[00:10] <qwebirc84189> oh, and I know it is a problem with that script because I temp renamed the script so it would not run and the computer woke up later
[00:11] <qwebirc84189> Prob is hardware clocks will always creep a bit and this script puts it back in line.


[01:39] <atrius`> silly question time... it is possible to install ubuntu _server_ via nfs/PXE, right?
[01:40] <sarnold> atrius`: PXE should be possible though I've not tried. NFS, no idea.
[01:41] <atrius`> sarnold: i can get it to boot just fine.. but it then promptly ignores the netboot=nfs bits and complains it can't mount the CD. if i use the initrd.gz from the netboot directory on the iso it ignores the NFS argument again and wants to load everything from the internet
[01:43] <atrius`> lots of google hits for doing this on the desktop install, which works fine, but largely nothing for the server image
[01:48] <sarnold> atrius`: hrm, indeed, my quick searches turn up the same results.
[01:49] <atrius`> sarnold: and it is looking worse.. pulling apart the netboot initrd for server is starting to make it look like it doesn't support NFS installs at all
[01:49] <sarnold> atrius`: for some (many? all?) releases, the server installer has been the debian installer.. it might be done differently..
[01:50] <atrius`> checking that
[01:51] <sarnold> atrius`: this page seems to suggest it is possible.. it also describes ftp and http. http feels more likely to work than ftp, but that's just me.. :)  http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Network-Install-HOWTO-8.html
[01:52] <atrius`> suggest yes.. but no deatils
[01:52] <atrius`> details even
[01:52] <sarnold> indeed. this page also suggests HTTP or FTP: http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/ch02s04.html.en#idp5637360
[01:52] <atrius`> which probably means setting up an entire mirror
[01:53] <atrius`> which negates the rather extensive work already done on my PXE boot/NFS install server
[01:53] <atrius`> which installs everything else in the universe just fine
[01:53]  * atrius` kicks ubuntu server
[01:53] <sarnold> :(
[01:53] <atrius`> can't imagine why they don't use the same installer for both Desktop and Server :(
[01:54] <sarnold> atrius`: you might be able to configure a preseed file that leaves out all the gui and network-manager pieces... (not saying that's awesome, but it might get you where you want.)
[01:54] <atrius`> i suppose it would be better than nothing
[01:56] <atrius`> i'm searching the initrd file for any references to NFS
[01:57] <atrius`> lovely.. the only references are via kickseed
[02:11] <atrius`> well.. it appears that so far installing _server_ via NFS isn't possible. one guy even resorted to using squid to cache files from an HTTP source on the internet
[02:11] <atrius`> if this is true that's pretty bloody lame since pretty much every other distro supports NFS install easily
[02:12] <sarnold> atrius`: if you choose to go down the squid route rather than http, there's a squid-deb-proxy package that may help.
[02:13] <sarnold> atrius`: please also file a bug.
[02:13] <atrius`> sarnold: i'll probably file a bug after i'm less upset and less likely to write something like "lack of NFS install ability is retarded" :D
[02:18] <sarnold> atrius`: heh, that's kind :) but once in a great while, an anger-induced bug report can do great good: https://jira.mongodb.org/browse/PYTHON-532
[02:21] <atrius`> lol
[02:33] <tohuw> sarnold: That bug report was a thoroughly entertaining read. Thanks.
[02:34] <sarnold> tohuw: happy to make your friday night / saturday morning :)
[02:35] <tohuw> For awhile, I was wondering if "Jibbers" was actually someone on the pymongo team!
[02:56] <genii> I was asked by work to see if there is a way to not have the Symantec PGP Universal Server in between a Blackberry Enterprise Server and an MS Server 2008 with Exchange. So the idea I'm entertaining currently is 13.04 with hockeypuck or sks for keyserver then something like either make some procmail rules to encrypt and forward to the MS box, or perhaps something like Google's gpg-mailgate app with postfix to accomplish that part. Is anything
[02:56] <genii> like this feasible?
[03:04] <samglover> Hey all. I'm trying to set up BitTorrent Sync on an Amazon EC2 Ubuntu server instance.
[03:05] <samglover> I've provisioned a new Ubuntu server, installed btsync, and run it. Now, I just need to figure out how to connect to the web UI.
[03:05] <samglover> Anyone able to help me figure this out?
[03:11] <sarnold> samglover: there's probably a few things to keep track of ...
[03:11] <samglover> I'm sure.
[03:12] <sarnold> samglover: there's the AWS security groups.. and then whatever address the gui server binds to.. and then whatever access controls the GUI server might impose itself
[03:13] <sarnold> samglover: if you forward http over ssh, your connections will appear to come from localhost (from the perspective of the GUI server), so it can bind to localhost and allow only localhost -- and not require any new AWS security groups
[03:13] <samglover> Okay, I'm already lost. Is there a tutorial you can point me to? I don't want you to waste your time walking me through it if I can try on my own with some guidance.
[03:13] <sarnold> samglover: if you want to connect directly to it with a web browser, that'd require configuring it to listen publicly, setting up security groups to allow it, and maybe configuring some access controls to limit access to you and yuou alone..
[03:13] <sarnold> ah, good thing, it's dinner time ;) hehe
[03:14] <samglover> Or maybe some keywords I can use to find a tutorial? I don't even know what I'm looking for.
[03:15] <sarnold> samglover: ssh -L and -R are probably the things to start with. here's a guide, but I don't love what I see so far.. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SSH/OpenSSH/PortForwarding
[03:15] <sarnold> samglover: oh, my fault, there's a <host> argument at the end of the examples of "local port forwarding". they're tolerable examples. :)
[03:15] <sarnold> good luck :)
[03:16] <samglover> Thanks. I'll come back if I can't figure it out (which will probably be the case). But hopefully with more-informed questions.
[03:24] <samglover> Okay, so my btsync process is listening:
[03:24] <samglover> Here's what netstat -lp shows:
[03:24] <samglover> tcp        0      0 *:8888                  *:*                     LISTEN      951/btsync
[03:25] <samglover> And the btsync manual says: WebUI is the default way of accessing BitTorrent Sync. It can be reached at: YourLocalIP:8888/gui
[03:27] <samglover> But when I try it with my EC2 instance, like this, I get nothing: ec2-##-###-##-##.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com:8888/gui
[03:27] <samglover> The private DNS doesn't work, either.
[03:28] <samglover> So what I gather from sarnold's comments are that I could access it using local port forwarding. But wouldn't I need to insert my key pair somewhere in the command, in order to make it work?
[03:28] <qman__> that netstat line means that it should be listening from any address, so it sounds to me like an AWS problem
[03:28] <qman__> I don't know enough about AWS to tell you how to fix it, though
[03:29] <qman__> to SSH with an arbitrary key, use the -i parameter
[03:29] <samglover> FWIW, it's a clean Ubuntu 12.04 server, updated, with btsync.
[03:30] <qman__> e.g. ssh -i /path/to/private_key -L 8888:<IP_ADDRESS>:8888 youramazonserver.com
[03:31] <samglover> Cool. I'll try that.
[03:31] <qman__> if establishing that connection works, you'd then browse to your local host on 8888 to get to it
[03:32] <samglover> You mean I'd enter <IP_ADDRESS>:8888/gui in my web browser?
[03:32] <qman__> yes
[03:34] <qman__> this also assumes you're running linux on your local computer, or at least a system with openssh client
[03:34] <qman__> if you're on windows you'll need to use putty and configure the port forwarding the GUI way
[03:34] <samglover> It's a Mac, so I think I'm good.
[03:35] <samglover> The Ubuntu PC is at my office, but I'll need to connect that, too, at some point.
[03:35] <samglover> Holy shit, that worked!
[03:35] <jacksonka> Hello
[03:37] <jacksonka> My port 5060 is open filtered but will not allow SIP registration.  Anyone had this problem with Ubuntu Server 12.04?
[03:39] <jacksonka> I changed the ports to 5070 and presto everything registered.
[03:40] <qman__> the port can't be open and filtered, it's either open, closed, or filtered
[03:41] <samglover> You guys rock. Thanks! Now I'm rolling my own Dropbox.
[03:41] <qman__> which corresponds to Accept, Reject, or Drop respectively
[03:41] <samglover> Up yours, NSA.
[03:41] <qman__> samglover, neat, I'll have to check out that software
[03:44] <samglover> I'll post a tutorial shortly. How do I turn off the local port forwarding? I want to make sure it keeps working.
[03:44] <jacksonka> ok here it comes
[03:44] <jacksonka> small flood
[03:44] <jacksonka> only way
[03:44] <jacksonka> 6.00 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2013-06-07 23:42 EDT
[03:44] <jacksonka> Nmap scan report for cinsolar.com (<IP_ADDRESS>)
[03:44] <jacksonka> Host is up (0.0011s latency).
[03:44] <jacksonka> PORT     STATE  SERVICE
[03:44] <jacksonka> 5058/udp closed unknown
[03:44] <jacksonka> MAC Address: F4:CE:46:0F:44:74 (Hewlett-Packard Company)
[03:44] <jacksonka> Nmap done: 1 IP address (1 host up) scanned in 0.20 seconds
[03:44] <jacksonka> jacksonkirka@jacksonkirka-HP-ProBook-4520s:~$ sudo nmap -p 5060 -sU cinsolar.com
[03:44] <jacksonka> Starting Nmap 6.00 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2013-06-07 23:42 EDT
[03:44] <jacksonka> Nmap scan report for cinsolar.com (<IP_ADDRESS>)
[03:44] <jacksonka> Host is up (0.0011s latency).
[03:44] <jacksonka> PORT     STATE  SERVICE
[03:45] <qman__> please use a pastebin
[03:45] <jacksonka> Sorry about the small flood
[03:45] <qman__> !pastebin
[03:45] <jacksonka> Thanks
[03:46] <qman__> samglover, exit from the SSH session, and the tunnel goes away
[03:46] <jacksonka> Why is my port 5060 closed?
[03:47] <qman__> jacksonka, it means either nothing is listening there or the firewall is filtering it
[03:48] <samglover> Hm, that doesn't seem to have done it. I can still access the server using my browser.
[03:49] <samglover> I assume if the tunnel goes away, I shouldn't be able to access the web UI, at least.
[03:49] <jacksonka> After I disabled ufw it still blocks this port although my router is from Cincinnati Bell and the router may be blocking the port.
[03:51] <qman__> you can check on the server side with netstat -tulanp | grep 5060
[03:52] <jacksonka> k, logging in using ECDSA 521 ssh.
[03:52] <qman__> if you find that is listening on udp 5060 on the correct interfaces, then it's probably a firewall somewhere down the line
[03:54] <jacksonka> no
[03:54] <jacksonka> UDP ports do not listen.
