[09:37] <kia0gh> hi all
[09:37] <kia0gh> '/ msg nickserv help register
[09:37] <kia0gh> can someone help me with a java peoblem
[09:38] <kia0gh> how do u set a double type to be less than a value cant find anything on api
[09:43] <kia0gh> hi
[09:43] <kia0gh> can someone help me please
[09:43] <kia0gh> i cant coonect to ##java
[09:43] <kia0gh> how do i register for ir
[23:20] <sdfsdf> does anyone know how to setup an internet connection on ubuntu


[01:43] <hieupm37> cjwatson: do you mean that I can create a Makefile that creates .deb from my pre-build binaries? Pre-build binaries are the source and I can upload to launchpad this source and Makefile.
[11:22] <elacheche> Hey guys!! I created a branch under lp:~user/+junk/branche_name Is it possible to add a blue print (under +junk) to that branch or I must create a project to do it?
[11:23] <mgz> you need a project for blueprints
[11:28] <elacheche> ok, thx mgz, I'm discovering LP and Bazaar..
[11:31] <mgz> elacheche: if you want somewhere to play around without harming anything, you can use https://staging.launchpad.net/
[11:31] <mgz> that has a copy of the data, but you can create and change things without affecting the real site
[12:38] <elacheche> Great mgz :) :D
[12:38] <elacheche> thx
[16:22] <wxl> hey folks i'm trying to authenticate with the api and i get ssl.SSLError: [Errno 185090050] _ssl.c:344: error:0B084002:x509 certificate routines:X509_load_cert_crl_file:sys
[17:00] <teward> if i have a depwait on a build in a PPA, and upload a newer version of the package being built, will that automatically supersede the current dep-wait'd builds and then build the new version?
[17:13] <cjwatson> teward: should do yes
[17:19] <teward> cjwatson: awesome, thanks.
[19:22] <teward> did Launchpad just explode?
[19:22] <teward> tried uploading a debdiff to a bug and it failed - says there was a problem connecting
[19:23] <teward> cjwatson: ^
[19:34] <cjwatson> teward: doesn't look obviously broken from here, maybe a network glitch of some kind but it's past the end of my day so not investigating now.  try again?
[19:35] <teward> cjwatson: figured it out - the debdiff was 172MB. o.o
[19:35] <teward> i've gzipped it and uploaded without incident
[19:35] <cjwatson> ok


[05:16] <Kilos> morning all of you. not sure if i get shed today again
[05:18] <Kilos> pumping water quick too. somewhere a pipe popped last night and after 20mm rain ground wet everywhere so how to find it is the thing
[06:33] <Padroni> Morning
[06:34] <Kilos> hi Padroni
[06:35] <Kilos> hi Jacques_Stry
[06:35] <Jacques_Stry> Morning
[06:36] <Padroni> hi Jacques_Stry
[06:43] <inetpro> good mornings
[06:44] <Kilos> hi inetpro
[06:45] <Squirm> morning
[06:45] <Kilos> hi Squirm
[07:10] <Padroni> #mailqueues
[07:10]  * Padroni sighs
[07:11] <Kilos> sorry power went
[07:11] <Kilos> Padroni  fight the good fight
[07:11] <Padroni> lol
[07:11] <Padroni> more like routine, bro
[07:12] <Kilos> im too old to be a bro
[07:13] <stickyboy> Kilos: What about bru?
[07:13] <Kilos> that too
[07:14] <Kilos> im trying to remember what we used to use 40 years ago
[07:15] <Kilos> buddy, china, mate,bud
[07:15] <Padroni> 'bru' implies relation/respect, not age
[07:15] <Kilos> will think more
[07:15] <Padroni> I will stick to Kilos though.
[07:15] <Kilos> lol
[07:16] <Kilos> Padroni  did you fly up yesterday?
[07:16] <Padroni> No
[07:16] <Kilos> or sleep all day
[07:16] <Kilos> hi ThatGraemeGuy
[07:16] <Padroni> got a snotty mail from the Directorate of Priority Crime Investigation about my unwilingness to co-operate
[07:16] <Kilos> oh my
[07:17] <Padroni> retorted with a detailed explanation of the investigating officer's complete incompetence and lack of understanding even basic internet terms
[07:17] <Padroni> So we are now in a bit of a stalemate, it seems.
[07:17] <Kilos> lol
[07:18] <Padroni> But they replied back in the mean time that they will get my subpoena re-issued correctly
[07:18] <Padroni> so I think they basically admitted defeat?
[07:18] <Kilos> yay
[07:22] <Kilos> hi mazal
[07:22] <mazal> Morning everyone
[07:27] <Kilos> hi TinuvaMac
[07:27] <TinuvaMac> hi Kilos
[07:27] <TinuvaMac> how goes
[07:27] <Kilos> ok ty and there
[07:32] <TinuvaMac> no complaints here
[07:33] <ThatGraemeGuy> 'lo
[07:35] <stickyboy> lol "china"
[07:35] <stickyboy> Funny slang in ZA :P
[07:35] <Kilos> haha
[07:36] <Kilos> that is oooold slang stickyboy
[07:36] <stickyboy> :P
[07:46] <Padroni> wrote an article last year where I disected a good phishing site
[07:47] <Padroni> explaining it's methods, obfuscation, etc.
[07:47] <Padroni> posted on my blog - which has less than 30 articles in total.
[07:47] <Padroni> it's been generating a stupid amount of traffic eversince...
[07:47]  * Padroni is baffled.
[07:47] <Kilos> lol
[07:48] <Kilos> key words attracting peeps
[07:48] <Padroni> yes
[07:48] <Padroni> lots of reads
[07:48] <Kilos> good
[07:51] <Padroni> I write stuff for criticalwatch.com sometimes
[07:51] <Padroni> or rather, they use my research in some of their articles.
[07:51] <Kilos> good too
[07:52] <Padroni> it's funny to watch them get my stuff wrong though
[07:52] <Padroni> or misinterpret it
[07:52] <Kilos> lol
[07:52] <Kilos> do they then come ask for help?
[07:54] <Padroni> we discuss via skype
[07:54] <Padroni> me and the owner
[08:36] <Kilos> hi magellanic
[08:36] <magellanic> greets
[08:39] <Padroni> hi
[08:45] <SDCDev> morning Kilos
[08:47] <Kilos> hi SDCDev
[08:47] <Kilos> you gotta greet the rest as well
[08:47] <Kilos> otherwise they sulk
[08:54] <SDCDev> lol
[08:54] <SDCDev> hey sulkers
[08:55] <SDCDev> (rest)
[08:55] <Kilos> hee hee
[08:57]  * Padroni waves
[09:04] <Kilos> hi Xethron
[09:05] <Kilos> https://heimdalsecurity.com/blog/ctb-locker-ransomware/
[09:06] <Xethron> Hello Kilos
[09:14] <highvoltage> http://mybroadband.co.za/news/energy/118565-tell-eskom-and-its-load-shedding-to-stuff-off.html
[09:14] <highvoltage> (wrong channel but right country at least :) )
[09:22] <magellanic> highvoltage: heya :)
[09:22] <Kilos> lol lo highvoltage
[09:23] <highvoltage> good morning
[09:26] <superfly> morning all
[09:27] <Kilos> hi superfly
[09:28] <Padroni> hi superfly / highvoltage / magellanic
[09:29] <magellanic> heya
[09:30] <superfly> Padroni: I haven't forgotten about you... just busy... *sigh*
[09:32] <Padroni> no worries
[09:32] <Padroni> same here
[09:37] <stickyboy> Padroni: Which TLS cipher suite do you use?
[09:37] <Padroni> I don't use TLS
[09:38] <Padroni> everything can be broken
[09:38] <stickyboy> So you use plaintext?
[09:38] <Padroni> making encryption a bit of a moot point
[09:38] <Padroni> depends on what I need it for
[09:38] <Padroni> what do you use TLS for?
[09:39] <stickyboy> Padroni: I use TLS for HTTPS.
[09:39] <Padroni> I stick to SSL for https if need be
[09:39] <stickyboy> I'm not debating that "everything can be broken", but it's not a very pragmatic approach.
[09:40] <Padroni> but I never do anything that can cause too much damage should SSL fail
[09:40] <Padroni> like transactions and such
[09:40] <stickyboy> Padroni: Hmm? SSLv3 is beyond broken...
[09:40] <Padroni> that is always done on the vendor's side
[09:40] <Padroni> i know, stickyboy
[09:40] <stickyboy> Padroni: Do you work for the NSA? ANSWER ME NOW.
[09:40] <Padroni> hence my poiint of view on the matter
[09:40] <Padroni> lol
[09:40] <Padroni> no
[09:40] <Padroni> they have scoped me out on linkedin though
[09:40] <Padroni> which kinda made me nervous
[09:41] <stickyboy> Ok, I am a big supporter of TLS1.2 with AEAD and forward secrecy.
[09:41] <Padroni> I am a big supporter of privacy and the right to anonomity in general
[09:41] <stickyboy> My blogs don't work without HTTPS... https://mjanja.ch/ https://alaninkenya.org/
[09:41] <Padroni> I feel the gov have fucked up enough things that they don't need to meddle in my communications
[09:41] <Padroni> oh snap - pardon my language
[09:41] <stickyboy> All HTTP links are 301 -> with long strict transport headers.
[09:43] <stickyboy> Yesterday's report on Equation APT by Kaspersky was amaaaaazing.
[09:45] <Padroni> I spent the day looking after my 4month old son yesterday
[09:45] <Padroni> by 11H00 I have been puked, pissed, and shat on and I kinda gave up trying to get behind a pc
[09:45] <Kilos> lol
[10:09] <highvoltage> stickyboy: https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/analyze.html?d=mjanja.ch - not bad
[10:13] <stickyboy> highvoltage: ;)
[10:21] <Symmetria> stickyboy should be back in a minute
[10:22] <Symmetria> its rebooting, for some bizarre reason linux does that occasionally with those raid systems
[10:22] <Symmetria> it randomnly decides it cant communicate with them
[10:27] <Padroni> Here's something to ruin everyone's day:
[10:27] <Padroni> http://thehackernews.com/2015/02/hard-drive-firmware-hacking.html
[10:27] <Squirm> Hey - Anyone else having issues with za.archive.ubuntu.com?
