] <Yagisan> zyga: I picked 5 because it was supposed to use distcc ...
[07:30] <koke> Amaranth: as "alacarte" ??
[07:30] <Amaranth> koke: as smeg
[07:30] <Nafallo> -j 200 :-)
[07:30] <zyga> koke: nice indeed
[07:30] <koke> Amaranth: so it's the same one?? xDD
[07:30] <zyga> koke: first editor that looks sane on screenshots
[07:30] <Amaranth> koke: the deb i made supplies, conflicts, and replaces smeg so ubuntu-desktop doesn't cry, i think i might have gone overboard
[07:31] <Amaranth> koke: yep, just a new version
[07:31] <Amaranth> although it's so much better it's hard to tell :)
[07:31] <Yagisan> zyga: I can send you a pbuilderrc that in theory runs great with distcc, and turns your network into a huge compile farm
[07:32] <Amaranth> lintian and linda are both happy with the .changes, .dsc, and .deb file (except for saying dapper is invalid) so i think i'm good there :)
[07:32] <Amaranth> final 0.8 release is tomorrow, i'll see if seb can upload it for me then
[07:33] <zyga> Yagisan: I've got no network backend for those boxes yet.. I need to find a switch and a bunch of network cables
[07:33] <zyga> Yagisan: just send it anyway, I'll try to set it up on a two box setup meanwhile
[07:33] <Nafallo> Amaranth: dist-upgrade and it will not say dapper is a bad choice of a dist ;-)
[07:33] <Amaranth> Nafallo: already done, i love upgrades :)
[07:33] <Amaranth> Nafallo: lintian still complains
[07:33] <zyga> koke: is there any way to remove whole menus in any editor?
[07:34] <zyga> I'd love to get rid of the 'Debian' menu
[07:34] <Amaranth> zyga: not remove, just hide
[07:34] <koke> zyga: no idea, I don't edit menus :)
[07:34] <zyga> Amaranth: hide is fine
[07:34] <Amaranth> zyga: open smeg, click applications, then in the right listview uncheck debian
[07:34] <Amaranth> close it and look at your menu
[07:34] <Amaranth> 0.8 does instant apply, btw :)
[07:34] <Nafallo> Amaranth: oh? lintian 1.23.13ubuntu1?
[07:35] <Amaranth> 1.23.10ubuntu1
[07:35] <Amaranth> zyga: alacarte can do it too
[07:35] <Amaranth> alacarte == smeg
[07:35] <zyga> hmm
[07:35] <Nafallo> Amaranth: that's why then ;-)
[07:35] <zyga> Amaranth: right clicking didn't really work in alacarte
[07:36] <Amaranth> zyga: how do you mean?
[07:36] <zyga> ahhh
[07:36] <Amaranth> Yagisan: don't get too drunk
[07:36] <Nafallo> Yagisan: say hello from me :-)
[07:36] <zyga> arrgh usability
[07:36] <Amaranth> zyga: i'm in string freeze, otherwise i'd made "Delete" change to "Hide/Unhide" for things you can't delete
[07:36] <zyga> there is no way to unchech debian in the tree view
[07:36] <zyga> Yagisan: 100 years to you :-)
[07:36] <zyga> Amaranth: upstream?
[07:36] <Amaranth> zyga: i am upstream
[07:37] <zyga> Amaranth: cool - no more debian
[07:37] <Yagisan> Amaranth: I can't get drunk - I've got to look after bub
[07:37] <Amaranth> zyga: no more debian?
[07:37] <Nafallo> Yagisan: ah, congrats :-). or something :-).
[07:37] <zyga> Amaranth: the debian menu is filled with clutter
[07:38] <zyga> Amaranth: is there any way you could provide checkbox in the tree on the left?
[07:38] <zyga> that would make it much easier IMHO
[07:38] <Amaranth> zyga: it looks ugly as sin
[07:38] <Amaranth> zyga: and it duplicates options in two places
[07:39] <Amaranth> zyga: the Delete to Hide/Unhide thing should help a lot, i think
[07:39] <zyga> what is the reason for both views by the way?
