[12:08] <sebsebseb> hi
[13:30] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[13:30] <nigelb> Hello everyone!
[13:30] <silvertip257> morning :)
[13:31] <nigelb> Welcome to our fourth Ubuntu User Day event! https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays
[13:31] <jemparing> helo :)
[13:31] <nigelb> The User Days Team has been working hard these past few weeks in order to bring you these 12 sessions.
[13:31] <sebsebseb> Hello
[13:31] <nigelb> Now, we have members from many teams in the Ubuntu community here today who have graciously volunteered to share their knowledge with all of us.
[13:32] <nigelb> Before we begin, we would like to get a quick feel for who is here. If you are here, please say your name and where you are from.
[13:32] <sebsebseb> Sebastian from England
[13:32] <nigelb> I'm Nigel from India btw :)
[13:32] <pleia2> and I'm Elizabeth from California (where it's 6:30AM ;))
[13:33] <robb_billy> Robert from Romania :)
[13:33] <silvertip257> Mike from Pennsylvania
[13:33] <nabilinux> Hi, I am Nabil from Morocco
[13:33] <fhassouneh> Fouad from Newfoundland, Canada :)
[13:33] <jemparing> Hadri Malaysia
[13:33] <nigelb> Excellent!
[13:34] <nigelb> Its great to see a good international turnout
[13:34] <nigelb> A few of you are probably wondering what User Days are all about.
[13:35] <nigelb> User Days were created to be sets of classes offered during a one day period to teach the beginning or intermediate Ubuntu user the basics in order to get them started using Ubuntu. This includes:
[13:35] <nigelb> Finding Help in Ubuntu, Accessibility Apps, Command Line Basics, Unity, ...
[13:35] <nigelb> ...and more! For our full schedule head over to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays
[13:36] <nigelb> User Days were born out of a discussion at the Ubuntu Developers Summit in November 2009 regarding Ubuntu Open Week not being targeted enough at users.
[13:36] <nigelb> (This however is now changing. From this cycle on Ubuntu Open Week will be targeted at users)
[13:37] <pleia2> thanks nigelb, now for a quick rundown of how today will work:
[13:37] <pleia2> Each hour, an instructor will be giving a class in this channel, #ubuntu-classroom
[13:37] <pleia2> During the classes, #ubuntu-classroom will be moderated (+m). This means that only the instructor and hosts will be able to talk in the channel.
[13:37] <pleia2> (we are -m right now for the intro so people could say hello and where they were from :))
[13:37] <pleia2> Any discussion about the class should take place #ubuntu-classroom-chat
[13:38] <pleia2> If you have a question during the class, please ask in #ubuntu-classroom-chat. Be sure to prefix it with 'QUESTION:' to ensure that it gets noticed. For example:
[13:38] <pleia2> QUESTION: What are Ubuntu User Days?
[13:38] <pleia2> Anyone wanna give it a try? :)
[13:38] <ClassBot> nigelb asked: Do you like cats?
[13:39] <pleia2> why yes! and I have two of them :)
[13:39] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: Do you like dogs?
[13:39] <pleia2> dogs are lovely too!
[13:39] <pleia2> these questions aren't immediately posted, I opened up a query with ClassBot to paste them in channel
[13:40] <pleia2> each instructor will do this at their own pace, no need to repeat your question if you haven't seen it yet, it's probably still in the question queue
[13:40] <pleia2> After each session, our group of volunteers will post the IRC logs to the wiki as soon as possible.
[13:40] <pleia2> So if you miss a session or just want to review what you learned, be sure to check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays for links to logs that our volunteers will put up as soon as they are able
[13:40] <pleia2> If you can't wait, Logs will also be automatically posted on http://irclogs.ubuntu.com near the end of each hour.
[13:41] <pleia2> Please be sure to remind all of your friends and family who might be interested in using Ubuntu that this event is taking place today. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays/JoiningIn has some information about how they can participate.
[13:41] <nigelb> Thanks pleia2.
[13:42] <nigelb> If you think your IRC client is noisy, the Joining In page linked about has some information for most of the common clients.
[13:42] <nigelb> Finally, before we move on to answering any more questions about Ubuntu User Days that you might have, I would like to give a big thanks to everyone who has helped make this day possible.
[13:42] <nigelb> It simply would not have been possible to organize this event without all of their help :)
[13:43] <nigelb> Finally, at the end of the day, please take some time to fill out our survey! We will use the results to help make the next Ubuntu User Day event even better. http://goo.gl/bryxq
[13:43] <nigelb> Now, does anyone have any general questions about the day?
[13:45] <pleia2> btw, you will notice that one of the questions on the survey is related to whether we'll keep running User Days now that Open Week is very similar, so if you feel strongly about keeping this event alive, please let us know :)
[13:46] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: Why is this users day so close to the 11.10 release?
[13:46] <pleia2> availability of volunteers to run it and in July we had lots of other Classroom events going on
[13:46] <sebsebseb> and then another Open Week after the release
[13:46] <pleia2> if there is another User Days, we'll try to do it earlier in the cycle (probably January)
[13:47] <nigelb> Most of us volunteers were a bit busy to handle it earlier in the cycle, that's all.
[13:47] <sebsebseb> ok
[13:49] <pleia2> any other questions?
[13:50] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[13:50] <sebsebseb> not from me
[13:50] <ClassBot> jedijf asked: How do we thank you for doing this?
[13:51] <pleia2> I'll be in Philly on Oneiric release day, parties are good :)
[13:51] <jedijf> lol, you got it!
[13:55] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[13:57] <nabilinux> Thank you for your understanding, it's the first time that I use this tool!
[13:58] <nabilinux> I mean the messaging tool is new to me
[13:58] <sebsebseb> nabilinux: Which tool? IRC?
[13:58] <nabilinux> The one that I am using right now
[14:00] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[14:03] <pleia2> ok, it looks like our instructor DBO is running late, until he arrives we're going to turn this session into a general Ubuntu Q&A
[14:06] <pleia2> so, does anyone have any Ubuntu project questions? (not support :))
[14:07] <ClassBot> jsjgruber-l-onei asked:  The most basic question: Why should someone run Ubuntu?
[14:07] <nigelb> heh, good one.
[14:08] <nigelb> Everyone person running Ubuntu will probably give you a different answer.
[14:08] <nigelb> Because, well, there are *so* many reasons
[14:08] <pleia2> a few of my family members prefer it because it has the software center that makes installing stuff easy (and free!)
[14:09] <pleia2> they also like that they haven't gotten any viruses which slow down their computer :)
[14:10] <nigelb> I've found that Ubuntu is a great environment to code in, that's why I use it.
[14:11] <pleia2> driver support for things like printers has gotten better too, so instead of having a disk to install a printer driver like in some other OSes, you can just select from a dropdown of already installed drivers
[14:12] <pleia2> I like using it because there are lots of options for configuration, lots of different desktop options :)
[14:12] <pleia2> and I'm sure there are dozens of other reasons why people use Ubuntu!
[14:12] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: What do you both personally think of Unity pleia2 and nigelb and why?
[14:13] <nigelb> I like it :) Though I tend to usually just work on terminals for the most part.
[14:13] <pleia2> I'm an Xubuntu project member, I've never even really used Gnome classic, didn't make the move to Unity, still using Xfce
[14:14] <pleia2> but the betas for oneiric I've tried here and there were pretty nice, and I really like how keybinding driven it can be
[14:14] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: What about Gnome Shell pleia2 and nigelb? Which I know isn't  really in 11.04, but there's the ppa, but will be in the repos for 11.10 as an option.
[14:14] <nigelb> Never tried it.
[14:15] <pleia2> neither have I
[14:15] <ClassBot> Bauwan asked:  Will shortcut super+F for showing last used files work in 11.10? In beta1 I tested it and it seemed gone.
[14:15] <pleia2> if our Unity guy makes it we'll pass this question along to him (unless you know, nigelb?)
[14:15] <nigelb> Nope, sorry.
[14:15] <nigelb> (I mean I don't know)
[14:15] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: Why do you think a new user straight from Windows or Mac OS X should go for Ubuntu, rather then well well many other distributions that are also pretty user friendly?
[14:17] <nigelb> Ubuntu has enough users that there is good documenation and support available than a most other distros. I think sites like askubuntu.com with a good community drive would be another reason.
[14:17] <pleia2> and you have pretty much every option for support in ubuntu, we're not restricted to mailing lists or forums as a main avenue of support
[14:19] <pleia2> and I happen to think it's one of the best options out there ;) but I suppose personal preference doesn't mean a whole lot
[14:19] <ClassBot> Bauwan asked:  What about a new icon-theme for Ubuntu? Is that on your timeline? Design-team already on it to surprise us until 12.04? ;)
[14:19] <pleia2> unfortunately I haven't kept up with this
[14:20] <pleia2> any comments, nigelb?
[14:21] <nigelb> No, I'm a bit detached from those developments
[14:22] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: I know pleia2 is doing a session later about KDE and XFCE4, but what about LXDE/Lubuntu have either of you used it, what you think of it?  Plus it became officaly recognised by Canonical with 11.04 I think it was.
[14:23] <pleia2> LXDE is nice, light-weight (Xfce doesn't really strive for that anymore)
[14:23] <pleia2> it's first official release will be with 11.10
[14:23] <pleia2> well, recognised and using all the ubuntu resources
[14:24] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: XFCE doesn't really strive to be light-waight anymore, meaning what exactly?
[14:25] <pleia2> one of the benefits of Xubuntu used to be that it ran better on older systems, while it can still be slimmed down more than gnome-based systems, by default some of the recent benchmarks these past few years showed it's similar to gnome2
[14:26] <pleia2> so you won't find the light-weight comment on the Xubuntu website these days, it's really geared toward being an alternative that's more (and easily!) customizable
[14:28] <pleia2> more questions? :)
[14:28] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: Some people think that Gnome 2 can be replaced with XFCE quite easilly now, because they are pretty similar, not quite similar enough for me to just be able to do that  though, but Ubuntu Studio will switch to XFCE from Gnome 2 for 11.10 I read before instead of using Gnome2/3/Unity/GnomeShell,  what do you think about all this any comments?
[14:30] <pleia2> yes, the Studio folks are switching to XFCE for 11.10, it may be a bit of a rough release though since it's the first one with a different desktop
[14:30] <pleia2> they'll be in great shape for 12.04 though
[14:30] <pleia2> I find Xfce to be a good replacement for Gnome2, but the feeling is not universal
[14:32] <pleia2> whatever happens, moving away from Gnome2 is a big step no matter where you go from there, Unity and Gnome Shell are a major UI change which the Studio people didn't feel would work well with what they were trying to achieve with Studio
[14:32] <pleia2> at the end of the day, part of the reason I use Linux is because we have so many options, it's exciting to see all this new development happening, and being able to work with people to change defaults if they don't like what they see
[14:33] <ClassBot> Bauwan asked:  I'm changing my parents computer from vista to Ubuntu with 11.10. Any tips what to teach them first to make them feel comfortable as fast as possible. What helps Ex-Windows/new Ubuntu users?
[14:34] <pleia2> the official documentation by the docs team was quite good in 11.04, so I might start them off there: https://help.ubuntu.com/11.04/ubuntu-help/index.html
[14:34] <pleia2> (or the 11.10 version once it's released)
[14:35] <pleia2> there have been some Unity cheat-sheets out there for getting familiar with the interface, but I'm afraid I don't have any current ones off-hand
[14:37] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: I know of one distribution that's going to actsaully let users choose betwen Gnome 2 and Gnome 3,  surely really a distro that is doing that, has quite an advantage over the distros that are only providing one of them?  Altough it seems most of them will just go and provide Gnome 3, and not bother with Gnome 2 or a fork of it.