[10:28] <Kilos> yes Squirm  Symmetria  is rebooting i think
[10:28] <Kilos> use neology so long
[10:28] <Squirm> Symmetria: you still manage that?
[10:28] <Kilos> our repos are pointed to him
[10:29] <Squirm> I can wait
[10:31] <Symmetria> its fixed
[10:31] <Kilos> go Squirm
[10:31] <Symmetria> sorry we had a minor issue where linux sometimes loses ability to talk to the equilogix units
[10:31] <Symmetria> for some bizarro reason
[10:31] <Symmetria> and that requires a reboot
[10:46] <Squirm> Cool
[10:54] <Padroni> and then confirmation:
[10:54] <Padroni> http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/02/16/us-usa-cyberspying-idUSKBN0LK1QV20150216
[11:14] <stickyboy> Symmetria: It's back. Ta
[11:14] <stickyboy> Symmetria: I get it too, on mirror.mjanja.co.ke.  Storage went away last week and some LUG members were like STICKYYYY
[12:36] <mazal> Bye everyone , God bless
[14:19] <Squirm> Has anyone here had many dealings with SIP phones?
[14:22] <ThatGraemeGuy> I try to have a little to do with phones as possible
[14:25] <Squirm> We have a small fibre line, dedicated to dealing with our VOIP traffic, from our provider. When this line fails, which is does from time to time, we fail over to our primary fibre connection. This is great. The only real routing our firewall does, is pass all voip traffic over our voip fibre if it's up, and then rules disappear when the voip fibre goes down. This all works well. The problem comes in when our voip fibre comes
[14:25] <Squirm> back online. It seems either the phones/our SIP provider(telviva.com) is holding on to the IP address of our primary fibre. So calls from then on, don't work. The call dials, but no sound comes through the handset. So the packets are essentially going out through voip fibre and in through primary fibre, which makes things break...
[14:28] <magellanic> don't the phones timeout and reconnect to the sip server though?
[14:30] <Squirm> magellanic: no. Maybe because the primary fibre doesn't actually go down
[14:32] <magellanic> hmm yes
[14:35] <magellanic> I guess the firewall should make sure routing goes through the voip-fiber when it's up
[14:35] <Squirm> It does
[14:35] <Squirm> If I traceroute our  sip server, it goes out the correct route
[14:36] <magellanic> but the phones have an established connection going via the other route?
[14:37] <Squirm> Well.. I'm not sure what's happening there. I've rebooted phones countless times and they're not establishing a new connection
[14:37] <magellanic> tcpdump for traffic to the voip server on the primary line
[14:45] <magespawn> good afternoon
[14:46] <magellanic> heya
[14:53] <magespawn> hey Kilos
[14:53] <Kilos> hi magespawn
[15:28] <magespawn> bbl just moving into my roo
[15:28] <magespawn> s/roo/room
[15:59] <Kilos> hi gremble
[15:59] <gremble> Hey Kilos
[15:59] <Kilos> you are becoming like rocking horse droppings=very scarce
[16:03] <gremble> I've turned into quite the busy person
[16:03] <gremble> haha
[16:04] <Squirm> magellanic: Seems the firewall wasn't changing the ESTABLISHED connections
[16:04] <Squirm> found a way to clear all connections to our SIP Server from our primary fibre
[16:04] <Squirm> voila
[16:04] <magellanic> nice
[16:05] <Squirm> But there doesn't seem to be a way on our firewall to automate it
[16:05] <Squirm> So might have ti script something that sits on another server :/
[16:30] <Kilos> hi mazal
[16:30] <mazal> Naand oom
[16:36] <magellanic> Squirm: it know when the other line comes back up though, you could force all traffic to sip server via that route then
[16:37] <Squirm> magellanic: That's the route in place
[16:37] <Squirm> But it's nor forcing already established connections over that route
[16:38] <magellanic> the rules are just routing rules you have there? that get set/unset when the lines come/go?
[16:46] <Kilos> wb octoquad
[16:49] <Kilos> hi Tonberry
[16:50] <octoquad> greetings
[17:02] <Kilos> hi magellanic
[17:21] <Kilos> hi bduk1
[17:32] <Squirm> magellanic: Yep
[17:39] <magespawn> hi Kilos
[17:39] <Kilos> hi my magespawn  sup?
[17:40] <mazal> Oom Kilos , daar is fout met bduk se chat
[17:40] <Kilos> ai! maak reg vir hom
[17:40] <mazal> Hy het my vandag gesê dat hy niks kan sien wat in die channel getik word nie
[17:40] <mazal> Hy het re-install , en nou wil die chat nie werk nie
[17:40] <Kilos> wsatter client
[17:41] <Kilos> oh ya die thunderbird ding
[17:41] <mazal> Yep , en ek kennie daai settings vie chat op tb nie
[17:41] <Kilos> se vir hom xchat of hexchat
[17:41] <mazal> Nee hy soek als in een app
[17:41] <Kilos> ek gebruik tb nerens
[17:41] <Kilos> lol
[17:42] <mazal> Ag koos vergeet ek alweer ek maggie afr praat nie
[17:42] <Kilos> hy kan kyk in /home
[17:42] <Kilos> np
[17:42] <mazal> He installed K , so I recommended konversation
[17:42] <magellanic> Squirm: you could use iptables nat stuff or ip rule rules to force it..
[17:42] <mazal> But he doesn't want multiple apps open
[17:43] <Kilos> in hom get to see the file .thunderbird
[17:43] <Kilos> tell him to go to /home and then press alt +. and he will see the hidden files
[17:44] <mazal> Everything works , connects and even shows the channel tab red that there is activity , but clicking on the tab does nothing , doesn't actually opens the window to see inside the channel view
[17:44] <mazal> I will see when he is back at work if I see the problem in front of me if I can figure out what's wrong
[17:44] <Kilos> maybe something is corrupt in the conf file
[17:45] <Kilos> normally removing the app then deleting that .file and then installing again will sort it
[17:45] <mazal> Is difficult to know what's wrong with just a description , need to see it before me
[17:46] <Kilos> yip me too
[17:46] <mazal> Just thought I should tell you guys why he is in and out without saying anything
[17:47] <Kilos> tell him he is forgiven hehe
[17:47] <mazal> And I told him K is nice , so he installed that and now he has problems :P
[17:47] <Kilos> murphy
[17:48] <mazal> yeah
[17:49] <Kilos> you can try using thunderbird irc chat by you and then looking at what must be in that .file
[18:11] <magespawn> mazal i think there are chat clients that you can use in firefox rather than thunderbird
[18:12] <magespawn> brb just rebooting
[18:14] <Kilos> ohi superfly
[18:19] <inetpro> good evening
[18:19] <Kilos> hi inetpro
[18:20] <magespawn> good evening inetpro
[18:21] <inetpro> mazal: if you are on KDE then please try Konversation as a client for IRC
[18:21] <Kilos> haha its bduk and he like everything in one app
[18:21] <inetpro> IRC via thunderbird doesn't come close to Konversation
[18:22] <Kilos> i know that
[18:22] <inetpro> Kilos: is mazal using Konversation yet?
[18:22] <mazal> inetpro: Is not me , is bduk
[18:22] <Kilos> most likely
[18:22] <inetpro> mazal: are you?
[18:22] <mazal> I'm on konversation
[18:22] <Kilos> hee hee
[18:22] <inetpro> cool, then please show him
[18:23] <mazal> Which I recommended to him
[18:23] <mazal> But he wants everything in 1 app
[18:23] <inetpro> nothing beats seeing it in action
[18:23] <inetpro> thunderbird is a mail client, that is where it's strenghts lie
[18:24] <mazal> I don't know why he wants it that way , but that's how he wants it and used it for long time
[18:24] <mazal> I agree with you inetpro
[18:24] <mazal> I'll try and convince him :)
[18:24]  * inetpro tried IRC on thunderbird
[18:24] <magespawn> irssi for the win
[18:25] <inetpro> meh!
[18:25] <Kilos> he is most likely like me and needs to learn to use many workspaces
[18:25] <mazal> Kilos: I think it's more a matter of unity's multiple app windows that's a shlep
[18:25] <Kilos> unity?
[18:25] <mazal> I think that annoyed him
[18:26] <inetpro> you really don't have to use multiple workspaces
[18:26] <mazal> Yeah we were mos for long time on unity
[18:26] <Kilos> oh ya
[18:26] <inetpro> just use ALT+Tab to switch between apps
[18:26] <Kilos> inetpro  i love my 10 workspaces
[18:26] <mazal> I think that's where the thing started with him of not wanting many apps open
[18:27] <mazal> I know he had issues getting apps to the top and things like that
[18:27] <mazal> I must just show him that with K there isn't that nonsense
[18:28] <mazal> And switching is a breeze
[18:28] <Kilos> kde rocks
[18:29] <mazal> Yeah I'm very happy since I switched.
[18:29]  * inetpro keeps things very basic
[18:29] <inetpro> three to four apps on a single desktop at any one time and no fancy desktop effects at all
[18:29] <mazal> inetpro: Yeah me too , disabled desktop effects and have 3 apps on desktop 1 and only 1 app on desktop 2
[18:30] <mazal> I'm kinda old school that way , don't like many bells & wistles
[18:31] <inetpro> bells and whistles is a massive waste of resources
[18:31] <magespawn> yup agree with that one
[18:32] <mazal> That's why today's cars breaks so easy and cost so much to repair lol
[18:32] <Kilos> lol
[18:33] <magespawn> i am learning to do almost all my work through the command line when possible
[18:34]  * mazal be hungry
[18:35]  * mazal go search for snacks
[18:36] <stickyboy> magespawn: irssi ftw++
[18:36] <stickyboy> tmux + irssi + znc +
[18:36] <stickyboy> omg winning
[18:41] <magespawn> stickyboy: screen + byobu when working on mutiple machines
[18:42] <stickyboy> magespawn: tmux all the way, br0.