[07:39] <Amaranth> well, mostly because it's easier to work with
[07:39] <Amaranth> 0.5 had one huge list
[07:39] <zyga> Amaranth: where is delete?
[07:39] <Amaranth> not only was the code harder to write, it was harder to scroll around
[07:39] <Amaranth> zyga: edit menu or right click, but you can't delete something you didn't make
[07:39] <zyga> Amaranth: arghh
[07:39] <zyga> Amaranth: okay :-)
[07:40] <Amaranth> zyga: thus the change to hide/unhide i'm planning for the next release
[07:40] <zyga> Amaranth: so it's not only a string change
[07:40] <zyga> it's functionality change, right?
[07:40] <zyga> Amaranth: curious
[07:41] <zyga> Amaranth: how do you look up icons
[07:41] <zyga> Amaranth: is there any .desktop reading library/
[07:41] <zyga> in python?
[07:41] <Amaranth> zyga: pyxdg
[07:41] <Amaranth> zyga: implements most of the fd.o specs all in one library
[07:41] <Amaranth> it has to, since the menu spec uses most of them
[07:42] <zyga> Amaranth: thanks
[07:42] <zyga> Amaranth: that brings an idea back
[07:51] <JanC> Amaranth: do you still have to dual boot?  (I read about that some time ago?)
[07:52] <Amaranth> JanC: well right now i'm internet only at school again for awhile
[07:52] <Amaranth> but with vmware player and their browser appliance i'm good for ubuntu access here
[07:52] <JanC> ah, because you could try coLinux
[07:52] <siretart> okay, chroots updated,
[07:52] <Amaranth> does ubuntu have coLinux support? i thought you need to modify your kernel
[07:52] <JanC> http://www.willmer.com/kb/2005/07/colinux-for-ubuntu/
[07:52] <siretart> now lets go for something to eat
[07:53] <Amaranth> at home i dual-boot and my net access is windows only, so this would help :)
[07:54] <JanC> I didn't test, but the Rachel from that blog seems to have succeeded doing that  :)
[07:55] <Amaranth> hrm, i dunno if i want to try running my breezy install with the dualboot setup like they show
[07:55] <Amaranth> i'm afraid it'll break something and i'll lose universe
[07:56] <JanC> well, just wanted to point you to it as an option
[07:56] <Amaranth> i guess if it does break something i can always reinstall and download glade manually though, i guess
[07:56] <Amaranth> that would be awesome though, internet access from ubuntu at home again
[07:56] <Amaranth> but i hopefully start a nice paying job on friday, so i may not need to worry about dialup
[07:57] <JanC> ah, we'll all help hoping  :-)
[07:58] <JanC> no affordable DSL or cable there?
[07:59] <Amaranth> if i get the job i'm getting cable
[08:00] <Amaranth> i don't pay for the dialup i'm on now though, so i have no say over it (i'd get $8/month local straight dialup, not an AOL knockoff)
[08:01] <JanC> I see...
[08:02] <JanC> dialup is way too expensive here, so everybody uses DSL or cable  :)
[08:11] <tseng> tigger^: woo
[08:12] <tigger^> tseng: hi
[08:18] <slomo> hi tseng :)
[08:18] <tseng> hi slomo
[08:19] <tseng> meet tigger, he is a clueful hacker on various small projects
[08:19] <tigger^> hi hi
[08:19] <slomo> what projects? :)
[08:19] <tigger^> can't tell
[08:19] <tigger^> its sekrit!
[08:19] <tigger^> :P
[08:20] <tigger^> heh
[08:20] <tigger^> tenshi, pretrace
[08:20] <tseng> http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/infrastructure/tenshi/
[08:20] <tseng> this is my favorite
[08:20] <tseng> i used to use it
[08:20] <tigger^> working on formatcheck module for valgrind
[08:20] <tigger^> lots of small things
[08:21] <tigger^> prelude
[08:21] <tigger^> (sometimes)
[08:21] <tseng> argl, prelude
[08:21] <slomo> hehe :)
[08:21] <tseng> "cant be arsed"
[08:21] <tigger^> hah
[08:21] <tigger^> bad tseng :P
[08:22] <tseng> all my stuff is behind several firewalls
[08:22] <tigger^> that's ok then
[08:22] <tigger^> ;)
[08:22] <tseng> what happens outside that is not my area of concern
[08:22] <tseng> we have a "security group" for that
[08:22] <tigger^> ah ok
[08:22] <slomo> tseng: btw, when do you sleep? you're always talking here when i'm here too ;)
[08:22] <tigger^> let you off then
[08:22] <tseng> slomo: sleep?
