[02:04] <ScottL> rexbron_, did you see my email about ubuntustudio-nightly?
[04:36] <acmeinc> @holstein, this is Tim from the list.  You suggested I am around to freenode, here I am.
[06:47] <stochastic> hey everyone
[11:02] <ScottL> hi stochastic !
[11:02]  * ScottL is going to work now on saturday (and probably will be on sunday)
[11:17] <knome> awwh :)
[12:44] <scott-work> TheMuso: i have made a blueprint for getting the -lowlatency kernel in the repos for precise-12.04
[12:45] <scott-work> is there any point to suggesting it for the sprint at uds-p if it depends on a decision at uds-p on the kernel version?
[12:46] <scott-work> good morning (or afternoon) falktx  :)
[12:46] <falktx> hey there
[12:46] <scott-work> falktx: would you like to do some more work on the lightdm theme?
[12:46] <scott-work> i'm not sure what xubuntu will be doing, but the ubuntu lightdm theme looks really nice and i want to steal it and make it better ;)
[12:46] <falktx> scott-work: depends on the 'when'
[12:47] <falktx> the folling 2 weeks are going to be crazy for me
[12:47] <scott-work> falktx: would several weeks by acceptable?
[12:47] <falktx> scott-work: yes, totally
[12:47] <falktx> I'm finally about to release Cadence
[12:47] <scott-work> falktx: i don't think the tool chain is even supposed to be pushed until after uds
[12:47] <scott-work> falktx: wow!  congratulations!
[12:47] <falktx> scott-work: when is it UDS btw?
[12:48] <scott-work> first week of november
[12:48]  * scott-work is checking calander for tool chain
[12:49] <scott-work> woah, i was really off on the tool chain, apparently it was scheduled for oct 20th
[12:50] <scott-work> falktx: but several weeks from now is more than fine, i think we really need to make sure this is behind us by alpha1 which is dec 1st
[12:50] <falktx> yes, sure thing
[12:52] <scott-work> oustanding!
[12:56] <falktx> all apps seem to be working now, perfect for an alpha release
[12:56] <falktx> I do of course expect bugs
[13:19] <scott-work> cool, that is very exciting falktx
[13:19] <scott-work> i really admire the way you create these apps :)
[13:26] <scott-work> hey falktx, i just thought of something
[13:26] <scott-work> let me explain the backstory for a few lines then i'll ask the question
[13:27] <falktx> k
[13:27] <scott-work> ubuntu studio is planning on moving towards a live dvd this cycle, but also include a process to allow users to select and install components during installing from a gui
[13:27] <scott-work> edubuntu does this...hold on a sec
[13:28] <scott-work> you can see this in the right image on the first line, here:  http://edubuntu.org/documentation/11.04/installation-guide#Edubuntu_Options_and_Partitioning_
[13:29] <scott-work> this would be similar to tasksel that we currently use
[13:29] <scott-work> however, it has been my thought for a while since starting the work flows that it would be nice to be able to manage these things similarly but after installation
[13:30] <scott-work> and my thought would be to use ubuntustudio-controls to allow users to simply add or remove work flows (i.e. their associated applications)
[13:31] <scott-work> use case example:  i've already installed ubuntu studio and i didn't choose the 'podcast' component (or task) but now i want to do so
[13:32] <scott-work> i pick ubuntustudio-controsl (or whatever the app name ends up) and look at the 'work flows' tab and pick the radio button for 'podcast' and pick the 'install' button...viola, it grabs all the associated apps and installs them if not already on the computer
[13:33] <scott-work> similarly, i can remove a 'work flow' by unselected and hitting...hmmmm, i guess an 'install' button wasn't a good choice before, perhaps an 'apply' button...hitting the 'apply' button
[13:33] <scott-work> falktx: does this make sense, do you think this may be something you could assist with next year?
[13:34] <falktx> scott-work: yes, it makes perfect sense
[13:34] <falktx> scott-work: does it matter if this is made in us-controls or I just add it to my Cadence app?
[13:34] <scott-work> falktx: oh good, i've been thinking about these things for so long that i don't always express or explain it well :P
[13:35] <scott-work> falktx: re: cadence, is cadence going to be in the repos so we can ship it?
[13:35] <falktx> since it's pretty much near first release, I think it has more than time to hit debian
[13:36] <scott-work> falktx, then i think that seems like a viable vector then :)
[13:37] <falktx> yep
[13:41] <scott-work> falktx: i should point that currently we haven't even looked at the edubuntu stuff or considered how our seeds might change
[13:42] <falktx> scott-work: btw, I have made the US 11.10 live ISO
[13:42] <falktx> still uploading though, and it looks like it's gonna take a while
[13:42] <scott-work> i'm not sure this part will happen before a month or two (i need to talk to shnatsel about this, but we may get the live dvd part first, then move to user install selection)
[13:43] <scott-work> falktx: eh, did you fix the lightdm and icons for that?  i don't think your changes made it past the bzr branch from what i've seen
[13:43] <scott-work> but i'm still curious to play with it and see how the performance compares
[13:43] <falktx> I forced the lightdm theme install
[13:43] <falktx> but settings are still not set by default
[20:51] <falktx> it is done
[20:51] <falktx> http://sourceforge.net/projects/kxstudio/files/Live/UbuntuStudio-KR_11.10_32bit.iso/download
[20:51] <knome> hmm?
[20:52] <falktx> UbuntuStudio 11.10 Live DVD - KXStudio Remix
[20:52] <knome> what is kxstudio?
[20:52] <falktx> knome: http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/
[20:52] <knome> aha
[20:53] <rlameiro> hey
[20:53] <falktx> rlameiro: hey
[20:53] <falktx> rlameiro: did you got my message?
[20:54] <rlameiro> falktx, axeling it
[20:54] <rlameiro> falktx, yeap
[20:54] <rlameiro> but dude, Lac is on the USA
[20:54] <rlameiro> Ii dont have money to go to USA
[20:54] <falktx> me too
[20:54] <falktx> sadly
[20:54] <falktx> rlameiro: do you think they will sponser the presentators?
[20:55] <rlameiro> dunno
[20:55] <rlameiro> maybe
[20:55] <rlameiro> you could do one
[20:55] <rlameiro> I dont have nothing to present :D
[20:56] <rlameiro> falktx, do you know of any problem of jack and Firewire on natty?
[20:56] <falktx> I don't use firewire
[20:56] <rlameiro> I know
[20:56] <falktx> rlameiro: I actually have something very important to present
[20:56] <rlameiro> I cant connect it
[20:56] <falktx> the whole Cadence tools
[20:56] <rlameiro> Cadence?
[20:57] <rlameiro> yeap
[20:57] <falktx> let me show an example
[20:57] <rlameiro> plus your new plugin project
[20:57] <falktx> http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/screenshots/carla.png
[20:57] <falktx> yep, Carla that is
[20:57] <rlameiro> dude i am now on kxstudio/ubuntustudio/xubuntu :D
[20:57] <rlameiro> I am using them
[20:57] <falktx> ah, ok
[20:57] <rlameiro> far more eficient than KDE
[20:57] <rlameiro> sorry
[20:58] <falktx> kxstudio != kDE
[20:58] <falktx> rlameiro: you haven't seen carla-control then
[20:58] <falktx> hehe, I really need a camera to show this to people
[20:58] <rlameiro> falktx, I was talking about http://distrho.sourceforge.net/
[20:58] <falktx> rlameiro: oh, that is nothing that big
[20:59] <falktx> I have other stuff to show, much cooler than that
[20:59] <falktx> but new plugins are always nice, yes
[21:00] <rlameiro> i think i will try today the new kxstudio
[21:00] <rlameiro> if it doesnt work with firewire
[21:00] <rlameiro> I will go again to US 10.04
[21:01] <falktx> rlameiro: I think this is kernel related
[21:01] <rlameiro> I need to record that stuff for the OSMP album
[21:01] <falktx> 11.10 should be the best bet right now
[21:01] <falktx> rlameiro: you can try the ISO and see if it works ;)
[21:01] <rlameiro> maybe, maybe some to do with jackdmp/jack1 v jack2
[21:02] <falktx> maybe
[21:02] <rlameiro> is it live or just install
[21:02] <falktx> rlameiro: you can always try jack1
[21:02] <falktx> rlameiro: that is a live-dvd
[21:02] <rlameiro> weeeee
[21:02] <rlameiro> unetbootin here i go
[21:03] <rlameiro> is very slow from sourceforge man
[21:03] <falktx> wait a few minutes
[21:03] <falktx> I just finished the upload
[21:03] <rlameiro> I am downloading at 700KB/s when I usually download at 3.1 MB/s
[21:03] <falktx> 700Kb and you complain??
[21:03] <falktx> damn...
[21:03] <falktx> I can't get pass 500Kb for *all* downloads
[21:04] <rlameiro> well, from 3.1 MB/s to 700KB/s its a very big diference :D
[21:04] <rlameiro> It is slower for sure :D
[21:04] <rlameiro> yeah, I know
[21:04] <rlameiro> But i pay 60€ for it....
[21:05] <rlameiro> ok, tv and phone included ... :)
[21:06] <falktx> meo?
[21:07] <rlameiro> Zon
[21:07] <falktx> nice
[21:07] <rlameiro> yeap
[21:07] <falktx> I have it two, but just for TV
[21:07] <rlameiro> 1 MB upload
[21:07] <falktx> *too
[21:07] <rlameiro> I want to have my server at home
[21:07] <falktx> arrg, I get 50Kb upload
[21:07] <falktx> but internet is Vodafone, not Zon
[21:09] <rlameiro> well, its better than before
[21:11] <rlameiro> cofee break
[21:51] <rlameiro> back
[21:54] <ScottL> hi rlameiro  :)
[21:54] <ScottL> how is your new equipment?
[21:55] <falktx> ScottL: hey!
[21:55] <falktx> ScottL: this is for you:
[21:55] <falktx> http://sourceforge.net/projects/kxstudio/files/Live/UbuntuStudio-KR_11.10_32bit.iso/download
[21:56] <rlameiro> ScottL, hi
[21:56] <rlameiro> Well, first of all it works
[21:56] <rlameiro>  :D
[21:56] <rlameiro> I tried to run my FW interface but no luck
[21:56] <rlameiro> I wil try this new kxstudio release and if it doesnt works, I am back to US 10.04
[21:57] <ScottL> falktx, i saw that in the backscroll, i am going to download that now
[21:57] <falktx> I hope md5sum matches
[21:57] <falktx> [#1 SIZE:21.7MiB/1,387.6MiB(1%) CN:1 SPD:420.3KiBs ETA:55m27s]
[21:58] <falktx> rlameiro: ^that is all I can get here
[21:59] <rlameiro> well, i never check checksums
[21:59] <rlameiro> I should....