[18:42] <stickyboy> Got my configs on public git repo, w00t.
[18:42] <stickyboy> That's the first thing I clone on all my servers.
[18:44] <magespawn> i will give tmux a look, but i am not that organised yet
[18:45] <stickyboy> Merge branches '4_x-dev-DS-2355', '4_x-dev-banners', '4_x-dev-update-cua', '4_x-dev-xmlui-strings', '4_x-dev-cocoon-caching' and '4_x-dev-controlled-vocab' into 4_x-dev-next
[18:45] <stickyboy> LOL I just merged SIX branches into one in git.
[18:45] <stickyboy> w00t
[18:46] <stickyboy> magespawn: I wrote a blog post ~2 years ago when I switched from screen -> tmux... it might inspire you: https://mjanja.ch/2013/03/migrating-from-screen-to-tmux/
[18:47] <Squirm> magellanic: I could. but it's not a linux firewall, it's a fortigate
[18:47] <Squirm> so I can't
[18:54]  * inetpro shall have to take the dive and learn tmux
[18:54] <inetpro> but not now
[18:54] <inetpro> stickyboy: nice posting!
[18:55] <superfly> I'm sticking to Quassel. I have enough complicated in my life, I don't need any more.
[18:55] <stickyboy> inetpro: Thanks
[18:56] <Kilos> lol
[18:57]  * inetpro has many years of mustle memory stuck in screen mode
[18:57] <stickyboy> inetpro: I ported my .screenrc to .tmux.conf: https://github.com/alanorth/dotfiles/
[18:57] <stickyboy> :D
[18:57] <inetpro> stickyboy: I noticed
[18:57] <stickyboy> ^a-c... ^a-d... all of them :)
[18:58] <inetpro> looks very cool
[18:58] <stickyboy> All the young kids in the office use ^b. I laugh at them.
[18:58] <inetpro> but am too tired to attack anything new now
[18:58] <stickyboy> inetpro: No prob.
[19:00] <magespawn> screen is not actively maintained? wow
[19:05] <mazal> Night everyone , sleep well
[19:52] <magespawn> right, good night all
[19:52] <Kilos> night magespawn
[19:52] <Kilos> sleep tight
[19:53] <Kilos> ai!
[20:02] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight


[01:30] <whiprush> sladen: man, you guys are seriously rocking the fridge.
[01:30] <whiprush> the level of content quality is just amazing right now.
[01:33] <sladen> whiprush: :)
[01:33] <Burgwork> I need a UWN story, stat!
[01:33] <sladen> whiprush: while you're around, could you add 'ghewson' to the 'ubuntu-fridge' LP group
[01:33] <whiprush> sure
[01:34] <sladen> 'stat' ?
[01:34] <sladen> Burgwork: what do you think about posting out the ToC and highlights for the UWN, rather than the whole thing by email?
[01:35] <sladen> Burgwork: it would make fixing the corrections after release easier
[01:35] <whiprush> sladen: as soon as I figure out how
[01:35] <sladen> Burgwork: or I guess just more thorough review and less rush to get it out
[01:36] <whiprush> sladen: done, anyone else?
[01:36] <whiprush> hmmm, what happened to brandon and rich, did I miss something?
[01:37] <Burgwork> sladen, that sounds great
[01:38] <sladen> whiprush: yeah, there was a spell around the time of Ubucon (you should be able to spot the thread from a mile away) where people were just waxing off at each other on the mailing-list
[01:38] <whiprush> sladen: unfortunate. :-/
[01:39] <sladen> whiprush: I think they got bored.  After some coaxing they back on board and I sent an email asking people to chill, relax (oh and not reply to my email so's not to continue the subject further)
[01:40] <whiprush> next time I'm in chicago I'll get brandon hammered.
[01:40] <whiprush> beer always fixes problems.
[01:40] <whiprush> who did the upstart story?
[01:40] <sladen> Burgwork utterly failed to read the bit about "Please do not reply to this email.  Pretty please.    Even something short can take a couple of hours with sorting photos;  800+ word stories (the upstart one) take much, much longer
[01:58] <sladen> http://ohiolinux.org/speakers.html#talk6  I think your abstract has been spelling-checked
[01:59] <sladen> Burgwork: would ^^ do as a basis for a UWN piece?
[01:59] <whiprush> sladen: indeed
[02:06] <Burgwork> sladen, UWN has just added an "upcoming events, so you can add it there"
[05:57] <imbrandon> moins sladen and Burgwork ;)
[05:58] <imbrandon> sladen, when is a good time for you to hash out some podcast ideas and schedule some times to recored, i really wanna get that rockin BEFORE the edgy release
[06:17] <imbrandon> sladen, well ping me sometime when your not afk
[10:22] <sladen> imbrandon: I've got some recordings from Wiesbaden, but not much useable (too much background noise)
[02:39] <matthewrevell> anyone available to approve a story in the mod queue?


[11:16] <CrazyYellow> hey guys.. just tried upgrading from 14.04 to 16.04 and this didnt go according to plan.. any way how can i fix this https://paste.sh/qF9hrKqt#e3Tyfa8nDSGQERWJJoj7a6gs
[11:17] <CrazyYellow> im on live usb and chrooted into 16.04
[11:17] <darkxst> CrazyYellow, remove any ppa's first
[11:18] <CrazyYellow> darkxst: ppas appear to be commented out
[11:19] <darkxst> CrazyYellow, use ppa-purge and remove them
[11:19] <darkxst> having ppa packages installed, can confuse the upgrader!
[11:19] <CrazyYellow> darkxst: hmm..k trying that
[11:30] <CrazyMelon> well i guess ppa-purge does not want to remove packages if ppa is commented out.. keep getting Warning:  Could not find package list for PPA:
[11:32] <darkxst> CrazyMelon, yes, you will need to uncomment the ppa first
[11:34] <CrazyMelon> https://paste.sh/bSdO233_#dZWDAikZw2guaz8Jh_4oHPQ8
[11:34] <CrazyMelon> darkxst: i think im in a infinite loop
[11:35] <darkxst> CrazyMelon, try install aptitude
[11:35] <CrazyMelon> darkxst: did that..same error as above
[11:35] <darkxst> it might handle the failures better
[11:35] <CrazyMelon> i will try downloading aptitude deb and install it manuallz
[11:35] <darkxst> and remove heaps of extra packages but they should get pulled back in
[11:35] <CrazyMelon> manually
[11:41] <CrazyMelon> darkxst partial progress..removed the inkscape ppa first and things seem to progress
[11:41] <CrazyMelon> will see if this resolves the issues entirely
[11:44] <CrazyMelon> currently it looks like its removing everything..even unity
[11:45] <darkxst> CrazyMelon, you can run 'sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop^' to pull the seed back in after
[11:46] <darkxst> you may lose in self-installed packages though
[13:00] <CrazyLemon> darkxst just reporting my experience..yes i did have to install ubuntu-desktop again..
[13:00] <CrazyLemon> and while installing it got stuck on starting braille support smth
[13:00]  * CrazyLemon is on 16.04ish now
[13:01] <CrazyLemon> but yea..i think the inkscape ppa was the one that messed the whole thing up.. so thank you for your help
[15:59] <smatbuy> hi
[18:22] <muktupavels> trevinho: I pushed two new commits to wip/muktupavels/gnome-3-20 branch.
[18:22] <muktupavels> trevinho: do you plan to make 3.20 release of libwnck?


[08:04] <sil2100> Morning! Another LP API question - I would like to easily get a count of overall people with main_archive upload rights, possibly counting core-devs, MOTUs and per-package uploaders
[08:05] <sil2100> Wanted to use the main_archive.getAllPermissions() for that possibly, but even though I get a set of archive permissions (over 700) those are not accessible for me
[08:05] <sil2100> I can't read their contents
[08:05] <sil2100> What would be the best and easiest way to achieve that?
[08:14] <wgrant> sil2100: What do you mean when you say they are inaccessible?
[08:15] <sil2100> wgrant: strange thing, I get a collection, can check its length but if I try to access its individual archive_permission objects it says it's out of bounds, e.g. main_archive.getAllPermissions()[0]
[08:15] <wgrant> sil2100: Ah, what if you log in?
[08:16] <sil2100> wgrant: is this not available anonymously? Since that would be my requirement
[08:16] <wgrant> sil2100: It's very easy to accidentally export something that's available to all authenticated users but not anonymous ones.
[08:16] <wgrant> It's also easy to fix.
[08:17] <sil2100> hm, since otherwise it'll be quite hard for me to get the number of all uploaders to Ubuntu, hmm
[08:18] <wgrant> Sure
[08:18] <wgrant> I'm just saying you should do that now to a) verify that it's the problem and b) have a workaround until we can fix it in LP.
[08:21] <sil2100> wgrant: confirmed, when logged in it works
[08:21] <wgrant> sil2100: Great. Can you file a bug?
[08:21] <sil2100> Sure thing
[08:26] <sil2100> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpadlib/+bug/1705996
[08:26] <mup> Bug #1705996: Unable to access archive_permission for archive when not logged in <launchpadlib :New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1705996>
[08:26] <sil2100> Thanks!
[08:32] <sil2100> wgrant: while thinking about it, can I actually get a real number of *actual* users that have upload rights to an archive?
[08:34] <wgrant> sil2100: You'd need to expand all the team participants and exclude robots and such.
[08:50] <sil2100> wgrant: thanks
[08:51] <sil2100> wgrant: one (hopefully) last question: is there a way I could check a given user's team memberships? I don't see that straight away from the docs - I'd be mostly interested in the data of 'if this user part of canonical', since the ~canonical team seems to be private
[08:51] <sil2100> And I can't access it when not logged in
[08:55] <wgrant> sil2100: It's deliberately not possible to determine someone's Canonical employment status anonymously.
[08:56] <blahdeblah> And membership in that team doesn't guarantee Canonical employment, either.
[08:57] <blahdeblah> (Most of those are corner cases that usually aren't relevant, though.)