[08:22] <zyga> Amaranth: ping
[08:23] <Amaranth> zyga: pong
[08:23] <zyga> Amaranth: pyxdg only provides a relative icon name
[08:23] <zyga> Amaranth: could you tell me how do you look up the final path?
[08:23] <Amaranth> yes, but pyxdg also has a module for the fd.o icon theme spec
[08:23] <Amaranth> and alcarte has a bit of code to find out the GNOME and/or KDE theme is in use so i can use that
[08:23] <zyga> so IconTheme.py
[08:24] <zyga> thanks
[08:24] <Amaranth> check out src/Alacarte/PyXDGIconTheme.py
[08:24] <Amaranth> err
[08:24] <Amaranth> check out src/Alacarte/PyXDGIconHandler.py
[08:26] <zyga> checking
[08:27] <zyga> I want to add icon variants
[08:27] <zyga> but it's way more difficult in this design
[08:27] <zyga> icon variants meaning that I can provide alternatives in the desktop file
[08:27] <zyga> now I'm not sure where to put this
[08:28] <zyga> ideally this would be hidden in DesktopEntry stuff
[08:28] <zyga> and thus easily available to all applications
[08:28] <zyga> but since it knows nothing about icon themes it's not possible
[08:30] <zyga> I don't want to push this change all the way into the app layer
[08:39] <Amaranth> you mean make the Icon key a list of strings instead of just a string?
[08:40] <Amaranth> that's not backward compatible with older implementations
[08:40] <Amaranth> zyga: ^
[08:40] <zyga> Amaranth: yes
[08:41] <zyga> Amaranth: I want to have something like
[08:41] <zyga> music-player:gnome-music-player:xmms-music-player
[08:41] <Amaranth> in order to make that change you need to modify the DesktopEntry class, the IconTheme class, and every app that uses pyxdg
[08:41] <zyga> (icon names are fake ;-)
[08:41] <zyga> Amaranth: I know and I think that sucks :-)
[08:41] <Amaranth> it would be Icon=music-player;gnome-music-player;xmms-music-player;
[08:41] <Amaranth> zyga: There is no alternative.
[08:41] <zyga> too bad there is no DesktopEntry + IconTheme class
[08:42] <Amaranth> zyga: That's why this is called "not backward compatible"
[08:42] <zyga> one that can give final URL to the icon
[08:42] <Amaranth> zyga: what about xfce, kde, gnome, and everyone else who uses the spec?
[08:43] <Amaranth> you'd be better off adding a new key and hacking IconTheme to use it if what it has in Icon doesn't exist
[08:43] <zyga> Amaranth: :-)
[08:43] <Amaranth> IconList or something
[08:43] <zyga> Amaranth: this was propsed some time ago
[08:44] <zyga> Amaranth: but the discussion suddenly stopped
[08:44] <Amaranth> yeah, and they said the same thing i'm saying :)
[08:44] <zyga> Amaranth: some people seen no need, some have seen the need
[08:44] <Amaranth> you need a new key, there is no other way to do it without breaking things
[08:44] <Amaranth> for now i'd call the key X-IconList (so it's compliant with the desktop entry spec) and make ubuntu use it
[08:44] <Amaranth> then work on getting it into the spec
[08:50] <siretart> boah, why is wiki.ubuntu.com that dogslow :(
[08:51] <HiddenWolf> siretart, because it's grown out of his skin, very much
[08:51] <zyga> Amaranth: no acutally
[08:52] <zyga> Amaranth: first of all I'm not really going to get through with this
[08:52] <zyga> Amaranth: what would be really neded is specs change and gradual upstream adaptation
[09:02] <Amaranth> zyga: but using pyxdg at least as an example implementation will help your case
[09:02] <siretart> hi _Tonio_
[09:02] <_Tonio_> hi siretart
[09:02] <zyga> Amaranth: I'm too depressed to hack today
[09:03] <siretart> _Tonio_: I'm just reviewing tellico ;)
[09:03] <_Tonio_> siretart: I'm embarassed with a package....