[21:59] <rlameiro> i am installing it right now on the pen
[21:59] <ScottL> rlameiro, what problems are you having with your firewire?  is this with ubuntu studio or kxstudio?
[21:59] <ScottL> is it because of the new firewire stack, juju?
[21:59] <rlameiro> kxs
[21:59] <rlameiro> maybe
[21:59] <ScottL> ah, okay
[21:59] <falktx> rlameiro: can you check md5sum of the image for me?
[21:59] <rlameiro> neither cadence or qjackctl can start firewire
[22:00] <ScottL> holstein, still might be a good resource to troubleshoot, i think he's pretty masterful at that
[22:00] <falktx> rlameiro: you can try jack1
[22:00] <rlameiro> ffado-test shows the interface, so it is detected but not by jack
[22:00] <ScottL> falktx, do you have a sourceforge page or image or something for cadence?
[22:00] <falktx> rlameiro: just add 'ppa:kxstudio-team/jack1' and update
[22:00] <falktx> ScottL: not yet
[22:00] <ScottL> falktx, okay
[22:00] <rlameiro> hummm, that id iddnt knew :D
[22:00] <falktx> ScottL: I'll create a full info page before release
[22:00]  * ScottL is going upstairs to start download and do a few other tasks
[22:01] <rlameiro> well, i am going to reboot :D i will try it now
[22:01] <rlameiro> cya
[22:03] <falktx> hm, no md5sum?


[12:51] <raheel> can any one help me how to setup the maximum pages PER JOB using cups or lpadmin
[12:53] <serfus> raheel, this is not a support channel, try at #ubuntu or rather at #cups
[12:53] <jfi> raheel, try #ubuntu channel, #ubuntu-classroom is not for support
[12:53] <raheel> ok thanks


[00:00] <amurray> (by required kernel, I mean required for this feature to be actively tested - the FFe itself doesn't require that kernel)
[00:22] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Base amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:22] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Base arm64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:22] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Base armhf [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:22] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Base ppc64el [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:22] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Base riscv64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:22] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Base s390x [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:26] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Unity Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:27] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: ubuntucinnamon-environment (mantic-proposed/universe) [23.10.1 => 23.10.2] (no packageset)
[00:27]  * ItzSwirlz grumbles
[00:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Kubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:29] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Budgie Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919) has been added
[00:29] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu MATE Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:33] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Desktop arm64+raspi [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:35] <Eickmeyer> vorlon: If you have a quick cycle, ubuntucinnamon-environment 23.10.1 is awaiting approval, should fix the build issue per ItzSwirlz 's testing.
[00:35] <Eickmeyer> er, .2
[00:36] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Desktop (Legacy) amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:36] <bdmurray> looking
[00:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Kylin Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919) has been added
[00:37] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: tia
[00:37] <bdmurray> Eickmeyer: Did y'all test it this time?
[00:37] <ItzSwirlz> yes
[00:37] <ItzSwirlz> i did
[00:37] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: As stated, ItzSwirlz tested it. I don't have the environment.
[00:37] <ItzSwirlz> if it still has problems I will be *stunned*
[00:39] <bdmurray> I don't see any substance to the changes in this upload https://launchpadlibrarian.net/688164315/ubuntucinnamon-environment_23.10.1_23.10.2.diff.gz
[00:40] <ItzSwirlz> `Binary files /tmp/tmp_wuqskp1/wE4oZYE0Sp/ubuntucinnamon-environment-23.10.1/usr/share/cinnamon/thumbnails/cinnamon/unknown.png and /tmp/tmp_wuqskp1/HSDy9FNhHs/ubuntucinnamon-environment-23.10.2/usr/share/cinnamon/thumbnails/cinnamon/unknown.png differ` it was removed
[00:40] <bdmurray> Got it
[00:40] <ItzSwirlz> https://github.com/ubuntucinnamon/ubuntucinnamon-environment/commit/ac8a6dd74c70fef420f099ac7253ef1c0d7cdadb
[00:40] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Commit ac8a6dd in ubuntucinnamon/ubuntucinnamon-environment "23.10.2 - dont replace identical conflicting file usr/share/cinnamon/thumbnails/cinnamon/unknown.png"
[00:45] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Edubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[00:47] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Studio DVD amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919) has been added
[00:47] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted ubuntucinnamon-environment [source] (mantic-proposed) [23.10.2]
[00:48] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: Thanks
[00:52] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[01:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: xubuntu-default-settings (mantic-proposed/universe) [23.04.0 => 23.10.0] (xubuntu)
[01:32] <bluesabre> (not required for beta)
[01:34] <vorlon> Eickmeyer: the environment> literally just requires trying to install the two packages together in a chroot or container
[01:34] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted xubuntu-default-settings [source] (mantic-proposed) [23.10.0]
[01:35] <Eickmeyer> vorlon: Fair, but that didn't occur to me. I was thinking the entire flavor, but I'm a total completionist like that. :P
[02:10] <ItzSwirlz> been about an hour, i assume -environment is good? if so, you can add the cinnamon build whenever you want
[02:25] <bdmurray> I was eating dinner, looking now
[02:30] <vorlon> hasn't made it through a britney run yet
[02:30] <bdmurray> I'm working on adding an unblock hint for it
[02:31] <ItzSwirlz> oh well, im going to sleep. msg me on telegram if anything happens
[02:32] <bdmurray> vorlon: is there a reason not to do that?
[02:32] <vorlon> bdmurray: none
[02:38] <bdmurray> That's done then, waiting for britney
[02:45] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: edubuntu-artwork (mantic-proposed/universe) [23.10.5 => 23.10.6] (no packageset)
[02:48] <Eickmeyer> bug 2036683 ^
[02:48] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2036683 in edubuntu-artwork (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu Software disappeared from default dock" [High, Fix Committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2036683
[02:48] <Eickmeyer> I will be bugging the desktop team about that one.
[02:54] <Eickmeyer> That's a definite respin for edubuntu as it's a UX issue.
[03:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server Subiquity amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[03:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server Subiquity arm64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[03:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server Subiquity ppc64el [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[03:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server Subiquity riscv64 [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[03:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server Subiquity s390x [Mantic Beta] (20230919.1) has been added
[03:00] <bdmurray> Respin for the Beta?
[03:01] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: Yes, because otherwise it won't show up in the dock for the beta.
[03:01] <Eickmeyer> At all.
[03:01] <Eickmeyer> Not even upon update.
[03:08] <bdmurray> Eickmeyer: So you'd like me to review the edubuntu-artwork upload then and unblock it and respin the image?
[03:08] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: If you have a cycle to spare. It is getting late, and I know there are others.
[03:09] <Eickmeyer> It's a one-line change to a conf file.
[03:09] <bdmurray> I see that
[03:10] <Eickmeyer> I've had to deal with that one line all dev cycle because the file name kept changing.
[03:14] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted edubuntu-artwork [source] (mantic-proposed) [23.10.6]
[03:14] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: tyvm
[06:34] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server arm64+raspi [Mantic Beta] (20230920) has been added
[06:34] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server armhf+raspi [Mantic Beta] (20230920) has been added
[06:34] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server riscv64+icicle [Mantic Beta] (20230920) has been added
[06:35] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server riscv64+licheerv [Mantic Beta] (20230920) has been added
[06:35] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server riscv64+nezha [Mantic Beta] (20230920) has been added
[06:35] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server riscv64+unmatched [Mantic Beta] (20230920) has been added
[06:35] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Server riscv64+visionfive [Mantic Beta] (20230920) has been added
[06:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-adair-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in focal
[06:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-adair-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in jammy
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-stella-nobisuke-rpl-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in focal
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-barrett-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in focal
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-barrington-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in focal
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-caitir-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in focal
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-calaminag-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in focal
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-stella-nobisuke-rpl-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in jammy
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-barrett-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in jammy
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-barrington-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in jammy
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-caitir-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in jammy
[07:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Packageset: Added oem-sutton-calaminag-meta to canonical-oem-metapackages in jammy
[08:17] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted systemd [source] (lunar-proposed) [252.5-2ubuntu3.2]
[08:18] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted systemd [source] (jammy-proposed) [249.11-0ubuntu3.11]
[08:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: davmail (mantic-proposed/universe) [<IP_ADDRESS>23-4 => <IP_ADDRESS>23-5] (no packageset) (sync)
[08:38] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted davmail [sync] (mantic-proposed) [<IP_ADDRESS>23-5]
[10:17] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: abyss (mantic-proposed/multiverse) [2.3.7-1 => 2.3.7-2] (no packageset) (sync)
[10:17] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted abyss [sync] (mantic-proposed) [2.3.7-2]
[10:58] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: libfile-fcntllock-perl (mantic-proposed/main) [0.22-4build1 => 0.22-4ubuntu1] (core)
[11:54] <AlsoItzSwirlz> What's cinnamon's status, has the ubuntucinnamon-environment binary been uploaded?
[12:00] <fossfreedom_> In the release pocket 8 hours ago https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntucinnamon-environment
[12:01] <AlsoItzSwirlz> ok, status of the ISO?
[12:04] <fossfreedom_> ah - the last attempt of the build was 13 hours ago - so before that package migrated.
[12:14] <fossfreedom_> AlsoItzSwirlz: ordinarily I would say to kick the ISO to be rebuilt via the ISO tracker - but given we are in beta thats probably a Release Team request
[12:14] <AlsoItzSwirlz> yeah, thats my request, can the RT add cinnamon to the list of images/build a cinnamon image
[13:39] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: boot-managed-by-snapd (mantic-proposed/main) [2 => 3] (no packageset)
[13:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted boot-managed-by-snapd [source] (mantic-proposed) [3]
[14:08] <bdmurray> Hunh, I thought I built cinnamon last night
[14:09] <bdmurray> Doing so now
[14:15] <Eickmeyer> RAOF: verification done bug 2033992, but I probably just missed you. :)
[14:15] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2033992 in ubuntustudio-menu (Ubuntu Lunar) "[SRU] Change Ubuntu Studio Chat from Matrix to IRC" [High, Fix Committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2033992
[14:36] <bdmurray> Eickmeyer: I'm gonna rebuild edubuntu too b/c I don't see the latest edubuntu-artwork in the manifest
[14:36] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: Huh. I'll take it!