[08:58] <sil2100> oh!
[08:59] <sil2100> Indeed, I didn't know that when I'm not logged in I can't see my canonical membership
[08:59] <sil2100> Ok, today is a day where things that seemed easy just get a bit more complicated ;)
[09:03] <sil2100> I'll just have to do some fancy guess-work
[14:41] <skay> hey, I was wondering what needs to happen for lp:948857. I don't know how to do that, so I made a junk repo to experiment on. https://code.launchpad.net/~codersquid/+junk/oops-datedir-no-pruning
[14:46] <skay> I've not used zope.interface, but when working in Java I've used interfaces and dependency injection. so, I imagine it is a similar principle. I just haven't done it in python before
[14:52] <cjwatson> Well, I mean I guess an abstract interface is the ideally correct way to do it, but that code isn't using zope.interface (or indeed zope.component) more than trivially at the moment so it may not be worth it.  Perhaps just try / except ImportError: instead?
[14:53] <cjwatson> We'd need to review in a bit more detail but your "hack" doesn't seem obviously wrong.
[14:53] <skay> cjwatson: that is what I did in my junk branch. I made a wheel for my own use.
[14:53] <cjwatson> Don't use junk branches when a project already exists though, as they mean you won't be able to propose a merge ...
[14:54] <skay> I wasn't sure I'd ever propose one since it is hacky
[14:54] <skay> mine is hacky
[14:54] <skay> if you want it, I'll make a real branch
[14:54] <cjwatson> Doesn't seem overly hacky :)
[14:55] <cjwatson> You probably want a bit more effort into telling the user they don't have the right stuff to use that feature.
[14:58] <skay> would you want a separate branch for changing setup.py to use setuptools instead of distutils.core? that part is unrelated to making prune optional.
[15:00] <skay> it was just for personal use. seems like I shouldn't mix things if someone's going to review
[15:14] <cjwatson> I don't really know this codebase particularly well, but on general principles I think that ought to be a separate branch
[16:40] <skay> cjwatson and anyone, I made https://code.launchpad.net/~codersquid/python-oops-datedir-repo/optional-prune-dependencies/+merge/327978 for making prune optional, but this is not ready to land since I couldn't get tests to run
[16:41] <skay> see my comment. I followed the README bit on development and I'm missing a step somewhere
[16:41] <skay> I haven't used testr before, so perhaps I've missed something obvious


[13:43] <bloopletech> I have just reported a bug in libgl1-mesa-glx, and I'd like to do what I can to avoid the bug being ignored/unnoticed. The issue revolves around the x86_64-linux-gnu_gl_conf alternative, and two packages that provide it, libgl1-mesa-glx, and nvidia-304. I am able to help troubleshoot the issue right now; I asked about this in ubuntu-devel, but I think this might be a better venue
[13:44] <bloopletech> the bug url is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/1229734
[15:28] <ldn13> Since yesterday, I've been unable to submit new bugs in Launchpad.  Neither ubuntu-bug nor manually works.  Both let me fill in the form but won't actually submit.  The button at the bottom of the form, "Submit Bug Report", seems to do nothing.
[23:51] <chiluk> is anyone here part of the Ubuntu Bug Control team?  I need to nominate bug 1150413 for p, q, r, s .... and I've already attached debdiffs with fixes.
[23:52] <chiluk> bdmurray you still alive?  you always seem to be the one to push my stuff ^^^^
[23:55] <bdmurray> chiluk: still alive seems a bit uh extreme.
[23:56] <chiluk> hah
[23:56] <chiluk> well I've been working for close to 12 hours now..
[23:56] <chiluk> I'm looking forward to walking away from this.
[23:57] <chiluk> anyhow, it's not super urgent, but I'd like to get at least the saucy debdiff uploaded in the next few days.
[23:57] <chiluk> especially since we're probably getting close to freeze
[23:59] <bdmurray> well it is beta freeze now, but I'll look at it soon


[00:36] <nigelb> does every sync need an ffe?
[00:36] <crimsun> only if it's a new version
[00:36] <nigelb> we need to sync openclipart-openoffice.org (0.18+dfsg-9) from debian, we currently have dfsg-8
[00:36] <nigelb> the one we have conflicts with openoffice
[00:37] <crimsun> nope, just file a bug requesting the sync
[00:37] <nigelb> okay :) thanks
[00:37] <crimsun> if you're quick, I can approve it before I head out
[00:37] <nigelb> 2 mins :)
[00:39] <nigelb> there is already a sync request
[00:39] <nigelb> looks like it has some build troubles
[00:39] <nigelb> bug 529625
[00:40] <crimsun> feel free to work on it :-)
[00:40] <nigelb> yeah, getting to it
[03:07] <lfaraone> Should a daemon's socket be in /var/run?
[03:21] <nigelb> someone around to help me figure out build issues?  trying to build the new openclip art from debian
[03:21] <nigelb> I keep getting this warning (inkscape:22890): WARNING **: Unimplemented style property SP_PROP_CLIP_RULE: value: evenodd
[03:23] <nigelb> also can someone accept karmic nomination for bug 533369
[05:17] <micahg> any release members around?
[05:18] <nigelb> micahg: I think ScottK is around
[05:18]  * ScottK is here, but about to go to bed.  What's up?
[05:19] <micahg> ScottK: was wondering if I can get FFe approval for fennec: bug 394219
[05:19] <crimsun> nigelb: approved
[05:20] <nigelb> crimsun: thank you :)
[05:20] <crimsun> yw
[05:25] <ScottK> micahg: Ack'ed.
[05:25] <micahg> ScottK: thanks :)
[05:28] <micahg> ScottK: have a good night
[05:28] <ScottK> Thanks.
[06:22] <wrapster> i wanted to divert a library provided by a pkg libgmp3-dev and use one from a different pkg "sunwcsl". ... So i did this..http://pastie.org/868713
[06:22] <wrapster> im pretty new to packaging and I wrote it in the preinst script.i would like to know if this is correct?
[08:17] <nigelb> is there a reason why the new debootstrap isn't synced to ubuntu?
[08:22] <micahg> nigelb: was after sync freeze
[08:24] <nigelb> micahg: worth a sync?
[08:24] <micahg> nigelb: idk, depends what changed
[08:25] <nigelb> I'm trying to do an SRU and i'm wondering how to get an SRU without the bug being fixed in lucid
[08:25] <nigelb> micahg: whole bunch of stuff http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/d/debootstrap/debootstrap_1.0.22/changelog
[08:26] <micahg> nigelb: idk, better to ask someone else
[08:27] <nigelb> I'll just wait for monday then
[09:04] <ddecator> yay for late night packaging...
[10:53] <michas> Hi, what is the correct way to handle menu entries? Debian uses the menu packet, but this seems not to be used by default. How do I configure my package to add an menu entry for ubuntu?
[10:54] <geser> create a .desktop file
[10:54] <persia> michas: You want to do two things: 1) use the menu system anyway, because some desktop environments require that, and 2) add an XDG .desktop file.
[10:55] <nigelb> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#.desktop%20Files might help
[10:55] <michas> Where do I find more information about XDG .desktop files?
[10:56] <michas> oh, ok. :)
[11:18]  * abogani waves
[11:18] <abogani>  As reported in http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi the avr-libc package don't build from source.
[11:18] <abogani>  I have the simple patch that fix it but I should open a bug on LP about this first? Or a merge request via bzr branch is enough?
[11:18] <abogani> Thanks in advance!
[11:20] <persia> abogani: Either way *should* work at this point.
[11:20] <persia> abogani: Actually, you might want to file a bug, but you don't need to put a patch on the bug: you can just link the branch.
[11:21]  * persia thinks that branches not linked to bugs may not show up in the report
[11:21] <persia> abogani: Just to verify, make sure that your issue is represented at http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring when you're done.
[11:21] <abogani> persia: Ok I'll fill a bug then. Thanks!
[13:20] <aburch> Hi.  Can somebody ack my two sync requests (538004 and 538005).  They already have a freeze exception.
[18:09] <micahg> any u-u-s around?
[18:12] <nhandler> micahg: Need something?
[18:12] <micahg> nhandler: a debdiff sponsored :)
[18:12] <nhandler> micahg: Bug # ?
[18:12] <micahg> bug 530660
[18:15] <nhandler> micahg: Don't forget we are in Feature Freeze
[18:15] <nhandler> micahg: You also do not need to mention changing the maintainer field in the changelog
[18:16] <micahg> nhandler: k, and about FF, I figured this is a problem that needs to be fixed
[18:16] <micahg> just a package rename
[18:16] <nhandler> micahg: Yes, but you will want an FFe
[18:17] <micahg> nhandler: FFe please?
[18:18] <nhandler> micahg: :) One minute
[18:20] <nhandler> micahg: Also, why is the transitional package Architecture: any ?
[18:21]  * micahg looks
[18:21] <micahg> oh, right, that can be i386
[18:21] <micahg> nhandler: my first time doing transitional package from scratch
[18:21] <nhandler> micahg: Why not just make it Arch: all ?
[18:21] <micahg> will fix
[18:22] <nhandler> Or was the old package only built for i386 ?
[18:22] <micahg> nhandler: no, it was for amd64 and i386
[18:22] <micahg> nhandler: is Arch: all i386 only?
[18:24] <pochu> micahg: Arch: all is built only once (usually on i386) but can be installed on any architecture
[18:24] <pochu> it's arch independent
[18:29] <micahg> nhandler: fixed
[18:31] <nhandler> micahg: And pidgin-mbpurple was already removed from lucid ?
[18:32] <micahg> nhandler: I wanted to have the transitional package in place before requesting removal
[18:34] <nhandler> micahg: And have you tested that upgrades and fresh installs work with this?
[18:36] <micahg> nhandler: no, I suppose I could though
[18:36]  * micahg fires up Lucid VM
[18:37] <nhandler> micahg: Yeah, when requesting FFe's, you usually will want to include logs showing that everything works as expected.