[09:03] <siretart> _Tonio_: it looks fine, but could you please make another upload with target 'dapper'? thanks
[09:03] <_Tonio_> siretart: what would you do with a package that doesn't have any homepage and whose developper is unknown ?
[09:03] <siretart> I wouldn't package it, because of unclear status
[09:03] <_Tonio_> siretart: yes.... I have about 25 uploads to perform ;)
[09:04] <siretart> oh
[09:04] <_Tonio_> siretart: and if this unclear package is required by a marvellous application ?? ^_^
[09:04] <_Tonio_> frustrating ;)
[09:05] <_Tonio_> siretart: is the kdelibs4-dev problem resolved for dapper ? because if it is not I may have to wait for upload with dapper target
[09:06] <siretart> _Tonio_: what is the kdelibs4-dev problem?
[09:06] <_Tonio_> siretart: dunno, but I saw Riddell talking about that yeserday evening on #kubuntu-devel
[09:07] <_Tonio_> siretart: anyway, if you have succedded compiling with a dapper pbuilder, I'll perform the upload immediatly
[09:07] <siretart> Riddell: if you are around, could you please elaborate on the "kdelibs4-dev" problem?
[09:07] <slomo> lol... i found a funny bug in evolution ;) next to the help menu there is an empty menu without a label =)
[09:08] <_Tonio_> siretart: according to what I remember, if was a dependancy issue, causing kde applications to failed compiling...
[09:08] <zyga> slomo: heh, true
[09:19] <tigger^> anyone know where dh_make is from?
[09:21] <Amaranth> dh-make
[09:21] <zyga> slomo: maybe it's a plugin leftover?
[09:21] <tigger^> Amaranth: hmm. thought I had that
[09:21] <tigger^> Amaranth: ok, ta
[09:22] <slomo> zyga: no idea... but it doesn't hurt ;)
[09:25] <_Tonio_> hum.......... W: tellico source: source-nmu-has-incorrect-version-number 1.0-0ubuntu1
[09:26] <_Tonio_> anyone know how to correct this ?
[09:26] <_Tonio_> it is not the first time that I can see this kind or error and I've never been able to understand it ;)
[09:26] <slomo> make you the maintainer
[09:26] <slomo> (compare the maintainer field and the name/email in control/changelog)
[09:26] <_Tonio_> hum....... okay
[09:26] <slomo> and this package is by you, right?
[09:26] <_Tonio_> yep
[09:27] <slomo> when you only did a change to it ignore the warning ;)
[09:27] <_Tonio_> but I did a simple synthax error ;)
[09:27] <_Tonio_> thanks for the info slomo
[09:27] <siretart> _Tonio_: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/tellico-0509190115/tellico_1.0-0ubuntu1.buildlog
[09:27] <tigger^> Amaranth: ok, I'm missing something here. I have dh-make package installed, but there is no dh_make command I can see, and no dh_make man page..
[09:27] <herve> hello
[09:28] <siretart> _Tonio_: this is the buildlog of tellico in dapper
[09:28] <siretart> hi herve
[09:28] <slomo> _Tonio_: np :)
[09:28] <siretart> _Tonio_: I'd say build-depend on kdelibs4-dev
[09:29] <_Tonio_> siretart: so the problem is apparently resolved, good news, I will start the uploads ;)
[09:30] <testuser> hi ... just want to say libaqbanking-plugins-libgwenhywfar17c2 isn't available in the repository, but needed from for example libaqhbci
[09:31] <siretart> testuser: uuuh, which package build that binary?
[09:32] <testuser> sorry, what ?