[14:37] <pleia2> AFAIK the Gnome foundation won't be maintaining Gnome2 forever, so it'll be a lot of work to maintain it for feature upgrades, security and have new plugins still work (or keep the old ones patched)
[14:38] <nigelb> And the libraries as well.
[14:38] <pleia2> if one distro is doing it, that's quite impressive :) but it will get harder as the years go on
[14:38] <pleia2> Ubuntu has pretty much gone the future-looking route rather than trying to maintain older stuff
[14:43] <ClassBot> jsjgruber-l-onei asked:  A relative of mine likes Ubuntu but says he always has trouble getting it set up to play DVDs. Any advice on this?
[14:43] <pleia2> I'd suggest they head over to ubuntuforums.org to see if there is anyone who can help
[14:43] <pleia2> there is a beginners forum: http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=326
[14:44] <pleia2> my only suggestion is that they pay attention to the thread and cooperate with the people trying to help them :)
[14:44] <pleia2> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats may also be worth a read (if they haven't already)
[14:46] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: Do you think that Unity might eventually help make Ubuntu go a bit more main streame,  the new users straight from Windows or Mac OS X and quite a lot of them, but whilst not losing quite a few of the more expereinced users who don't really like Unity that much to other distributions, and yeah the kind who really like or liked Gnome 2 as well?  I mean 11.10 won't have Gnome 2 at all anymore, so I wonder what will happen,
[14:47] <pleia2> almost everyone I talk to about Unity at events and things say the same thing "I didn't like it at first, but once I got used to it I really liked it"
[14:47] <pleia2> so while I realize there are a lot of folks out there who don't like it, anecdotal evidence shows me that they're a loud minority
[14:48] <pleia2> I can't really speak to whether it will cause more Windows/OSX people to switch, I really don't know
[14:49] <pleia2> and again, it's not like Ubuntu has gotten rid of KDE and XFCE...they added LXDE! so you still have lots of options
[14:49] <pleia2> the new fluxbox is nice too, they have some new developers lately :)
[14:50] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[14:55] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[14:55] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: Let's say someone likes Ubuntu really, but wants to keep Gnome 2,  well 11.10 won't really be an option for them,  so what do you think they should do,  run a older version of Ubuntu  that still has Gnome 2 for a bit longer whilst it's still supported, or possbily use a Ubuntu based distro that is still  using Gnome 2?
[14:56] <pleia2> well, 10.04 is an LTS so that's supported for another 18 months
[14:57] <pleia2> there is also gnome-fallback is gnome3 which should look pretty similar to classic, I can't confirm it's ready for 11.10 though (again, I'm not much of a Gnome person :))
[14:57]  * starcraftman says hop ship to KDE :)
[14:59] <ClassBot> sebsebseb asked: I remember when Gnome 3 came out in April, and loads of people on the web, it was like they thought, they had to not use Gnome 2 anymore, because it was old,  even though loads of distros were still providing it,  and it seemed many people thought they had to go and use Gnome 3 already, or an alternative such as XFCE,  and I don't think there's anything wrong with using Gnome 2 still  as long as the distro is still having
[14:59] <pleia2> continued: security updates and such, what you think?
[15:00] <starcraftman> pleia2: you asking me?
[15:00] <pleia2> no one said there was anything wrong with Gnome 2, yes it's fine if you're using a distro that's still patching it, but Ubuntu is putting their effort into future development
[15:00] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[15:01] <starcraftman> Ok, want me to intro myself pleia2?
[15:01] <pleia2> yeah, go for it :)
[15:01] <pleia2> welcome starcraftman!
[15:02] <starcraftman> Hi folks, I'm a computer science student that lives up north in the great Canadian expanse (around Montreal). I'm a third year student and started in the Linux community quite a while ago. I started in support/documentation and will likely transition to development help when I'm a bit more free.
[15:03] <starcraftman> you can find more aobut me here > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/starcraft.man
[15:03] <starcraftman> (I don't actually endorse smoking, picture just really cool :) )
[15:04] <starcraftman> starcraft: Anyway, this session will be a bit impromptu for me, I got requested last minute. I'll be typing it on the fly.
[15:04] <starcraftman> Your free to ask questions as I go but I will only be answering them at the end of the session. I hope that's alright, want to be sure I get to all my material.
[15:05] <starcraftman> So, off we go.
[15:06] <starcraftman> Today's topic relates to Hardware and Buying for Linux computers. This isn't to say it's about finding support, but to avoid needing support altogether by buying machines that "just work" as people like to say about Windows and OSX/Macs.
[15:06] <starcraftman> I guess the starting question we really want to get into is why doesn't everything just naturally work with Linux out of the box like the other two main OS.
[15:07] <starcraftman> The answer is rather straightforward, Windows and OSX are supported by two massive companies who have the luxury of making corporate arrangements and affording large QA teams to guarantee that their hardware/software work together almost seemlessly. Apple has it even easier than Microsoft since they have such a small pool of hardware that they officially support and are the only legal hardware seller.
[15:08] <starcraftman> In addition to these complications, many manufacturers of hardware loathe disclosing things like product specifications and low level details for fear that the competition might use this to gain an advantage (though this seems less valid to me).
[15:10] <starcraftman> So, we'll be looking at how to research and buy hardware smartly that will avoid this mess entirely. We'll go over somet things you can do to improve (there are few guarantees in life) the chances of everyhting working out of the box.
[15:10] <starcraftman> Now, the crux of the question:  What hardware is guaranteed to work with Ubuntu ?
[15:11] <starcraftman> No strict guarantees but there are definite trends I've seen in my years at buying hardware for my own personal machines (desktops and notebooks).
[15:12] <starcraftman> Companies like Intel offer very strong support for the platform and have engineers that work to ensure support is good.
[15:12] <starcraftman> There are other companies like Nvidia that have a more uneasy relationship I suppose. Rather than contributing open source drivers like intel does, they have their own drivers released in a binary format.
[15:13] <starcraftman> Then of course there are some companies that just don't much care for open source, they don't get much money out of it and provide little to no support. A lot of proprietary wireless makers could fall here like broadcom who I've always had trouble with and avoid now in wireless area.
[15:13] <starcraftman> So where to go to know what is supported and working.
[15:14] <starcraftman> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport
[15:14] <starcraftman> Click the above link and take a look.
[15:14] <starcraftman> We have 3 options here I'll go into to get information when buying.
[15:15] <starcraftman> First is the Ubuntu Certification program. This is a program run by Canonical who works with their corporate partners to ensure that machines certified here work as a complete system.
[15:15] <starcraftman> That is they don't rate the hardware in particulare but the systems as a whole.
[15:16] <starcraftman> http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/ < Certified site.
[15:16] <starcraftman> Lets take a little test drive, and look at Dell.
[15:17] <starcraftman> Say we were looking for a notebook, we can click on the notebook link in the Dell row and get to > http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/make/Dell/laptops
[15:17] <starcraftman> From here we can peruse different models and see what was certified when. Note that each machine has versions listed. That indicates when it was tested.
[15:18] <starcraftman> If we were buying today we would look for those with the latest release (11.04 until the next one releases in october).
[15:18] <starcraftman> If you click the links you can see what OS and what notes were made at certificiation. I'll leave it to you to continue browsing at your leisure.
[15:18] <starcraftman> Next is Ubuntu Friendly.
[15:19] <starcraftman> This is more of a community oriented project, aimed at testing parts like the old hardware pages (I'll get to those in a minute).
[15:19] <starcraftman> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuFriendly
[15:19] <starcraftman> The project is still in the early stages but is promising and definitely something to look into at a later date.
[15:20] <starcraftman> At the bottom of the page you'll see the old (now discontinued) wiki pages that aimed to test particular hardware like printers, scanners, notebooks and such.
[15:21] <starcraftman> Say we were looking for Scanners , click that and then HP you get to > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupportComponentsScannersHp
[15:22] <starcraftman> This was the old way of rating hardware, a bit messy as one big table. I hope the new ubuntu friendly guys have a nicer presentation. These pages though discontinued do hold valuable information but it will likely be out of date and can't be perfectly relied upon the longer the time between it's testing and your purchase.
[15:22] <starcraftman> These are resources when your shopping from traditional makers that usually don't offer extensive support for Linux.
[15:23] <starcraftman> The alternative to this is buying from a Linux shop (usually smaller outfits) that will test and preload a linux distribution on their machines.
[15:23] <starcraftman> http://linuxpreloaded.com/
[15:23] <starcraftman> ^ This site has a fairly good list of retailers.
[15:24] <starcraftman> I've bought from 76 and know others who've used Zareason, good choices I'd say. Of course it's important to compare around and see what best fits your needs but these machines are  tested with linux and in general don't need any additional help with drivers.
[15:25] <starcraftman> my System76 notebook's wireless, webcam and bluetooth work without any extra steps on a clean install.
[15:25] <starcraftman> You can browse these at your own discretion and compare with other options.
[15:26]  * starcraftman is just taking a lil break to get some whater, been typing a lot.
[15:26] <starcraftman> and back.
[15:27] <starcraftman> Now, I guess we can go over a few guidelines that might help when shopping.
[15:27] <starcraftman> Rule 1: Don't break your system.
[15:28] <starcraftman> If your trying to get some new hardware working, be careful. If it's tricky and has some instructions asking you to compile, insert into the kernel and do other steps your not comfortable with be careful.
[15:28] <starcraftman> In general, if your not sure about it, don't blindly follow steps posted on the internet unless you trust the person (say it's posted by a community member like me or pleia2).
[15:29] <starcraftman> Rule 2: Search effectively over the net BEFORE purchasing.
[15:30] <starcraftman> I've said this before in my finding help session I deliver usually but it's a golden rule that remains true. If your having a problem, 99% of the time somebody else did before you.
[15:31] <starcraftman> This applies in particular to hardware, the difference is you should be looking for posts on the web, the wikis, forums and launchpad to  see people experience with particular hardware BEFORE buying. Once you give a company money, it's hard to negociate eh?
[15:32] <starcraftman> I'll cover more specifically how to get effective help in a later session in 5 hours or so, don't want to overlap too much so I'll just use a quick example.
[15:34] <starcraftman> Say I wanted to buy from dell and was looking at labtops, I could come across INspiron 15 found here > http://www.dell.com/us/p/inspiron-15-intel-n5040/pd
[15:34] <starcraftman> (Not that I'm endorsing Dell to be clear)
[15:34] <starcraftman> It's best to use the methods we've seen now to see how that would fair.
[15:35] <starcraftman> First we can go to the Ubuntu certified program and look under dell/labtops
[15:35] <starcraftman> http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/make/Dell/laptops
[15:36] <starcraftman> We see inspiron 15 models listed, we'd have to get a bit more specific but good to read them all and see how it is overall.
[15:36] <starcraftman> We can also google and see the results. The important bit is getting a general feeling for the rpoduct.
[15:37] <starcraftman> This advice comes with the caveat that there aren't any guarantees, so take everything with a grain of salt.
[15:37] <starcraftman> Rule 3: Professional vs Community Help
[15:38] <starcraftman> This ones a note from MagicFab, it's important to remember that Canonical does provide Support to users and businesses if the need exists. You can use these services to get help directly from people who know what they are talking about.
[15:38] <starcraftman> I've never used paid support but MagicFab used to be there so I'm sure it's pretty good :).
[15:39] <starcraftman> Community help would of course be things like  the Ubuntu Forums, the wiki and other unofficial pages like the Ubuntu friendly system.
[15:39] <starcraftman> Rule 4: Share your findings.
[15:40] <starcraftman> One of the best things about community is that people share. If you buy a labtop x and find there's a minor problem even if it was listed as ubuntu certified,  write about it.