[18:37] <micahg> nhandler: I didn't realize it was an FFe...I'll test an install of the old package and then install the new package to simulate an upgrade
[18:55] <micahg> nhandler: ugh...I seem to be having issues
[18:57] <lfaraone> What exactly are UCSNs? I saw "UCSN-1" recently wrt clamav; I assume they're USNs for things not in main?
[18:59] <nhandler> micahg: What type of issues?
[19:00] <nhandler> lfaraone: Looks like it stands for Ubuntu Community Security Notice
[19:00] <micahg> nhandler: it didn't install the files.  I think I have to modify more stuff :( apologies for not following this through all the way first
[19:01] <nhandler> micahg: Hmm...Was this on lucid simply installing your modified pidgin-microblog or on lucid going from pidgin-mbpurple to -microblog ?
[19:01] <micahg> nhandler: it didn't install hte files in any package
[19:01] <lfaraone> nhandler: when did this get started? (apparently without fanfare :)
[19:02]  * lfaraone has seen no docs mentioning it.
[19:02] <nhandler> lfaraone: No clue. You will probably want to ask someone on the security team
[19:02] <nhandler> micahg: Let me give it a try. Could you push your modified package to a PPA ?
[19:03] <micahg> nhandler: already did
[19:03] <nhandler> micahg: Which ppa?
[19:03] <micahg> nhandler: https://edge.launchpad.net/~micahg/+archive/patch-test/+packages
[19:03] <micahg> nhandler: packages are empty
[19:03] <micahg> nhandler: I just need to make a .install file for the microblog pacakge
[19:10] <lfaraone> nhandler: you wouldn't happen to know anybody in motu-release we could bug about ground control, do you?
[19:11] <nhandler> lfaraone: Do you have a bug?
[19:11] <nhandler> And motu-release is now part of ubuntu-release fyi
[19:11] <lfaraone> nhandler: bug 486807.
[19:12] <nhandler> lfaraone: Didn't that get into Debian already?
[19:12] <lfaraone> nhandler: correct. We're trying to get it into Lucid.
[19:12] <nhandler> lfaraone: If it cleared NEW, we can sync it. No need for a '[needs-packaging]' bug
[19:13] <lfaraone> nhandler: the needs-packaging bug was filed before I suggested we send it through Debian NEW.
[19:13] <lfaraone> nhandler: if you prefer, I can retitle it.
[19:13] <nhandler> lfaraone: So change it to a sync request ;)
[19:16] <lfaraone> nhandler: done. bug 486807 modified.
[19:16] <lfaraone> (it seems ubottu caches, it should read "Please sync groundcontrol 1.5-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)")
[19:16] <lfaraone> nhandler: should the task be set to "confirmed" or "triaged", or is leaving it as it is fine?
[19:17] <nhandler> lfaraone: It should technically be New and unassigned right now
[19:17] <lfaraone> nhandler: also done :)
[19:18] <nhandler> lfaraone: Great. Let me look it over
[19:24] <micahg> nhandler: still not working, If I add a replaces on the new package, will that make it uninstall the old one first?
[19:27] <nhandler> micahg: You might want to read through http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html
[19:27] <micahg> nhandler: thanks, that's what I was jsut looking for
[19:35] <micahg> nhandler: I didn't think this was going to be that hard :/
[19:56] <nhandler> micahg: It gets easier ;)
[19:56] <micahg> nhandler: yeah, I'm learning a lot...
[20:00] <lfaraone> kees: ping.
[20:17] <malev> hi there. is the mentors program currently working?
[20:21] <micahg> nhandler: seems to work now, I'll attach a new debdifff
[20:21] <crimsun> malev: It should be. Do you have a more precise question about it?
[20:22] <malev> crimsun, no, I'm thinking in asking for a mentorship. that's all. but now I'm reading the packing guide
[20:22] <crimsun> malev: ok, please feel free to follow up
[20:22] <malev> crimsun, thanks!!
[20:23] <malev> crimsun, is there a mail list of the motu team? or it's only for motus?
[20:23] <crimsun> malev: it's used by MOTU, but it isn't private
[20:23] <crimsun> ubuntu-motu at lists
[20:24] <malev> cook!
[20:24] <malev> }cool!
[20:24] <malev> ja
[20:24] <crimsun> feel free to pop into #ubuntu-packaging if you have specific packaging questions
[21:12] <ScottK> crimsun: Since when is this not the place to ask packaging questions for Ubuntu?
[21:23] <crimsun> ScottK: I'm unaware of this channel being deprecated for such a purpose. Recently #ubuntu-packaging was formed with the presumed intent of answering packaging questions.
[21:23] <ScottK> crimsun: It seems odd to direct people away from here to get packaging questions answered.
[21:24] <crimsun> ScottK: sure. It would help to clarify what the explicit separation is for #ubuntu-packaging.
[21:25] <ScottK> crimsun: IIRC, it was created because there wasn't a good place for PPA packaging questions.
[21:25] <lifeless> ubuntu-packaging was created as a non-official-ubuntu packaging forum
[21:25] <lifeless> e.g.
[21:25] <lifeless> PPA help
[21:25] <lifeless> derivative distro help
[21:26] <crimsun> so, if the intent is to answer only derivative packaging questions in that channel, we should make that distinction much more explicit in the [that channel's] topic
[21:27]  * ScottK has never been there, so wouldn't know.
[21:32] <lifeless> crimsun: I don't think it excludes non-derivatives
[21:33] <lifeless> its just derivative questions here, in #launchpad, and #ubuntu-devel were all starting to pile up, and be confused
[21:35] <crimsun> lifeless: I was fairly confused by the "Packaging for Ubuntu" bit in the topic
[21:37] <lifeless> crimsun: hmm persia set it up; I'll defer to him to comment fi the topic is exactly what he meant
[23:50] <kees> lfaraone: hello (saw your privmsg, I'll be working on it on monday)
[23:51] <lfaraone> kees: thanks. let me know if you need a UCSN description writeup for it :)
[23:54] <kees> lfaraone: okay, cool.  we're still working out the details on UCSNs.  We know we want to have it happen, but we haven't finalized it yet.  However, clamav was a good test run for a pretty big change.


[03:01] <wing>  hello,i want to ask one question that what does it mean between live and not-live in the iso for ubuntu system?
[03:02] <wing> I am now trying ubuntu-server-19
[03:03] <wing> anyone?
[03:04] <OerHeks> live server can be handy to fix things, server and mini iso have no live mode
[03:04] <OerHeks> this is fixed recently for such occaisions
[03:04] <OerHeks> https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/installing-live-server.html
[03:09] <wing> oh,thank you very much


[04:49] <OvenWerk1> zequence I am writing from ssh from aphone(
[04:50] <OvenWerk1> but those two bugs make sence
[04:51] <OvenWerk1> recording and generation are supposed to ne rolled into audio
[04:53] <OvenWerk1> so yes they are no lpmger valid pr used. i do not know if they woild have any effevt on an upgtade from 1204.
[04:54] <OvenWerk1> these are small keys on the nexus :P
[04:56] <OvenWerk1> i had aleaus tjougj the backdrop dir was not standard.
[04:56] <OvenWerk1> thought*
[04:57] <OvenWerk1> link or config?
[04:59] <OvenWerk1> can we config mpre than one dir for default
[05:01] <OvenWerk1> i will look closer when i m home
[07:45] <zequence> So, it is possible to upgrade from LTS to LTS?
[07:46] <elfy> I've not done it for you - but I've tested that upgrade path for us and it worked ok
[07:46] <zequence> hmm, yeah, at least there will be no releases in between after a while
[07:47] <zequence> Means I can't remove those two transitional packages that we have. Ahh, need to make some changes to our plugin.
[07:47] <zequence> ..ubiquity plugin


[06:44] <crevette> hello
[07:11] <crevette> salut huats
[07:11] <huats> hello crevette
[08:48] <seb128> good morning there
[08:48] <mvo> hey seb128!
[08:48] <seb128> hello mvo
[08:48] <seb128> mvo: I'm on my laptop now ;-)
[08:48] <mvo> did you had a chance to look at the gconf output?
[08:49] <mvo> great :)
[08:49] <seb128> can you give me the gconf key again?
[08:49] <seb128> or rather gconf directory
[08:49] <mvo> gconftool --get /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
[08:49] <seb128> $  gconftool --get /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
[08:49] <seb128> [core,ccp,dbus,place,mousepoll,gnomecompat,move,resize,decoration,png,svg,imgjpeg,text,neg,video,wall,snap,animation,scale,scaleaddon,expo,staticswitcher,regex,resizeinfo,workarounds,ezoom,vpswitch,extrawm,fade,session]
[08:50] <mvo> but with this config its now working, right?
[08:50] <seb128> no
[08:50] <mvo> does that include the latest uploads I did from yesterday?
[08:50] <mvo> oh
[08:50] <seb128> I did upgrade to the version you uploaded yesterday and use the capplet to reset normal effects
[08:51] <mvo> but you still get the windows on multiple workspaces?
[08:51] <seb128> yes
[08:51]  * mvo scratches his head
[08:51] <seb128> mvo: if you open the applications menu, accessories and select screenshot there it's only listed on one workspace?
[08:53] <mvo> seb128: yes, but with the live-cd from yesterday I saw the same effect as you, just not on my normal system. I will try harder to reproduce
[08:53] <seb128> just select the normal effects in the appareance capplet?
[08:54] <seb128> mvo: that's weird, if I run 'gnome-screenshot --interactive' which is the desktop command I don't get the bug
[08:54] <seb128> using the run application dialog or a command line
[08:54] <seb128> but when starting it from the gnome-panel menu I get the issue
[08:54] <mvo> and its evo and gnome-screenshot? or everything you start from the panekl?
[08:55] <seb128> same for evolution
[08:55] <seb128> starting it on a command line = no bug
[08:55] <seb128> using the launcher installed by default = bug
[08:55] <seb128> everything I start using a launcher
[08:55] <seb128> or menu entry
[08:55] <seb128> I get it with gedit too now
[08:57] <seb128> mvo: get the bug too now?