[14:37] <bdmurray> I'm sorry, you'd a) like a reubild or b) are going to do one?
[14:38] <bdmurray> Eickmeyer: ?
[14:39] <Eickmeyer> I'd like the rebuild. It's necessary for that package to show the defaults properly.
[14:39] <Eickmeyer> I'm sorry if that was mistyped
[14:39] <Eickmeyer> Lost in translation, I guess.
[14:39]  * Eickmeyer hasn't had coffee yet.
[14:39] <bdmurray> Or the fog of sleep deprivation
[14:40] <Eickmeyer> That too. Woke up to a deluge outside this morning.
[14:42] <Eickmeyer> Do get some rest at some point, though.
[14:44] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Ubuntu Cinnamon Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] (20230920) has been added
[14:46] <bdmurray> \o/
[15:12] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Edubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] has been updated (20230920)
[15:13] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: Bad news. The system I was on was upgraded less than a week ago, and ubuntu-release-upgrader did not upgrade the snap-store snap to track latest/stable/ubuntu-23.10 as it was still tracking 23.04. What we have is a bug in ubuntu-release-upgrader. I'll be reverting the change in edubuntu-artwork and requiring a respin. 😞
[15:16]  * Eickmeyer bangs head against wall
[15:16] <Eickmeyer> This is why we test though, right?
[15:17] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: hello (bionic-proposed/main) [2.10-1build3 => 2.10-1build3+test1] (core)
[15:18] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected hello [source] (bionic-proposed) [2.10-1build3+test1]
[15:18] <cjwatson> (me again)
[15:19] <cjwatson> upload.ubuntu.com is on a new deployment now
[15:22] <Eickmeyer> cjwatson: \o/
[15:23] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: edubuntu-artwork (mantic-proposed/universe) [23.10.6 => 23.10.7] (no packageset)
[15:24] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: hello (bionic-proposed/main) [2.10-1build3 => 2.10-1build3+test1] (core)
[15:29] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected hello [source] (bionic-proposed) [2.10-1build3+test1]
[15:35] <Eickmeyer> Ok, let's try this again. Undoing the changes to edubuntu-artwork, will need a respin. 🤦
[15:35] <Eickmeyer> bug 2036683
[15:35] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2036683 in edubuntu-artwork (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu Software disappeared from default dock" [High, In Progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2036683
[15:36] <Eickmeyer> Related: bug 2036765
[15:36] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2036765 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-release-upgrader failed to upgrade snap to track new release" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2036765
[15:50] <bdmurray> accepting edubuntu-artwork again
[15:51] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: Thanks again. 😞
[15:51] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted edubuntu-artwork [source] (mantic-proposed) [23.10.7]
[15:55] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: alsa-ucm-conf (mantic-proposed/main) [1.2.9-1ubuntu2 => 1.2.9-1ubuntu3] (core)
[16:48] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: nwchem (mantic-proposed/universe) [7.0.2-4 => 7.0.2-5] (no packageset) (sync)
[16:49] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted nwchem [sync] (mantic-proposed) [7.0.2-5]
[17:14] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Edubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] has been disabled
[17:16] <Eickmeyer> Trying to help ItzSwirlz investigate bug 2036764, and why indicator-keyboard is even being autopkgtested against ubuntucinnamon-meta.
[17:16] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2036764 in ubuntucinnamon-meta (Ubuntu) "indicator keyboard crashes when upgrading from lunar->mantic on ubuntu cinnamon" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2036764
[17:43] <GunnarHj> bdmurray: Bug #2034986 is rather ugly, and I have an idea for a fix. Please see the latest comment. Any chance such a change could make it for the beta?
[17:43] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2034986 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu Mantic) "some text became unreadable during a distribution upgrade" [Critical, Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2034986
[17:46] <bdmurray> GunnarHj: its been around for a while. Could you explain why you think it should be sorted this week?
[17:48] <GunnarHj> bdmurray: Well, since the beta is the starting point for many testers, many users will probably run into it otherwise. Guess that's the best I can come up with. :)
[17:53] <Eickmeyer> We figured it out. rdeps showed problems, and the autopkgtest might be wrong as it couldn't be reproduced in a vm.
[18:07] <bdmurray> Respinning edubuntu
[18:07] <Eickmeyer> 👍 Thanks so much.
[18:13] <jbicha> I don't think we have triggered the font upgrade issue in a while but I believe it triggers reliably with update-manager to 23.10 now. But to fix it for the upgrader itself, do we need to SRU ubuntu-release-upgrader?
[18:14]  * Eickmeyer has seen the font upgrade issue first-hand.
[18:14] <bdmurray> No, the way the upgrade process works is it downloads the dist-upgrader tarball for the release to which the system is upgrading
[18:15] <bdmurray> e.g. http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/mantic/main/dist-upgrader-all/current/mantic.tar.gz as seen in the meta-release-development file
[18:20] <jbicha> ok then yes, I think we ought to fix it for Beta, but maybe we could zero-day it so we don't need to respin ISOs
[18:30] <jbicha> there's also bug 2036765
[18:30] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2036765 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-release-upgrader failed to upgrade snap to track new release" [Critical, Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2036765
[18:36] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Edubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] has been updated (20230920.1)
[19:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: gnocchi (mantic-proposed/universe) [4.5.0-0ubuntu1 => 4.6.0-0ubuntu1] (openstack)
[19:29] <bdmurray> I clicked rebuild too soon and the old edubuntu-artwork is in the image, retrying now
[19:29] <Eickmeyer> ope
[19:29] <Eickmeyer> Happens. I've done that too.
[20:03] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: networking-mlnx (mantic-proposed/universe) [1:19.0.0+git2023011010.0a69b971-0ubuntu1 => 1:21.0.0-0ubuntu1] (openstack)
[20:12] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: networking-l2gw (mantic-proposed/universe) [1:18.0.0+git2022100517.fbebe30-0ubuntu1 => 1:19.0.0+git2023092015.20542bf0-0ubuntu1] (openstack)
[20:28] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Edubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] has been updated (20230920.2)
[20:45] <bdmurray> Now edubuntu is good
[20:47] <Eickmeyer> 👍 I'll re-zsync here just to make sure.
[20:52] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: re bug 2036765: snapd?
[20:52] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2036765 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-release-upgrader failed to upgrade snap to track new release" [Critical, Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2036765
[20:55] <bdmurray> The Foundations team meeting is tomorrow so it'll at least be discussed then
[20:56] <sergiodj> vorlon: I have a fix for apt-cacher-ng. I assume it's better to wait until the beta freeze is lifted before uploading, but let me know otherwise
[20:58] <bdmurray> sergiodj: Is it seeded?
[20:59] <sergiodj> bdmurray: not sure, let me check
[21:00] <sergiodj> bdmurray: no, it doesn't seem that it is
[21:02] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: ubuntu-unity-backgrounds (mantic-proposed/universe) [23.04.1-0ubuntu1 => 23.10-0ubuntu1] (no packageset)
[21:08] <sergiodj> uploaded, then
[21:09] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: apt-cacher-ng (mantic-proposed/universe) [3.7.4-1build3 => 3.7.4-1ubuntu1] (no packageset)
[21:10] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted apt-cacher-ng [source] (mantic-proposed) [3.7.4-1ubuntu1]
[21:35] <vorlon> sergiodj: and in general unless you think your upload is going to interfere with some /other/ change to the package that will be beta-critical, it's still better to upload it to the queue and let the release team unblock it as needed
[21:45] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Edubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] has been marked as ready
[22:28] <dbungert> bdmurray: we appear to have a plan on how to build a s390x subiquity snap without LP: #2036424.  I should have a candidate in a few minutes, which I will hand-verify.  If that looks good then I will suggest a live-server rebuild for s390x
[22:28] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Launchpad bug 2036424 in subiquity "Mantic s390x install fails: grep-status: *** stack smashing detected ***: terminated" [Undecided, Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2036424
[22:38] <dbungert> bdmurray: yes, the snap appears to be built correctly.  Would you rebuild s390x mantic live-server?
[22:57] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Xubuntu Desktop amd64 [Mantic Beta] has been marked as ready
[22:57] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Builds: Xubuntu Minimal amd64 [Mantic Beta] has been marked as ready
[23:07] <bdmurray> dbungert: I'd stepped away for a bit. So the snap will have the same features but just be built differently for s390x?
[23:08] <bdmurray> same features for every arch
[23:09] <dbungert> bdmurray: this snap build for s390x was done with core22 from edge instead of stable.  Note that if you want this to match commit for commit it would have to be an all-arch live-server rebuild, or I would have to backtrack a branch for a specific s390x snap build to match the actual beta ISO candidates.
[23:11] <bdmurray> dbungert: I gather you and mwhudson think using this snap for 390x is the best option?
[23:12] <mwhudson> yes
[23:12] <dbungert> bdmurray: yes.  mwhudson also note as such at https://bugs.launchpad.net/subiquity/+bug/2036424/comments/13
[23:12] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Launchpad bug 2036424 in subiquity "Mantic s390x install fails: grep-status: *** stack smashing detected ***: terminated" [Undecided, Triaged]
[23:12] <mwhudson> i don't know what the differences are between the subiquity source between the broken one and the working one
[23:13] <dbungert> a rebuild for current state is also good as it should pick up another s390x fix, LP: #2029479
[23:13] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Launchpad bug 2029479 in Ubuntu on IBM z Systems "mantic daily (on s390x) does not reboot (post-install) from correct disk" [High, In Progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2029479
[23:14] <mwhudson> i am reasonably sure that building with edge core22 doesn't result in any differences to the contents of the snap
[23:16] <bdmurray> Okay, I'll kick off a re-build then
[23:17] <dbungert> bdmurray: to be clear, will that be an all-arch rebuild or just s390x?