[15:40] <starcraftman> Be it on your blog, on the wiki pages, to ubuntu-friendly, etc...
[15:40] <starcraftman> We can only get more information by sharing.
[15:41] <starcraftman> The last and most effective weapon/rule.
[15:41] <starcraftman> The live CD.
[15:41] <starcraftman> It's important to remember that any burt CD of Ubuntu is in fact a bootable live CD, this means you can try hardware on a show floor (with permission) without damaging it.
[15:42] <starcraftman> By booting up such a machine you'll see if the drivers for say wireless or webcam work out of the box.
[15:42] <starcraftman> Quite a handy trick.
[15:43] <starcraftman> Anyway, hmmm, that's quite a bit of information. I think that covers most of the bases.
[15:43] <starcraftman> Oh and just another example > http://castrojo.wordpress.com/2009/12/20/asus-eeetop-2002-and-ubuntu/
[15:44] <starcraftman> Many Linux members like to review their purchases, googling for "labtop model" and "ubuntu review" can often turn up good stuff.
[15:44] <starcraftman> I think that's about it now, I'll take questions for the last 15 minutes. Went faster than I thought.
[15:44] <starcraftman> Maybe I just type fast :)
[15:45] <ClassBot> lunzie asked:  are talks about freedom boxes on the table yet for ubuntu?
[15:46] <starcraftman> I think I want a bit of clarification on this question.
[15:48] <starcraftman> We'll interesting question, a bit tricky. There are various projects that have attempted to be entirely FLOSS over the years, the most prominent to my memory is > http://www.gnewsense.org/Main/HomePage
[15:48] <starcraftman> I can't attest to how well it runs, the problem with a FLOSS only distro is that an unfortunate reality is a lot of hardware is proprietary still.
[15:50] <starcraftman> This is where buying from companies that support Linux and FLOSS comes in. Companies like Intel and HP for printers giving direct opensource support need to be favoured over others. Ultimately corporations work based on demand and if the demand shifts to those who support FLOSS we'll get better hardware  drivers/support. Hopefully.
[15:50] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[15:50] <starcraftman> Hope that answers question.
[15:50] <ClassBot> rigved asked: what are your thoughts on the Emperor Linux vendor (http://emperorlinux.com/)?
[15:51] <starcraftman> Never used then rigved, so I can't really comment on how well they are. Nor do I know any friends off top of head who have.
[15:51] <starcraftman> Sorry.
[15:52] <ClassBot> lunzie asked:  is there a compatibility site to check peripheral equipment, like camcorders, say? I can't get my sony handycam to work as a webcam
[15:52] <starcraftman> I would say the best bet is Ubuntu friendly once that gets up and running completely. That should be our new repository for all individual hardware testing by the community.
[15:53] <starcraftman> The old site for hardware on wiki has a section of webcams > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupportComponentsMultimediaWebCameras
[15:53] <starcraftman> Also one for multimedia devices like cams > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupportComponentsMultimedia
[15:53] <starcraftman> Don't really have many other definite sites. Hope that helps.
[15:55] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[15:57] <starcraftman> Hope everyone enjoyed session, was a little more impromptu than I'd usually do. Happy shopping for Linux Machines :)
[15:58] <starcraftman> Oh and just a reminder, my later session will cover getting help kind of overlaps with this, I'll go over effective power searching google and finding help. Kinda fits with this topic.
[16:00] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[16:00] <akgraner> Hi I'm Amber Graner - or otherwise known as "akgraner"
[16:00] <akgraner> I've been involved in the Ubuntu Community since early 2009 when I started using Ubuntu and Blogging about my experience.
[16:01] <akgraner> Thanks for joining this session!
[16:01] <akgraner> Now I am a freelance journalist and write for publications such as Linux Pro and Ubuntu User Magazines (online and print), informIT, and I am one of the co-authors of "The Offical Ubuntu Book", by Pearson Publishing.
[16:01] <akgraner> When I started out in the Ubuntu Community I just used Ubuntu and blogged about my experience.  However, I wanted to contribute, but I was (and still am) not a developer - meaning, I don't write code, but I heard that there is a place for anyone to contribute to Ubuntu and I wanted to find out where.
[16:02] <akgraner> My first year I went a little overboard, so I don't recommend anyone taking on as much as I did my first year - that will lead to burnout (which is another talk I give but I digress).  My point is there are many, many, many places for non-developers to get involved with. I would stress that as you transition from End User Consumer (meaning you just use the OS) to End User Contributor you concentrate on doing one thing well rather than
[16:02] <akgraner>  many things half-way or so-so. (In other words don't be a jack-of-all-trades, but a master of none).
[16:02] <akgraner> I'm really excited to tell anyone who will listen that there is a place for everyone to contribute and participate and Contribute in the Ubuntu Community you just have to know where to look.
[16:02] <akgraner> This is an overview of all the areas of the community I had to go and find out about when I started is what I wish someone had given me.
[16:03] <akgraner> **** What is this talk about? ****
[16:03] <akgraner> This talk is about making you aware of all the areas that you can get involved in the Ubuntu Community as a contributor and the resources that help you make the conversion from consumer user to contributor user.   :-D
[16:04] <akgraner> **** What this talk is not? ****
[16:04] <akgraner> This talk is not about addressing the community problem of the day. If you have complaints about areas of the community please address those with the proper governing bodies (we will discuss governance a little in this talk)
[16:04] <akgraner> **** Questions ****
[16:04] <akgraner> Please use the following format for all questions -- QUESTION: Where do I find all the Ubuntu Mailing lists?  All questions should be asked in #ubuntu-classroom-chat and I'll use classbot to post them into #ubuntu-classroom.  Please ask your questions as you think of them and I'll take time at the end of the session to answer as many as possible.
[16:06] <akgraner> (I don't want to present this too quickly so just let me know  in the chat channel if I am moving/posting to fast)
[16:06] <akgraner> **** Contributing to Ubuntu ****
[16:06] <akgraner> As I mentioned before, there is a place for everyone to contribute within the Ubuntu Community.  I want to stress--YOU DO NOT HAVE TO BE A DEVELOPER TO CONTRIBUTE.  Entering into Community Contribution is like a lattice not a ladder. Lattice - http://people.ubuntu.com/~akgraner/Contributing%20to%20the%20Ubuntu%20Community/wooden-lattice-500x500.jpg   Ladder - http://people.ubuntu.com/~akgraner/Contributing%20to%20the%20Ubuntu%20Commun
[16:06] <akgraner> ity/ladder.gif
[16:07] <akgraner> Ladder - http://people.ubuntu.com/~akgraner/Contributing%20to%20the%20Ubuntu%20Community/ladder.gif
[16:07] <akgraner> What do I mean by that - you don't have to go to step 1 then step 2 etc - you can pick a point in the community and start contributing. Hopefully this talk will give you short cuts and guides to find your way around the community and find the place you can start contributing to based on your interest, skills, and talents.
[16:09] <akgraner> Let's First look at the resources that you will need to know about:
[16:09] <akgraner> **** Resources ****
[16:09] <akgraner>  * Wiki Pages - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ - these are the pages where you can find out almost all information about any and all projects withing the Ubuntu Project  - even the supported derivative distributions have many of these same resources (we'll go over links to those supported distributions later in the talk so you know how to find out information about those as well)
[16:10] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Website - http://www.ubuntu.com/ - this is the official Ubuntu Website and also has links to ways you can get involved and contribute
[16:10] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Forums - http://ubuntuforums.org/ - this where information about various projects, discussions, and questions are asked and answered and information is distributed
[16:10] <akgraner> * Ask Ubuntu - http://askubuntu.com/ - this is a new official area to ask questions and get answers to questions.
[16:10] <akgraner> * Mailing Lists - https://lists.ubuntu.com/ this is the list for all the Ubuntu Mailing list so you can see which list you want to sign up for
[16:11] <akgraner> * IRC Channels - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/ChannelList
[16:11] <akgraner>  * Ubuntu Fridge - http://fridge.ubuntu.com/ (Official Ubuntu News Source) - You can find out about upcoming projects here
[16:11] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter - Summary of weekly Ubuntu related news items and a source to find out about projects and needs within the community
[16:12] <akgraner> * Fridge Calendar - http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars/fridge/ - where you can see when and where all the various project and team meeting are being held so you can participate and find out more about that project or team
[16:12] <akgraner> * Classroom Calendar - http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars/classroom/ - where you can find out about classes you can participate in that are being held in #ubuntu-classroom and #ubuntu-classroom-chat
[16:12] <akgraner> * SpreadUbuntu - http://spreadubuntu.org/ - DIY is a material repository and resource for local initiatives and LoCo Teams wishing to spread the Ubuntu operating system.
[16:13] <akgraner> * LoCo Directory - http://loco.ubuntu.com/ - The LoCo Team Directory is an excellent resource for LoCo Teams to use when planning events. The LoCo Team Directory allows users to set up events and venues for their LoCo Team, and then allow users to register their attendance to the event. This makes planning and tracking much easier for users.
[16:13] <akgraner> * Launchpad - https://launchpad.net/ - Launchpad is an open source suite of tools that help people and teams to work together on software projects.  All Ubuntu Projects have launchpad accounts. While contributing to many areas of the Ubuntu Community a Launchpad account isn't necessary, but the more involved you get the more you will find the need to have a Launchpad account.
[16:13] <akgraner> * Planet Ubuntu  - http://planet.ubuntu.com/ - Planet Ubuntu is a window into the world, work and lives of Ubuntu developers and contributors. (Ubuntu Members have the option to syndicate their blogs to planet Ubuntu)  You can also find out about various projects and needs withing the community and projects by following the planet ubuntu.
[16:13] <akgraner>  * Ubuntu Weblogs - http://ubuntuweblogs.org/ - UbuntuWeblogs.org, also known as Planet Ubuntu Users, aims to create a central place for all Ubuntu-related weblogs. Unlike Planet Ubuntu, this Planet is open to anyone who writes about Ubuntu or any derivative. This is also a great place to find out what people are working on and might need help with.
[16:14] <akgraner> I wanted you all to have a list of resources in one place - you can look through say the IRC List or MailingList and find out about teams you might be interested in for example
[16:15] <akgraner> **** Supported Ubuntu Distributions and its Derivatives  ****
[16:15] <akgraner> I mention these because the list is growing and you may find yourself wanting to participate and contribute to one of these distributions as well.  I'll list the names of the distributions and their websites and later you can look up more information and find out about these communities as well.  Just like Ubuntu each of the derivative distributions have communities for you to contribute.
[16:16] <akgraner> * Ubuntu - http://www.ubuntu.com/
[16:16] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Server - http://www.ubuntu.com/business/server/overview
[16:16] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Cloud - http://cloud.ubuntu.com/
[16:16] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Netboot - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LiveCDNetboot
[16:16] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Core - http://www.canonical.com/engineering-services/ubuntu-core
[16:17] <akgraner> * Kubuntu Desktop - http://www.kubuntu.org/
[16:17] <akgraner> * Kubuntu Mobile - http://www.kubuntu.org/
[16:17] <akgraner> * Xubuntu Desktop - http://www.xubuntu.org/
[16:17] <akgraner> * Edubuntu - http://www.edubuntu.org/
[16:18] <akgraner> * Mythbuntu - http://www.mythbuntu.org/
[16:18] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Studio - http://ubuntustudio.org/
[16:18] <akgraner> * Lubuntu - http://lubuntu.net/
[16:19] <akgraner> There is more to the overall community and where your talents and interest can be used than just Ubuntu.  I want to make sure you knew of the other areas are well.
[16:19] <akgraner> **** Ubuntu Community (taken from the website - http://www.ubuntu.com/community) ****
[16:20] <akgraner> Many areas have overlap where you can either get help or give help.  This list is just to make you aware of what is available and the areas you can look into.