[08:57] <mvo> not ready yet, give me a minute :)
[08:59] <seb128> that sounds like a "let me get some tea first then I can have a look" ;-)
[08:59] <mvo> heh .) no, tea is already ready
[08:59] <mvo> *yum*
[08:59] <seb128> ;-)
[09:00] <mvo> but the compiz test machine was not booted yet
[09:00] <seb128> ah ok
[09:00] <mvo> seb128: do you compiz 1:0.7.9+git20090211-0ubuntu3 ( ?
[09:00] <seb128> "compiz test machine", I see
[09:01] <mvo> :)
[09:01] <seb128> you don't run this compiz crap on your normal boxes right? ;-)
[09:01] <mvo> the laptop can't run compiz, it freeze after 5min (ati driver issue)
[09:01] <mvo> and everything else runs compiz (i.e. my regular workstation)
[09:01] <seb128> let me restart my session to be sure
[09:03] <seb128> $ dpkg -l | grep compiz
[09:03] <seb128> ii  compiz                                     1:0.7.9+git20090211-0ubuntu3      OpenGL window and compositing manager
[09:03] <seb128> still getting the issue after a session restart
[09:03] <seb128> mvo: so you still don't get the bug?
[09:03] <mvo> woah, that is very strange, *now* I get it too, but I did not restart or anything, just clicked on the menu
[09:04] <mvo> that is puzzeling
[09:04] <seb128> mvo: you didn't even try before did you?
[09:04] <mvo> seb128: you click on the workspace switcher applet? or use the key (ctrl-alt-left) ro swithc?
[09:05]  * seb128 can see mvo saying "compiz bug, yeah, yeah, another of those gtk bugs rather"
[09:05] <mvo> seb128: *plong*
[09:05] <seb128> mvo: doesn't make a difference but neither of those, I've switch to workspace-n set for the workspaces I use often
[09:06] <seb128> but using ctrl-alt-arrows or mouse doesn't make a difference
[09:06] <mvo> I think I can reproduce it now too
[09:07] <seb128> what did you change in your workflow to get it?
[09:07] <mvo> starting it via the gnome-panel seems to be the key
[09:08] <seb128> right
[09:08] <mvo> hm
[09:09] <mvo> _NET_WM_DESKTOP =<PHONE_NUMBER> does not look quite right :)
[09:09] <mvo> (especiall when a manually started xterm has "0")
[09:10] <mvo> metacity gets that right, I think here is the problem
[09:10]  * mvo digs into the changes
[09:10] <mvo> thanks a lot seb128!
[09:10] <seb128> mvo: thanks to you ;-)
[09:11] <mvo> I bet its a off-by-one error,<PHONE_NUMBER> is FFFFFFFF
[09:24] <pitti> didrocks: congratulations to your MOTU badge!
[09:25] <seb128> pitti: where has that been announced? did huat get accepted too?
[09:27] <pochu> seb128: yeah :) check the motu ml
[09:28] <pochu> seb128: or ubuntu-devel@
[09:33] <pitti> seb128: yes, huats too
[09:33] <pitti> seb128: u-d or u-d-d
[09:33] <seb128> got the emails now
[09:33] <seb128> you guys are too quick at reading those ;-)
[09:34]  * pochu was at the end of the meeting ;)
[09:34] <seb128> I tend to not poll on my emails every minutes or I spend half of the day doing that ;-)
[09:34] <pitti> seb128: just by accident, I figure
[09:34]  * pitti usually processes mails three or four times a day
[09:34] <seb128> btw other topic
[09:35] <seb128> but do you guys have an opinion on all those netbook patches which randomly add scrollbars?
[09:35] <seb128> that seems rather an ugly workaround to me and I don't like those very much though there is no strong technical reason for that
[09:36] <pitti> scrollbars??
[09:36] <seb128> I'm wondering if we should just apply those or should discuss other ways too?
[09:36] <pitti> eww
[09:36] <pitti> I thought they'd rearrange the dialogs to fit into small screens?
[09:36] <seb128> pitti: no, they do add scrollviews for when < 600
[09:37] <seb128> pitti: bug #324464 is one example
[09:38] <seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22549603/90_1024x600_gnome-mouse-properties.c.patch
[09:40] <pitti> seb128: well, *shrug* if it doesn't alter the default look if you have more than 600 pixels, it's certainly bearable for jaunty, but IMHO the dialogs should just be rearranged upstream
[09:41] <seb128> right, my opinion too
[09:41] <didrocks> pitti: thanks a lot ;)
[09:41] <seb128> several of those changes patch glade files though
[09:41] <seb128> didrocks: congrats
[09:41] <seb128> and patching glade = no fun to do updates
[09:41] <didrocks> hi seb128 and thanks too :)
[09:41] <pitti> seb128: for jaunty they won't change that much any more, and the original authors should push to get them upstream; otherwise we'll just drop them again in the next release and ask them to re-do the patch
[09:42] <seb128> pitti: ok, I dislike the changes but I guess we can do that for jaunty
[09:46] <pitti> seb128: btw, does the evo integration in the clock applet work for you?
[09:46] <pitti> seb128: I never get any appointments/TODOs there any more
[09:46] <pitti> and with google cals in evo enabled, it even hangs the panel
[09:47] <seb128> I don't want to click on the applet now, I got too many hangs recently and ctrl-alt-backspace not working ;-)
[09:47] <pitti> heh
[09:47] <pitti> killall gnome-panel helps
[09:48] <seb128> right when you think about opening a command line before having the issue ;-)
[09:48] <pitti> ctlr+alt+f1 :)
[09:49] <seb128> pitti: ok, can't use clock applet, hangs every time
[09:50] <seb128> pitti: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=570765
[09:50]  * seb128 grrrrrs at vuntz
[09:58] <seb128> re
[09:58] <seb128> pitti: the clock applet seems to list events correctly when not freezing after starting evolution
[09:59] <seb128> ie I restart, open the calendar, nothing listed, start evo, open the calendar, then they are listed there
[10:58] <mvo> seb128: I think I nailed it down, sn_startup_sequence_get_workspace() return 0xffffffff when opened by the gnome-panel. I'm not sure if this is (also) a bug in the panel, but I added a workaround into compiz and sent a patch upstream
[10:59] <seb128> mvo: ok thanks, that worked fine with compiz before the recent updates so compiz did change in some way
[11:00] <mvo> seb128: yeah, I suspect its really compiz that is faulty, let me know if the new version (-ubuntu4) fixes it for you too, thanks again for the good description of the problem :)
[11:00]  * mvo off for lunch
[11:00] <seb128> mvo: you're welcome, thanks for the quick fixing ;-)
[11:22] <huats> hey seb128 :)
[11:22] <huats> we missed you this morning ;)
[11:22] <seb128> lut huats, congrats
[11:23] <huats> thanks seb128
[11:23] <seb128> huats: too early for me ;-)
[11:23] <huats> you deserve a great share for that...
[11:24] <seb128> huats: now we can count on your for universe desktopish updates ;-)
[11:24] <huats> yep !
[11:30] <seb128> pedro_: hello, g_slice crashes require a valgrind log
[11:30] <seb128> huats: how was the meeting then? did you get many questions?
[11:30] <huats> seb128: not a lot
[11:30] <pedro_> seb128: i know, I'm getting one since same crash is happening here
[11:31] <huats> mainly about my opinion on how to improve the desktop work
[11:31] <seb128> pedro_: ok
[11:32]  * asac hugs huats for reaching MOTU decoration ;)
[11:32] <huats> thanks asac !
[12:23] <rickspencer31> pitti: ping
[12:29] <Laney> seb128: What's the deal with bug #327747?
[12:37] <seb128> Laney: what do you mean exactly?
[12:38] <seb128> Laney: that's a new package that needs review and sponsoring?
[12:38] <Laney> Yeah, is there a reason why it's not on REVU?
[12:38] <Laney> and why it's native?
[12:39] <seb128> Laney: there is a diff.gz on the bug, how native?
[12:39] <Laney> I see no orig
[12:39] <seb128> Laney: is using REVU a rule? I for one don't have an account on REVU and don't use it
[12:39] <seb128> Laney: the orig is the nautilus-sendto one
[12:39] <Laney> ah
[12:40] <Laney> REVU isn't technically required, but I doubt that any MOTU will review and upload straight from launchpad
[12:40] <Laney> unless the package is special for some reason
[12:40] <seb128> I will if they don't
[12:40] <seb128> MOTU sucks sometimes
[12:40] <seb128> I don't get why using REVU should be a requirement
[12:40] <seb128> that's a normal sponsoring request
[12:40] <seb128> need to talk to dholbach about it
[12:44] <Laney> maybe its fine, I just didn't get what it was about
[12:45] <seb128> Laney: it's about building code which requires universe build-depends
[12:45] <seb128> Laney: the choice are to either promote those build-depends or have an universe package which does the build
[12:47] <Laney> oh right, I get it
[12:47] <Laney> it wasn't very clear, sorry for the confusion
[12:47] <seb128> that's alright
[12:48] <seb128> just curious but was not clear?
[12:48] <seb128> the description and package name should give good clue
[12:49] <Laney> I understood the purpose, but not the implementation
[12:50] <seb128> what do you consider as suboptimal?
[12:50] <seb128> or what is weird for you?