[03:54] <jacksonka> ONly tcp ports listen
[03:55] <qman__> so it means you don't have anything listening, which answers the question
[03:55] <jacksonka> Using nmap with -p 5060 -sU
[03:56] <jacksonka> -sU with nmap specifies udp
[03:56] <qman__> yes, which is why I said UDP
[03:56] <qman__> while UDP is stateless the software still needs to bind to the port
[03:56] <qman__> and will remain bound to that port in order to accept connections
[03:56] <jacksonka> Notice in the print nestat printout the udp ports don't say listen
[03:57] <qman__> if netstat does not show any software bound to 5060 then that is your problem
[03:57] <jacksonka> Port 5070 is bound
[03:58] <jacksonka> No I can use 5070 and the phones work
[03:58] <jacksonka> Why would 5060 be closed if Asterisk sip.conf is configured for <IP_ADDRESS>:5060?
[03:59] <jacksonka> I disabled ufw.
[03:59] <jacksonka> I changed the port to 5070
[03:59] <qman__> it's closed because you're not using 5060 right now
[03:59] <qman__> you will need to change it back in order to trace down the issue
[04:00] <jacksonka> Addr->IP     : <IP_ADDRESS>:5060
[04:01] <jacksonka> This is text from Asterisk cntl
[04:01] <jacksonka> It is shows my phone at home on 5060 but it works and Asterisk PBX is configured for 5070.
[04:02] <jacksonka> Like you say 5060 isn't accepting data.
[04:02] <jacksonka> I have the phone Polycom 321 expressly configured to use port 5070.
[04:02] <jacksonka> It matches the port in Asterisk.
[04:03] <jacksonka> So the phone works but it reports its still on 5060.
[04:04] <qman__> what device is <IP_ADDRESS>?
[04:04] <jacksonka> Some party I am associated with Ubuntu, Asterisk, Yaai, Cincinnati Bell or other is intentionally blocking my ports.
[04:05] <qman__> does that IP belong to the asterisk server or to the polycom?
[04:05] <jacksonka> The Polycom 321 TCP/IP parameters
[04:05] <jacksonka> .......................................................
[04:06] <jacksonka> IP: <IP_ADDRESS>
[04:06] <qman__> ok
[04:07] <qman__> what that output is telling you is that the polycom's sip port is still 5060, that is not telling you about asterisk's sip port, which should be 5070 based on what you've said
[04:07] <qman__> both ends have a sip port set up
[04:07] <jacksonka> What I am saying is I used 5070 when I discovered that 5060 was being intentionally block and not by me because it was working for a long time.
[04:08] <qman__> well, if it worked before, it's a simple matter of finding out what changed
[04:08] <jacksonka> No sir, I have the phone expressly set up on the line as port 5070
[04:08] <qman__> if you didn't change server config for it to break, it wasn't your server
[04:09] <jacksonka> Absolutely
[04:09] <qman__> no, you have the phone set up to connect to asterisk on 5070, which is a separate setting
[04:09] <qman__> the phone still has a sip port on it configured elsewhere, which that output says is 5060
[04:09] <jacksonka> Oh, I don't know or have info to confirm this.
[04:09] <qman__> it may not even be changeable depending on the device
[04:09] <jacksonka> I will double check everything on the phone.
[04:10] <qman__> it shouldn't need to be changed
[04:10] <jacksonka> If I change it to 5060 it will not work because that port is closed.
[04:12] <jacksonka> I have the sip server Asterisk in /etc/asterisk/sip.conf set up on <IP_ADDRESS>:5070
[04:12] <jacksonka> actual server address left out
[04:12] <qman__> yes, and we cannot troubleshoot it unless you change it back to 5060
[04:12] <jacksonka> It is absolutely changeable
[04:13] <qman__> that is not what I was referring to
[04:13] <jacksonka> OK
[04:13] <jacksonka> I will
[04:13] <jacksonka> edting /etc/asterisk/sip.conf now.....
[04:13] <qman__> ok
[04:13] <qman__> also pastebin the output of iptables -nvL | grep 5060
[04:14] <jacksonka> done
[04:14] <qman__> assuming there is any
[04:14] <jacksonka> My address is <IP_ADDRESS>
[04:15] <jacksonka> so udpbindaddress: <IP_ADDRESS>:5060
[04:15] <qman__> ok
[04:15] <qman__> it's showing as open from here
[04:15] <jacksonka> rebooting asterisk
[04:15] <jacksonka> restarting daemon
[04:16] <jacksonka> Changing extenion 101 to port 5060
[04:16] <qman__> ok\
[04:19] <jacksonka> Ok furthermore, my router is <IP_ADDRESS> and server is <IP_ADDRESS>  configured on the internet as public interface /etc/network/interfaces.
[04:20] <jacksonka> I could log on physically near the server on lan but not from wan or public internet infrastructure
[04:21] <qman__> ok, that is a separate issue
[04:21] <qman__> SIP and NAT don't get along well at either end, you have to configure your phone device to play nice with NAT, and make sure the routers at both ends don't break anything
[04:22] <jacksonka> I can log on now on 5060 as before but have to wait until I get to work to test with I can from public infrastructure log on thru 5060.  See, when I changed the port to 5070 I could log in thru public internet without being on lan.
[04:23] <jacksonka> I don't use port forward to <IP_ADDRESS> server address but configure my server on Cincinnati Bell's public IP4 address.
[04:23] <qman__> correct
[04:23] <qman__> I am referring to the client side
[04:24] <jacksonka> Yes, client side ok on 5060 lan.
[04:24] <qman__> the phone which you are connecting with at work is behind a NAT router
[04:24] <qman__> so the phone itself must be configured in a NAT friendly mode
[04:24] <jacksonka> Yes and configured as nat=yes and qualify=yes
[04:24] <qman__> ok
[04:24] <jacksonka> It has worked for a long time.
[04:25] <jacksonka> After some event, the port 5060 status changed.  I will check status of 5060 now.
[04:25] <qman__> you may also be running into UPnP causing you trouble
[04:26] <jacksonka> Oh, I saw a post about this.  Can you explain further.
[04:26] <jacksonka> Do you have a link?
[04:26] <qman__> UPnP is basically a dynamic port forwarding system
[04:26] <qman__> so if some other device requested 5060 be forwarded somewhere, it may have interfered with your ability to connect
[04:26] <jacksonka> Port 5060 appears to be ready.
[04:27] <jacksonka> via nestat
[04:27] <jacksonka> via netstat
[04:28] <qman__> due to the dynamic nature of UPnP, this failure would have been temporary and difficult to diagnose
[04:28] <qman__> and yes, 5060 appears to be working from where I'm sitting as well
[04:28] <jacksonka> Nmap reports :   5060/udp open|filtered sip
[04:29] <jacksonka> Do you have a sip phone
[04:29] <jacksonka> Do you have a sip phone?  Softphone would do.
[04:30] <qman__> yes, if you would like to /msg me an account I can test it for you
[04:30] <jacksonka> sudo apt-get install ekiga
[04:30] <jacksonka> thans
[04:30] <jacksonka> thanks
[04:30] <jacksonka> editing sip.conf to add
[04:36] <jacksonka> k.  Try login 105 passwd 3593
[04:38] <jacksonka> qman you there?
[04:38] <qman__> yes, trying now
[04:38] <jacksonka> Its ok I can delete the account afterward.
[04:39] <qman__> I get a request timeout
[04:39] <jacksonka> correct
[04:39] <jacksonka> Now, sudo apt-get install nmap
[04:39] <qman__> yes, I have nmap, it shows as open
[04:40] <qman__> if you open the asterisk console, do you see me attempting to register?
[04:40] <jacksonka> Use sudo nmap -p 5060 -sU <IP_ADDRESS>
[04:40] <qman__> also, was the output of iptables -nvL | grep 5060    blank?
[04:41] <jacksonka> logging back in
[04:42] <jacksonka> I restarted asterisk a second time just to make sure.
[04:43] <jacksonka> sip show peers
[04:44] <jacksonka> 105 is (unspecified)
[04:44] <qman__> yes, it still has not registered
[04:44] <jacksonka> checking iptables....
[04:44] <qman__> ok
[04:44] <qman__> ufw is just a front end to iptables, so this will check if there is anything at that level interfering
[04:46] <qman__> you will also need to check the policy, you should probably not actually grep it and just read it
[04:46] <jacksonka> sudo iptables -nvL shows only labels with no output when logged in to the server.
[04:46] <qman__> ok
[04:46] <qman__> are they all accept?
[04:46] <jacksonka> No there is no output at all
[04:46] <jacksonka> sudo iptables -nvL
[04:47] <jacksonka> only header with no data
[04:47] <qman__> you should at least have something along the lines of "Chain INPUT (policy ACCEPT)"
[04:47] <jacksonka> policy ACCEPT 4331 packets, 404k bytes
[04:47] <qman__> ah, ok
[04:48] <jacksonka> I have no expertise with iptables.
[04:48] <jacksonka> Sorry for the ignorance.
[04:48] <qman__> don't need to, that's what I was looking for
[04:48] <qman__> so it's not being blocked there, and it works from LAN so the server is working
[04:48] <qman__> the next step in the chain is your router
[04:49] <jacksonka> You bet.
[04:49] <jacksonka> I believe that Cincinnati Bell is intentionally block incoming 5060 because they are a phone company.
[04:49] <qman__> the exact steps for it can vary wildly based on model and ISP, so I can't really tell you exactly
[04:50] <jacksonka> Checking router....
[04:50] <qman__> that's entirely possible, you may want to call customer support and ask
[04:50] <jacksonka> Westell router
[04:50] <qman__> however, they normally only apply such restrictions to residential, non-static customers
[04:51] <qman__> they meaning ISPs in general
[04:51] <jacksonka> Firewall is set to low only known security holes are protected.
[04:51] <qman__> SIP may have been added as a "known" security hole
[04:51] <qman__> I would recommend turning it off/allow all at least for the testing phase
[04:51] <jacksonka> I am static and have both a residential and commercial ip account with Cincinnati Bell.
[04:51] <jacksonka> k
[04:52] <jacksonka> I will allow one minute.
[04:52] <jacksonka> go
[04:52] <jacksonka> The firewall is down
[04:52] <jacksonka> at the router
[04:52] <qman__> ok
[04:52] <jacksonka> All traffic is allowed.
[04:53] <qman__> timed out again
[04:54] <jacksonka> It said the outbound ports were all available but inbound it says may be configured via port forwarding.
[04:54] <jacksonka> I get nothing in port forwarding tab
[04:54] <qman__> ok, it should be blank, as your server should have its own address
[04:55] <jacksonka> so they are clearly block the incoming port on the wan router
[04:55] <qman__> maybe, one way to test for sure
[04:55] <qman__> install tcpdump on the server
[04:55] <jacksonka> at the nearest station to my house.
[04:55] <qman__> and run it with these parameters
[04:55] <jacksonka> doing it
[04:55] <qman__> tcpdump -n udp dst port 5060
[04:56] <qman__> by doing this, it should log all incoming SIP connections to the screen
[04:56] <jacksonka> already have it.
[04:56] <qman__> all attempts
[04:56] <jacksonka> udp as well
[04:56] <qman__> I will attempt to connect a few times and you should see me
[04:56] <qman__> if you don't, it's being blocked
[04:57] <jacksonka> no suitable device found
[04:57] <qman__> ah, add -i eth0 where eth0 is your network card that has your external IP configured
[04:57] <qman__> in front, so like
[04:57] <qman__> tcpdump -i eth0 -n udp dst port 5060
[04:58] <jacksonka> ok go
[04:58] <qman__> ok
[04:58] <jacksonka> wait I need -v option
[04:58] <jacksonka> It is listening now.