[16:21] <akgraner> ** Contribution **
[16:21] <akgraner> Remember: Whether you're an experienced Linux user or you're just getting started with open-source software, there are lots of ways to get involved with the Ubuntu community.
[16:21] <akgraner> * Developers/Development - Contribute by writing or packaging new software or fixing bugs in existing software. We're always ready to embrace new technologies. - http://www.ubuntu.com/community/get-involved/developers
[16:21] <akgraner> * Documentation - Help produce official documentation, share the solution to a problem or check, proof and test documents for accuracy. - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam
[16:22] <akgraner> * Artwork/Design - Put your creativity to work by improving the look and feel of Ubuntu. Help design themes, graphics or backgrounds for the next release. - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork
[16:22] <akgraner> * Support - Share your technical know-how with other users on email and discussion lists, or Internet Relay Chat (IRC) channels. Help users by answering questions in forums.  - http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community
[16:22] <akgraner> * Bug Squad - Help make Ubuntu even better by working with bug reports to ensure they're clear, complete and if possible, easy to reproduce. Anyone can help! - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad
[16:22] <akgraner> * Testing - Ubuntu releases new versions every six months so we need lots of testers who can report or confirm problems. If you'd like to be on the cutting edge of the very latest Ubuntu developments, get testing! - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing
[16:22] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Brainstorm - Everyone can participate in the Brainstorm website. It's full of ideas on how to improve Ubuntu. Once ideas mature, they can move on to become specifications , which are detailed blueprints of future Ubuntu features. Anyone can suggest new ideas and the community votes on which ideas are the most important.  - http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/
[16:23] <akgraner> * Translations - If your first language is not English but you have strong English skills, you can make a huge contribution by helping to translate Ubuntu applications into your first language. Even if you just translate a few lines you can make a difference to someone in your own country who is learning about computers and free software. - https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators - https://launchpad.net/rosetta
[16:23] <akgraner> ** Help and Support **
[16:23] <akgraner> (Many of these resources I mentioned earlier but I wanted to go over them again here with a little more detail from the website)
[16:23] <akgraner> * Documentation - Official documentation explains everything from adding new applications to configuring networks. - https://help.ubuntu.com/
[16:24] <akgraner> * Support - Access forums, live chat sessions or mailing lists and benefit from the technical knowledge of Ubuntu community members. - http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community
[16:24] <akgraner> * Community Blogs - Planet Ubuntu is your window into the world, work and lives of Ubuntu developers and contributors. - http://planet.ubuntu.com/
[16:24] <akgraner> * News - Keep up-to-date with the Ubuntu news at The Fridge or read Ubuntu Weekly News – the community-created newsletter. - http://fridge.ubuntu.com/
[16:24] <akgraner> ** Community Structure **
[16:25] <akgraner> As I mentioned previously, we will touch on the way the community is organized as it helps to know and understand how the community is structured and who to turn to for what.
[16:26] <akgraner> * Governance - Learn more about how the community is organized and how responsibility is allocated. - http://www.ubuntu.com/project/about-ubuntu/governance
[16:26] <akgraner> * Code of Conduct - Review the Code of Conduct to which community members subscribe. It's our bible for collaboration and helps define the way we all work together. - http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct
[16:26] <akgraner> * Project Teams - Learn about the dozens of project teams, their contributions to Ubuntu and how they work. - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Teams
[16:26] <akgraner> (This page needs updating but it's a good page to bookmark - because updates should be coming soon)
[16:27] <akgraner> * Local (LoCo) Ubuntu Teams - Find and join an official local community (LoCo) team near you, or get advice on how to create a team in your local community. - http://loco.ubuntu.com/
[16:27] <akgraner> This list of links will help you find out more about the structure of the community and how you can find teams and projects near you
[16:28] <akgraner> **Ubuntu Events **
[16:28] <akgraner> These are online tutorials offered each cycle geared toward various users.  These are easy weeks for users to participate in or if you can't attend you can read the logs after each session and find out ways where you can help and offer you time, talent, and treasures to make Ubuntu better.
[16:28] <akgraner> (Like the one you are attending and participating in now)
[16:28] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Open Week - Ubuntu Open Week is a series of online workshops where you can: learn about the Ubuntu landscape, talk to some of the key developers from the Ubuntu project, find out about the Community and its relationship with Canonical and participate in an open Q&A with Mark Shuttleworth, the founder of Ubuntu. - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek/
[16:29] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Developer Week - Ubuntu Developer Week is a series of online workshops where you can: learn about different packaging techniques, find out more about different development teams, check out the efforts of the world-wide Development Community, participate in open Q&A sessions with Ubuntu developers - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek
[16:29] <akgraner> * Ubuntu App Developer Week  - Ubuntu App Developer Week is a week of sessions aimed at enabling and inspiring developers to write applications that scratch their itches. Our goal is to give all attendees a taste of the wide variety of tools on the Ubuntu platform that can be used to create awesome applications, and to showcase some applications that have been created and explain how they were put together. - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/U
[16:29] <akgraner> buntuAppDeveloperWeek
[16:29] <akgraner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek
[16:30] <akgraner> * Ubuntu Cloud Days - Ubuntu Cloud Days is a series of online sessions where topics such as the following would be presented:, Answering your questions about Ubuntu and the Cloud, Ubuntu Cloud Images, using Ubuntu with Amazon EC2 cloud, Building your private cloud over Ubuntu Server platform, New virtualization and container technologies in Ubuntu Server, Crunching Big-Data on the cloud
[16:30] <akgraner> and Scaling your web-apps on the cloud with Ubuntu - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCloudDays
[16:30] <akgraner> * Ubuntu User Days - User Days was created to be a set of courses offered during a one day period to teach the beginning or intermediate Ubuntu user the basics to get them started with Ubuntu. User Days is a series of online courses where you can: learn how to install Ubuntu, find equivalent programs in Ubuntu, learn how to get help, learn the basics of how to use Ubuntu, learn how to get involved in the community - https://wiki.ubunt
[16:30] <akgraner> u.com/UserDays
[16:30] <akgraner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays
[16:31] <akgraner> ** Remember there is no commUnIty without U and I.  We're in this together.  Hopefully this session will give you a handy dandy guide to find out more information about many of the areas where you can get started with Ubuntu Contribution.
[16:31] <akgraner> This is by no means a list of every project and place where you can participate and contribute but hopefully it will give you information to get you started and navigate your way around the community **
[16:31] <akgraner> Ok any questions
[16:32] <ClassBot> philipballew asked: Do certain areas need more help then others in the community?
[16:34] <akgraner> Great question - they do but they best way to find out is to go to those teams, and find out their needs  - the is no one place where you can go to find out which team has the greater needs...however, the Ubuntu Community team does a great job of posting the needs of each cycle to the Fridge throughout each of the milestone points in the release cycle
[16:34] <akgraner> Any other questions?
[16:35] <akgraner> Remember each team and projects needs people of all skill levels - developers and non-developers alike
[16:35] <akgraner> all teams and projects have people who will help you get started as well
[16:35] <akgraner> for example the first mailing list I joined was Ubuntu Women
[16:35] <akgraner> from there I found out about IRC and joined the project's IRC channel
[16:36] <akgraner> then found the wiki pages etc
[16:36] <akgraner> before I become an Ubuntu Member my blog was syndicated to the Ubuntu Webblogs link I listed above
[16:36] <akgraner> and one thing lead to another
[16:37] <ClassBot> philipballew asked: if someone sees an area not present in the community they would like to start, is there a way to start that that the community officials find acceptable?
[16:37] <akgraner> Basically it's what I and others call "do-ology" :-)
[16:37] <akgraner> A good example of this very think is the Ubuntu Leadership Team
[16:38] <akgraner> there was a group of folks (myself included) who wanted to offer leadership resources to the community - so we started setting it up and keeping the Ubuntu Community Team as well as members of the Community Council in the know
[16:39] <akgraner> as far as LoCo teams go you should use the loco directory (link listed above) to see if there is a team in your area if not there is a section on how to start one
[16:41] <akgraner> You really don't have to "ask permission" from anyone - but always check to see what is out there first - if it deals with forums talk to the forums council, if IRC talk to the IRC council, if it deals with loco teams check with the loco council, if you aren't sure where your project falls under ask the Community Council or other Ubuntu Members etc.
[16:42] <akgraner> Any other questions?
[16:43] <akgraner> I know this is a pretty long and concise list, but I didn't want people to have to hunt through a ton of wiki pages and web pages to come up with a solid list to work from
[16:47] <akgraner> If there are no other questions then I'll end with a Thank you for joining me...  If you find you need help and can't find what you are looking for on this list - then feel free to email me - I may not have all the answers but together we can learn and figure it out - akgraner  AT  ubuntu DOT com.
[16:48] <akgraner> Thanks again everyone - looking forward to you all getting involved and again if I can help ya - just drop me an email....Have a great day, y'all! :-D
[16:50] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[16:50] <akgraner> Oh I'll also be adding this list of resources to my blog and a googledoc for people to add to... akgraner.com so if you want to help keep the list updated that's a way to help as well...
[16:55] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[16:58] <akgraner> Thank again everyone!  See you online and hopefully at events throughout the FOSS communities!
[17:00] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[17:00] <the_hydra> hi guys
[17:01] <the_hydra> today, I am gonna discuss about few command line basics...to be precise, how to use Bash effectively
[17:02] <the_hydra> why Bash? strictly because that's the shell you will likely use in your terminal or text console
[17:02] <the_hydra> if you're in doubt, simple do "echo $SHELL"
[17:02] <the_hydra> it should yield "/bin/bash"
[17:03] <the_hydra> alright, so what's the good of using Bash?
[17:03] <the_hydra> if you just use it simply to type your command like typing machine...then you've missed whole lot features
[17:03] <the_hydra> start with Tab completion, for example
[17:04] <the_hydra> suppose you wanna do "ls /usr/share/doc/blahblah/alrighty.txt"
[17:04] <the_hydra> you type that one by one?
[17:05] <the_hydra> for God sake, please don't :)
[17:05] <the_hydra> use Tab completion here.... type "ls" first
[17:05] <the_hydra> follow it by / and u....press Tab
[17:06] <the_hydra> if there is no other directory started by /u (and AFAIK there isn't), it will be completed as "/usr" right away
[17:06] <the_hydra> proceed with "/usr/s"
[17:07] <the_hydra> press Tab..... no progress, just beep... yes?
[17:07] <the_hydra> that means you have more than one choices...press Tab again...they will be listed
[17:07] <the_hydra> that way you can look them up and know what to type ahead
[17:08] <the_hydra> add "h"...so now it's "/usr/sh"....pressing Tab here should complete it into "/usr/share/"
[17:08] <the_hydra> do it for the rest of the path
[17:09] <the_hydra> remember.....no beep....then it is already unique....beep....then press Tab....alternatives will be shown up
[17:10] <the_hydra> Tab completion works for path and commands
[17:10] <the_hydra> so far so good, people?
[17:10] <the_hydra> if you have questions, please keep it later in Q&A
[17:11] <the_hydra> ok, next...in my favourite tricks list
[17:12] <the_hydra> bash remembers commands you have type, up to HISTSIZE commands
[17:12] <the_hydra> usually it is 500
[17:12] <the_hydra> and it helps you to recall your entered command
[17:14] <the_hydra> suppose you remember you've entered this jazzy one "find -xdev -type f -mmin -30 -exec cp "{}" /tmp \;"
[17:14] <the_hydra> that's great....and you wanna recall it
[17:14] <the_hydra> pressing up won't be a good solution, it could takes ten, maybe 20 or 50 keypresses
[17:15] <the_hydra> try this , type "find" and press Ctrl+r
[17:15] <the_hydra> bash will look up in the so called "history"...finding command you've entered starting with "find"
[17:16] <the_hydra> if that's only "find" you've entered,then great...voila....it will be there....retyped for you....simply press Enter to execute
[17:17] <the_hydra> what if that's not your "find"? press ctrl-r again and it will look up again....keep pressing it until you found it
[17:17] <the_hydra> to cancel, Ctrl+C is the key
[17:18] <the_hydra> ok, proceed....