[23:18] <bdmurray> just s390x
[23:18] <bdmurray> the other ones have good results so far
[23:18] <dbungert> understood, thanks
[23:22] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: gnome-contacts (mantic-proposed/universe) [45~beta-1 => 45.0-1] (no packageset) (sync)
[23:50] <liushuyu> Hi Ubuntu Release Team, Security team has gave their final approvals and confirmations on these MIRs: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/http-parser/+bug/1990655    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libssh2/+bug/1991650
[23:50] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Launchpad bug 1990655 in http-parser (Ubuntu) "MIR: libgit2, http-parser" [High, In Progress]
[23:50] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Launchpad bug 1991650 in libssh2 (Ubuntu) "MIR: libssh2" [High, In Progress]
[23:51] <liushuyu> Can someone in the release team do the actual promotion process?
[23:52] <bdmurray> that's an archive admin task but some release team members are archive admins
[23:52] <bdmurray> just not me! ;-)
[23:54] <liushuyu> bdmurray: Ah, then I will rephase my message to include "archive admin" or "AA"
[23:55] <liushuyu> Is there any archive admin to do the actual promotion process for libssh2 and http-parser?


[14:16] <LordOfTime> anyone on bug control here?
[14:16] <LordOfTime> or rather, can help me confirm whether this bug is invalid?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/metacity/+bug/1019280
[14:16] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1019280 in metacity "[need-packaging] New Upstream Release" [Undecided,New]
[14:16] <LordOfTime> since its already in Debian (they only give a link to the sid package)
[14:29] <bcurtiswx> LordOfTime, The currently Ubuntu version is lower than the one in sid it appears,
[14:29] <bcurtiswx> s/currently/current
[14:29] <LordOfTime> bcurtiswx: its marked, needs-packaging, what it needs is a sync
[14:29] <LordOfTime> is tagging as 'needs-packaging' valid for when a sync is needed?
[14:30] <hggdh> nope, but we can put this down as lack of knowledge from the OP. Just correct to a sync (or merge) as needed
[14:30] <bcurtiswx> If it were me, i would close the bug and ask the user to use 'requestsync' from the terminal
[14:31] <LordOfTime> ARGH!  Y U NO WORK LAUNCHPAD
[14:32] <LordOfTime> i agree with hggdh on this, but that's because right now my mood is such i dont want to close that bug
[14:32] <LordOfTime> unfortunately, LP crapped out on me right now
[14:32] <LordOfTime> so i cant do anything </annoyed.
[14:33] <bcurtiswx> LordOfTime, its entirely up to you. Your original question was whether it was valid, and it is. What you do from this point is up to you :)
[14:33] <LordOfTime> bcurtiswx: :P
[14:33] <LordOfTime> its also dependent on LP working
[14:33]  * bcurtiswx kicks LP
[14:33] <LordOfTime> but unfortunately for some reason i'm getting LP OOPS things
[14:33] <LordOfTime> (timeouts everywhere from this IP)
[14:34] <LordOfTime> the only thing i can see is my user page without a timeout
[14:34] <bcurtiswx> could be because it's cached
[14:34] <LordOfTime> *notices a few emails sitting in his inbox*
[14:34] <LordOfTime> ... ohh...
[14:34] <LordOfTime> "Network Maintenance"

[14:34] <bcurtiswx> haha, i'd still be raged, just more patient
[14:35] <LordOfTime> bcurtiswx: problem is the maintenance window
[14:35] <LordOfTime> ('tis a BIG WINDOW)
[14:36] <bcurtiswx> works fine 'ere
[14:36] <LordOfTime> yeah, the source is here
[14:36]  * LordOfTime now has standard HTTP timeout errors
[14:36] <bcurtiswx> sorry you're IT doesn't like you
[14:36] <LordOfTime> indeed
[14:46] <hggdh> oh, c'mon, IT does not like users, period
[14:46]  * hggdh knowns, been there
[14:49] <bcurtiswx> it's true, i think they're trained to loathe every user..
[14:53] <LordOfTime> except I work in IT
[14:53] <LordOfTime> :O
[14:53] <LordOfTime> :P *
[15:01] <hggdh> so did I, for quite a long time
[15:09] <LordOfTime> hggdh: i'm on ITSec though
[15:09] <LordOfTime> so...
[15:09] <LordOfTime> :P
[15:10] <hggdh> oh, even worse ;-)
[15:19] <LordOfTime> hggdh: heh
[17:15] <TheLordOfTime> is anyone on Ubuntu 12.04 able to check and confirm this?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/seahorse/+bug/1019341
[17:15] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1019341 in seahorse "Seahorse GUI does not display additional-identity email information on PGP keys " [Undecided,New]
[18:46] <hggdh> TheLordOfTime: I am running Quantal -- it works (but with a slightly different interface, the emails are listed below the GPG keys)
[21:44] <TheLordOfTime> hggdh:  ah, well its a 12.04 regression then, because that existed in 11.10 according to a few people around here
[21:44] <TheLordOfTime> (and it existed in 11.04)
[21:46] <hggdh> TheLordOfTime: it does sound as a regression. But, as Seb pointed out, might not be easy to fix. The best, I guess, would be to ping the seahorse developers at seahorse-list at gnome.org
[21:46] <micahg> if it's a regression, it should be flagged in LP as such
[21:47] <hggdh> TheLordOfTime: also what micahg points out -- add 'regression-release' as a tag to your bug
[21:47] <micahg> also needs targetting :)
[21:47]  * micahg gives a task
[21:48]  * micahg waits for the tag
[21:48]  * TheLordOfTime waits for signal strength to increase slightly
[21:49] <micahg> TheLordOfTime: make sure to include a comment about it being a regression from oneiric as well
[21:50] <TheLordOfTime> micahg:  i havent confirmed *personally* its a regression, as I skipped Oneiric (wouldnt run on this system)
[21:50] <micahg> TheLordOfTime: well, do you have a reliable source? :)
[21:50] <TheLordOfTime> micahg:  hang on, i might have an old oneiric VM lying around i can confirm in
[21:50] <micahg> if it works in oneiric and is broken in precise, it should be easier to fix
[21:51] <TheLordOfTime> *backs up an old multi-name key for testing*
[21:51] <micahg> if it's broke in both, that's more difficult
[21:51]  * micahg used that word easy too easily
[21:51] <TheLordOfTime> lol
[21:51] <micahg> as both precise and oneiric have 3.2.2
[21:52] <micahg> otherwise both releases should be noted as affected
[21:54]  * TheLordOfTime will have to personally test before marking that its a regression
[21:54] <TheLordOfTime> since apparently this VM is exploded


[00:26] <philipballew> how can i edit my grub menu to show the name of the operating system as something different
[00:27] <philipballew> backtrack5 shows up as ubuntu 2.6.38
[00:30] <DarkwingDuck> lolz... Backtrack5
[00:31] <DarkwingDuck> philipballew: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1287602
[00:32] <philipballew> its the best system to monitor my network. my nirghbors use our internet and i dont want to have the cops show up at our door so i monitor all websites and downloads, then flagg it with things. kinda like opendns
[00:33] <philipballew> but yes, it does have a bad rap!
[00:34] <DarkwingDuck> Oh... I finally got the druggies in few apts down from me to stop...
[00:35] <DarkwingDuck> I changed my essid to IB_Surveillance_Van_8
[00:36] <philipballew> haha, was it not password protected?
[00:36] <DarkwingDuck> Yes, but when people would scan it would show up.
[00:41] <philipballew> oh i see. so its a hidden network. im trying to set up my router to only log pre approved mac address with a rsa type key
[00:41] <philipballew> probably gonna ddwrt the router
[00:41] <philipballew> the drug lords must have figured out how to scan wifi
[00:42] <DarkwingDuck> lol
[02:16] <r4y> How do I find out how much time several videos on my hard drive add up to?
[02:18] <holstein> r4y: i would probably just que them up in something
[02:18] <r4y> I know that if I right click one of the videos it will say how long a video is, so other then adding their time together.
[02:18] <r4y> I ried Banshee but no go
[02:18] <r4y> as well as mplayer
[02:18] <holstein> there is a calculator ;)
[02:19]  * holstein looks around
[02:19]  * IAmNotThatGuy looks at the side
[02:20] <holstein> rhythym box is doing it with audio...
[02:20] <r4y> Hmm, I am not sure what might work for queing them up, so  guess I with add their total, thank you for responding. I will try rhythmbox out in a sec
[02:21] <r4y> There are 2 to pick from?
[02:22] <r4y> OK, never mind
[02:22] <holstein> yeah, if you're too lazy to add, just drop em here, and i'll do it :)
[02:23] <r4y> Well, it didn't work. I meant never mind to which rhythmbox to choose from using open with
[02:25] <holstein> yeah, rhythymbox doesnt do video right?
[02:25] <holstein> im just saying, it has that summing funcionality in the playlist
[02:25] <holstein> VLC doesnt seem to
[02:25] <holstein> totem didnt
[02:26] <holstein> you tried banshee and mplayer
[02:26] <r4y> I just tried smplayer as well
[02:27] <r4y> Right, rhythm box is for music, I was just trying
[02:28] <r4y> I even tried soundconverter, it's cool, it's not a big deal to add it together. It would be neat to be able to find out how long through a queing of some sort. I try to find out little things like this. It's fun to find out. Thank you for talking with me.
[02:29] <holstein> sure
[02:29] <holstein> yeah, now i want to know too :)
[02:30] <r4y> Might be possible with a script perhaps.
[02:32] <holstein> relevant http://www.commandlinefu.com/commands/view/3612/get-the-total-length-of-all-video-audio-in-the-current-dir-and-below-in-hms
[02:33] <r4y> I downloaded a bunch of Angry Video Game Nerd with the AVGN vs the Nostalgia Critic and That Guy with the Glasses because my brother is coming and I am not sure he will want to watch them all because he sort of has ADD
[02:34] <r4y> Yes, perfect, I need to go and do chores, so I will have to try it out later, TY
[02:35] <r4y> Bookmarked
[02:35] <r4y> Thank you ver much
[03:49] <r4y> The second command from the link you gave me worked. The first command may need to be changed a little in my case. I tried removing the avi part, but it doesn't matter because the second command worked. 1h:27m:55s
[03:52] <r4y> I even calculated the time roughly and I had about 1.46, 1 being an hour and 46 minutes, so I don't know how my math was wrong, but I tried.
[03:53] <r4y> Hmm, I should try again I guess
[03:53] <r4y> TY, you it worked. Now if I can get my own math right, lol.