[12:50] <Laney> It wasn't clear that this was a fork of an already-existing package, and that it uses the same orig
[12:51] <Laney> maybe it's just the way I read it though
[12:51] <seb128> well, it doesn't use the same orig exactly
[12:52] <seb128> or rather than a cp nautilus-sendto.orig.tar.gz nautilus-sendto-universe.orig.tar.gz
[12:52] <Laney> yeah
[12:52] <Laney> md5sum-identical
[12:52] <seb128> the idea is to have the same source but ship the things which have universe depends only
[12:52] <Laney> anyway I will review it later
[12:52] <seb128> thanks
[12:52] <seb128> I was going to do that but if you do it that's better so I can NEW it
[12:53] <seb128> I prefer to not have the same person doing the review and NEWing
[12:53] <seb128> for what is worth I did look at the debdiff and it's trivial
[12:53] <seb128> it's basically extra build-deps over the main package and a .install to install the things which are not in nautilus-sendto
[12:58] <seb128> Laney: welcome on your new MOTU membership btw ;-)
[13:01] <Laney> thanks
[13:03] <seb128> welcome -> congrats
[13:03] <seb128> rather ;-)
[14:22] <ember> congrats huats didrocks and Laney :p
[14:22] <huats> thanks ember
[14:54] <bluesmoke> mvo: Please do a snapshot of plugins-main, wall is so awesome now :)
[14:54] <mvo> bluesmoke: you should still have commit access to the team ;)
[14:55] <mvo> bluesmoke: but yeah, sounds great. I need some "commitment" from danny that there will be a stable releas at some point
[14:55] <mvo> otherwise I get into trouble :)
[14:55] <bluesmoke> Supposedly 0.8 was supposed to be out now
[14:55] <mvo> but just compiz, no? the plugins-{main,extra} are not branched
[14:55] <mvo> or is trunk just what will be 0.8?
[14:56] <mvo> (for the plugins)
[14:56] <bluesmoke> They planned on doing it all together
[14:56] <mvo> cool
[14:56] <mvo> I missed that
[14:56] <mvo> Amaranth: I make a update into the compiz ppa now, sounds like we should be prepared
[14:56] <Amaranth> mvo: They want 0.8 to be the first release that drops the fusion name, from what I can understand of it
[14:56] <Amaranth> Which I think is too much, they should just do the release and worry about that stuff for 0.9
[14:57] <mvo> I agree, its just a name afterall
[15:02] <pitti> rickspencer31: pong
[15:14] <seb128> huats: do you have universe upload rights already?
[15:14] <seb128> didrocks: or you?
[15:14] <seb128> bug #329020 seems a good first desktop sponsoring ;-)
[15:17] <huats> seb128: I don't know :)
[15:18] <seb128> huats: good opportunity to try if you want ;-)
[15:18] <huats> seb128: I am a bit on a rush now :(
[15:18] <seb128> huats: ok no hurry, maybe something to try this weekend if you want
[15:18] <huats> yep
[15:18] <huats> I am taking care of it , but this WE or monday :)
[15:19] <seb128> ok
[15:19] <huats> (of course I'll look if nobody deal with it ))
[15:24] <ember> mvo or seb128 care to accept the gnome-desktop-sharp2 binaries? tomboy requires libgnomepanel2.24-cil
[15:24] <mvo> Amaranth: plugins are now in the compiz-ppa
[15:25] <Amaranth> mvo: woohoo
[15:25] <mvo> ember: seb128 will have to do that, I can not do NEW
[15:25] <Amaranth> mvo: have you seen the feature I'm talking about in wall?
[15:25] <mvo> Amaranth: :) I like the "keep dock windows in place" when doing the place
[15:25] <mvo> eh, switch
[15:25] <mvo> is that what you mean?
[15:25] <Amaranth> yep
[15:26] <Amaranth> It's like the static plugin but it works for the desktop too
[15:29] <mvo> Amaranth: yeah, its very cool
[15:29] <mvo> a small thing, but looks much nicer
[15:29] <Amaranth> I was asked to ensure this gets into jaunty :)
[15:30] <mvo> haha
[15:31] <mvo> Amaranth: by danny? or some users :) ?
[15:31] <Amaranth> users
[15:31] <Amaranth> gnome-do developers, actually
[15:32] <mvo> nice
[15:32] <mvo> I guess it should be safe to upload it into jaunty proper
[15:33] <Amaranth> until 0.9 compiz is still "the latest git snapshot is better then the last release"
[15:33] <Amaranth> 0.9.x is going to be hard to deal with
[15:34] <mvo> did you actually start to package the compiz++ branch?
[15:38] <asac> Riddell: i tried kubuntu-desktop yesterday on my ati system and after login it ends up with a white screen similar to what happens if i force compiz under gnome.
[15:38] <Amaranth> mvo: Nope, not really worth it yet
[15:39] <Amaranth> mvo: everything is going to be moving around
[15:39] <asac> mpt_: see msg
[15:39]  * mvo nods
[15:40] <Riddell> asac: if you're in a testing mood, see if this helps  echo -e "[Compositing]\nEnabled=false" > ~/.kde/share/config/kwinrc
[15:40] <asac> Riddell: ok so you dont run similar blacklisting as we do for compiz
[15:40] <asac> =
[15:41] <asac> Riddell: Riddell you ment ">>" not ">" right=
[15:41] <asac> damn keyboard
[15:41] <Riddell> asac: it should use the blacklist from compiz
[15:41] <Riddell> asac: depends if you care about about kwin settings :)
[15:41] <asac> i appended that now to my config. next time i log in i will check
[15:42] <asac> Riddell: probably not ... i never used kde in the last years or so
[15:42] <asac> oh i started it in intrepid for networkmanager i think
[15:42] <asac> Riddell: the only thing that makes compiz fallback on my card is "Software Rasterizing" ... you probably want to check for that too
[15:45] <asac> Riddell: anyway ... will let you know if that helped at all
[16:25] <seb128> re
[16:25] <seb128> mvo: so how many compiz updates can you screw in a week? ;-)
[16:26] <mvo> *pff*
[16:28] <seb128> mvo: just jocking, your new version fix my issue ;-)
[16:28]  * seb128 hugs mvo
[16:28] <crevette> hey gentlemen
[16:28] <crevette> I plan to do the update of the lastest bluez version
[16:36]  * mvo hugs seb128
[16:53] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128 - just looking at bug 314263 again - the uploaded patch is not correct, which is part of the reason it doesn't work anymore
[16:54] <seb128> chrisccoulson: feel free to submit a debdiff to fix it
[16:54] <chrisccoulson> i will do, but i just tested it with the patch applied correctly, and it still doesn't work correctly. it doesn't pass any uri to the application now
[16:55] <seb128> chrisccoulson: what is wrong in the patch?
[16:56] <chrisccoulson> the patch does what was intended, but i'm wondering whether something changed between 2.19.5 and 2.19.6. i'm going to apply it to 2.19.5 in a minute and make sure it still works
[16:56] <chrisccoulson> i'm doing a build with some g_debug's in at the moment so i can try and work out what is going on
[17:10] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'll provide a corrected debdiff for that. it seems to be working now after logging out and back in again
[17:13] <seb128> chrisccoulson: what did you change now?
[17:13] <chrisccoulson> i havent changed anything, other than correcting the patch so that it applies properly
[17:17] <seb128> chrisccoulson: you don't want to tell me what was wrong or not correctly applied then?
[17:18] <chrisccoulson> yeah, the patch actually patched itself (if that makes sense), because of a copy/paste error from the debdiff i provided
[17:19] <seb128> ah ok
[17:19] <seb128> I did screw the 2.15.6 update because my local copy was not uptodate
[17:19] <seb128> and your debdiff added another revision rather than fixing that
[17:19] <seb128> so I did tweak it
[17:20] <seb128> but I did it quickly and probably did something wrongly there
[17:20] <seb128> next time I will ask for an updated debdiff rather ;-)
[17:20] <chrisccoulson> that's ok ;)
[17:20] <chrisccoulson> just in case it didn't make sense, i copied the extracted patch to http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/117746/ so you can see
[17:21] <chrisccoulson> it's a direct copy and paste from the debdiff i think and as a consequence it actually patches itself;)
[17:53] <asac> bryce: http://www.tuxradar.com/content/browser-benchmarks-2-even-wine-beats-linux-firefox ... hmm
[17:54] <asac> thats partly firefox fault. most time probably goes lost on cairo/X11/driver level
[17:55] <asac> just FYI
[17:59] <bryce> asac: bummer
[18:01] <bryce> asac: hmm, I wonder exactly what differences in the stack exist between wine and non-wine
[18:01] <bryce> asac: I'd think they're using the same X11/driver bits underneath but who knows
[18:01] <bryce> could easily just be some difference in cairo backends
[18:01] <asac> bryce: its gtk + cairo + xrender vs. windows.dll toolkit that probably doesnt use cairo and maybe not xrender underneath
[18:02] <asac> bryce: i am quite sure its cairo (if not gtk), but not sure if its really cairos folk or just its heavy use of xrender or other X11 features
[18:02] <asac> i know that cairo has a few cases where it has bugs ... like rendering of box borders
[18:03] <asac> not sure if those can explain all
[18:03] <bryce> mm
[18:03] <bryce> well I'm good friends with cworth (he lives the next town over) so if there's specific work or questions you need, I'd be happy to get his help
[18:05] <bryce> asac, hmm in fact i'll send him this article now and get  his feedback
[18:05] <bryce> asac: btw have you run that benchmark to confirm the findings on ubuntu?
[18:07] <asomething> seb128: not to distract from your discussion in devel, but I was wondering if there are any 2.25.90 updates that still need some one to handle them.
[18:09] <seb128> asomething: I don't think so but 2.25.91 coming soon ;-)
[18:09] <seb128> asomething: you can work on split evolution documentation by locale if you want
[18:10] <seb128> that would be nice to win cd space
[18:10] <asomething> seb128: interesting, I'll look into that. that would be something new for me
[18:11] <seb128> basically list evolution-documentation-nn where nn is a locale for each locale in the control file and move things in the rules or something I would expect
[18:11] <seb128> you can try looking at how gimp does that
[18:12] <asomething> i'll give it a shot
[18:12] <asac> bryce: no, but a commentor did: 161 (wine) vs 130 (native)
[18:12] <bryce> mm ok
[18:12] <bryce> I'll cc you
[18:22] <crevette> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/327747/comments/6
[18:23] <crevette> hey Laney
[18:23] <crevette> you're here
[18:23] <Laney> yessir
[18:23] <crevette> about https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/327747/comments/6
[18:24] <seb128> Laney: control.in, that's a copy of nautilus-sendto mostly so better to keep changes low to make easier to do updates and keeping those in sync
[18:24] <crevette> if you I replace Universe by Supplementrary in short description, wiil it make you happy?