[04:59] <qman__> ok, I just attempted
[04:59] <qman__> did you see any output?
[04:59] <jacksonka> yes
[04:59] <qman__> from <IP_ADDRESS>?
[05:00] <jacksonka> tcpdump: eth0: You don't have permission to capture on that device
[05:00] <jacksonka> (socket: Operation not permitted)
[05:00] <jacksonka> jacksonkirka@hpm110g6:~$ sudo tcpdump -i eth0 -n udp dst port 5060
[05:00] <jacksonka> tcpdump: verbose output suppressed, use -v or -vv for full protocol decode
[05:00] <jacksonka> listening on eth0, link-type EN10MB (Ethernet), capture size 65535 bytes
[05:00] <jacksonka> 00:59:16.827851 IP <IP_ADDRESS>.5060 > <IP_ADDRESS>.5060: SIP, length: 658
[05:00] <jacksonka> 00:59:16.890484 IP <IP_ADDRESS>.5060 > <IP_ADDRESS>.5060: SIP, length: 440
[05:00] <jacksonka> Sorry
[05:00] <qman__> hmm, that's odd
[05:00] <qman__> is <IP_ADDRESS> work?
[05:01] <jacksonka> Yes that is Geils in New York
[05:01] <jacksonka> It is my trunk
[05:01] <qman__> oh, ok
[05:01] <qman__> makes sense
[05:01] <qman__> but you don't see any from me
[05:01] <jacksonka> This is my expertise.
[05:02] <jacksonka> I trunk to geils and deploy Asterisk PBX on port 5060 along with many other services.
[05:02] <qman__> if you don't have anything coming from <IP_ADDRESS> then it looks to me like an issue on your router or futher upstream stopping the traffic from getting there
[05:02] <qman__> and you may need ISP support to get that resolved
[05:02] <samglover> Here's my BTSync on Amazon tutorial: http://samglover.net/bittorrent-sync-amazon-ec2/
[05:03] <samglover> Tell me if I screwed anything up.
[05:05] <qman__> I'm also seeing other open ports so I'm pretty sure your IP setup works, which leads me to believe that 5060 is explicitly blocked
[05:05] <jacksonka> Thanks qman I will contact Cincinnati Bell because they are the only culprit left.
[05:05] <qman__> sure, glad I could help
[05:05] <jacksonka> With your permission I will delete exten 105
[05:05] <qman__> yeah
[05:06] <jacksonka> How do I stop tcpdump
[05:06] <qman__> ctrl+c
[05:06] <jacksonka> Wait -vvv
[05:06] <jacksonka> ok I increased the verbosity
[05:07] <jacksonka> the account is still good
[05:07] <qman__> ok, I sent a few more packets that way
[05:12] <jacksonka> qman I cannot see your IP at all
[05:12] <qman__> ok, that further confirms the diagnosis, 5060 is being blocked somewhere
[05:13] <qman__> most likely the ISP or router, and since you don't have any config saying it's blocked, you will probably have to contact them about it
[06:00] <Chunky56> I have a RAID 5 array in ubuntu server where one of the hard drives died--I got a replacement under warranty and am now trying to add it to the array and have it resync, but using mdadm --manage /dev/md127 --add /dev/sdd1 is not working or giving any response (I verified sdd1 is the new hard drive)
[12:28] <imanc> I'm trying to install a backport of cacti and despite following instructinos to add the ppa, et.c it's still consistently installing the version i don't want. If I prefix the package with the version number in apt-get, it says that the version is not found
[12:28] <imanc> does anyone have any ideas how to solve this?
[12:35] <dassouki> this morning I had a high I/O rate. I checked it out and it was high. my httpd server is still running but my sql is not. I'm assuming it's something with fake accounts creating wiki comments on mysql and blocking it or something of that sort
[12:35] <dassouki> when i go to any website htat has a db i get an "error conencting to database" and when i do "mysql" in terminal, I get the following error "ERROR 2003 (HY000): Can't connect to MySQL server on '<IP_ADDRESS>' (111)"
[12:42] <daya> any one have tried the ubuntu from scratch, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCDCustomizationFromScratch
[12:42] <daya> I am able to make the Live CD, but could not add installer,
[13:38] <demonoid_me> hello i have a problem with openvpn
[13:39] <demonoid_me> when i write command ./build-ca
[13:42] <demonoid_me> this is the log http://paste.ubuntu.com/5745114/
[13:43] <demonoid_me> pls hellp me
[13:43] <demonoid_me> :)
[13:45] <demonoid_me> can you help me please?!?!?!
[13:56] <demonoid_me> exooooooooooooo
[13:56] <demonoid_me> hijos de puta
[14:18] <e_t_> !language
[15:56] <aarcane> I have an ubuntu server where a bunch of stuff is suspect now.  I don't have the time to do a reinstall completely, is there some way to tell apt or aptitude to verify every installed file against the version from repos?
[16:02] <shauno> debsums does what you're describing, but I fear it'll just lead you to misplaced trust.  it's nothing close to a proper audit, just one tool in the box
[16:14] <aarcane> shauno, I can manually verify my configuration if I can verify the binaries.  The only issue then is the dying disk, which I've replaced.
[16:17] <gyre007> guys I need to export PATH globally on the server...so I thought sticking a script into /etc/profile.d/ with export PATH="$PATH:/foo/path" would do it but it doesnt seem to do the job...
[16:17] <gyre007> anyone ideas how to do this ?
[18:31] <nineteen67comet> G'day everyone .. I was wondering; can I have a startup script on a headless server box that'll run a rsync command and shut-back-down? (I can have the bios start the box; and the script shut it down).
[18:32] <nineteen67comet> It's an old computer that I don't want running all the time; just startup/backup via rsync to my media box and shut back down.
[18:32]  * nineteen67comet I'd love it if Ubuntu-Server worked on Raspberry pi
[20:22] <OiCory_> Hi guys, I'm trying to install OpenVPN on my Ubuntu server 12.10 using an offcial guide from Ubuntu.com and I'm hanging on this one command
[20:31] <yousaf> hi all
[20:31] <yousaf> at the moment my webserver default home is at /var/www/ how can I change this to /var/www/laravel/public_html?
[20:44] <ScatterBrain> How do I add multiple IP addresses to one NIC?  (I want a block of say 5 addresses on the same physical card).
[20:45] <ScatterBrain> I can still do eth1:1, eth1:2, etc...right?
[22:54] <beneter> so much activity here ^^


[20:37] <mup> PR operator#722 opened: Fixing updated link in docstrings <Created by Abuelodelanada> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/722>


[23:13] <StevenK> wgrant: https://code.launchpad.net/~stevenk/launchpad/re-enable-workermonitor/+merge/136072
[23:16] <wgrant> StevenK: Why?
[23:16] <StevenK> mrs_poolie: \o/
[23:17] <StevenK> wgrant: To close a critical and have less disabled tests?
[23:17] <wgrant> StevenK: I mean, what's the justification for just increasing the timeout?
[23:17] <wgrant> Why should these things take a minute?
[23:17] <wgrant> (it's a trick question; no test can ever be allowed to run for a minute)
[23:18] <mrs_poolie> hi StevenK :)
[23:18] <StevenK> wgrant: Well, I'm not sold on 60, I was just seeing if increasing the timeout would stop the tests failing -- given 20 seems bad, I wasn't sure about 30.
[23:19] <wgrant> Ah, they run subprocesses, I see
[23:19] <StevenK> And it's a timeout, it isn't supposed to take that long, that's when we give up and fail the test, no?
[23:19] <wgrant> Your __all__ is missing a comma
[23:19] <wgrant> Otherwise good
[23:20] <StevenK> Ah, so it is
[23:23] <StevenK> wgrant: Can haz approve?
[23:23] <wgrant> Done
[23:25] <StevenK> Hmm, kanban actually logged me out
[23:39] <bigjools> mrs_poolie: nice nick!
[23:40] <mrs_poolie> hi bigjools
[23:40] <bigjools> mrs_poolie: fyi, the Ghiardelli chocolate did *not* last long
[23:41] <mrs_poolie> bigjools: lol. we still have lots here. going to give some away


[00:48] <GunnarHj> dsmythies, godbyk, everybody else: Just updated the proposed "What's new" page.
[00:48] <GunnarHj> http://people.ubuntu.com/~gunnarhj/whats-new.html
[00:48] <GunnarHj> Please let me know if you have some last minute feedback.
[00:50] <godbyk> GunnarHj: Should we split the updates into two categories: since 12.04 and since 13.10?
[00:51] <GunnarHj> godbyk: I know that we talked about doing so during a meeting, but I found it difficult to make that distinction in a sensible way.
[00:51] <godbyk> GunnarHj: Fair enough.
[00:52] <godbyk> brb
[01:08] <godbyk> back
[01:09] <godbyk> GunnarHj: I'd change #3 to read: Improved look and style including rounded window decorations, a new interface for screen unlock, and other tweaks to the theme.
[01:11] <GunnarHj> godbyk: Good improvement!
[01:12] <godbyk> I want to rejigger #5, too...
[01:13] <GunnarHj> godbyk: Please be feel to do it directly in the branch.
[01:13] <GunnarHj> free
[01:14] <godbyk> GunnarHj: okay.
[01:14] <godbyk> GunnarHj: Probably easier than describing the changes. :)
[01:15] <GunnarHj> godbyk: Right.
[01:18] <godbyk> GunnarHj: Where did you get the 'literally hundreds of different online sources' count for the Dash? How many does it actually search?
[01:23] <GunnarHj> godbyk: https://help.ubuntu.com/13.10/ubuntu-help/whats-new.html
[01:23] <GunnarHj> godbyk: I just copied and pasted... Don't really know.
[01:23] <godbyk> GunnarHj: Huh. Fair enough. :)
[01:24] <GunnarHj> godbyk: But I agree it does not sound plausible.
[01:25] <GunnarHj> godbyk: Maybe we should make it a litte more vague...
[01:25] <godbyk> Yeah.
[01:25] <godbyk> I was trying to find a real number.. are there actually hundreds?  Or just dozens?  Or maybe only a dozen?
[01:26] <GunnarHj> godbyk: Good question. I have absolutely no idea. I have it switched off...
[01:27] <GunnarHj> godbyk: I can ask someone tomorrow.
[01:28] <godbyk> 'kay.
[01:35] <godbyk> GunnarHj: I made some adjustments to the What's New page. I've just pushed the to bzr so you can take a look. Feel free to revert anything you dislike.
[01:40] <GunnarHj> godbyk: I like it. Thanks!
[01:40] <godbyk> GunnarHj: np
[06:27] <bkerensa> godbyk: I noticed What's News says changes made since 12.04 LTS
[06:27] <bkerensa> but these changes should be since the last release not 12.04 LTS
[06:48] <dsmythies> bkerensa: I'll forward you some e-mail thread about the what's new stuff.
[06:52] <bkerensa> dsmythies: oh so I should leave the 12.04 LTS bit?