[03:55] <r4y> Dang it, I have to go to the store. I am going to try an online calculator for time.
[08:59] <Ubuntu-firsttime> Question - which version of Ubuntu would best suit a Toshiba Satellite laptop?
 T2300 processor - 1 mb ram
 have installed 11.4 but seems to run very slow
 Can anyone help?
[08:59] <bioterror> 1MB is bad ;)
[08:59] <Ubuntu-firsttime> :(
[09:00] <bioterror> try 11.04
[09:00] <bioterror> why is it slow?
[09:00] <Ubuntu-firsttime> sorry yes 11.04 is installed
[09:00] <bioterror> !xubuntu | Ubuntu-firsttime
[09:00] <ubot2> Ubuntu-firsttime: Xubuntu is Ubuntu with Xfce instead of !GNOME. More info at http://www.xubuntu.org and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/ - To install from Ubuntu: « sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop » - Join #xubuntu for support - See also: !Ubuntu and !Xubuntu-Channels
[09:02] <Ubuntu-firsttime> sorry to both you
[09:03] <Ubuntu-firsttime> bother
[09:18]  * nlsthzn has run all distro's on a similar Toshiba and it is plenty fast enough to handle any of them...
[10:42] <benonsoftware> Hi al.
[10:44] <Sidewinder1> Mornin'.
[10:45] <benonsoftware> Evening.
[10:46] <benonsoftware> Who is looking for mentors here?
[12:20] <kristian-aalborg> soo... trying to set up an usb hdd with gparted
[12:20] <kristian-aalborg> the program became unresponsive... I can't get to view the "detailed view"
[12:23] <kristian-aalborg> I just have a minimized "Applying pending operations"
[12:25] <kristian-aalborg> holstein, get some fresh air :P
[13:03] <stlsaint> yo yo
[13:06] <stlsaint> any terminator users in here
[13:12] <r4y> How do  an mp3 every so many seconds?, Is there a way to make a longer bar in Banshee?, that would be cool.
[13:12] <r4y> How do we mark an mp3 every so many seconds?
[13:12] <r4y> LOL, oops
[13:28] <Sidewinder1> r4y, Have you tried it in Audacity?
[13:28] <r4y> I am looking
[13:28] <r4y> I am going to try regular Interval Labels
[13:31] <r4y> O ya, that was it
[13:31] <r4y> TY Take care
[13:31] <r4y> bye
[20:44] <kristian-aalborg> hi all
[20:45] <kristian-aalborg> looking to rename some movies via imdb - I got the imdb-tools package, but it makes a dotfile out of the input file (.avi)
[20:45] <kristian-aalborg> it looks unmaintained, I guess imdb changed the API
[20:45] <kristian-aalborg> anybody know another way to do this?
[20:58] <kristian-aalborg> http://photos.wiju.es/1/7/6/1/6/3/2/6/969a6e7b8395eb5179591e275ca1355a.jpg <--- anybody know if somebody's selling a keyboard similar to this nowadays?
[20:59] <holstein> kristian-aalborg: i saw one at the charity shop the other day :)
[21:00] <kristian-aalborg> holstein, make and model=
[21:00] <kristian-aalborg> ?
[21:00] <kristian-aalborg> this is not #lol, you know :P
[21:04] <holstein> kristian-aalborg: you mean the kind that bows up in the middle like that?
[21:04] <holstein> or a particular brand?
[21:05] <holstein> im not interested in them, so i didnt really pay much attention, but i see them at the used places all the time
[21:05] <holstein> i remember getting on in, and dropping it off at the charity shop too
[21:05] <kristian-aalborg> holstein, the kind that splits in the middle - with keys in the "spacer"
[21:05] <kristian-aalborg> brand is not important
[21:06] <kristian-aalborg> (not for me, for someone I know)
[21:06] <holstein> i dont recall ever seeing a black one
[21:06] <holstein> the one i had was really nice... silver and wireless
[21:10] <kristian-aalborg> color is not important, either
[21:10] <kristian-aalborg> holstein, I shall be seeing a good bass player on monday :)
[21:11] <holstein> cool... whos that?
[21:12] <kristian-aalborg> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EptLbfjG_9o
[21:15] <kristian-aalborg> his name's Scott Firth... you could say that he's "freeloading" on Jah Wobble etc as he's "only" doing live stuff and have not written the songs
[21:16] <RRRRube> kristian-aalborg If you search for Microsoft Ergonomic Keyboard, you should find someone selling them
[21:18] <kristian-aalborg> RRRRube, thanks
[21:18] <kristian-aalborg> the one on the picture is made by Trust, btw
[21:20] <RRRRube> I used to have one a while ago, but I got fed up with it :)
[21:21] <kristian-aalborg> I *might* get an IBM model M next time, just to keep it real
[21:21] <kristian-aalborg> ;)
[21:22] <RRRRube> LOL!
[21:22] <kristian-aalborg> holstein, do you like the music?
[21:22]  * holstein listening
[21:22] <holstein> i got busy..
[21:22] <RRRRube> I actually have an ancient MS keyboard that I've been using forever. MS got a lot of flack but I think they actually make decent keyboards (or they used to anyway)
[21:22] <kristian-aalborg> RRRRube, yes, it will look good with my green Terminus font ;)
[21:23] <RRRRube> Oh, you're so hardcore LOL
[21:24] <holstein> hmmm... well my mom always told me 'if you dont have anything nice to say...' ;)
[21:24] <holstein> its not bad, its just not my thing
[21:25] <kristian-aalborg> yeah, not for everyone
[21:25] <holstein> well, thats kinda my issue.. i would argue that it is exactly constructed for *everyone*
[21:25] <kristian-aalborg> bass dude has worked with Toni Braxton, the Spice Girls, Elvis Costello... pretty much everyone
[21:26] <holstein> but, thats just my opinion*
[21:26] <kristian-aalborg> holstein, please expand on that
[21:26] <holstein> we should go to -team ->
[21:27] <kristian-aalborg> likely ;)


[01:00] <bigjools> yo thumper
[01:11] <thumper> hi bigjools
[01:11] <bigjools> you wanted me earlier?
[01:12] <thumper> yeah, perhaps chat about maas
[01:12] <thumper> but I need to shower first
[01:14] <thumper> hmm... my magic change hasn't worked
[01:14] <thumper> I think I know why it failed...
[01:14] <thumper> but need more investigation
[01:22] <wallyworld_> thumper: i'd like a catch up too
[01:34] <thumper> wallyworld_: give me 5 minutes to grab these log files.
[01:35] <wallyworld_> ok
[01:46] <thumper> ok, ready
[01:46] <thumper> but confused
[01:46] <thumper> wallyworld_: shall I start a hangout?
[01:46] <wallyworld_> ok
[01:46] <thumper> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/98238f3ad80fb6e5ea1e7c6e53442bef8dd68df6?hl=en
[02:00] <bigjools> davecheney: "i can tell that you and I are going to get on like a house on fire in BNE" - is it ok if I laugh a lot?
[02:01] <davecheney> yes
[02:01] <davecheney> that would break the ice
[02:01] <bigjools> :)
[02:01] <davecheney> opp
[02:01] <davecheney> changing host
[02:01] <davecheney> two secs
[02:03] <davecheney> aaaand, back
[02:03] <davecheney> wifi, how does it even work /
[02:03] <davecheney> ?
[02:03] <bigjools> it uses the tears of developers
[02:04] <davecheney> apparently not enough tears in my house today
[02:04] <bigjools> also pixie dust
[02:04] <davecheney> and unicorn vomit
[02:04] <davecheney> -- that is what someone described the plague of frozen yoghut stores that are springing up in Sydney
[02:05]  * bigjools lives in the boonies so doesn't see that kind of nonsense
[02:05] <bigjools> everyone here complained when McDonalds got planning permission
[02:06] <davecheney> isn't that just what australian's do ?
[02:06] <bigjools> whinge?  oh yes
[02:07] <davecheney> we don't want airports, freeways, desalination plants, or mcdonalds' in our backyards
[02:08] <bigjools> hey wallyworld_, I found out that the big empty space next to Coles here is going to get a huge department store and a Woolies!
[02:08] <bigjools> the locals will go nuts :)
[02:09] <wallyworld_> great
[02:09] <bigjools> wallyworld_: and the phuqers put speed humps on that incline so I can't take you over it in the air any more
[02:10] <wallyworld_> :-(
[02:10]  * bigjools considers  going monster truck stylee
[02:11] <davecheney> oh you kids, with your monster trucks and airborne shenanigans
[02:13] <bigjools> davecheney: you made a series called 1.12 from a tag called 1.11.4?
[02:14] <davecheney> yessir i did
[02:14] <bigjools> how do you plan to work now, are you pushing revisions from trunk back to 1.12 or something else?
[02:14] <davecheney> select revisions
[02:14] <davecheney> possibly none
[02:15] <bigjools> you plan on branching a new series from trunk at some point?
[02:15] <davecheney> the reason for a stable tag is to give something to james page so that we can try to push that into backports for all series
[02:15] <bigjools> ok
[02:15] <davecheney> at the moment the devel versions are only going into aucys
[02:15] <davecheney> saucy
[02:15] <davecheney> ffs lag
[02:16] <davecheney> the next stable will be 1.14, and I understand that a better local provider is the headline feature for that release
[02:16] <bigjools> and azure
[02:16] <davecheney> bigjools: yeah, i didn't want to overstep in my email
[02:17] <bigjools> it's in our best interests to get Azure done ASAP
[02:17] <davecheney> as I wasn't sure of the plan, but azure in 1.14 sounds good to me
[02:17] <davecheney> right-o
[02:17] <bigjools> and I'll be doing a handover when you're all in BNE
[02:17] <davecheney> bigjools: so you know something about this sprint ?
[02:17] <bigjools> since Red are moving to maas pastures
[02:18] <bigjools> davecheney: I know that it's planned, and that's about it :)  Trying to get mramm to get it organised etc etc
[02:18] <davecheney> ok, things are going about as smoothly as usual then
[02:18] <davecheney> anyone know what date ?