[09:33] <testuser> i wanted to install aqbanking with hbci support
[09:33] <tigger^> Amaranth: nm, user error
[09:33] <testuser> try to install libaqhbci-plugin-libaqbanking0 .. it will break
[09:34] <Amaranth> yay, new lintian
[09:34] <Amaranth> it was stuck in dist-upgrade land
[09:34] <Amaranth> so now alacarte gets no errors in lintian or linda
[09:35] <_Tonio_> siretart: just uploading tellico with dapper target.... I also added a little patch for the .desktop file
[09:35] <siretart> _Tonio_: sounds great! :)
[09:36] <_Tonio_> siretart: just that I didn't modified the eps to kdelibs4-dev
[09:36] <_Tonio_> can you remove so that I can upload again ?
[09:37] <_Tonio_> or maybe I just have to wait a fex minutes
[09:37] <_Tonio_> s/fex/few
[09:38] <siretart> just a moment
[09:41] <_Tonio_> siretart: okay I'll do in 10 minutes, time to update my pbuilder and build locally. then I'll let you know for revuing
[09:41] <siretart> _Tonio_: you may upload, incoming queue is clear
[09:41] <_Tonio_> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[09:41] <_Tonio_>   kdelibs4-dev: Depends: libssl-dev but it is not going to be installed
[09:42] <_Tonio_> here it is...... it works with kdelibs-dev but not kdelibs4-dev.....
[09:43] <siretart> strange
[09:43] <siretart> aah, this is because of broken libssl-dev
[09:43] <siretart> I think you have to wait until openssl is fixed
[09:43] <testuser> mh..is there some hope that libaqhbci-plugin-libaqbanking0 will be fixed in near future ? do i have to write the maintainer from this package ?
[09:44] <_Tonio_> siretart: this is the reason I didn't want to upload immediatly for dapper ;)
[09:45] <ajmitch> morning all
[09:45] <siretart> testuser: can you please file a malone bug about this?
[09:45] <siretart> morning ajmitch!
[09:45] <siretart> ajmitch: you don't need much sleep, do you? ;)
[09:45] <testuser> siretart: sure, can you tell me how to do that ?
[09:45] <ajmitch> siretart: I said good night about 8 hours ago :)
[09:46] <siretart> testuser: https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/+package
[09:46] <siretart> ajmitch: ah, now I see in the backlog. that was about 1pm for me ;)
[09:47] <siretart> ajmitch: now it is 21:46 ;)
[09:47] <ajmitch> siretart: it was barely enough :)
[09:47] <siretart> :)
[09:48] <siretart> perhaps we should purge all of revu
[09:49] <siretart> too much stuff there. much old ones, espc.
[09:49] <herve> not mine :-(
[09:49] <ajmitch> siretart: go through them all in a UBZ session :)
[09:49] <siretart> ajmitch: ;)
[09:49] <ajmitch> siretart: when do you head to UBZ?
[09:50] <siretart> ajmitch: on saturday. you?
[09:50] <ajmitch> in ~24 hours
[09:50] <siretart> :)
[09:54] <siretart> hi Fuddl ;)
[09:57] <sivang> ajmitch: you also arrive on 29th sat?
[10:00] <ajmitch> sivang: yes
[10:00] <sivang> ajmitch: but being in .nz makes the trip how much longer? :)
[10:00] <ajmitch> lots
[10:01] <ajmitch> since I have to cross the date line :)
[10:01] <ajmitch> in total it's over a day's travel time
[10:04] <sivang> oh man
[10:04] <sivang> I don't have to cross it, and still it's going to be around 12hr
[10:05] <Mithrandir> keyes: please turn off public away.  It's just noise.
[10:05] <keyes> ok
[10:10] <ajmitch> sivang: > 12 hours for me to just reach the US
[10:10] <ajmitch> excluding all the airport waiting time
[10:10] <sivang> ajmitch: wow dude, I can just wish you easy flight :)
[10:11] <ajmitch> sivang: part of the price of living in NZ :)
[10:12] <sivang> at least you get amazing views,
[10:12] <sivang> and landscape
[10:12] <ajmitch> yeah
[10:12] <ajmitch> anyway, must get ready for work
[10:13] <ajmitch> given the amount of stuff I have to sort out by tomorrow morning
[10:30] <Amaranth> can you put python-xdg (> 0.15, << 0.16) in a Depends or does that need to be two seperate entries?