[17:19] <the_hydra> how many of you ever get into this situation:
[17:19] <the_hydra> typing "grep blah /usr/share/doc/abc/xyz.txt"
[17:20] <the_hydra> right before you press enter, you suddenly realize, "blah" is not really the word you wanna grep
[17:20] <the_hydra> to make sure, you need to open your note via vi
[17:21] <the_hydra> ok, usually people just press ctrl+c...just like I did ..once :)
[17:21] <the_hydra> (shame on me :D )
[17:21] <the_hydra> after I found it, then i retype same command, only this time I put "grep stuff"
[17:21] <the_hydra> what a type, right?
[17:21] <the_hydra> how about this?
[17:22] <the_hydra> type the first "grep blah...."

[17:25] <the_hydra> what do you do? press up arrow usually....and add "sudo", yes?
[17:26] <the_hydra> you guys realize there is faster way?
[17:26] <the_hydra> how about "sudo !!"
[17:26] <the_hydra> the magic lies in "!!", it will recall your entire last typed command
[17:27] <the_hydra> only this time, we put "sudo" in front....so your last reexecuted inside sudo :)
[17:27] <the_hydra> oh btw, if you guys need to delete a word back, just press Ctrl+W, alright?
[17:28] <the_hydra> this time, it's old time tips, but useful: many times we need to "ping pong " between two directories
[17:28] <the_hydra> say, /home/mine and /tmp
[17:29] <the_hydra> so you do cd /tmp, cd /home/mine alternately?
[17:29] <the_hydra> could we make it faster?
[17:29] <the_hydra> yes "cd -" is your friend
[17:29] <the_hydra> "-" is calling your last working directory
[17:30] <the_hydra> calling that repeatedly will cause ping pong effect :)
[17:30] <the_hydra> ok, guess Q&A time now :)
[17:31] <the_hydra> feel free to ask in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
[17:31] <ClassBot> mf|2 asked: how do i stop a process once you start it in vi
[17:33] <the_hydra> alright, this won't be straightforward....i think best to locate that process using
[17:33] <the_hydra> pgrep or alike
[17:34] <the_hydra> make sure that is the task you wanna end up and then send "kill"
[17:34] <the_hydra> or there's shortcut....pkill <task name>
[17:35] <the_hydra> I believe vi, in this case, is like opening pipe receiving those processes output...or simply putting them in background
[17:35] <the_hydra> so you're quite likely safe to "kill" them
[17:36] <ClassBot> silvertip257 asked: Suggestion really... Introduce word replacement with ^ ... example `grep smtp /etc/services`, but you really wanted to grep for imap (and already ran the command) ... to replace smtp with imap:  ^smtp^imap and press enter
[17:36] <the_hydra> thanks silvertip257
[17:37] <the_hydra> that would be good too, so say you type "ls -al <very long path>"
[17:37] <the_hydra> and now you wanna sort based on size, you can do "^al^alS", Enter
[17:37] <the_hydra> voila, last command recall-ed as "ls -alS" :)
[17:38] <the_hydra> allow me to continue a bit
[17:39] <the_hydra> once in a time, even casual user need to type something really long command
[17:39] <the_hydra> to me, it's like "diff -u <(veryhackylonglonglong) <(anotherhackypipedlongcommand)
[17:40] <the_hydra> and you wish your shell is like your  text editor :)
[17:40] <the_hydra> well indeed you can
[17:40] <the_hydra> press Ctrl+X, followed by Ctrl+E
[17:40] <the_hydra> kazaam!!!
[17:40] <the_hydra> quite likely, it's vi/vim that's called
[17:41] <the_hydra> with your command as its buffer
[17:41] <the_hydra> now what? well, edit it as you like :)
[17:41] <the_hydra> 10 lines? 20? go ahead :)
[17:41] <the_hydra> after you're done, save it like usual i.e ":wq"
[17:41] <the_hydra> vi will quit and the command is executed
[17:42] <the_hydra> the editor called depends on EDITOR environment variable, so you may tweak it i.e
[17:43] <the_hydra> export EDITOR=/usr/bin/nano
[17:43] <the_hydra> so next time you press the same key combo, nano will take place :)
[17:44] <the_hydra> anyway, another example
[17:45] <the_hydra> you type "ls -l /tmp/junk/note.txt"
[17:46] <the_hydra> just realize it should be "stat"
[17:46] <the_hydra> let the first command finish
[17:46] <the_hydra> then "stat !$"
[17:47] <the_hydra> "!$" will be substituted with your last command last argument
[17:47] <the_hydra> kinda useful if you simply wanna take the argument and "dump" the rest
[17:49] <the_hydra> probably the last tip from me
[17:49] <the_hydra> for you guys who love scripting
[17:49] <the_hydra> probably wonders why this "for a in *; do echo $a; done"
[17:50] <the_hydra> doesn't yield the dot prefixed files/directories?
[17:50] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[17:50] <the_hydra> that's because "*" doesn't really mean "all"
[17:50] <the_hydra> so how to make it really yield all of them?
[17:50] <the_hydra> first, execute "shopt -s dotglob"
[17:51] <the_hydra> by doing this, it's like saying to Bash "hey, include those dot prefixed files/directories, will you?"
[17:51] <the_hydra> and then, the "for" line will work as you expected i.e all files no matter it's prefixed with dot or not..are shown
[17:52] <the_hydra> ok guys, that's all from me...I will take the rest of the time again for Q&A, if you have ones
[17:52] <the_hydra> and thanks for coming and listening :)
[17:55] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[17:55] <the_hydra> ok guys, just to add
[17:55] <the_hydra> few links
[17:55] <the_hydra> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Bash#Tips_and_tricks
[17:56] <the_hydra> http://mywiki.wooledge.org/BashFAQ?action=fullsearch&value=linkto%3A%22BashFAQ%22&context=180
[17:56] <the_hydra> http://tiswww.case.edu/php/chet/readline/rluserman.html
[17:56] <ClassBot> TheEvilPhoenix asked: What about basic usage of 'sed'?
[17:56] <the_hydra> many
[17:56] <the_hydra> here's mine
[17:57] <the_hydra> sudo sed -i 's/^/#/' /etc/resolv.conf
[17:57] <the_hydra> that to put "#" mark on every existing line of resolv.conf
[17:57] <the_hydra> "-i" is used to do "in place" editing
[17:57] <the_hydra> if not, it won't be reflected back to the file
[17:58] <the_hydra> or sed -i 2d afile.txt
[17:59] <the_hydra> to delete second line
[17:59] <the_hydra> ok time is up I believe
[17:59] <the_hydra> cheers people...and see you next time :)
[18:00] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[18:00] <starcraftman> Hello again folks, I'm back.
[18:02] <starcraftman> A quick introduction for this session, I'm starcraft.man a computer science student, third year in the program. Live in the lovely cold Canada :).
[18:02] <starcraftman> You can find more about me here > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/starcraft.man. Do need to update my wiki a bit more, been busy.
[18:03] <starcraftman> This is a big topic, finding help is a hard topic. I've provided a complete outline and links for this presentation at the following link:
[18:03] <starcraftman> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDaysTeam/natty/FindingHelp
[18:04] <starcraftman> At the bottom you'll find my entire lecture, it's too long to type out so I'll be copy/pasting. I'll try not to go too fast. I'd like questions reserved to the end due to the amount of information I need to cover.
[18:04] <starcraftman> I think that's about it, time to go into it.
[18:05] <starcraftman>  Section 0 - Introduction
[18:05] <starcraftman>  I'll be covering an important topic today. What to do when things go wrong. It happens to everyone and dealing with it correctly can save a lot of trouble.
[18:05] <starcraftman>  Please keep questions to #ubuntu-classroom-chat as with other sessions. I'd prefer if they were reserved for the end. You're free to ask them during and hopefully someone else can respond. I don't want to be stopping at every question I've a lot of stuff to mention, I'm also pretty sure I've covered most things people will question by end.
[18:06] <starcraftman>  I'll try to pace these out not too fast. I'll try to pace these out not too fast. I do read a bit fast.
[18:06] <starcraftman>  If your question remains unanswered by end, I'll take it then from the queue. Please make sure you keep them prefaced with Question so people can see them.
[18:06] <starcraftman>  Things go wrong. Especially when you can least afford it.
[18:06] <starcraftman>  The same way gravity unfortunately is still there when you wake up in the morning even if you were dreaming of flying.
[18:06] <starcraftman>  One minute you are typing away merrily on your word processor then.....
[18:06] <starcraftman>  [Insert program crash here with some profanity about lost work]
[18:07] <starcraftman>  Maybe you just finished installing some updates and wham!
[18:07] <starcraftman>  Some unknown error appears on screen and you don't know what to do.
[18:07] <starcraftman>  The first rule of getting help is DON'T PANIC. Incidentally, this is also written in big bold letters on the back of a certain book for Hitchhiker's trekking the galaxy.
[18:07] <starcraftman>  I'd say it's a very good first rule.
[18:07] <starcraftman>  The focus of this session will dealing with such problems like the aforementioned in a simple and effective manner. By the end, you should be able to gather simple information and on any problem and find help from the most appropriate resource.
[18:07] <starcraftman>  Section I - Preparing for Help
[18:07] <starcraftman>  The title sounds a bit silly doesn't it?
[18:07] <starcraftman>  You'd be surprised how just a few steps make all the difference finding good help.
[18:08] <starcraftman>  Mostly it will help you narrow the focus of your search. If you reach out to someone else on forums or in person, it's easier to bring them up to speed.
[18:08] <starcraftman>  The average user skips this step. Usually this is followed by an attempt to use bad or limited information to fix the problem.  The result is getting flustered. At this point they usually reach out to someone else, say on a forum or by email to a friend. This results in more annoyance as they answer many questions they didn't consider at first to give the expert necessary information.
[18:08] <starcraftman>  In the end, users can get very angry/frustrated.
[18:08] <starcraftman>  Posting on a forum in a bad mood “My video is broken, FIX IT!” is not a good way to get help.
[18:08] <starcraftman>  Consider (as some may know) that the forums are staffed, moderated and questions answered by volunteers not being paid. None of above like seeing rants posted.
[18:09] <starcraftman>  If you speak like that to your tech friend, well, I don't think he'll be your friend after giving you the fix.
[18:09] <starcraftman>  More to the point, a lot of your time got wasted. You got upset. You also didn't resolve the problem given the time invested.
[18:09] <starcraftman>  This leads to rule 2  - “Try to spend time solving a problem yourself before you ask other people for help. If you follow this common courtesy, then it will not be an imposition when you ask for help.” That's from the community wiki. Good quote I'd say.
[18:09] <starcraftman>  Section 1a - Analysis
[18:09] <starcraftman>  When something goes wrong, the first thing that's important to do is think what just happened? What was I doing? What crashed? What did I see?
[18:10] <starcraftman>  Get a piece of paper and a pen and immediately write the answers to those questions down. Write in plain language all the details, you may not think it's important but the person who helps you might disagree.
[18:10] <starcraftman>  Say for example evolution mail client just crashed, and there's a window that popped up stating so with an error and asking you to file a report. Take down the error, note what you were doing.
[18:10] <starcraftman>  If the error is a graphical one (like the error window popping up) you might want to take a screenshot of this.