[02:19] <bigjools> I heard same week as IoM sprint
[02:19] <bigjools> but I don't recall from whom that came
[02:20] <davecheney> bigjools: that's arse backwards
[02:20] <davecheney> thumper: must be there
[02:20] <davecheney> otherwise itt's a waste of time
[02:20] <thumper> I don't entirely agree with that
[02:20]  * bigjools shrugs
[02:21] <bigjools> as much as I'd like to spend time with thumper
[02:21]  * thumper deputises wallyworld_
[02:22] <davecheney> thumper: axw is your boss
[02:22] <davecheney> he should get to meet you in person sometime this year :)
[02:22] <bigjools> guffaw
[02:22] <axw> wat
[02:22] <thumper> davecheney: you get that the right way round?
[02:22] <axw> :)
[02:22] <thumper> davecheney: and I thought that it was mramm, not me
[02:22] <thumper> anyway...
[02:22] <davecheney> on noes, not the not double negative
[02:22] <davecheney> thumper: you need to study the org chart more closely
[02:23] <bigjools> trololol
[02:23] <thumper> bigjools: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/98238f3ad80fb6e5ea1e7c6e53442bef8dd68df6?hl=en plz join
[02:23]  * thumper pokes the directory
[02:23] <bigjools> thumper: eek, hang on
[02:23] <bigjools> 2 mins
[02:24] <thumper> davecheney: look at axw in the directory, manager mramm
[02:25] <davecheney> thumper: who do I report to ?
[02:25] <davecheney> if it says mramm
[02:25] <davecheney> it's wront
[02:25] <davecheney> it's wrong
[02:25] <thumper> davecheney: arosales
[02:25] <davecheney> ok, i guess it's correct
[02:25] <thumper> :)
[02:25] <thumper> this is what I expected anyway
[02:26]  * axw is not sure where he's meant to be placed
[02:27] <axw> davecheney: did you see my comment on the warning log change, regarding transient errors?
[02:28] <davecheney> axw: i sort of did
[02:28] <davecheney> i threw some code at you
[02:28] <davecheney> i tried to fix the problem from the other end
[02:28] <davecheney> i hoped that there would be a middle group
[02:28] <davecheney> ground
[02:28] <axw> *looks*
[02:30] <axw> same sort of thing
[02:31] <axw> the problem I realised later is that there may be ERROR logs that don't result in a command failure
[02:31] <axw> I was playing with the local provider yesterday, and got a bunch of ERROR logs about not being able to connect to port... then after a while it connects and succeeds
[02:33] <axw> I suppose those could be changed to be not-errors though, except for the final one if it gives up retrying.
[03:19] <davecheney> meeting agenda for tonight, https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1eeHzbtyt_4dlKQMof-vRfplMWMrClBx32k6BFI-77MI/edit#
[03:21] <jtv> wallyworld_: now, about simplestreams...
[03:23] <wallyworld_> jtv: otp to bigjools, give me a sec
[03:40] <wallyworld_> jtv: you rang?
[03:43] <jtv> wallyworld_: otp to bigjools, give me aq sec
[03:43] <bigjools> heh
[03:43] <wallyworld_> lol
[04:01] <jtv> wallyworld_: off the phone now.  I don't know who this bigjools thinks he is, keeping us all from getting work done like that.
[04:01] <wallyworld_> indeed
[04:01] <bigjools> it's a rare skill I have
[04:03] <wallyworld_> jtv: so what bit of my limited knowledge did you want me to share?
[04:03] <jtv> wallyworld_: don't worry, he doesn't mean the skill is rare.  He means it's rare for him to have a skill.
[04:03] <wallyworld_> pwned
[04:03] <jtv> I'm trying to invite you to a hangout, but your name is just too common...
[04:04]  * bigjools bends over
[04:05]  * wallyworld_ unzips
[04:05] <bigjools>  /everyone screams
[04:05] <wallyworld_> bigjools screams loudest
[04:06]  * bigjools loves the family channel atmosphere
[04:06] <jtv> Good thing you two are alone on a separate continent.  Now all we need to do is seal the exits and let you fight it out.
[04:07] <wallyworld_> bigjools: you started it
[04:07] <bigjools> wallyworld_: and you're going to finish it... oh wait you already did
[04:07] <bigjools> ;)
[04:15] <thumper> wallyworld_: hmm... don't really want to use host network
[04:15] <thumper> wallyworld_: weird shit happens
[04:15] <wallyworld_> thumper: otp to jtv
[04:15] <thumper> wallyworld_: I had a container with that config, didn't really start properly, and worse than that, when I did lxc-shutdown, it shut down the host
[04:16] <thumper> as in, my laptop
[04:17] <bigjools> haha
[04:22] <thumper> bigjools: I lost those links you pasted before
[04:22] <thumper> bigjools: got them handy?
[04:23] <bigjools> thumper: http://bj0z.wordpress.com/2011/08/19/howto-build-a-base-lxc-container-in-ubuntu-11-04/
[04:23] <bigjools> thumper: http://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/50201/how-to-configure-external-ip-addresses-for-lxc-guests
[04:36] <jtv> thumper: I let wallyworld_ go, so you can have him now.
[04:36] <wallyworld_> thumper: funny that your laptop shut down
[04:36] <wallyworld_> well, funny for me :-D
[05:18] <wallyworld_> thumper: well that sucks
[05:19] <thumper> wallyworld_: I'm sending an email out
[05:19] <thumper> end of day lack of progress email
[05:19] <wallyworld_> thumper: ni, i have a new peroblem
[05:19] <thumper> which is? trouble spelling?
[05:19] <wallyworld_> it seems you can't bridge to a wireless interface
[05:19] <wallyworld_> typing
[05:20] <wallyworld_> and when i tried doing it to my eth nic which is disconnected, it killed my connectivity
[05:20] <thumper> heh
[05:20] <wallyworld_> and i don't have a wired connection that is easily accessible :-(
[05:21] <wallyworld_> i mean, it's 2013 after all
[05:23] <thumper> :)
[05:23]  * thumper signs off until the meeting
[07:34] <TheMue> dimitern: you've seen, I handled your review yesterday evening
[07:34] <TheMue> dimitern: morning btw
[07:38] <dimitern> TheMue: morning :)
[07:38] <dimitern> TheMue: yeah, except one suggestion about table based tests
[07:39] <rogpeppe> mornin' all
[07:39] <dimitern> rogpeppe: moin
[07:39] <dimitern> TheMue: https://codereview.appspot.com/11588043/diff/6001/environs/sync/sync_test.go#newcode85
[07:42] <TheMue> dimitern: yep, they haven't been table driven in the old original synctools code. this cl is intended to only move the logic with as less changes as possible.
[07:43] <TheMue> rogpeppe: morning, reviewed your ...4045 yesterday
[07:43] <axw> morning
[07:43] <rogpeppe> TheMue: yup, saw that, thanks a lot! branch is landing now.
[07:43] <rogpeppe> axw: hiya
[07:44] <dimitern> TheMue: so don't you think converting them to a table-based test will improve the code, and reduce it a lot?
[07:45] <dimitern> axw: hey
[07:46] <TheMue> dimitern: maybe in another cl, but i dislike mixing two intentions in one cl
[07:47] <TheMue> dimitern: but i'm also no real fan of table-driven tests. here you often need extra effort to follow failing tests, e.g. add the output of an index or description to see which of the tests is failing
[07:48] <dimitern> TheMue: well, instead of like 6 tests which are almost identical, you can have a 6-element table and a single case testing all cases
[07:48] <dimitern> TheMue: but anyway, please at least add a TODO about that
[07:50] <TheMue> dimitern: shouldn't it be a CANDO? ;)
[07:51] <dimitern> TheMue: well, you asked me for a review :P
[07:52] <dimitern> TheMue: i think it should be done, not necessarily by you
[07:52] <dimitern> TheMue: but having a TODO at the right place is helpful to remember
[07:54] <TheMue> dimitern: will change it to TDT so you've got your peace. but I still have the opinion that they are worse readable and followable in case of a fail. the only positive part is writing less code.
[07:55] <dimitern> TheMue: let's agree to disagree then :)
[07:55] <TheMue> dimitern: and btw, SetUpTest and TearDownTest have to be moved inside the loop this way. instead using the mechanisms of all mature test frameworks
[07:56] <dimitern> TheMue: when I have some time, I'll do it and show you how better it looks ;)
[07:57] <rogpeppe> TheMue: FWIW i agree strongly with dimitern in this case
[07:57] <rogpeppe> TheMue: with the non-table test I have to scan very carefully for subtle differences between the test cases
[07:57] <dimitern> rogpeppe: I knew you would
[07:57] <dimitern> rogpeppe: that block there is almost 1-1 ready for a table
[07:58] <rogpeppe> TheMue: whereas if it was a table i could look at one single piece of code, and then look at the changing data independently
[07:58] <davecheney> evening
[07:58] <dimitern> davecheney: morning :)
[07:59] <rogpeppe> TheMue: for the setup/teardown thing, you can call SetUpTest and TearDownTest within the test itself, which can work (i usually define Reset as {Teardown; Setup})
[07:59] <rogpeppe> davecheney: hey boss
[07:59] <TheMue> rogpeppe: but i have to identify the test data that caused the fail. often enough found tests where i had to count tests myself instead just reading the source
[07:59] <rogpeppe> TheMue: that's why we usually put an "about" field in the table
[07:59] <rogpeppe> TheMue: and log it
[08:00] <dimitern> +1
[08:00] <thumper> rogpeppe: that sounds terrible
[08:00] <thumper> rogpeppe: why not just have an independent test?
[08:00] <TheMue> thumper: +1
[08:00] <TheMue> :D
[08:00] <dimitern> gents, meeting time
[08:01] <rogpeppe> thumper: because in this case there are 110 almost-duplicated and non-trivial lines of test code
[08:01] <rogpeppe> thumper: which could probably be reduced to a single function with a static data table
[08:01] <rogpeppe> thumper: personally i think that's a win
[08:04] <rogpeppe> axw: ping
[08:04] <dimitern> axw: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/bf3f4cfe715017bf60521d59b0628e5873f2a1d3
[08:04] <thumper> axw: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/bf3f4cfe715017bf60521d59b0628e5873f2a1d3
[08:05] <axw> ?
[08:05] <axw> brt
[08:05] <rogpeppe> axw: team meeting
[08:05] <axw> ah
[08:05] <thumper> axw: yeah, but no one invited you :)
[08:07] <davecheney> https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1eeHzbtyt_4dlKQMof-vRfplMWMrClBx32k6BFI-77MI/edit#
[08:13] <davecheney> mramm: hey there
[08:14] <davecheney> we're having a meetiong
[08:14] <davecheney> wanna come ?