[10:30] <Amaranth> err, >= 0.15
[10:30] <Amaranth> or would == 0.15 handle all 0.15-XubuntuX versions?
[10:31] <herve> I have a preference for the >= 0.15, << 0.16
[10:34] <Amaranth> but that does work?
[10:34] <dholbach> hey herve
[10:34] <herve> yo Daniel!
[10:34] <dholbach> ow are you?
[10:34] <Amaranth> dholbach: thanks for patching pyxdg for me
[10:34] <herve> Amaranth, yes, I don't try to trick you :-)
[10:34] <dholbach> Amaranth: de rien
[10:34] <herve> dholbach, exhausted!
[10:35] <dholbach> herve: how comes?
[10:35] <dholbach> herve: too much food at your parents place?
[10:35] <dholbach> :)
[10:36] <herve> no (well yes) but I need more vacation!
[10:36] <herve> so I go trekking in the Alps this weekend
[10:37] <dholbach> oh nice
[10:43] <slomo> Amaranth: == 0.15 is a real equals ;) only 0.15 will match, not 0.15-XubuntuY
[10:44] <dholbach> good night guys
[10:45] <slomo> gn8 dholbach :)
[10:45] <dholbach> night sebastian
[10:47] <keyes> Is DMA actived by default with Breezy?
[10:48] <Amaranth> no
[10:48] <herve> even when known to be supported?
[10:49] <herve> night dholbach
[10:49] <dholbach> night herv
[10:51] <ajmitch> hm
[10:51] <schweeb> omg hi all
[10:52] <ajmitch> omg hi schweeb!!
[10:52] <schweeb> still rebuilding my server :(
[11:08] <herve> good night
[11:25] <Amaranth> wtf
[11:25] <Amaranth> lintian says W: alacarte: old-fsf-address-in-copyright-file
[11:25] <Amaranth> but /usr/share/common-licenses/LGPL-2 has the exact same address i have
[11:26] <ajmitch> look at /usr/share/common-licenses/LGPL-2.1
[11:27] <Amaranth> they need to stop changing their address
[11:28] <PlanarPlatypus> does anyone in here know if it is possible to install eclipse plugins if one has installed eclipse from the universe repository?
[11:28] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: yes it is
[11:28] <Amaranth> linda tells me 'File /home/travis/Projects/alacarte_0.8-0ubuntu1.dsc failed to process: Level 2 unpacking failed: Data "python-xdg (>= 0.15" doesn't match
[11:28] <Amaranth> '
[11:28] <ajmitch> Amaranth: why, because they've changed it once?
[11:29] <Amaranth> ajmitch: twice
[11:29] <ajmitch> Amaranth: and that's bad & mean to you? :P
[11:29] <spayne> any MOTUs here?
[11:29] <Amaranth> ajmitch: i've gotten that message twice now, once i had to change from what a gnome cvs project had to lgpl-2, now new lintian wants me to change to lgpl-2.1
[11:29] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, fair enough, it keeps breaking for me on texlipse and pydev.  Both give an error of "no such file or directory".    Do you know any good places to ask for more help on it?
[11:31] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: Afraid not, not actually an ubuntu user :)
[11:31] <PlanarPlatypus> lol
[11:32] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, ooc how do you know it is possible then?
[11:32] <spayne> ajmitch: "no, we all decided to abandon the project"
[11:32] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: I'm making assumptions based on the fact I can't see a single reason it wouldn't be :)
[11:32] <PlanarPlatypus> lol
[11:32] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: bearing in mind it works everywhere else I've tried :)
[11:32] <ajmitch> spayne: if you can't see that as a joke..
[11:33] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: if eclipse is installed ok, plugins should work
[11:33] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, it works everywhere else for me too, except when I install it from apt
[11:33] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: ah. mebbe tis broke then :/
[11:33] <tigger^> dunno
[11:33] <tigger^> I can't even get the OS installed atm :)
[11:33] <spayne> ajmitch: if it just a joke, fine
[11:34] <tigger^> "Installation of base system has failed. Please see /target/var/log/boostrap.log", which doesn't exist
[11:34] <tigger^> yay
[11:34] <tigger^> :P
[11:34] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, ah, fair enough.  ooc what hardware is this on?