[06:52] <bkerensa> dsmythies: nick of time btw I was just about to push :P
[06:53] <dsmythies> Yes, I think so. I'll forward you a bit of the thread.
[06:56] <bkerensa> okie dokie
[06:56] <dsmythies> bkerensa: I sent some of the e-mails, but not all. The issue was discussed and LTS to LTS what's new won out.
[06:58] <bkerensa> Do you know if anyone from the team is interested in taking care of the release notes?
[06:58] <bkerensa> It usually takes a couple hours of time and pinging all the teams for contributor names
[07:03] <bkerensa> good night all
[13:37] <melodie> hi
[13:37] <melodie> anyone here has a write access to the wiki ?
[13:37] <belkinsa> Hey there, melodie.  Everyone does with a LP account.
[13:37] <melodie> hi belkinsa everyone but me
[13:37] <belkinsa> Did you log in?
[13:37] <pleia2> melodie: when you sign into the wiki, is the username box checked?
[13:37] <melodie> when I try to get to a wiki page I am redirected to the login screen
[13:38] <melodie> hi pleia2 I will check now and reply
[13:38] <melodie> I am at "yes log me in" all boxes checked
[13:39] <pleia2> including Username?
[13:39] <melodie> now I would like to go back to the page I was there
[13:39] <pleia2> (it won't show up if you don't have one)
[13:39] <melodie> pleia2 all 3 boxes checked
[13:39] <pleia2> I have 4 boxes :)
[13:39] <pleia2> so I don't know what 3 you have
[13:40] <pleia2> Username is the important one
[13:40] <melodie> what are your other boxes?
[13:40] <pleia2> Time zone, Full name, Username, Email address
[13:40] <belkinsa> I have those too.
[13:41] <melodie> I think I don't have timezone
[13:41] <pleia2> ok, but you do have Username?
[13:41] <belkinsa> Isn't the full name one the only one that isn't grey out?
[13:41] <pleia2> the other issue on the wiki is caching, sometimes logging in with a different browser helps, or clearing the cache
[13:41] <melodie> miracle, that seems to work!
[13:41] <pleia2> oh good :)
[13:42] <melodie> I had to login twice though
[13:42] <belkinsa> Good to hear.
[13:42] <pleia2> goofy thing
[13:42] <belkinsa> It can be weird at times.
[13:42] <melodie> goofy?
[13:42] <melodie> o_o
[13:42] <pleia2> they use pretty aggressive caching on the wiki, so sometimes it behaves oddly
[13:42] <knome> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a6/Goofy.svg
[13:42] <belkinsa> lol, knome.
[13:43] <melodie> yes! Dingo :D
[14:33] <melodie> ok, the doc is edited now
[14:33] <melodie> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudio/UsbAudioDevices
[14:34] <melodie> I put it under a title 2: "Information as of 2014, March 20"
[14:34] <melodie> I hope it's ok for you guys and gals
[16:45] <dsmythies> godbyk: I am using your check_validation.sh script right now. But I do not know what it is doing. I entered: doug@s15:~/docs-1404/ubuntu-docs/ubuntu-help/C$ ./check_validation.sh and it has been gone for about 10 minutes now.
[16:46] <dsmythies> godbyk: Oh. It finished.
[16:46] <godbyk> dsmythies: It's checking everything but not telling you anything until it finds an error.
[16:46] <godbyk> dsmythies: If you use the -v option, it'll give you status information as it goes along.
[16:52] <CarstenG> Hi all
[16:54] <CarstenG> Today is DocumentationStringFreeze. So we can now safely start with the translation.
[16:54] <CarstenG> Or is there any change in any pot file expected?
[16:58] <godbyk> CarstenG: I think dsmythies has already uploaded the pot file today, but I'm not positive.
[17:01] <CarstenG> godbyk: Thanks. I saw his email in the branch revisions.
[17:01] <dsmythies> I t was not me that changed the pot file. I'm checking things and would like until the freeze time of 21:00 UTC. (Unrelated but, For the serverguide I need until 21:00 UTC, but I do the next step anyway)
[17:02] <CarstenG> Ok, than we can start :-) And in general, for all the other packages I think, we can also start.
[17:02] <CarstenG> Ah, ok. Then we wait until 21 UTC
[17:02] <godbyk> CarstenG: You can probably start translating, though. I don't think many strings have changed.
[17:02] <CarstenG> Or better tomorrow :-)
[17:03] <CarstenG> Yes, I guess some typos...
[17:03] <godbyk> dsmythies: Btw, I kind of like the simplicity of this: https://wiki.gnome.org/DocumentationProject/Tasks/DesktopHelp
[17:06] <CarstenG> Fortunately yesterday I downloaded all the po files from the doc. So I can compare it with the current version :-)
[17:06] <dsmythies> godbyk: Validation: I an do the syntax, orphans and dead link checks in 25 seconds. The script is takiing 3 minutes and  36 seconds. I'll do it again with verbose and observe what it is doing.
[17:07] <godbyk> dsmythies: Hmm.. that's quite a bit of a difference.
[17:07] <godbyk> dsmythies: One thing I'm doing differently than yelp-check is that I'm checking each file individually, but I wouldn't expect that to add so much overhead.
[17:15] <dsmythies> CarstenG: It was Gunnar that updated the .pot file and you should be O.K. to proceed.
[17:16] <dsmythies> godbyk: yes I like the gnome tasks page.
[19:45] <shaunm> hey all, I've set the dates for open help 2014. would be great to see some ubuntu faces again. http://openhelpconference.com/
[22:25] <bkerensa> godbyk: has anyone mailed the translations list to officially tell them they can begin translation?
[22:26] <godbyk> bkerensa: I haven't noticed such an email yet.
[22:26] <bkerensa> godbyk: we should send one
[22:26] <bkerensa> :D
[22:27] <godbyk> bkerensa: I think the latest pot is up on Rosetta/Launchpad now, so it should be safe to start translations.
[22:29] <godbyk> bkerensa: Btw, Gunnar has upload rights now, so we shouldn't have to worry about chasing down someone to upload our package.
[22:31] <godbyk> bkerensa: Oh, and I just saw an email exchange between Doug and Gunnar. They're on top of the translations mailing list. They're going to send an email once they've taken care of a couple odds and ends (e.g., waiting for the Launchpad to process the approval for the translation template).
[23:00] <belkinsa> I found this question interesting: http://askubuntu.com/questions/202088/is-there-a-kind-of-ubuntu-wiki-sitemap-or-contents-index?atw=1  Someone is looking for a site map, maybe one should be created for the wiki?
[23:13] <bkerensa> godbyk: Yeah I saw that and talked to him


[00:24] <seele> Riddell: http://paste.ubuntu.com/49480/
[00:24] <seele> Riddell: should set default win size for first time running, when the app closes it will set it as the new default and the kde control module entry will remove itself
[00:25] <seele> Riddell: there are a few apps that still don't obey the global icon setting, i'll fix that next
[00:26] <Riddell> seele: mm, you've been busy :)
[00:27] <seele> Riddell: omg it took me forever to figure it out too.. but i'm glad i found this way instead of fifteen rc files
[00:27] <seele> Riddell: we'll still need to replace a few rc files for the apps that don't obey the global setting, and i think there are a few apps that are better off as icon only (like konq)
[00:29] <Riddell> konq is buggy for that, I think on restore it adds text to the icons
[00:29] <Riddell> to the toolbars I mean
[01:07] <Riddell> seele: kwinrulesrc uploading
[01:07] <Riddell> time to snooze
[01:08] <seele> Riddell: 'night
[01:11] <txwikinger> Riddell: still awake?
[01:12] <Jucato> he snoozes fast :)
[01:14] <txwikinger> well..it is the time to do it over there ;D
[02:28] <goatsocks> seele: some kde4 apps' default css stylesheets are prioritizing MS fonts ("arial", "verdana") over "sans", "sans-serif", or "monospace"... since msttcorefonts is a multiverse package shouldn't all explicit references to MS fonts be replaced with the generic names "sans" etc.?
[02:29] <goatsocks> seele: see: grep --include "*css" -Iri font /usr/share/kde4/* | grep family
[02:34] <seele> goatsocks: hmm?
[02:38] <goatsocks> seele: for example, ktorrent's web interface serves up a css file that will tell your browser to use MS verdana or MS arial over DejaVu or whatever free font the user has chosen globally in KDE
[02:39] <goatsocks> if the user doesn't have msttcorefonts installed that's no problem, it'll default to "sans" (which in my case maps to DejaVu Sans), however i don't think hard-coding MS fonts is a good idea
[02:40] <seele> oh, you mean in terms of the spacing being off?
[02:40] <seele> but that shouldnt have changed from alpha 4 to 5 to 6, everything i tested were default installs
[02:40] <goatsocks> MS fonts render badly with freetype under Qt
[02:41] <goatsocks> (plus they're proprietary)
[02:41] <goatsocks> so let's say i've picked DejaVu Sans in System Settings as my global default app font
[02:42] <goatsocks> ktorrent's web interface serves up a page that forces MS fonts first, and only if MS fonts are absent will it try my KDE global default DejaVu Sans
[02:43] <goatsocks> i could tell my browser to always use my custom fonts, but that kind of ignores the problem
[02:44] <seele> ah, well i'm not too concerned if someone is going to change the defaults.  if they can configure that, then they can probably deal with slight abnormalities which are equaly easy to fix
[02:45] <seele> it only becomes a problem when a lot of people are doing the same thing and we can find a way of preventing it in a nice way
[02:45] <seele> but i think must kubuntu users who arent uber power users just use it out of box
[02:45] <apachelogger> Arby: were you logged in?
[02:45]  * apachelogger is pretty sure one can reopen bugs as normal users on bko
[02:46] <apachelogger> wel
[02:46] <apachelogger> l
[02:46] <goatsocks> yeah they're changeable, i still think they're bad (as in bad taste) defaults though... i'll probably file a bug with some patches ;)
[02:46] <apachelogger> Good morning everyone
[02:46] <goatsocks> hi apachelogger
[02:46] <seele> goatsocks: you mean using MS fonts in the style cheet?
[02:46] <goatsocks> seele: yeah
[02:47] <seele> yeah i agree, especially in an os that is so finicky about pure oss
[02:47] <seele> er, distribution even
[02:49] <goatsocks> personally i think setting specific fonts should be removed from the CSS spec, you should only be able to set generic font families like sans-serif, serif, and monospace
[02:49]  * goatsocks hates when "fancy" websites make assumptions about my fonts
[02:49] <seele> even then is a lot of control by the app.. they shouldnt be setting any font sizes or styles, it should be consistent with the environment
[02:49] <apachelogger> jtechidna: that is actually pretty sad
[02:50] <seele> a label should be the same size and style as all the other labels and not different for one app
[02:50] <apachelogger> jtechidna: I wonder if we should backport 4.1 to gutsy ;-)
[03:10] <apachelogger> kde rev 863738
[04:29] <apachelogger> Riddell: where to move bug 272991 to?
[06:41] <Arby_> Riddell: I mailed you a debdiff for the ktimetracker fix.