[18:10] <starcraftman>  Screenshots are just a way of taking an image of the screen, works on Linux just like Windows. Push print screen on the keyboard. Doing so will open up a screenshot application (on any Ubuntu variant), from there save the image to your Desktop.
[18:10] <starcraftman>  (you can try to printscreen now if you like)
[18:10] <starcraftman>  We'll see what to do with this image later.
[18:10] <starcraftman>  Another helpful thing to do in advance of getting help is knowing your hardware (this can especially help with networking/graphics problems). An easy way to get a complete listing of your hardware is to use the following simple command in any terminal (open from menus Applications > Accessories >Terminal) and using the command:
[18:11] <starcraftman>  sudo lshw > ~/Desktop/hardware.txt
[18:11] <starcraftman>  This command creates a file called hardware.txt that you can open and browse on your desktop. It lists all components of your PC, CPU, RAM, Graphics card, Network interfaces, etc... There are a few commands that produce more precise output (like just listing PCI cards) but this covers everything with one shot.
[18:11] <starcraftman>  The similar commands are lspci, lsusb, lsbpcmia, all listing what the command is named.
[18:11] <starcraftman>  Very useful. (You can try too, takes a moment)
[18:11] <starcraftman>  After jotting down this information and taking a screenshot we can proceed to play detective.  That would be a networking issue.
[18:12] <starcraftman>  IT detective work involves narrowing things down through categories, you start at the top and work your way down specifying at each new level until the problem is clear.
[18:12] <starcraftman>  You might not have enough experience to solve it completely, but getting a start with what you know can go a long way.
[18:12] <starcraftman>  It's hard to say how much effort you should put in before moving on. Usually it becomes clear when you can no longer write or deduce anything else.
[18:12] <starcraftman>  Section 2 - Power Searching Google
[18:12] <starcraftman>  So the first stop is a search engine. I'll use Google for this example, any engine should work.
[18:12] <starcraftman>  The reason to search is another rule- If you're having a problem, 99.9% of the time someone else has had the same one and posted its solution.
[18:13] <starcraftman>  At this point, if everyone can go to www.google.com that'd be great.
[18:13] <starcraftman>  Or your local version . I recommend google.ca :)
[18:13] <starcraftman>  Power searching is when you do more than simply type key words into Google. By default, each word is searched successively. For example, do the following three searches separately in Google and see the difference:
[18:13] <starcraftman>  DC Batman Robin Crusader
[18:13] <starcraftman> "Batman Robin Crusader"
[18:14] <starcraftman>  DC OR Batman OR Robin OR Crusader
[18:14] <starcraftman> Copy them verbatim into Google and you'll see quite the difference in the results returned after pushing enter.
[18:14] <starcraftman> I'll wait a few seconds.
[18:15] <starcraftman>  The first time (first search with no quotes) Google searches for DC and finds all pages with references to it, then cross-references with all pages with Batman. The overlap becomes the new base and then further narrowed by overlap with Robin and Crusader. The search operation descends one word at a time, so the first word is most important and more general usually.
[18:15] <starcraftman> This means in the first case we narrow with every new term.
[18:15] <starcraftman>  When searching in Google “DC Batman Robin Crusader” you humorously get 4 results (all in fact logs of this very speech :D), very different from before. In this instance, Google searched for the string (a computer science term referring to the quoted line) as a whole, the exact sequence of words in the order inside the quotes is simply never used (it is incoherent as a sentence after all). The last one returns well over a
[18:15] <starcraftman> million results.
[18:16] <starcraftman> The last one returned so many because we found every page that had "DC" or "Batman" etc..., a lot of pages on these :)
[18:16] <starcraftman>  Now time to get to the meat of this. Everyone go to Google homepage and click “Advanced” on the right.
[18:16] <starcraftman>  Here's the advanced search page, a lot of people don't know about it. It is very handy.
[18:17] <starcraftman> http://www.google.com/advanced_search
[18:17] <starcraftman>  Immediately I'd like you to note the box at the top highlighted in blue stating “Use the form...”, here you will see the actual search string used when you enable all these advanced tricks. Look up every time you try something else.
[18:17] <starcraftman>  This means that this is the actual search you could use alternatively in the standard Google Search box, you'll see what I mean as I go.
[18:17] <starcraftman>  First two lines cover what I've already explained.
[18:17] <starcraftman>  The third is the Boolean OR search. This means that rather than only take the overlap (or intersection) between DC and Batman, a search for DC OR Batman would include all results from the individual searches for DC and all results from Batman. Rather than narrow down this really widens a search with every new result, use carefully.
[18:17] <starcraftman>  "Don't show these pages" does exactly what it says, put keywords here and all pages with them will be subtracted from the search. Excellent at excluding specific things.
[18:18] <starcraftman>  "Search within site or domain" is another useful one. Your entire search is then confined to the site listed. You can also limit by domain, so .edu limits it to educational websites indexed by Google on the internet.
[18:18] <starcraftman>  Take a moment and play around with these modifiers to search, take note of the top line that shows how the modifiers are used. You can combine many, like a site search, all these words and language.
[18:18] <starcraftman>  "Filetype" does as it says and limits your search to an extension, say .pdf or .txt. Any extension is valid (though limited in the drop down, on a text search you specify what you want).
[18:18] <starcraftman>  Language and results are self explanatory.
[18:18] <starcraftman>  Click on "Date, usage rights, numeric range, and more..." here you'll find even more advanced though less commonly used modifiers.
[18:18] <starcraftman>  These are mostly obvious, you can check pages by date, search with numeric ranges (like price), confine it to a geographic region, search based on sites usage rights (click the link for more explanation on that, it’s outside my scope).
[18:19] <starcraftman>  Page specific tools are interesting; first one lets you specify a page and Google will find something similar. Second lets you identify pages that link to page x.
[18:19] <starcraftman>  One thing not here is wildcard modifier for search.
[18:19] <starcraftman>  * is the wildcard. Say I knew part of a word, say.... nvidia but I only knew it started with nvid. Searching nvid* produces nvidia as top result. It isn't always most useful given there might be words that complete the wildcard that you maybe don't want included.
[18:19] <starcraftman>  Careful with wildcards, they can be quite loose depending on how much of the word you put and Google’s ranking algorithm.
[18:19] <starcraftman>  I don't have time to go into all of them.  The more you employ the less results will appear. Often just one or two of these modifiers makes the difference.
[18:19] <starcraftman>  Say you have a video problem; you want to check whether other people have had trouble with it. It's an nvidia 8800GT. You know Ubuntu Forums usually has people posting about such things. You fill "ubuntuforums.org" in Site Search box, "nvidia 8800 GT" in all these words then search. Voila.
[18:20] <starcraftman>  I don't have time to cover all the nuance of power searching. I will leave you with a good site for those interested. http://www.googleguide.com/ . See the section start now that best applies to you.
[18:20] <starcraftman>  Another page to note is Ubuntu Search at http://search.ubuntu.com/
[18:20] <starcraftman>  As it says on its homepage, by default it only searches Ubuntu related sites like the Wikis and Forums.
[18:20] <starcraftman>  Though it doesn't have an advanced option per se, I'm pretty sure it supports most of the above function. You just have to do it manually via text modifiers.
[18:20] <starcraftman>  lil pause here again, so people can catch up.
[18:21] <starcraftman>  Section 3 - System Documentation and Wiki
[18:21] <starcraftman>  For this section we will cover Ubuntu's official documentation.
[18:21] <starcraftman>  System Docs are the documentation that comes with any standard Ubuntu installation, these are accessible locally even without a net connection.
[18:21] <starcraftman>  On the main panel, notice the blue question mark. Please click it. If you don't have it, see System > Help and Support (KDE users open up K Menu and search for help, first option). (For GNOME 2.x users)
[18:21] <starcraftman> For unity folks, open the menu and search for Help.
[18:22] <starcraftman>  Note: If you’re not on Ubuntu at this moment, you won't of course.
[18:22] <starcraftman>  Here you will find the documentation promised. It's a gem overlooked often by people in need of help. Feel free to click around.
[18:22] <starcraftman>  On the main page at the right you'll see some common questions. At the left is most of the main sections covered like "New to Ubuntu?", go ahead and click it, new options appear, pick what you like. You can always go back to beginning with the Home button (the house) on the Toolbar at the top.
[18:22] <starcraftman>  The documentation contains a lot of answers to common questions and introductory material you can read to understand Ubuntu.
[18:22] <starcraftman>  Do a test search and scroll to the bottom. You'll see repeat this search online, click it. Presto, you're back at search.ubuntu.com, nifty. I only just found that one.
[18:23] <starcraftman>  Feel free to explore later, need to continue.
[18:23] <starcraftman>  Go back to homepage pls (push home button as mentioned on the toolbar).
[18:23] <starcraftman>  I'd like to note at the home page you can find the Free Support link, directing you to a lot of materials I'll talk about.
[18:23] <starcraftman>  A newer project to mention quick is the manual project. It's a pdf that serves as a beginner’s tutorial, does offer explanations of many common things. While not a diagnostic tool per se it can be searched by contents and text search, see http://ubuntu-manual.org/ for more details.
[18:23] <starcraftman>  Next is the Wikis, we have two.
[18:24] <starcraftman>  The help wiki you'll be most interested in is at- https://help.ubuntu.com/ . The other site is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ . This second site I tell you to prevent confusion, it is primarily for organization of teams. Help.ubuntu.com as the name implies stores all the help documents. Use the first one, not the second.
[18:24] <starcraftman>  People often don't understand, these are official sites. They aren't like a wikia, a spin off by fans.
[18:24] <starcraftman>  So take a moment and load up https://help.ubuntu.com/
[18:24] <starcraftman>  Here you'll see listed the versions of Ubuntu still in support (i.e. 11.04, 10.10, these are links to their documentation). Clicking any of the versions will take you to an online version of the system pages, useful if you need it on the internet for reference.
[18:24] <starcraftman>  (if you’re not on Ubuntu at this moment, you can now browse system docs)
[18:24] <starcraftman>  Some people prefer the system docs in their browser, it's got a different feel. The content is to my knowledge exactly the same though.
[18:24] <starcraftman>  At the bottom you'll see a link on upgrade notes, useful for upgrades.
[18:25] <starcraftman>  More interesting is the community link, please click it https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ < to be clear.
[18:25] <starcraftman>  This is the main wiki area it is maintained entirely by the community (folks like me) in an effort to document the software of Ubuntu and problems that arise. Browse all the information on the main page.
[18:25] <starcraftman>  The bulk of documentation is in English, it is however translated into other languages where available.
[18:25] <starcraftman>  You can of course probably use Google translate if you need a page in english to another.
[18:25] <starcraftman>  See the "Getting Started with Ubuntu" section. Here is some beginner stuff you can read, there are also three subsequent sections underneath with useful links to stuff beginners need like Installation help and learning more information about their system.
[18:26] <starcraftman>  This is all good reading material even if you don't have an immediate problem.
[18:26] <starcraftman>  Next, have a look at the "Finding Your Way with Ubuntu" section.
[18:26] <starcraftman>  Say hello to Signpost.
[18:26] <starcraftman> (Scroll down some to get to it fyi)
[18:26] <starcraftman>  Its aim is simple, to start with the general and try and narrow down to the right information.
[18:27] <starcraftman>  Click "get Help", and click around some. It's fairly easy. Different sections have different focus, some on help, filing bugs, some for programmers. See what you need.
[18:27] <starcraftman>  Now lastly, search (top right). Say for example I'm having a video problem with my nvidia card. It won't display my maximum resolution. Do a quick search here for "video nvidia" and see what pops up. Or maybe I just want to learn a good way to backup my system... search for "backup system". Shameless plug,  top result is one of my pages. Good reading.