[08:14] <mramm> hey
[08:14] <mramm> trying for the last bit
[08:57] <wallyworld> thumper: got 5?
[08:57] <thumper> wallyworld: for you, maybe even six
[08:57] <thumper> wallyworld: hangout or irc?
[08:57] <wallyworld> rejoin thehangout
[08:58] <rogpeppe> i'm looking for a review of this, please: https://codereview.appspot.com/11800044/
[08:58] <dimitern> rogpeppe: on it
[08:58] <rogpeppe> dimitern: thanks
[09:14] <dimitern> rogpeppe: reviewed
[09:15] <rogpeppe> dimitern: thanks
[09:31] <rogpeppe> looking for a second review of https://codereview.appspot.com/11800044/ if anyone cares to take a look
[09:42] <fwereade> rogpeppe, https://codereview.appspot.com/11800044/ reviewed, just one question
[09:44] <rogpeppe> fwereade: no particular reason other than it doesn't seem like it's necessary for state to define every possible interface that a client might use
[09:44] <rogpeppe> fwereade: but i'll move it the interface to state if you'd prefer
[09:45] <fwereade> rogpeppe, I agree that it's not quite right as it stands, but I'd be happiest if we at least kept those bits all together
[09:46] <fwereade> rogpeppe, LGTM with that then
[09:46] <rogpeppe> fwereade: thanks
[09:46] <jtv> Damn, I was about to approve that one.  :)
[09:46] <jtv> fwereade: you wanted a chat about instance-type selection in Azure?
[10:07] <axw> night folks
[10:11] <fwereade> jtv, yeah, sorry -- I was just wondering whether anything sprang to mind re possible unifications of the various don't-deploy-worthless-instances implementations
[10:11] <fwereade> jtv, IIRC there's something in openstack and ec2, as well as azure now
[10:12] <fwereade> jtv, (this is not a request for you to do more work, just a quick check to see if there's stuff in your brain that should maybe also be in mine)
[10:12] <jtv> What do you mean by worthless?
[10:12] <jtv> You mean, for setting a minimal baseline spec?
[10:12] <fwereade> jtv, unlikely to be useful
[10:12] <fwereade> jtv, yeah
[10:12] <jtv> Hmm...
[10:12] <jtv> That does look as if it ought to be the same story for every cloud, doesn't it?
[10:13] <fwereade> jtv, it does rather
[10:13] <jtv> It seems like a simple problem technically...  Just one function that everyone could call.
[10:13] <fwereade> jtv, and I have a feeling that at least one of them tries with the baseline and then falls back to whatever-it-can-get rather than just refusing
[10:14] <fwereade> jtv, yeah -- I don't intend to schedule anything now, just to remember it as something to bear in mind
[10:14] <fwereade> jtv, would you add a tech-debt bug please? and link it in the CL?
[10:21] <jtv> OK
[10:23] <TheMue> dimitern: the CL just landed again with table driven tests. ;) you can take a look?
[10:23] <dimitern> TheMue: which one was it?
[10:24] <TheMue> dimitern: https://codereview.appspot.com/11588043
[10:24] <m_3> davecheney: hey man, you around?
[10:27] <dimitern> TheMue: that's great, but my comment was not about cmd/juju/synctools_test.go, but about environs/sync/sync_test.go :)
[10:27] <jtv> fwereade: I filed bug 1204851 — now how do I link it to the CL?
[10:27] <_mup_> Bug #1204851: Different providers set different baseline instance constraints <tech-debt> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1204851>
[10:27] <fwereade> jtv, sorry, I just mean to mention it in there somewhere
[10:27] <dimitern> jtv: from LP's MP directly
[10:27] <TheMue> dimitern: so next round ;)
[10:28] <TheMue> dimitern: but why didn't mentioned you that for synctools_test? :P
[10:28] <dimitern> TheMue: because they were less and not so obviously similar
[10:28] <fwereade> dimitern, I don't think that's quite right, this CL doesn't actually address it -- it's just the thing that caused us to think "yeah, this should exist"
[10:29] <dimitern> fwereade: sorry?
[10:30] <TheMue> dimitern: they are even more similar than in sync_test
[10:30] <fwereade> dimitern, I don't think it's very useful to have the bug linked to the CL, because the CL doesn't address the bug; but IME it *is* useful to be able to look back at a CL and see that it spawned a bug
[10:30] <dimitern> TheMue: so good that you did them as well, no?
[10:30] <dimitern> fwereade: ah, I don't really know, I was just answering jtv's question, I think
[10:31] <TheMue> dimitern: please rephrase
[10:31] <fwereade> dimitern, yeah, you were just missing a spot of context
[10:31] <dimitern> fwereade: most likely
[10:31] <dimitern> TheMue: i meant "it was good that you've seen the similarity there and found a way to refactor them into a table-based test"
[10:32] <TheMue> dimitern: ah, ack
[10:33] <jtv> Argh.  Can we get another gwacl update on the build machine?
[10:43] <dimitern> jtv: on it
[10:43] <jtv> Thanks.  I'll send the email.
[10:44] <dimitern> jtv: thanks
[10:44] <dimitern> jtv: oops :)
[10:44] <dimitern> jtv: i meant "done"
[10:44] <jtv> Then thank you too.  :))
[10:44] <dimitern> jtv: np
[11:30] <dimitern> mgz, rogpeppe, TheMue, fwereade: standup
[11:31] <mgz> ta
[11:34] <dimitern> rogpeppe: standup
[11:41] <mgz> hm, Addresses in state/open.go currently uses st.db.Session.LiveServers()... what's that do exactly? I'd want machine ids to get detailed address info
[12:08] <benji> gary_poster: not that I'm aware of
[12:09] <benji> pffe
[12:14] <dimitern> fwereade: I cannot use StateInfo in apiserver
[12:39] <dimitern> rogpeppe: any idea for a workaround getting the addresses?
[12:39] <rogpeppe> dimitern: why can't you use StateInfo in apiserver?
[12:40] <dimitern> rogpeppe: it needs a bootstrapped environment
[12:40] <rogpeppe> dimitern: isn't the environment bootstrapped by the time the api server starts?
[12:40] <dimitern> rogpeppe: provider-config file in the bucket
[12:40] <dimitern> rogpeppe: and moreover, it's a client api
[12:41] <dimitern> rogpeppe: it's not supposed to be run on the server
[12:41] <dimitern> rogpeppe: how to test it?
[12:41] <rogpeppe> dimitern: it'll still work though, as a temporary hack, won't it?
[12:42] <rogpeppe> dimitern: how are any of the api server calls which use an Environ tested?
[12:42] <dimitern> rogpeppe: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5911031/
[12:42] <dimitern> rogpeppe: none of apiserver calls use the environ, except for the upgrader
[12:42] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i thought deploy did
[12:43] <dimitern> rogpeppe: no
[12:44] <rogpeppe> dimitern: Client.ServiceDeploy definitely does
[12:44] <dimitern> rogpeppe: let me see
[12:46] <rogpeppe> dimitern: hmm, i *think* it should work
[12:46] <dimitern> rogpeppe: no, it doesn't
[12:46] <dimitern> rogpeppe: not StateInfo or anything provider specific at least
[12:46] <dimitern> rogpeppe: and that's what I need
[12:47] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i don't see why
[12:47] <rogpeppe> dimitern: can't you call NewConnFromState?
[12:47] <dimitern> rogpeppe: why do I need that?
[12:48] <rogpeppe> dimitern: because a Conn contains an Environ
[12:48] <dimitern> rogpeppe: NewConnFromState essentially calls environs.New(cfg)
[12:48] <rogpeppe> dimitern: yes
[12:48] <dimitern> rogpeppe: I'm doing this:
[12:49] <rogpeppe> dimitern: the api server doesn't have environ credentials when it first bootstraps, so the StateAddresses call will fail until the credentials are pushed, but i don't *think* that's a problem because we won't be using StateAddresses until the first connection has been made. this is my only concern.
[12:49] <dimitern> rogpeppe: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5911043/
[12:49] <dimitern> rogpeppe: and StateInfo fails with "provider-config" not found
[12:49] <dimitern> rogpeppe: which happens at bootstrap time
[12:49] <rogpeppe> dimitern: oh god, StateInfo is non-provider-specific now
[12:50] <rogpeppe> dimitern: that's broken
[12:50] <dimitern> rogpeppe: why?
[12:50] <rogpeppe> dimitern: because the local provider doesn't store anything in the private bucket
[12:50] <dimitern> rogpeppe: I don't see how this matters
[12:51] <rogpeppe> dimitern: you're using StateInfo wrong
[12:51] <rogpeppe> dimitern: you need to call env.StateInfo()
[12:51] <dimitern> rogpeppe: I'll try
[12:51] <rogpeppe> dimitern: environs.StateInfo is just a way for providers to implement Environ.StateInfo
[12:54] <dimitern> rogpeppe: now only APIAddresses test fails
[12:54] <dimitern> rogpeppe: and each time the port is different, as reported by StateInfo
[12:55] <rogpeppe> dimitern: that's expected, i think
[12:55] <dimitern> rogpeppe: actually I think State.APIAddresses is too lazy
[12:55] <dimitern> rogpeppe: it just replaces the port
[12:55] <rogpeppe> dimitern: oh yes, that's true
[12:55] <dimitern> rogpeppe: and returns the same host as the state address
[12:55] <dimitern> rogpeppe: I can hack it a bit to get the actual port
[12:55] <rogpeppe> dimitern: where the dummy provider starts the API server on a random port
[12:58] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i think we should actually store the API addresses in the state
[12:59] <dimitern> rogpeppe: yeah, perhaps, but until then I need a workaround
[12:59] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i'm not sure there is one
[12:59] <rogpeppe> dimitern: how can the state know what port number has been allocated by the dummy provider?
[13:00] <rogpeppe> dimitern: isn't it quite trivial to add a State.SetAPIAddresses method?
[13:01] <dimitern> rogpeppe: I did it
[13:01] <rogpeppe> dimitern: cool!
[13:01] <dimitern> rogpeppe: using JujuConn.APIInfo() in the test
[13:01] <dimitern> rogpeppe: instead of s.State.APIAddresses
[13:01] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i thought the test was testing APIAddresses...