[06:42] <Arby_> let me know if there's anything wrong with it
[06:42] <Arby_> it's pretty small anyway.
[06:50] <apachelogger> jtechidna: shouldn't we get lancelot 103 in?
[07:57] <apachelogger> kde bug 170203
[08:05] <apachelogger> Nightrose, seaLne: bug 50686 - I get obnoxious from bugs where upstreams says it is fixed but our report isn't
[08:07] <apachelogger> yuriy: you might want to reopen kde bug 30572
[08:15] <apachelogger> kde rev 857262
[09:32] <Tonio_> hi there
[09:33] <Riddell> rebonjour
[09:34] <Riddell> apachelogger: xserver-xorg
[09:40] <apachelogger> Tonio_: hey, when are you pusing a new kdesudo to intrepid?
[09:42] <apachelogger> Riddell: btw, powerdevil is waiting in new ;-)
[10:06] <Tonio_> apachelogger: when I can fix that kprocess issue
[10:06] <Tonio_> apachelogger: it is polling for something I can't figure out...
[10:06] <apachelogger> Tonio_: I though you converted to qprocess?
[10:06] <Tonio_> apachelogger: same problem
[10:06] <Tonio_> apachelogger: I suspect a qt issue to be honnest
[10:07] <apachelogger> *nod*
[10:07] <Tonio_> apachelogger: completly random, dunno what happens
[10:07] <Tonio_> apachelogger: for example some apps do start with kdesudo, some don't....
[10:08] <Tonio_> apachelogger: looks like something is broken or incomplete in the qprocess environment where the process is running
[10:08] <Tonio_> apachelogger: I may not be able to fix that one myself....
[10:09] <apachelogger> hm
[10:10] <apachelogger> Tonio_: you might get some KDE guy to help ... but I think you should push the current kdesudo ASAP to do quality assurance on it
[10:11]  * apachelogger is going to commit 23 days of 5-a-day work
[10:11] <apachelogger> neversfelde: I hope you are happy
[10:11] <apachelogger> wasting my precious time with that stuff
[10:14] <Tonio_> apachelogger: will do today then ;)
[10:16] <apachelogger> oh kay
[10:18]  * jussi01 hugs apachelogger... why? just cause... :)
[10:19]  * apachelogger starts writing the 3rd ruby script today :D
[10:40] <neversfelde> apachelogger: ?
[10:40] <apachelogger> neversfelde: 5-a-day dood
[10:42] <neversfelde> apachelogger: thats mcas. My 5-a-day stuff is always broken :)
[10:43] <apachelogger> yus, but you complained when I said that I don't do 5adaying
[10:43] <neversfelde> anyway, I am happy^^
[10:57]  * apachelogger really should use dimap
[11:00] <apachelogger> hm
[11:00] <apachelogger> that amount of arguments is awesome
[11:28] <metellius> I extracted the ppa kdelibs package you built, how can I cleanly compile the package with CMAKE_BUILD_TYPE=debugfull?
[11:29] <metellius> I see some if's for DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS, but my packaging and bash skills are very low
[11:44] <apachelogger> metellius: it is built wiht debugfull IIRC
[12:16] <gnomefreak> if anyone has grub splash (picture in grub) can you please give me the first few lines of /boot/grub (just the part that defines the grub image)
[12:21] <jtechidna> apachelogger: it is in
[12:22] <jtechidna> apachelogger: the svn revision is because he hasn't been making tags for 1.0.x when he's been releasing them
[13:18] <smarter> heya!
[13:20] <smarter> sorry to have been a bit MIA these last days, I had some times this afternoon and decided to empty my TODO list ;)
[13:20] <smarter> Kepas FFe: bug #273553
[13:22] <smarter> Guidance Power Manager 4.1.1: https://code.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/guidance/powermanager-ubuntu
[13:23] <smarter> Fix for bug #269598: https://code.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/bespin/ubuntu
[13:24] <smarter> Riddell: ^ Could you please take a look and upload gpm and bespin? :)
[14:13] <smarter> Riddell: Hi, have you seen my message before netsplit? if not: http://pastebin.com/m344e892d I've uploaded a debdiff for gpm here: http://smarter.free.fr/pkg/guidance-power-manager_4.1.0-0ubuntu4_4.1.1-0ubuntu1.debdiff
[14:13] <smarter> and you can get the bespin one by running bzr diff -r20..21
[14:13]  * smarter takes a deep breath before pushing the send button of his MOTU Application :)
[14:14] <jtechidna> apachelogger: ^ lol
[14:14] <smarter> jtechidna: hey
[14:14] <smarter> how is it going?
[14:14] <jtechidna> hi
[14:15] <jtechidna> pretty good, school's back but I'm managing
[14:16] <smarter> same for me
[14:16] <smarter> well, I've some problem with the managing part :]
[14:18] <jtechidna> hehe
[14:30]  * smarter off to school
[14:33] <Riddell> well, upgrading from hardy KDE 3 worked
[14:33] <jjesse> yay
[14:35] <Hobbsee> always a good start.
[14:35] <Riddell> also knetworkmanager is just as broken in suse's beta as it is in intrepid
[14:36] <jjesse> agreed, tried it the other day and it doesn't work correctly in my vm at all
[14:36] <jjesse> for open suse
[14:52] <Riddell> rgreening: desktop-effects-kde uploaded
[14:53] <rgreening> kool.
[14:53] <rgreening> only for intrepid right? cause it would break under hardy without the install-package being available/installed.
[14:54] <Riddell> sure
[14:54] <rgreening> :P
[14:55] <rgreening> I feel like a McDonald's commercial "I'm Lovin' it".
[15:01] <apachelogger> oh
[15:01] <apachelogger> uh
[15:01] <apachelogger> jtechidna: I absolutely don't agree on closing kpdf bugs
[15:01] <jtechidna> eh?
[15:01] <apachelogger> IIRC recent versions of kpdf were using poppler
[15:02] <apachelogger> so assuming a lot of the issues are actually in the backend anyway closing doesn't make sense here
[15:02] <apachelogger> besides, okular relies on the same basis anyway I think
[15:02] <jtechidna> well, they were caused by patches to kpdf, apparently
[15:03] <jtechidna> or so sez upstream
[15:04] <apachelogger> jtechidna: upstream used to be grumpy because of the amount of bugs in it's product ;-)
[15:05] <jtechidna> hehe, I saw from the bug reports
[15:06] <apachelogger> it's your call anyway, I am just suggesting that an investigation probably makes sense because all the floss pdf readers relay on the same basis one way or another
[15:06] <jtechidna> I guess it wouldn't hurt to ask if it was still happening in Intrepid
[15:07] <jtechidna> Hmm, I think we should steal Opensuse's patches for panel autohiding and kwin cube
[15:07] <apachelogger> no
[15:07] <apachelogger> they both don't have QA
[15:08] <apachelogger> we really can't include fancy stuff we don't get the basics right *cough* kaffeine *cough*
[15:08] <jtechidna> hmm, your opinion of kaffine is "special" right?
[15:09] <apachelogger> yes, but that is unrelated to my opinion on how the codec installer problem was handled
[15:09] <jtechidna> oh yeah, we did have a codec installer. I bet that doesn't work with install-package
[15:09] <apachelogger> I fixed it
[15:09] <apachelogger> jtechidna: didn't you know?
[15:09] <apachelogger> that thing was looping
[15:10]  * jtechidna never really used kaffine
[15:10] <apachelogger> for every file it couldn't play with libxine1-ffmpeg
[15:10] <apachelogger> for > half a year
[15:10] <jtechidna> oh, I always install that package right off the bat
[15:10] <apachelogger> well, the installer will still kick in
[15:11] <jtechidna> heh
[15:11]  * apachelogger notes that it should just have been more like the amarok implimentation
[15:11] <apachelogger> anyway
[15:11] <apachelogger> jtechidna: I think you should raise the firefox dependency bug's importance to high
[15:11] <jtechidna> apachelogger: you mean the bug I just set to medium?
[15:11] <apachelogger> yus
[15:12] <apachelogger> it installs duplications without the users agreement
[15:12] <apachelogger> it pulls in software-props-gtk, we have -kde
[15:12] <apachelogger> it installs gksu, we have kdesudo
[15:12] <apachelogger> ...
[15:12] <apachelogger> jtechidna: we could also just ship 2 kinds of software by default :P
[15:12]  * apachelogger goes dinnering
[15:13] <jtechidna> :P
[15:13] <jtechidna> hmm, about time to exercise the dog
[16:00] <jtechidna> hrm
[16:00] <jtechidna> win: http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php/Oxygen+Reloaded?content=90031
[16:05] <apachelogger> mac: http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php/Oxygen+System+Monitor?content=86664
[16:06] <apachelogger> oh they haz made an own category for binary plasmoids
[16:06] <apachelogger> how very very sweet
[16:06] <jtechidna> that doesn't stop people from posting .skz as scripted plasmoids, \o/
[16:06] <apachelogger> oh
[16:06] <apachelogger> neato
[16:06] <apachelogger> http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php/Crystal+Monitor?content=28165
[16:06] <Riddell> smarter: kepas FFe is fine with me, got the files to upload?
[16:07]  * apachelogger logs in beats the uplaod and moves the file away
[16:07] <vorian> sigmadock
[16:07] <vorian> werd
[16:07] <jtechidna> oh hai
[16:08] <vorian> hullo
[16:09] <apachelogger> jtechidna: meh, now it is empty
[16:09]  * apachelogger moves one krama thingy back so that people can complain
[16:09] <apachelogger> hm
[16:09] <apachelogger> superkarma
[16:09] <apachelogger> omg
[16:09] <apachelogger> vorian: 4.1.1 cd?
[16:10] <vorian> yeah yeah
[16:10] <vorian> 704mb
[16:11] <apachelogger> vorian: is that still too big?
[16:11] <vorian> yes
[16:11] <apachelogger> meh
[16:11] <vorian> just by a pinch
[16:11] <apachelogger> vorian: did you remove the oxygen svgs?
[16:11] <vorian> i can remove wubi and get it smaller
[16:11] <vorian> yes
[16:11] <apachelogger> hmmmm
[16:11] <apachelogger> does amd64 use more space?
[16:11] <vorian> i am actually working on it now
[16:12] <vorian> it shouldn't
[16:12] <vorian> the original cd is only 686.9mb
[16:15] <apachelogger> vorian: drop some random kde4 package
[16:15] <apachelogger> :P
[16:15] <vorian> haha
[16:44] <smarter> Riddell: kepas is available on https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kepas/ubuntu and I attached a debdiff to the bug report
[16:45] <Riddell> smarter: but I still need the new .orig
[16:45] <Riddell> or an instruction on how to get it
[16:45] <smarter> Riddell: right, sorry, debian/rules get-orig-svn
[16:46] <apachelogger> oh
[16:46] <apachelogger> no
[16:46] <apachelogger> !
[16:46] <apachelogger> smarter: you need to post the tarball
[16:46] <smarter> heya apachelogger
[16:46] <apachelogger> get-orig-svn would fetch today's svn, wouldn't it? ;-)
[16:46] <smarter> okay
[16:46] <smarter> yep
[16:46] <smarter> but I modified the package today ;)
[16:47] <apachelogger> then it doesn't matter I guess
[16:47] <apachelogger> jtechidna: go tell the motu council about your nice colleague!