[18:25] <seb128> Laney: ie, cleaning that would only means extra diff over nautilus-sendto and work to do merges for no real win
[18:26] <Laney> seb128: Well I was imaginging that merges would be done manually anyway so it wouldn't matter
[18:26] <Laney> but I dont' feel strongly about it, it was more stylistic
[18:26] <seb128> right, I've no strong opinion either
[18:26] <crevette> as you want
[18:27] <Laney> crevette: I was thinking more along the lines of the nautilus-sendto one
[18:27] <Laney> integrates xxx and yyy into nautilus or something
[18:27] <Laney> also, there were some indentation inconsistencies in control, but now I'm really nitpicking :)
[18:28] <crevette> so should I drop control.in ?
[18:29] <Laney> I will upload either way, so pick what will make you more happy as maintainer
[18:31] <crevette> Laney: I'm not technically speaking a maintainer, and I don't consider myself as a maitainer
[18:31] <crevette> I'm just some guy helping ubuntu  :)
[18:32] <crevette> I appreciate any good advice
[18:32] <crevette> :)
[18:32] <Laney> well IMO it isn't necessary, especially as the changelog history will differ, and this is the main point of uploaders.mk
[18:33] <Laney> why did you add DEB_DESTDIR btw?
[18:33] <crevette> Laney: to be able to only provide the two *.so files
[18:34] <crevette> I've been advised to do so
[18:34] <crevette> :)
[18:34] <Laney> oh, was the whole directory installed by default in nautilus-sendto?
[18:34] <crevette> Laney: yes
[18:34] <Laney> i.e. not adding it would install all of the plugins again
[18:34] <Laney> OK, got it
[18:34] <Laney> (might be nice to say this in the changelog)
[18:35] <crevette> Laney: we rebuild whole nautilus-sendto why that, and we only pick up the so we want to have
[18:35] <Laney> yeah, I understand
[18:52] <crevette> Laney: http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m4b7895d5
[18:52] <crevette> is it better for you?
[18:53] <Laney> crevette: How about "integrates Empathy and UPnP into the Nautilus file manager"?
[18:53] <Laney> following nautilus-sendto
[18:54] <seb128_> Laney: are you a native english speaker?
[18:54] <Laney> yes
[18:54] <seb128_> just wondering ;-)
[18:54] <seb128_> Laney: ok, so you pick the description, will probably be better than what french guys (ie crevette or me for example) can do ;-)
[18:54] <Laney> heh, I was just going for consistency
[18:54] <Laney> but it sounds better to me too
[18:54] <seb128_> Laney: yeah, I think your suggestion makes sense
[18:55] <pochu> seb128: I didn't know the notification bugs where actually valid upstream bugs
[18:55] <pochu> seb128: that makes things quite different
[18:56] <pochu> I've already forwarded one upstream and I'm going to prepare a patch for another one
[18:56] <Laney> they are?
[18:56] <pochu> Laney: yes
[18:56] <Laney> interesting
[18:56] <Laney> I was under the impression that Ubuntu was being quite heavy-handed here
[18:56] <pochu> Actions may or may not supported by the daemon, so they should check that it's supported before using it
[18:56] <Laney> in what sense are they valid?
[18:56] <Laney> oh, that is cool
[18:56] <pochu> see "Actions" in table 1 in http://www.galago-project.org/specs/notification/0.9/x81.html
[18:56] <seb128> pochu: right, they are but they have no strong reason to go this way, they are just wishlists
[18:57] <pochu> "This functionality may not be implemented by the notification server, conforming clients should check if it is available before using it"
[18:57] <pochu> seb128: who are "they"?
[18:57] <seb128> Laney: well, the idea is to stop using notification in bubbles
[18:57] <Laney> Yeah, I know the idea
[18:57] <Laney> I just thought that it was an Ubuntu quirk
[18:57] <seb128> pochu: upstream, GNOME, the daemon they use support actions so they might not see the issue
[18:58] <seb128> where the new daemon will not
[18:58] <pochu> seb128: right, but they are ignoring the spec, which makes those valid bugs
[18:58] <pochu> even if they are low prio
[18:58] <seb128> right, bugs are valid
[18:58] <seb128> I just say it's not really a priority for them
[18:58] <pochu> yeah
[18:58] <seb128> but no doubt opening bugs makes sense
[18:58] <pochu> bug my two affected upstreams are not GNOME ;)
[18:58] <seb128> ;-)
[18:58] <pochu> and actually I'm now upstream for Liferea itself
[18:59] <pochu> although if you tell me Liferea consumes 100% cpu, I'll blame Xulrunner :)
[18:59] <seb128> pochu: congrats
[18:59] <pochu> thanks :)
[19:00] <crevette> pochu: time to switch to webkit :)
[19:00] <pochu> crevette: oh yeah :)
[19:00] <pochu> crevette: trunk is webkit only
[19:00] <seb128> pochu: btw where are you running for motu membership then?
[19:00] <crevette> really ?
[19:00] <pochu> no Xulrunner, no GtkHtml anymore ;)
[19:00] <pochu> crevette: yeah
[19:00] <seb128> where -> when
[19:00] <pochu> and 1.6 will be released soon
[19:00] <pochu> seb128: I'm MOTU for more than a year ;)
[19:00] <seb128> hum, I was not sure, should have checked
[19:01] <seb128> pochu: you should do universe sponsoring ;-)
[19:01] <pochu> yeah...
[19:01] <seb128> good to see new people helping there with Laney, huats and didrocks who joined today
[19:01] <seb128> anyway dinner time
[19:01] <seb128> bbl
[19:01] <pochu> enjoy
[19:02]  * crevette stays UNMOTU
[19:02] <crevette> :)
[19:02] <pochu> crevette: not for long!
[19:02] <crevette> pochu: you're tracking applications using action in notifications ?
[19:03] <pochu> crevette: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=dxteam
[19:04] <crevette> pochu: gnome-user-share uses actions (I coded notification for it)
[19:05] <crevette> but I don't see the gain removing actions, but it is true I didn't read docs related to the changes you're doing
[19:05] <pochu> crevette: I'm not tracking them... maybe the Dx team missed that
[19:05] <pochu> crevette: or maybe they didn't report it yet ;)
[19:05] <crevette> what is dxteam ?
[19:06] <pochu> crevette: well, the point is that according to the notification-daemon spec, the daemon may not have actions support
[19:06] <pochu> crevette: so you should check if it has, and if it doesn't, don't use them
[19:06] <crevette> okay
[19:06] <pochu> crevette: Desktop Experience team
[19:06] <pochu> (new Canonical team)
[19:06] <crevette> okay
[19:06] <pochu> crevette: so the bugs are for applications that don't check whether the daemon has actions support before using them
[19:07] <pochu> those that do are fine
[19:08] <mclasen_> pochu: yet the bugs all read '...shouldn't use notifications with actions'
[19:09] <pochu> mclasen_: yeah, I guess the title is incorrect
[19:09] <pochu> mclasen_: the body says "they should check if the daemon supports Actions"
[19:09] <mclasen_> fair enough
[19:09] <pochu> or actually
[19:09] <pochu> "Instead, the buttons should be made conditional on whether the notification server supports actions."
[19:10] <pochu> which is the direction that patches have
[19:10] <pochu> e.g. http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22449526/goobox-notify.diff
[20:50] <asac> pochu: where did you read that?
[20:50] <asac> 20:09 < pochu> "Instead, the buttons should be made conditional on whether the notification server supports  actions."
[23:12] <pochu> asac: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/liferea/+bug/328606
[23:20] <pochu> asac: see comment #3 in bug 328609
[23:38]  * asac looks
[23:45] <asac> pochu: (on liferea) but the presence of the option makes it difficult to remove ... what does that mean
[23:49] <pochu> asac: I think they mean the presence of the option in liferea's preferences, but I'll have to check it
[23:49] <pochu> I don't have libnotify enabled so I'm not sure
[23:49] <pochu> will try to have a look tomorrow
[23:49] <asac> which option?
[23:50] <asac> "presence of the option" - what option? what do you control with that? enable/disable notifications?
[23:50] <pochu> the preference option->yes
[23:50] <pochu> and the notifications have actions in it
[23:50] <pochu> like "mark those new items as read" and things like that
[23:50] <asac> i understand that part.
[23:51] <asac> for me "option" was not defined at all in the bug ... could be any option
[23:51] <asac> so lets assume its "enable/disable" notification optoin
[23:51] <asac> let me reread
[23:52] <pochu> Liferea has a “Show a popup window with new headlines.” option that is on by default
[23:52] <asac> pochu: heh
[23:52] <asac> true
[23:52] <pochu> it's cleary the preference option in the GUI tab, isn't it?
[23:52]  * asac rereads ;)
[23:52] <pochu> :)
[23:52] <pochu> s/cleary/clearly/
[23:53] <asac> pochu: so this bug is about removing action buttons
[23:53] <asac> why all the rest of this info?
[23:53] <asac> i mean its fine, but it isnt related to the bug ;)
[23:53] <asac> or am i missing the connection?
[23:54] <asac> so notifications are "These are annoying and unusable" ... because you get flooded ... now we remove actions which doesnt fix the flood ;)
[23:54] <asac> pochu: so are those libnotify notifications?
[23:55] <pochu> asac: yes
[23:56] <pochu> "Instead, the buttons should be made conditional on whether the notification server supports actions."
[23:56] <pochu> that's the key
[23:56] <pochu> the notification-daemon specification doesn't guarantee the daemon will support Actions
[23:56] <pochu> so the application (liferea) should check that the daemon does, and if so it can use Actions
[23:56] <pochu> there's an API to check that
[23:57] <pochu> but liferea currently doesn't check it, it just uses Actions unconditionally
[23:57] <pochu> the Dx team plans to change notification-daemon to not provide Actions support, so those apps that don't check if there's support for them will be buggy
[23:58] <pochu> those are bugs in the apps because of the spec says they need to check that
[23:58] <pochu> so that's what we need to fix :)
[23:59]  * pochu -> bed, g'night!