[18:27] <starcraftman>  Search will present you with relevant pages, as long as you know what you're looking for. If you do the preparation at the beginning this shouldn't be a problem.
[18:27] <starcraftman>  The community wiki is my preferred resource for a wide variety of problems. It's up to date and usually covers problems/software in a timely fashion.
[18:28] <starcraftman> About half way, hope this isn't too fast. Still got just under half to go.
[18:28] <starcraftman>  Section 4 - Forums
[18:28] <starcraftman>  Next, www.ubuntuforums.org
[18:28] <starcraftman>  An excellent site, when in doubt posting here is reasonably certain to get you a good answer. There's an art to posting though, as well as a wrong way to do it.
[18:28] <starcraftman>  While I'm explaining, feel free to sign up, click Register at left.
[18:28] <starcraftman>  Forums are openID enabled so if you know what that is, you can use it.
[18:29] <starcraftman>  First let's look at the structure. The most relevant section is Absolute Beginners Talk. It's come to be a catch all for new people and just problems in general, it gets the most eyeballs. If you post here with reasonable amount of information problem is usually resolved in one or two posts.
[18:29] <starcraftman>  The next section is the Main Support Categories, it offers more specialized help for those with... more exotic problems. Advanced server configurations or some more obscure problems. It's less used by beginners and is less frequented by support people. I'd encourage you to stick with ABT unless you've posted there and not gotten a reply in a reasonable time.
[18:29] <starcraftman>  The remainder of the site is aimed less at support than discussion/development. You can peruse it at your own leisure.
[18:29] <starcraftman>  Time to discuss posting etiquette on the forums, what to do/not do.
[18:30] <starcraftman>  We have a full list of things you have to agree to at register I believe, this is just a rundown of pet peeves and things that really shouldn't happen.
[18:30] <starcraftman>  Don't TYPE IN CAPS OR with LOTS of exclamations!!!!! CAPS usually infer yelling and exclamations excessively used are annoying.
[18:30] <starcraftman>  Don't curse or insult other members offering help. If you wouldn't say it to someone standing next to you, it generally shouldn't be posted.
[18:30] <starcraftman>  Don't demand help in the title/topic like "Fix this or I'm leaving Ubuntu". We aren't prone to offering better help when threatened. This is an unfortunate practice by people who get frustrated, it also gets attention quickly. It is incredibly rude and doesn't make things easier.
[18:30] <starcraftman>  Don't post in the ABT, wait a minute then repost the same thread in different sections. This is annoying. Post in one section (I recommend ABT) and wait for response. It may take 10 minutes or 20, or more, no more than a few hours usually. If so, you can bump your forum post.
[18:30] <starcraftman>  A bump of course is just you replying to the post and pushing it back to the top of cue of threads so it is noticed.
[18:31] <starcraftman>  Now a few pointers to actual posting, you can click New Reply somewhere (doesn't matter where) to follow along (just don't submit please).
[18:31] <starcraftman> (You can follow this along, just remember don't push submit. Don't want the forum mods blaming me :) )
[18:32] <starcraftman> Oh and you'll need to be signed in to follow this part.
[18:32] <starcraftman>  Do make your post title pertinent to your problem. If you don't have any internet on the machine then "I don't have internet" is better than "problem needs fixing". You don't need to convey too much information, just the general category of problem. Including the version of Ubuntu might also be good.
[18:32] <starcraftman>  To the left of title you'll find prefix, please select your version of Ubuntu. When it's solved, edit your first post and change the prefix to Solved.
[18:32] <starcraftman>  The solved tag is useful, it tells people searching the archives your problem was resolved. So they can rely on the proposed fix.
[18:32] <starcraftman>  This is nice, also goes back to one of the rules.
[18:32] <starcraftman>  I'd like to make a note here- to the right of the title is "Check if Already Posted". Please click this after writing in a title it will quickly search all previous posts for related information. Experiment with different titles. Often your question has already been answered. Don't be afraid to detour and read some of these pages, you can always return to new post and submit it.
[18:33] <starcraftman>  Just another way of preventing double posts, we get a lot of similar questions.
[18:33] <starcraftman>  Goes back to the 99.9% of all problems have happened before :).
[18:33] <starcraftman>  In your first post, try to put as much information as you can. Now is the time to consult that page we wrote earlier. Explain what you were doing, what went wrong, and what you have since learned (maybe from wiki). Nothing's too small, at the same time, don't write pages.
[18:33] <starcraftman>  Take a note of the GUI at top of the forum reply, there is # button.
[18:33] <starcraftman> (Bar ontop of the text box I mean)
[18:33] <starcraftman>  This is for the code tag.
[18:34] <starcraftman>  People will often use it responding, if you want to post the hardware.txt file output use these tags. It stops the page overflowing, puts an inline scrollbar instead. Handy.
[18:34] <starcraftman>  Screenshots can be hosted at sites like http://www.imgur.com or as attachments to the post (scroll down on new post page, click Manage Attachments). These are very useful.
[18:34] <starcraftman>  Images hosted on imgur you just copy the forum link and paste in the body of reply. The attachments way automates this. No preference to me, attachments do better integrate with site.
[18:35] <starcraftman> (Pictures really do help, post when possible and think it's pertinent)
[18:35] <starcraftman>  When you're happy with your post, submit it (don't push now). Someone should get back to you with instructions in a timely and friendly fashion.
[18:35] <starcraftman>  Some people ask how do I know the instructions will help? Or to trust the person giving? Well, there isn't a rule per se.
[18:35] <starcraftman>  I for instance have a very large post count; does that imply a user should trust me? I guess. Though when I started posting I only had a post count of 1, my knowledge has improved since but my advice was still usually helpful based on what I knew.
[18:35] <starcraftman>  The rule I'd say is, does it sound right and well explained? A person who knows their stuff should be able to convey relevant information and convince you it's the right thing to do.
[18:36] <starcraftman> (That said, there aren't any guarantees on the advice, it is a volunteer support forum)
[18:36] <starcraftman>  A few closing comments on the forums.
[18:36] <starcraftman>  It's a helpful resource; it harnesses the collective experience of thousands of geeks like me. Do remember we all volunteer for no pay.
[18:36] <starcraftman>  Also, a few helpful links you might enjoy are- http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1052065
[18:36] <starcraftman>  A free beginners guide PDF to getting started.
[18:36] <starcraftman>  http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=801404
[18:37] <starcraftman>  ^ A general launch point to many good forum guides written by people who know their stuff.
[18:37] <starcraftman>  A general launch point to many good forum guides written by people who know their stuff.
[18:37] <starcraftman>  Section 4.5 - IRC (Real  quick)
[18:37] <starcraftman> No session on IRC for this day, information about it can be found here (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/XChatHowto).  That page will get you started with XChat and you’ll understand the basics.
[18:37] <starcraftman> I only want to point out that IRC can be used for support. Channels such as #ubuntu, #kubuntu and #ubuntu-beginners are all good stops. A good run down of channels and getting help is available here- https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InternetRelayChat
[18:37] <starcraftman> I only want to point out that IRC can be used for support. Channels such as #ubuntu, #kubuntu and #ubuntu-beginners are all good stops. A good run down of channels and getting help is available here- https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InternetRelayChat
[18:37] <starcraftman> (oops)
[18:37] <starcraftman> ( Don’t click the #links, they will open IRC client to somewhere else).
[18:37] <starcraftman>  The web page lists the channels, what they focus and how to fix her up.
[18:38] <starcraftman> Anyway, that's that, on to the next stop.
[18:38] <starcraftman>  Section 5 - Launchpad
[18:38] <starcraftman>  I'm going to try and make this brief, I don't want to cover benonsoftware topic (see agenda for time), and he’s devoting a whole hour to launchpad.
[18:38] <starcraftman>  Launchpad is however the place to go when all of the above doesn't get you an answer. You have two choices.
[18:38] <starcraftman>  First is the answers section, see here- https://answers.launchpad.net/
[18:38] <starcraftman>  Launchpad Answers is basically a section designed to let the people working on the projects answer your question.
[18:38] <starcraftman>  Please note, you need to be signed up to use this site. If you want, you can sign up now in preparation for later with benonsoftware. A nice plus, any launchpad account is automatically an openID, can be used on other sites supporting such login.
[18:38] <starcraftman>  Say I have a problem with music playing in rhythmbox, so esoteric that none of the above helped.
[18:39] <starcraftman>  (by above, I mean the other resources)
[18:39] <starcraftman>  Go to answers home, click choose one project and type in rhythmbox. This takes you right to the project answer section. See if your problem is listed. If not, you can file a question here in much the same way as you would a bug (bug filing is last resort).
[18:39] <starcraftman>  Click ask a new question and fill it out (don't submit again). Someone should get back to you in a reasonable time. (don't file a question at this time...)
[18:39] <starcraftman>  People are very active in the Ubuntu project answering the Answers section, you might consider posting there more generally before in a specific project like rhythmbox.
[18:39] <starcraftman>  Next is a quick bug filing run down. Click bugs section at the top of rhythmbox. At the right, on top of ask a question is now Report a Bug.
[18:40] <starcraftman>  Click this only if you want to file a bug, please don't file them without being sure it's a bug and having searched existing bugs. Devs get a lot of duplicates that don't help.
[18:40] <starcraftman>  There's a structure to filling reports, benonsoftware should cover this. It's important to put more not less info, as specific as you can so devs can reproduce bugs, test and fix.
[18:40] <starcraftman>  Launchpad is a good service, though I'm more of a doc person so I guess I'm biased to recommend system then wiki docs.
[18:41] <starcraftman>  That's it on LP, please stay tuned later for more.
[18:41] <starcraftman> I'm gonna take a short break here.
[18:42] <starcraftman> and back
[18:42] <starcraftman>  Section 6 - AskUbuntu.com
[18:42] <starcraftman>  So now a new interesting site. AskUbuntu. Please go to the following url: http://askubuntu.com/questions . It's a Stack Overflow type site that some may be familiar with.
[18:42] <starcraftman>  Basically, you can post questions on the site and tag them with certain keywords. Other users then look through the unanswered section and write answers. Answers are voted up or down based on other users thoughts and you can validate that the users answer is the best or not helpful at all.
[18:43] <starcraftman>  To start using you can sign up if you want in top right (login). It isn't strictly required.
[18:43] <starcraftman>  Use the Ask Question > button in the header to make a question and then wait a while until it gets an answer.
[18:43] <starcraftman>  You'll also see a Tags section, where you can search based on sorted tags to find questions already asked.
[18:43] <starcraftman>  Unanswered section like name implies sorts and lists questions that are still open and waiting an answer. Lastly, there is Users sections. Here you can see the history of a person's answers on the site, maybe you want to know if they have a good history of suggestions. You can also see their shiny badges I suppose.
[18:43] <starcraftman>  The Site isn't directly run by Ubuntu, but many of its top contributors are long standing members of the community.
[18:44] <starcraftman>  That's about it, poke around and don't be shy to ask questions. :)
[18:44] <starcraftman>  Section 7 - Closing
[18:44] <starcraftman>  When confronted by a problem, stop and think. Don't panic.
[18:44] <starcraftman>  Write down all pertinent information that you know.
[18:44] <starcraftman>  Then use the right resource. I usually start with a search or wiki documentation.
[18:44] <starcraftman>  http://search.ubuntu.com is fast becoming a favourite of mine to get quick answers as it indexes most of the good resources.
[18:45] <starcraftman> Search them carefully and if you can't find relevant info ask in ABT for help with all the information you know. There's also of course IRC as an alternative to getting interactive help.
[18:45] <starcraftman>  Next if that doesn't work, see Launchpad answers/bug system as relevant.