[16:49] <smarter> Riddell: I attached everything to the bug report
[16:52] <Riddell> apachelogger: shouldn't powerdevil package be called plasmoid-powerdevil?
[16:53] <apachelogger> Riddell: it doesn't have a plasmoid
[16:53] <apachelogger> powerdevil is a kded module
[16:53] <apachelogger> with kcm
[16:53] <apachelogger> the plasmoid is only available in trunk
[16:53] <Riddell> so what does it do currently?
[16:57] <apachelogger> Riddell: power saving. the kded modules gets loaded and will act like guidance-power-manager just on a more advanced level, based on user-definable profiles, all configurable via the systemsettings
[16:57] <Riddell> smarter: hmm, I just ran kepas, started a server and opened the monitor window, closing the monitor window killed plasma
[16:57] <apachelogger> Riddell: I suggest installing it and taking a look at the kcm
[16:58] <apachelogger> pretty self-explaining
[17:00] <smarter> Riddell: ouch, you're right, I only tested this feature using the tray icon
[17:00] <smarter> X Error: BadWindow (invalid Window parameter) 3
[17:01] <smarter> yeah for X errors
[17:01] <Riddell> I don't think that's the error
[17:01] <smarter> that's the only output I get which seems related
[17:01] <smarter> do you have something better?
[17:02] <Riddell> I don't get an apport trace
[17:02] <Riddell> try starting plasma in gdb maybe
[17:02]  * smarter install -dbg things
[17:04] <Riddell> smarter: hmm, "Program exited normally." so it's a crash that isn't a crash
[17:04] <Riddell> or something
[17:05] <Riddell> you need to run  set args --nofork  in gdb incidently
[17:05] <Nightrose> apachelogger: do you have time to join #a.dev? eean commited the mysqle stuff and it looks like it will stay for beta 2 (tagging in two days)
[17:05] <Nightrose> and the default mysqle is not compiled with the right flag
[17:06] <apachelogger> I am flattering smarter right now -.-
[17:06]  * apachelogger saves as draft and joins the a channel
[17:07] <smarter> :]
[17:13] <vorian> apachelogger: people are just going to have to live with a 704mb iso
[17:13] <apachelogger> vorian: can't you drop some package?
[17:13] <vorian> not really
[17:13] <apachelogger> vorian: kubuntu-docs is alredy removed?
[17:14] <apachelogger> khelpcenter should be removable as well
[17:14] <vorian> blarg
[17:14] <vorian> haha
[17:14] <vorian> whoa
[17:14] <vorian> i really messed it up this time
[17:14] <vorian> 99.8 mb
[17:15] <Riddell> vorian: what are you doing?
[17:15] <vorian> Riddell: updating the 8.04.1 remix cd for amd64
[17:17] <vorian> http://kubuntu.vorian.org/kubuntu-kde4.1.1-8.04.1-desktop-amd64.iso
[17:17] <vorian> that's the iso, but it's 704mb
[17:19] <yuriy> apachelogger: sure, now that I can
[17:19] <apachelogger> yuriy: normal users can't?
[17:22] <yuriy> apachelogger: nope. bugs.kde.org doesn't give you much privs by default
[17:22] <apachelogger> lame
[17:22]  * apachelogger wasn't a regular user for long, so he can't tell :P
[17:23] <yuriy> bluezahl gave me privileges a couple weeks back after "you have an svn account but no bugzilla privs!?"
[17:25] <apachelogger> hehe
[17:27]  * apachelogger thinks yuriy could also mail the motu council about smarter's astonishing qualification for motu...
[17:28]  * smarter would like some b.k.o powa to add Kvkbd
[17:29] <Riddell> smarter: is kvkbd in KDE's svn?
[17:29] <smarter> yes
[17:30] <smarter> still in playground/utils
[17:30] <apachelogger> should go extragear IMHO
[17:31] <apachelogger> then again extragear might be obsolete with git anyway :P
[17:32] <smarter> apachelogger: it needs to go throught kdereview first, it would take some times
[17:32] <smarter> and I'm going to transform it into a plasmoid after 0.6 release
[17:33] <apachelogger> ah, cool
[17:33] <apachelogger> plasmoids ftw
[17:33]  * apachelogger proof reads
[17:33] <Riddell> smarter: added
[17:33] <smarter> thanks ;)
[17:34] <apachelogger> smarter: mail sent
[17:35] <smarter> thanks too :)
[17:37] <vorian> smarter: good luck :
[17:37] <vorian> )
[17:39] <Riddell> 4.1.2 tagging tomorrow, who's up for some packaging?
[17:41] <vorian> w00t
[17:41] <nixternal> I just noticed the printer stuff in System Settings is missing (Hardy)...what is the trick?
[17:42] <nixternal> I haven't used a printer in so long I am lost :)
[17:44] <Riddell> printer stuff?
[17:44] <Riddell> in KDE 3 it should be there
[17:44] <Riddell> in KDE 4 printer-applet should pop up when you add a printer
[17:44] <nixternal> KDE4
[17:44] <nixternal> it is a network printer
[17:44] <Riddell> system-config-printer-kde has some global cups settings, otherwise use gnome's system-config-printer
[17:44] <bdgraue> i use always localhost:631
[17:44] <nixternal> gotcha
[17:46] <apachelogger> Riddell: tomorrow already
[17:47] <apachelogger> oh my
[17:48] <Riddell> hmm, we seem to still have a Zoom In button in plasma, do we want that?
[17:49] <Riddell> did we decide about changing KDE branding in kickoff top right to kubuntu?
[17:49] <apachelogger> didn't decide
[17:50] <apachelogger> we just need a graphic I guess
[17:50] <apachelogger> and we should re-remove the zoom buttons
[17:54] <jtechidna> omg
[17:54] <jtechidna> didn't we just package 4.1.1?
[17:55] <apachelogger> *nod*
[17:55] <apachelogger> stupid monthly release cycle :P
[17:55] <apachelogger> jtechidna: write something nice about smarter
[17:55] <jtechidna> oh, ya, almost forgot
[17:56] <jtechidna> hmm, what list?
[17:56] <apachelogger> motu-council
[17:56]  * apachelogger needs to backport powerdevil to the kde4 ppa
[17:58] <jtechidna> hmm, what's the address?
[17:58] <nixternal> anyone here feel like writing some SNMP MIBs for me?
[17:58] <smarter> jtechidna:
[17:59] <smarter><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[17:59] <smarter><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[17:59] <smarter> oops, connection problem
[17:59] <jtechidna> hehe
[18:00] <Tm_T> ERP!
[18:01] <Tm_T> this translation issue is known? https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-translators/2008-September/001676.html
[18:01] <apachelogger> Riddell: ^
[18:01] <smarter> yep, and I hate that
[18:01] <smarter> half-translated apps are no fun
[18:02]  * apachelogger hates rosetta
[18:16] <apachelogger> powerdevil on the way to the kde4 ppa
[18:28] <rgreening> apachelogger: how does the Qt ver of Firefox look/behave?
[18:29] <apachelogger> like the broken stuff it is
[18:51] <jussi01> apachelogger: for hardy also?
[18:51] <apachelogger> jussi01: what?
[18:52] <jussi01> (re. powerdevil)
[19:06] <Arby> can anyone tell me if bug 194416 is actually a bug or if it's supposed to be like that?
[19:06] <Arby> sounds like a wishlist but not sure
[19:25] <apachelogger> jussi01: only that
[19:25] <apachelogger> jussi01: intrepid is already in official repos
[19:26] <apachelogger> Arby: I don't think it's much of our problem if users press random key combinations because they are bored ;-)
[19:26] <apachelogger> Arby: either close as won't fix and send the reporter to bugs.kde.org or wishlist and forward the report to bugs.kde.org
[19:27] <apachelogger> if upstream won't fixes it, we have all the more reason to do the same ;-)
[19:28] <Arby> I'll wishlist and send them to upstream then, I haven't got a won't fix option
[19:28] <Arby> only invalid
[19:28] <apachelogger> jtechidna: bug 273667
[19:28]  * apachelogger doesn't like screensavers
[19:28]  * apachelogger doesn't like the available screensavers
[19:29]  * apachelogger doesn't like bad screensavers by default, which leads him to a won't fix attitude
[19:29] <Arby> bah, can somebody set wish list for me, I can't
[19:29] <Arby> really must get that fixed
[19:29] <jtechidna> let's make a Klippy screensaver
[19:29] <apachelogger> Arby: done
[19:29] <jtechidna> pink neon lights
[19:29] <Arby> thanks
[19:30] <apachelogger> jtechidna: I like the vista one
[19:30]  * jtechidna hasn't seen it
[19:30] <apachelogger> basically like the xp one :P
[19:30] <apachelogger> which is like the 2k one
[19:30]  * jtechidna forgot what the default screensaver for those was too
[19:30] <apachelogger> well
[19:31] <apachelogger> the windows logo
[19:31] <apachelogger> floating aroudnt eh screen
[19:31] <jtechidna> we should use a marble kpart
[19:31] <jtechidna> \o/
[19:31] <apachelogger> only that in vista it fades in and out and fades in at a differen location ....
[19:31] <apachelogger> it provides good branding
[19:31] <apachelogger> and the fading looks pretty decent
[19:40] <Arby> apachelogger: is kdepim-dbg the right package for kpilot crash debugging symbols?
[19:47] <Lex79> apachelogger: http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php/KDE+Partition+Manager?content=89595
[19:47] <Lex79> :) nice
[19:57] <Riddell> apachelogger: goodness.  do you know if there's a bug for that translation issue?
[20:04] <apachelogger> Riddell: no.
[20:04] <apachelogger> jtechidna: do you know of a bug about https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-translators/2008-September/001676.html
[20:05] <Riddell> I don't know what it would be reported on anyway, I think a grump e-mail to the rosetta developers would be best
[20:05] <jtechidna> there have been several reports about sparse translation
[20:06] <jtechidna> I didn't know it was so serious a problem though...
[20:06] <jtechidna> bug 271849
[20:07]  * apachelogger is having a nervous breakdown soon
[20:07] <jtechidna> bug 269179
[20:07] <apachelogger> it's difficult enough to deploy a reasonable quality :/
[20:08] <apachelogger> Lex79: I like ... a lot
[20:09] <apachelogger> Arby: yes, kdepim-kde4-dbg in hardy I guess
[20:09] <Arby> thanks
[20:09] <jtechidna> so what's the issue, don't the l10n files contain all the upstream translations?
[20:10] <Lex79> apachelogger: It would be nice in systemsettings.... as kgrubeditor
[20:10] <apachelogger> Lex79: you should get in touch with the developer and suggest a cooperation with us, ask him if he'd like to attend a meeting
[20:12] <Lex79> yep
[20:12] <apachelogger> jtechidna: from what I understand: when the package gets built on the buildd it also creates a .pot file which gets imported into rosetta, then ubuntu pulls the actually language packs from rosetta
[20:13] <jtechidna> that's stupid, Ubuntu should just coperate with upstream if it wants better translations
[20:15] <Riddell> it's not as simple as that, upstream is dozens or hundreds of projects including some with very poor transltion infrastructure and some with only very geeky translation infrastructure (like KDE using SVN)
[20:16] <Riddell> we also change and add our own strings and applications
[20:16] <Riddell> as all distros do
[20:17]  * jtechidna doesn't know much about translations...