[13:01] <dimitern> rogpeppe: it was, but not anymore
[13:02] <dimitern> rogpeppe: it's testing what's in the api info, the same as reported back
[13:02] <dimitern> rogpeppe: will live test it now and see
[13:02] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i'll reserve judgement until i see the CL :-)
[13:21] <TheMue> dimitern: so, more table driven testing
[13:23] <dimitern> rogpeppe: live tests work!
[13:23] <dimitern> TheMue: will take a look soon
[13:24] <TheMue> dimitern: thx
[13:25] <rogpeppe> dimitern: cool. am at lunch BTW
[13:33] <dimitern> TheMue: reviewed
[13:37] <dimitern> rogpeppe, fwereade: https://codereview.appspot.com/11800045/
[13:41] <TheMue> dimitern: thx
[14:20] <dimitern> fwereade: ping
[14:21] <fwereade> dimitern, pong
[14:21] <dimitern> fwereade: can you take a look please? ^^
[14:22] <fwereade> dimitern, ah, sorry
[14:22] <dimitern> rogpeppe: you as well, after lunch?
[14:23] <rogpeppe> dimitern: looking
[14:23] <dimitern> thanks guys
[14:30] <dimitern> ok, mu mouse officially acts weird lately - a single click is frequently a double click and it drops while dragging and still holding the left button... hmm need a screw driver
[14:32] <mgz> I find drag and drop harder with a screwdriver than a mouse
[14:32] <dimitern> lol
[14:41]  * TheMue dcc's dimitern his BT mouse, isn't needed anymore
[14:47]  * dimitern bbi1h
[14:51] <dimitern> (or so.. dentist)
[14:54] <fwereade> dimitern, you'll have a review waiting when yuo return
[14:57] <fwereade> does anyone recall the justification for CanDeploy?
[15:07] <rogpeppe> dimitern: you have a review
[15:08] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i remember the justification for CanDeploy
[15:09] <fwereade> rogpeppe, oh yes?
[15:09] <rogpeppe> fwereade: it's because if we implemented AssignedMachineId(unitTag) in API (which is what the deployer previously used) it's a bit of a security leak
[15:09] <fwereade> rogpeppe, but CanDeploy itself doesn't need to exist AFAICS
[15:09] <rogpeppe> fwereade: because it means any machine agent can ask for the assigned id of any unit
[15:10] <rogpeppe> fwereade: well yes, i was puzzling over why we checked AssignedMachineId in the first place
[15:10] <fwereade> rogpeppe, what does CanDeploy do that isn't already done with UnauthorizedErrors?
[15:11]  * rogpeppe checks
[15:11] <fwereade> rogpeppe, it's just a big copy of the deployer's authfunc as far as I can see
[15:11] <fwereade> rogpeppe, it's just really well obfuscated ;p
[15:11] <rogpeppe> fwereade: the deployer's authfunc?
[15:12] <fwereade> rogpeppe, deployer.go:53
[15:13]  * rogpeppe looks in api*server*/deployer/deployer.go:53 :-)
[15:13] <fwereade> rogpeppe, ha, sorry
[15:13] <rogpeppe> fwereade: no, it's different to that
[15:13] <fwereade> rogpeppe, ah, ok, which units will be handled differently?
[15:14] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i *think* the case it's dealing with is when we get told about a unit by the watcher but that unit is no longer assigned to this machine
[15:15] <fwereade> rogpeppe, we'll get an unauthorized out of Life in that case
[15:15] <rogpeppe> fwereade: oh sorry, i didn't read far enough
[15:17] <rogpeppe> fwereade: wow, that getAuthFunc does quite a lot of work
[15:18] <fwereade> rogpeppe, the theory is that watchers are cheap
[15:19] <fwereade> rogpeppe, if not, getAllUnits can be tuned on its own
[15:22] <rogpeppe> fwereade: i suspect that making a set from the results of getAllUnits is vast premature optimisation, but i take your point
[15:22] <rogpeppe> fwereade: yes, i don't see any point in CanDeploy
[15:23] <fwereade> rogpeppe, I think it's more about clarity of expression than runtime optimization
[15:23] <fwereade> rogpeppe, cool, thanks
[15:26] <rogpeppe> fwereade: personally i think it's just as clear (+ shorter + more correct) this way, but YMMV. http://paste.ubuntu.com/5911521/
[15:29] <fwereade> rogpeppe, I think it's maybe implemented a little awkwardly -- would be nicer to build the set from units directly -- but I can't generally ever get very enthusiastic about replacing N map lookups with N linear searches
[15:29] <fwereade> rogpeppe, not to say it's never justified
[15:30] <rogpeppe> fwereade: the thing is currently N=1
[15:30] <rogpeppe> fwereade: so we lose out by building the set
[15:31] <fwereade> rogpeppe, I'd rather pay the fixed costs now and have something that stays sane as N grows
[15:31] <fwereade> rogpeppe, if the fixed costs become a problem we can revisit it ;p
[15:32] <rogpeppe> fwereade: seems like premature optimisation to me but there y'go
[15:32] <rogpeppe> fwereade: it's never gonna be a bottleneck
[17:03]  * rogpeppe is off for a bit of bouldering
[17:03] <rogpeppe> see y'all tomorrow
[17:13]  * fwereade is off too
[21:15] <sidnei> oh, wow. got a panic!
[21:16] <thumper> panic!
[21:16] <thumper> panic!
[21:16] <thumper> that type?
[21:17] <sidnei> panic: runtime error: comparing uncomparable type map[string]interface {}
[21:17] <sidnei> thumper: https://pastebin.canonical.com/95058/
[21:18] <thumper> sidnei: what were you doing?
[21:18] <sidnei> thumper: juju set u1-public-gallery general.environment_name=staging -e local
[21:19] <thumper> hmm... local provider
[21:19] <thumper> ?
[21:19] <thumper> can I get you to file a bug with as much info as possible?
[21:19] <sidnei> thumper: was about to :)
[21:23] <sidnei> thumper: https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1205112
[21:23] <_mup_> Bug #1205112: panic while setting a config value <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1205112>
[21:23] <thumper> ta
[21:24] <sidnei> thumper: somewhat related, seems like positional arguments are not supported for juju get?
[21:24] <thumper> sidnei: what do you mean?
[21:25] <sidnei> $ juju get u1-public-gallery general.environment_name -e local
[21:25] <sidnei> error: unrecognized args: ["general.environment_name"]
[21:25] <sidnei> to get a single setting
[21:27] <thumper> hmm...
[21:27] <thumper> seems like a reasonable request
[21:27] <thumper> file a bug :-)
[21:32] <sidnei> so, deploying the services needed to run a tiny part of u1 takes 18G of disk space
[21:33] <sidnei> fun
[21:34] <thumper> haha
[21:34] <thumper> wow
[21:35] <thumper> why so much?
[21:35] <sidnei> 16 containers
[21:35] <sidnei> i guess none of this uses overlays
[21:36] <sidnei> right? each container is a full base install?
[21:37] <thumper> yeah
[21:38] <thumper> I think there may be plans to use overlays later
[21:38] <thumper> once we get the basics working
[21:39] <sidnei> or ephemeral containers yeah
[21:44] <sidnei> thumper: did you talk to any of the tsuru guys?
[21:44] <thumper> no I haven't
[21:45] <sidnei> they are using docker to snapshot things so that add-unit is instantaneous
[21:45] <sidnei> not hooked up to juju, but working around it
[21:46] <sidnei> iiuc they start a unit directly with docker stab a charm into it then snapshot it
[21:47] <thumper> so they are using charms, but not juju?
[21:48] <sidnei> thumper: they are using juju to provision machines in ec2/openstack but only the provisioning part, then they inject charms into those machines, iiuc
[21:49] <sidnei> still on pyjuju because they have a branch with vpc that they depend on
[21:49] <sidnei> im looking at getting it moved to gojuju using the api directly instead of shelling out, since it's all in go
[21:49] <sidnei> but the lack of vpc is a blocker
[21:50]  * thumper nods
[21:51] <sidnei> haven't looked into how much tied to docker they are, maybe local provider is good enough
[21:53]  * sidnei wonders if flaviami_ is around
[23:09] <wallyworld> thumper: z'up
[23:18] <thumper> hi wallyworld
[23:18] <thumper> trying stuff
[23:18] <wallyworld> any luck?
[23:20] <thumper> can't seem to log into it
[23:21] <wallyworld> :-(
[23:22] <wallyworld> i pissed my mp still hasn't been given the 2nd +1
[23:22] <thumper> which one
[23:22] <wallyworld> if you're going to hold it up, you need to be responsive to changes
[23:22] <wallyworld> the simple streams validation
[23:23] <thumper> no response from the other reviewer?
[23:23] <wallyworld> nope. i mentioned it on the standup too
[23:23] <thumper> ok, see if you can get a +1 from davecheney or jtv1 or bigjools
[23:23] <wallyworld> and made sure my latest changes were ready for looking at
[23:23] <thumper> failing that, I'd say land it and do a post landing review if needed
[23:23]  * wallyworld checks to see if there's enough beer
[23:24] <wallyworld> the remaining stuff is more bikeshed than critical
[23:25] <wallyworld> thumper: the latest lxc email - the suggested network config looks like the setup i used for bridging
[23:25] <wallyworld> with no luck
[23:28] <thumper> what was the problem with yours?
[23:31] <wallyworld> thumper: i just hung like yours did
[23:31] <wallyworld> lxc-attach worked
[23:32] <wallyworld> but i had no eth cable plugged in
[23:32] <wallyworld> not sure if it didn't like that
[23:33] <wallyworld> i've got access to the qa lab now though
[23:34] <wallyworld> but i need to check with mgz where i can ssh to
[23:34] <thumper> I have an ec2 instance up that I'm playing with manually
[23:34] <thumper> resetting the networking etc
[23:36] <wallyworld> you would need to reboot it after changing /etc/network/interfaces, no?
[23:36] <wallyworld> or just restart networking i guess
[23:36] <thumper> I just restarted networking
[23:36] <thumper> and the ssh connection stayed valid
[23:36] <thumper> so that is good I guess
[23:44] <thumper> wallyworld: I need to be away for a bit
[23:44] <thumper> mind needs to mull this over
[23:44] <thumper> also taking kids to a thing in tow
[23:44] <thumper> n
[23:44] <thumper> back later
[23:44] <wallyworld> ok
[23:45] <wallyworld> let's catch up when you get back