[11:35] <spayne> ajmitch: let's put that behind us :)
[11:35] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: athlon
[11:35] <ajmitch> spayne: and your comments about big mono breakage earlier appeared to be misinformed, so I corrected them. We didn't really have many problems in breezy
[11:35] <ajmitch> spayne: the main fun we had with mono was getting about 10 uploads done while we were at UDU, for amd64 love
[11:35] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, where does it fail?
[11:36] <spayne> ajmitch: that's fine - i'm often wrong and wiling to be corrected
[11:36] <spayne> ajmitch: Xorg were the main problems in Breezy tbh
[11:36] <Amaranth> ajmitch: canada broadband doesn't have a rate limit on it so i think you'll be better there
[11:36] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, assuming you know more than on "installing the base system" :-)
[11:36] <Amaranth> at least i don't think it does...
[11:36] <ajmitch> spayne: if I seem a little blunt, that's a failing of mine. but I'm not trying to offend
[11:36] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: It does the partioning stuff, and then starts fetching/verifying/resolving stuff
[11:36] <Amaranth> no canadian folks i know ever complain about it
[11:36] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: and fails during that
[11:36] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: but as for which package, I'm afraid I don't know
[11:36] <Amaranth> err, not rate
[11:36] <ajmitch> Amaranth: 'broadband' here & in Australia is a bit of a problem :)
[11:36] <Amaranth> bandwidth
[11:37] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, fair enough.  I assume you have checked that the hardware is all working?
[11:37] <tigger^> Is there a media test option?
[11:37] <Amaranth> ajmitch: crappy stuff, caps and all
[11:37] <ajmitch> Amaranth: data allocation, you mean :)
[11:37] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: I'm not 100% sure it is no :)
[11:37] <PlanarPlatypus> lol
[11:37] <tigger^> Not used it for a few months
[11:37] <ajmitch> after which the data rate is restricted
[11:37] <Amaranth> E: alacarte: python-script-but-no-python-dep ./usr/bin/alacarte
[11:37] <ajmitch> we so often misuse the term 'bandwidth' :)
[11:37] <ajmitch> haha
[11:38] <Amaranth> i tried python (>= 2.4) and python2.4
[11:38] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: any ideas?
[11:38] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: is there a media test thing?
[11:38] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, I don't actully know but it wouldn't suprise me if there was
[11:39] <tigger^> I've installed from the iso I used to burn this CD inside vmware
[11:39] <tigger^> So, the file was ok
[11:39] <tigger^> maybe misburned
[11:40] <PlanarPlatypus> Did it fail once and then you gave up or did you try more than once
[11:40] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: ah, there is a check
[11:40] <Amaranth> appearently when you use #!/usr/bin/env python you can never get a Depends that makes lintian stfu?
[11:40] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: tried twice, failed in "roughly the same place"
[11:40] <Amaranth> ajmitch: you're the python package master here, right? got any tips?
[11:40] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, ah, not randomness then
[11:40] <ajmitch> *cough*
[11:40] <ajmitch> master is a very loose term there
[11:40] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: well, maybe. If it's a dodgy disk controller fex
[11:41] <Amaranth> ajmitch: you lead the team, don't you?
[11:41] <ajmitch> Amaranth: I package python stuff regularly
[11:41] <Amaranth> any idea on what to put in my Depends to make lintian stop complaining?
[11:41] <Amaranth> breezy lintian didn't do this, only dapper
[11:42] <ajmitch> right
[11:42] <tigger^> PlanarPlatypus: disk is broke :)
[11:42] <ajmitch> and there's a new lintian there, so blame dholbach?
[11:42] <PlanarPlatypus> tigger^, heh, it is often something like that
[11:43] <Amaranth> ajmitch: I like that idea. :)
[11:46] <Amaranth> nice, lintian is complaining about a nonexistant issue and linda is flat out breaking down while trying to check
[11:46] <ajmitch> u-d has traffic?
[11:47] <spayne> sivang: i noticed that too
[11:47] <spayne> night all
[11:47] <ajmitch> good night
[11:49] <Amaranth> http://dev.realistanew.com/alacarte/releases/0.8/ :D