[20:18]  * Arby finishes reading the e-mail
[20:18] <Arby> that's ... not good
[20:21] <apachelogger> Riddell: I think KDE could be interested in rosetta, once it's FLOSS and got more reasonable QA
[20:44] <Lex79> bug 269179
[20:44] <Lex79> same issue for italian language
[20:45] <smarter> same issue for *every* language
[20:45] <smarter> except english ;)
[20:45] <Lex79> uhm
[20:45] <Lex79> :) LoL
[20:46]  * Lex79 is away: Per ora assente
[20:46] <apachelogger> Lex79: turn off global away messages
[20:47] <apachelogger> Lex79: do you package partitionman?
[20:54] <apachelogger> dpkg-deb: building package `partitionmanager' in `../partitionmanager_1.0.0~alpha1-0ubuntu1_i386.deb'.
[20:55] <apachelogger> too late I guess :P
[21:11] <apachelogger> Lex79: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members-kde4/partitionman/ubuntu
[21:11] <smarter> -kde4?
[21:11] <apachelogger> vorian: please poke once the new CD is up
[21:12] <apachelogger> smarter: oh, that is indeed truely wrong :P
[21:12] <smarter> :)
[21:12] <apachelogger> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/partitionman/ubuntu
[21:12]  * apachelogger had problems with reading today
[21:12] <apachelogger> I probably need a break
[21:31] <Arby> what's the best course of action for bug 246244 ?
[21:32] <Arby> basically seems to be that kmail and knetwork manager don't play nice together
[21:36] <apachelogger> Arby: I think solid should take care of this really
[21:37] <Arby> so the longer term solution is that knetworkmanager goes away and solid handles all the kmail --> network status interaction?
[21:38] <Arby> so what do I do with that bug, close, ignore, reassign to a different package.
[21:38] <Arby> ?
[21:40] <Arby> 233910 is another good one
[21:40] <Arby> kind of hard to reproduce
[21:41] <Arby> kmail seems to be odd like that, some people have a nightmare with it, it's always been rock solid for me
[21:43] <Arby> while I'm at it, apachelogger, should bug 228214 just go straight upstream?
[21:44] <apachelogger> Arby: knetworkmanager can stick around
[21:44] <apachelogger> solid is talking to networkmanager
[21:44] <apachelogger> knetworkmanager as well
[21:44] <apachelogger> kmail talks to solid
[21:44] <apachelogger> so in a way kmail talks to networkmanager and knetworkmanager ;-)
[21:45] <Arby> ok, once I get below desktop level my knowledge is very weak
[21:45]  * rgreening say "latest knetworkmanager needs too much work to be useful for Intrepid and wireless"
[21:45] <Arby> frameworks and interprocess gubbins make my brain bleed
[21:49]  * Lex79 is back.
[21:49] <apachelogger> Lex79: turn off global back messages as well
[21:50] <Lex79> ok :)
[21:50] <Lex79> sorry
[21:50] <apachelogger> Lex79: https://edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-experimental/+archive I guess we need to determine which external tools are required
[21:50] <apachelogger> ...if you want to do that.... ;-)
[21:50] <Lex79> yes yes
[21:50] <jtechidna> apachelogger: why are we wanting to remove the zoom out button again?
[21:50] <Lex79> :)
[21:50] <apachelogger> jtechidna: definitely
[21:50] <jtechidna> why?
[21:51] <apachelogger> crashy
[21:51] <apachelogger> no real functionality
[21:51] <apachelogger> no predefined other stuff
[21:51] <apachelogger> not even wallpaper
[21:51]  * jtechidna wants containment/virtual desktop affinity
[21:52] <apachelogger> couple of issues (in some cases the containments are on top of each other)
[21:52] <jtechidna> in 4.1.1?
[21:52] <apachelogger> yes
[21:52] <apachelogger> the cashew is still scaling with the containment
[21:53] <apachelogger> upon crashes plasmas sometimes adds new containments which also are on top of each other
[21:53] <apachelogger> ....
[21:53] <jtechidna> hmm, I'm not getting all of that
[21:53] <apachelogger> well
[21:53] <apachelogger> one is already too much
[21:53] <apachelogger> jtechidna: checkout the new batcave header
[21:53] <apachelogger> uber sweet I say
[21:53] <goatsocks> don't disable the feature outright... just relabel the "zoom out" button to "don't click this"
[21:53] <jtechidna> yeah, I saw it
[21:53] <jtechidna> lol
[21:54] <goatsocks> that way when people click it and file bugs you can automatically close them
[21:54] <jtechidna> well, removing it would stop bug reports in the first place
[21:54] <apachelogger> big time saver
[21:54] <apachelogger> then again
[21:55] <apachelogger> reporting a bug about it would require the possibility to zoom back in
[21:55] <apachelogger> I imagine some people might have problems with that
[21:55] <goatsocks> is removing upstream features a nice thing to do though? i mean, how much "KDE" is a Kubuntu user getting when they decide they want KDE as a desktop? certainly removing features is not what upstream intended
[21:55] <apachelogger> goatsocks: it's not a feature
[21:55] <goatsocks> upstream ships it
[21:56] <apachelogger> it's a big annoyance aseigo just doesn't want to remove despite the fac that it is useless, confusing and dangerous
[21:56] <goatsocks> just as they shipped 4.0 with a ton of half-finished features
[21:56] <goatsocks> i agree they made a bad decision
[21:56] <Arby> apachelogger: did you move the batcave? my bookmarks seem to be broken
[21:56] <jtechidna> It'll be useful in 4.2 if containment -> virutal desktop mapping gets in
[21:56] <goatsocks> i'm just wondering about the purity of Kubuntu's KDE distribution... where do you draw the line with modifications?
[21:56] <jtechidna> Arby: yes, the location was revealed in an emergency upload session so we had to change it
[21:57] <Arby> ah I see
[21:57] <apachelogger> maybe we should get a batlist?
[21:57] <jtechidna> yet another mailing list?
[21:57] <goatsocks> surely you'll reach a point where you've made so many modifications to the expected behavior of upstream that users will be filing bugs on that too
[21:58] <apachelogger> jtechidna: well, it certainly improves in-between-release communication
[21:58] <apachelogger> goatsocks: doubtable, still then we can close it as wont fix :P
[21:58] <apachelogger> that is basically what suse does
[21:59] <goatsocks> heh well suse is a known KDE-perverter
[21:59] <jtechidna> heh, the power of wont fix
[21:59] <apachelogger> suse is a patch perverter
[21:59] <goatsocks> when you install suse, you know you're getting something upstream never intended ;)
[21:59] <jtechidna> they killed their initial 4.1.1 packages with a feature backport from trunk
[21:59] <jtechidna> well, they killed compositing
[21:59] <apachelogger> hm
[21:59] <apachelogger> goatsocks: same with kubuntu
[22:00] <apachelogger> I doubt KDE ever intended the desktop to work :P
[22:00] <jtechidna> but everybody knows compositing is next to clocks in importance
[22:00] <apachelogger> clocks \o/
[22:00] <Riddell> jtechidna: killed compositing?
[22:00] <goatsocks> but i'm wondering about this, because i have a bunch of patches here to remove CSS prioritizing of MS fonts from KDE packages, and i wonder if that goes too far in subverting upstream
[22:01] <jtechidna> Riddell: with their first packages they backported the untested self-composite-check feature from trunk
[22:01] <apachelogger> goatsocks: that goes too far in subverting the websites really
[22:01] <jtechidna> Riddell: the test always failed, preventing compositing from working
[22:01] <Riddell> jtechidna: to be fair, suse also implemented compositing in KDE
[22:01] <apachelogger> jtechidna: well, we uploaded a wrong kdelibs :P
[22:01] <Riddell> so it's theirs to break you could say :)
[22:01] <goatsocks> apachelogger: these stylesheets are for apps actually, some of them are served via web interfaces
[22:02] <jtechidna> ya, but we're talking about patch perversion
[22:02] <apachelogger> goatsocks: oh well, they are patches :P
[22:02] <jtechidna> btw, how did you get a 4.1.0 tarball with a 4.1.1 name anywayz? :P
[22:02] <apachelogger> goatsocks: send them upstream
[22:02] <goatsocks> goatsocks: not just CSS though, also for rc files
[22:02] <goatsocks> and why am i talking to myself
[22:02]  * jtechidna does that from time to time^
[22:02] <rgreening> It's really4.1.1 not just 4.1.1
[22:03]  * rgreening lends goatsocks an ear
[22:03] <apachelogger> jtechidna: kde got bz2 tarballs :P
[22:03] <jtechidna> ah, that'd do it
[22:03] <jtechidna> is there a batgz script yet?
[22:04] <apachelogger> me@apoc { ~/src/bzr/batscripts }$ ls | grep orig
[22:04] <apachelogger> batgetorig
[22:04]  * apachelogger should commit it before it gets lost
[22:05] <jtechidna> ooh, pizza
[22:05] <Arby> apachelogger: we definitely need batlist, so I can ask questions about what all the batscripts actually do :)
[22:05] <apachelogger> lol
[22:06] <apachelogger> Arby: feel free to find out and write a README :P
[22:06] <Arby> ok
[22:07]  * Arby plays the 'running random code' game
[22:23] <jtechidna> d00d
[22:23] <jtechidna> nixternal is the only non-european motu-council member
[22:48] <rgreening> Riddell: kdelibs5 patch (launchpad integration) completed... will fwd the debdiff shortly
[22:57] <rgreening> Riddell: debdiff sent for your build/upload pleasure


[13:32] <bac> henninge: you reviewing today, nominal as it is?
[13:33] <henninge> bac: oops, forgot ;)
[13:33] <bac> henninge: i suspect its a quiet day
[13:33] <bac> interrupted by panic
[13:33] <henninge> ;-)
[14:13] <matsubara> bac, hi, available for a review?
[14:13] <bac> matsubara: yes, of course
[14:13] <matsubara> bac, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~matsubara/launchpad/bug-553361-no-referrer/+merge/24506
[14:19] <bac> matsubara: r=bac, with one tiny fix
[14:22] <matsubara> thanks bac
[14:42] <leonardr> bac, henninge: i have a wadllib branch (based on james_w code) that didn't get reviewed yesterday. can you take it? https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~leonardr/wadllib/fix-bind-to-anon-collection/+merge/24613
[14:43] <henninge> bac: can you take that please? I am in the middle of something else.
[14:43]  * henninge guesses that bac is in the middle of something, too ... ;)
[14:43] <leonardr> there's no huge rush, but i would like to get it reviewed today
[14:45] <henninge> leonardr: I will give it a try later ;)
[14:53] <noodles775> abentley: hi! I've sent two incrementals to the branch you reviewed for me yesterday... but understand if you don't have time atm :)
[14:53] <abentley> noodles775, I'm having a look at one of them right now.
[14:54] <bac> henninge, leonardr: sorry i was on our stand up call.  leonardr i can review your branch now.
[14:54] <leonardr> bac, thanks
[14:54] <noodles775> abentley: great, thanks! Just note: I realised with the second one that I don't need the Mixin that I created on the first.
[14:54] <abentley> noodles775, ah, okay.
[16:51] <noodles775> Hi bac, I've got one here if you've time, but I won't be around to do the review interactively: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~michael.nelson/launchpad/567922-binarypackagebuild-new-table-2/+merge/24688
[16:51] <bac> noodles775: ok
[16:52] <noodles775> thanks bac  (or henninge) :)
[16:55] <bac> leonardr-afk: done


[01:11] <MutantTurkey> any ppa expereicne here?
[01:11] <MutantTurkey> i am contesting a ticket, they claim i wasn't parked properly on a 2 way... the reg says i must be parallel
[01:11] <MutantTurkey> but in fact i was parked on a grassy knoll of private property not on the street.
[01:11] <MutantTurkey> is it okay to admit to parking on private property of someone elsese property to try and fight this?
[01:12] <MutantTurkey> i need an armchair lawyer here
[01:42] <pleia2> I hate gallery2
[01:58] <Justin683> hey all got a pretty n00b question for ya'll
[01:59] <Justin683> im currently running a live vers of black lab linux off a pendrive, but I want to make a linux a default os to replace windows. Any recommendations?
[02:00] <MutantTurkey> yeah, i recommend Debian strongly
[02:00] <MutantTurkey> clear instructions, lots of packages, rather vanilla in terms of packaging, very stable, very solid, pretty easy to use, long support life
[02:00] <MutantTurkey> widely used
[02:00] <MutantTurkey> plus will get your hands sufficiently dirty to get some linux experience
[02:01] <pleia2> Ubuntu is nice :)
[02:02] <MutantTurkey> also pleia2 wrote the ubuntu handbook so that makes her liable to help you if you purchase it right? :p
[02:03] <Justin683> which distro of debian
[02:03] <MutantTurkey> debian is the distro... do you mean which release version?
[02:03] <MutantTurkey> I recommend Jessie (testing) because it's relatively up to date but still stable, I run stable on well servers and such so that I don't run into problems at all.
[02:03] <Justin683> yes sorry
[02:04] <MutantTurkey> yep
[02:04] <MutantTurkey> Ubuntu I don't have much of an opinion on anymore. 7.04 was great!
[02:05] <Justin683> ubuntu is just very widely used thats all... I ran linux mint for a little bit but I dont really like the interface
[02:05] <Justin683> unity is a crap shot of a UI
[02:05] <MutantTurkey> that's ubuntu then
[02:05] <pleia2> I use Xubuntu myself
[02:05] <MutantTurkey> you don't have to use Unity, but ubuntu is increasing designed arount it.
[02:05] <MutantTurkey> pleia2: is that still official?
[02:06] <MutantTurkey> I thought i read something like k/x ubuntu weren't getting the same support
[02:06] <pleia2> MutantTurkey: official? it's still a recognised flavor, yes
[02:06] <MutantTurkey> something about support from cannonical maybe. sorry vague memory about it
[02:06] <pleia2> same with kubuntu, lubuntu, gnome...
[02:06] <MutantTurkey> cool - gnombuntu? :p
[02:06] <pleia2> canonical only supports ubuntu stuff in the main repository, they don't even guarentee support for universe
[02:06] <pleia2> it's ubuntu gnome
[02:06] <MutantTurkey> got it
[02:07] <Justin683> alrighty well i guess ill give debian a try
[02:07] <MutantTurkey> and universe is basically debians packages synced every so often?
[02:07] <pleia2> all the flavors are community maintained, it's always been that way
[02:07] <Justin683> try a live usb of it
[02:07] <MutantTurkey> Justin683: ubuntu might be easier to use
[02:07] <pleia2> no, universe is packages canonical doesn't commit to supporting ;
[02:07] <pleia2> ;)
[02:07] <Justin683> ubuntu is super easy to use
[02:07] <MutantTurkey> debian's live usb probably will not going to be anything but a command line afaik
[02:07] <MutantTurkey> they might have an Xubuntu interface
[02:07] <pleia2> so flavor packages, packages people upload directly to ubuntu, a bunch of stuff from debian (some debian stuff is in main too)
[02:07] <Justin683> i just dont like UNITY
[02:07] <MutantTurkey> Justin683: they don't commit to one specific UI, you can use any. KDE , GNOME3 , XFCE 4.8,
[02:08] <pleia2> Justin683: you have lots of other options :) KDE, lxde, xfce
[02:08] <Justin683> interesting
[02:08] <pleia2> I use Xubuntu that uses Xfce, not Unity
[02:08] <MutantTurkey> the thing is, ubuntu does the same thing as well.
[02:08] <MutantTurkey> mostly all large linux distros support a wide variety of packages
[02:08] <MutantTurkey> welp
[02:08] <pleia2> too much for him
[02:08] <pleia2> hehe
[02:08]  * pleia2 has laundry to fold
[02:08] <MutantTurkey> "I'm outta here"
[02:08] <pleia2> I totally broke gallery.ubuntupennsylvania.org today when I upgraded the serve to 14.04
[02:09] <pleia2> sorry, I'll fix it eventually
[02:09] <pleia2> if it wasn't such a... :s
[02:09] <pleia2> it always breaks
[02:09] <pleia2> anyway, laundry
[02:09] <MutantTurkey> wait hold up
[02:09] <MutantTurkey> have you tried a static image generator? it might be easier and is definitely more reliable
[02:09] <MutantTurkey> you loose searching though
[02:10] <pleia2> no, and that's a much bigger question for the whole team since even gallery itself hasn't had new content for several years
[02:10] <MutantTurkey> I used sigal for my band photos, it was easy, i just dropped images in a folder and ran the python script in the top level.
[02:10] <MutantTurkey> http://mutantturkey.com/ls/gallery/index.html
[02:10] <pleia2> if the team is ok breaking all legacy links and switching to something new, sure
[02:10] <pleia2> but I've kept this going because it's heavily linked to
[02:10] <MutantTurkey> true, anyway if it's easier to use, i find myself using it more often...
[02:10] <pleia2> laundry :)
[02:11] <MutantTurkey> right - have at it
[02:11] <MutantTurkey> my PPA question is still up in the air guys
[02:16] <waltman> MutantTurkey: My only brush with the PPA was getting a ticket when I parked at a meter that had a message "out of order, follow posted signs". It said 2 hour parking, but half an hour later I had a ticket.
[02:17] <waltman> I protested it. It was a pain going down there and waiting to talk to someone, but it was worth it because they agreed with me that I shouldn't have gotten the ticket.
[02:17] <MutantTurkey> wow nice
[02:18] <MutantTurkey> what do you think about the logic of mine?
[02:18] <waltman> Keep in mind I was pretty sure I was in the right. I don't know about your situation.
[02:18] <MutantTurkey> while I might not have been parked parallel at all or correctly, i was in fact not parked on the physical street
[02:18] <MutantTurkey> https://www.google.com/maps/place/240+Osborn+St,+Philadelphia,+PA+19128/@40.0200216,-75.2050581,3a,75y,255.98h,90t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sDVQWszRzaAq-byYhIPW8Dg!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x89c6b88bd8f8feef:0x9a22bb3662750ff9!6m1!1e1
[02:19] <waltman> Did you have permission to park on this private property?
[02:19] <MutantTurkey> see how people park on the grass (private property)
[02:19] <MutantTurkey> no, but I didn't get a ticket for that, and they would need to prove that I didn't have permission
[02:19] <waltman> Wait, who owns the grass?
[02:19] <MutantTurkey> tickets must be for the correct charge to be valid. and I don't think you can post-crime charge the person
[02:20] <MutantTurkey> the people up on those porches
[02:20] <MutantTurkey> when they redid those condos they just made it accessible only by the next block
[02:20] <waltman> Were you parallel parked like the cars in that photo?
[02:20] <MutantTurkey> (did you see the google map?)
[02:20] <waltman> yes
[02:21] <MutantTurkey> mostly, except my car was more angled toward the brick wall, i wasn't parallel
[02:21] <waltman> Why not?
[02:21] <MutantTurkey> there wasn't much room to navigate
[02:21] <MutantTurkey> it was mostly parallel
[02:21] <MutantTurkey> say, off by 30 degrees or so
[02:21] <MutantTurkey> i wasn't parked like, facing the street or anything crazy
[02:21] <waltman> And how do you know those aren't considered normal parking spots on the street?
[02:21] <MutantTurkey> i live there...
[02:21] <waltman> 30 degrees is a lot
[02:21] <MutantTurkey> they are considered normal parking
[02:22] <MutantTurkey> but regardless, i won't contest the parallel issue
[02:22] <MutantTurkey> only that i wasn't on the street, so that rule doesn't apply
[02:22] <MutantTurkey> i was in fact on private property
[02:23] <waltman> I guess you can try. I don't have any idea what the law is in that case.
[02:23] <MutantTurkey> you have a PhD, let me link you to the specifics ...
[02:23] <MutantTurkey> http://www.phila.gov/philacode/html/_DATA/TITLE12/CHAPTER_12_900_PARKING_REGULAT/12_914_Additional_Parking_Regu.html
[02:23] <MutantTurkey> and
[02:23] <MutantTurkey> http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/LI/consCheck.cfm?txtType=HTM&ttl=75&div=0&chpt=33&sctn=53&subsctn=0
[02:23] <MutantTurkey> section (b)
[02:24] <waltman> I also have a weekend's full of unread emails I'm going through, so I'll let you read up on it yourself.
[02:24] <MutantTurkey> I did.
[02:24] <waltman> Also my PhD is in computer science, not traffic law.
[02:24] <MutantTurkey> grr i am struggling to mis-quote your dissertation title to prove you wrong
[02:24] <MutantTurkey> but i can't remember it
[02:25] <waltman> My dissertation included a driving experiment, but not a PARKING experiment.
[02:25] <MutantTurkey> :-P
[02:31] <pleia2> folding laundry cleared my head, gallery is fixed (rewrite woes)
[04:42] <ChinnoDog> MutantTurkey: It seems to me that unless the owner of the private property is pressing charges that not having your car parked in a place that they can ticket you is a legit way to get out of it.
[06:11] <MutantTurkey> there is also implied consent
[06:11] <MutantTurkey> because everyone has done it, for as long as i have known
[06:12] <MutantTurkey> no charges pressed before, one could argue the lack of their action is actuall implied consent
[06:12] <MutantTurkey> not as strong as written consent but still very valid
[06:12] <MutantTurkey> and since this is a PPD issued ticket, they probably will not be there for my hearing
[06:12] <MutantTurkey> it's a PPD ticket, but it all goes through the PPA
[10:30] <rmg51> Morning
[13:07] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, dogs, turkeys,hamsters and everything else
[19:54] <waltman> http://amultiverse.com/comic/2014/11/24/dungeon-divers-talk-turkey/