[18:45] <starcraftman>  There's no hard fast rule, it's more of an experience thing finding good answers. The more you do it the easier it becomes. It's not too intimidating now I hope.
[18:45] <starcraftman>  Do please consider where the information comes from before doing anything, if you do a Google search and you find a lone blog post detailing an answer with no comments or any affiliation with Ubuntu that's been abandoned by the poster, you should hesitate.
[18:46] <starcraftman>  Where the information comes from is important.
[18:46] <starcraftman> Just like when writing a paper we can't just quote everything/attribute to Wikipedia :)
[18:46] <starcraftman>  I know it's a lot of information to absorb, I hope you've found it helpful.
[18:46] <starcraftman>  I have extra links I may not have mentioned on my outline as listed at the beginning. Click and browse them at your leisure.
[18:47] <starcraftman> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDaysTeam/natty/FindingHelp
[18:47] <starcraftman> Link again just for a reminder.
[18:47] <starcraftman> Hole speech there too if you missed a part.
[18:47] <starcraftman> Whole*
[18:48] <starcraftman> That's it, guess we can start with the questions.
[18:48] <starcraftman> Oh, no questions in the queue, ok.
[18:50] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[18:51] <ClassBot> nlsthzn asked: any idea the criteria for mentioning ask ubuntu in the oneiric installation slides as oposed to the forum (or isn't that falling in the scope of this session)?
[18:52] <starcraftman> nlsthzn: I don't really know how the slides for installation are decided to be honest. I guess has to do more with buzz than anything else. I think all the resources I've mentioned are equally valid methods with pros and cons. Comes down to preference.
[18:55] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[18:58] <ClassBot> ScottSanbar asked: What is buzz?
[18:58] <starcraftman> Buzz: Slight internet slang, means popular, trending among people in the know.
[19:00] <DarkwingDuck> pleia2: hwo do you want to do this? You want to go first?
[19:00] <pleia2> yeah I'll start with the intro, you can go into kde
[19:00] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[19:00] <pleia2> Hi everyone, welcome to our session on Desktop Alternatives!
[19:01] <pleia2> Quick introductions, I'm Elizabeth Krumbach, a member of the Ubuntu Community Council and I've been using Xubuntu since my first *buntu install and have been using XFCE since 2003. My day job is as Debian Sysadmin.
[19:01] <DarkwingDuck> I’m David Wonderly. I am a member of the Kubuntu Council and admin Kubuntu System Documentation. I started with linux in the mid 90s with Red Hat and went to full time Ubuntu in 2005. I switched to Kubuntu in 2006. I am a freelance writer and web developer.
[19:01] <pleia2> To jump right in, a Desktop Environment is the full interface, including Window Manager, panels, menus, engines, tools and applications which are put or built to work together.
[19:02] <pleia2> By default, when you install Ubuntu you will get "Gnome" as your Desktop Environment with Unity as the "shell" and in this class we'll be exploring some of the other options for a Desktop Environment: KDE and XFCE.
[19:03] <pleia2> I will note, as it can be confusing, but a "Window Manager" is not a "Desktop Environment" it's only a part of one. At the core, a Window Manager simply handles the behavior of the windows on your screen.
[19:03] <pleia2> To add complexity, we've also been hearing a lot about "Unity" and "Gnome Shell" - a "Shell" in the graphical sense is more than a Window Manager and less than a Desktop Environment.
[19:03] <pleia2> So, why would you want to switch from Gnome, the default in Ubuntu, to a different Desktop Environment?
[19:04] <pleia2> One popular reason is simply preference. Give another one a try! You may like you find out how customizable the panels that are in XFCE, or the flashy widgets that are in KDE.
[19:04] <pleia2> Another is speed/performance. Some let you slim down your environment by loading up fewer things by default, some are faster (usually by sacrificing eye candy), some work with lighter window managers which may run better on your system.
[19:04] <pleia2> Any questions so far?
[19:06] <pleia2> ok, DarkwingDuck is going to talk a bit about KDE now :)
[19:06] <DarkwingDuck> Thanks pleia2
[19:07] <DarkwingDuck> KDE is not just a Desktop Environment but it also includes it's own window manager
[19:08] <DarkwingDuck> From the look of KDE within Kubuntu it has a look and feel of windows. The application launcher is in the bottom left with the main panel on the bottom.
[19:08] <DarkwingDuck> But, as you start to dig deeper within KDE you will find it is much much more.
[19:09] <DarkwingDuck> Oh yeah, if you have ANY questions while I am talking please stop me and ask.
[19:09] <DarkwingDuck> KDE is build on Plasma. This allows for changing of different workspaces without changing any settings.
[19:10] <DarkwingDuck> So, it can look like your standard desktop in one workspace and quickly move to a netbook (Called Seach and containment) workspace on the fly.
[19:11] <DarkwingDuck> When installing KDE with Kubuntu the installer will auto detect you system. If you are using a netbook it will read the screen resolution and auto pick teh workspace that fits your needs form one installer.
[19:12] <DarkwingDuck> It will also turn on and off different effects depending on what your hardware can handle.
[19:12] <DarkwingDuck> Plasma is widget based. Everything on the panels and the desktops are widgets.
[19:15] <ClassBot> mhall119 asked: how well do applications made for one desktop environment run in another?  Do they integrate well?
[19:16] <pleia2> in XFCE you can enable the gnome and kde background stuff if you want to get their apps to launch faster, most applications work fine though
[19:16] <DarkwingDuck> mhall119: It all comes down to the libraries. KDE is Qt based while Gnome uses GTK. So, to run some applications you will need to install firther things but, for the most part it all works together.
[19:17] <DarkwingDuck> Another thing that KDE and plasma has done is introduce Activities.
[19:17] <DarkwingDuck> Now, this *can* get very confusing but, bare with me as I try to explain it.
[19:18] <DarkwingDuck> The idea is this: You break the desktop up into activities so each desktop is very well defined by what that desktop does. You could have one desktop for writing, one desktop for programming, one desktop for entertainment.
[19:18] <DarkwingDuck> This seemed like a redundancy in Linux, what with the existence of the pager and all. But as KDE grew a bit older and wiser, the usage of this feature become more and more clear.
[19:19] <DarkwingDuck> Image this: You have a desktop for each of four activities (We’ll just say “A, B, C, and D”). This is simple to break down using the Linux pager. You would have Activity A on Desktop 1, Activity B on Desktop 2, Activity C on Desktop 3, and Activity D on Desktop 4. Now let’s say these activities become quite busy. You would then have a lot of windows open on each activity, making a veritable mess out of your efficient worksp
[19:20] <DarkwingDuck> Now, take that idea and expand it with KDE Activities. Each Activity now has it’s own multi-dimensional workspace. Each Activity has however many workspaces you have defined on your desktop.
[19:20] <DarkwingDuck> So if you have four workspaces each of those activities will have four workspaces to use. As well, you can associate specific windows with specific Activities (or specific workspaces within a specific Activity). This allows you to organize your activities with much more control over the standard method.
[19:21] <DarkwingDuck> This is where it starts to become obvious how effective activities can be. Let’s say you have a desktop Activity associated with Writing. For that activity you use a word processor, a web browser, and some other random applications.
[19:21] <DarkwingDuck> You can assosiate those windows to that certen activity
[19:21] <DarkwingDuck> Now that window will ONLY be visible on that particular activity. You can then open a completely different window (of the same application) and associate with a different activity.
[19:22] <DarkwingDuck> The concept of Activities isn’t the easiest to understand until you actually start working with it. But once you get the hang of it, you will certainly appreciate what it brings to the desktop.
[19:22] <DarkwingDuck> Everyone with me so far?
[19:23] <ClassBot> the_hydra asked: so Plasma is like the window manager?
[19:23] <DarkwingDuck> In a way...
[19:24] <DarkwingDuck> Plasma controls both the window manager AND everything within the dekstop. It's an intergrated system.
[19:24] <DarkwingDuck> KDE coems with a "One stop shopping" for system settings
[19:26] <DarkwingDuck> The window manager and everything else is controled from there so, you don't have to go chasing things about. There are also themes for the WM. Example: We have a GTK Oxygen theme so that the WM will flow better with GTK programs
[19:27] <DarkwingDuck> Does anyone have any questions about KDE? I could go on for hours but, I want to give pleia2 a chance to talk too. :)
[19:28] <DarkwingDuck> Oh!
[19:28] <ClassBot> nlsthzn asked: I don't get "activities"?! Any words of wisdom on using this feature?
[19:28] <ClassBot> nlsthzn asked: When will Ubuntu One be fully integrated with Kubuntu/KDE?
[19:29] <DarkwingDuck> Already hit hte activities sorry for that. Ubuntu One.
[19:30] <DarkwingDuck> We keep trying to intergrate Ubuntu One into Kubuntu. the issue has been that once we get a stable version working Ubuntu One changes the APIs around a bit. We find out about it a tad late and are two steps behind.
[19:30] <DarkwingDuck> apachelogger has been working with the Ubuntu One people to get a client working.
[19:31] <ClassBot> TheEvilPhoenix asked: For KDE, are there recommended minimum hardware specs to run KDE?
[19:32] <DarkwingDuck> TheEvilPhoenix: Give me a moment. I'm not sure we have them listed. I run KDE on an old desktop with 900mhz and less then a gig of ram.
[19:33] <DarkwingDuck> TheEvilPhoenix: I'm not finding it. Please email me and I will find the answer for you.
[19:34] <DarkwingDuck> Any other KDE questions?
[19:35] <DarkwingDuck> Okay, I posted my email address in -chat so, if you have further questions re KDE/Kubuntu please, feel free to email me or ask after pleia2
[19:35] <ClassBot> the_hydra asked: seems like KDE visual effect doesn't really need good video card?
[19:36] <DarkwingDuck> for the higher end effects yes. My 3 year old netbook keeps up with them very very well.
[19:37] <DarkwingDuck> You can turn desktop effects off and have a very high end looking graphic expirence.
[19:37] <DarkwingDuck> Okay pleia2, before I hijack any more of your time.
[19:38] <pleia2> :)
[19:38] <pleia2> ok, on to XFCE! XFCE is the Desktop Environment that comes with Xubuntu, you can find some details about it over at http://xfce.org/
[19:39] <pleia2> here's a screenshot of the default you'll see when you load up xubuntu 11.04: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/xubuntu/natty/xubuntu_desktop.png
[19:39] <pleia2> pretty familiar layout I think, no big surprises :) the mouse at the top left is your menu, at the bottom you have a panel you can add/remove stuff from
[19:40] <ClassBot> mhall119 asked: pleia2, does Xfce use GTK 3 now, or is it still on GTK 2?
[19:40] <pleia2> the latest stable release (4.8) still on gtk2
[19:41] <pleia2> Now Xubuntu with Xfce itself differs from Ubuntu not just in environment,  it doesn't come with Open Office, instead it comes with lighter-weight "abiword" for word processing and "gnumeric" for spreadsheets.
[19:41] <pleia2> Xfce uses the XFwm by default for the window manager. It uses Thunar for a basic file manager, as sorta seen here: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/xubuntu/natty/xubuntu_thunar.png
[19:42] <pleia2> as you can see it's a pretty basic file manager, there are a bunch of wishlist items for expanding it
[19:42] <ClassBot> the_hydra asked: which is lighter, Xubuntu or Lubuntu?
[19:43] <pleia2> lubuntu, no question, xubuntu doesn't really strive to be light, it's more about being simple and easy to configure
[19:43] <pleia2> (you won't see the light claim on xubuntu.org anymore)
[19:43] <pleia2> The Xfce panels (at the top and bottom in the screenshot) have their own items you can add, but you can also use some gnome panel items
[19:44] <pleia2> one of my favorite things is that you can do things like add multiple clocks :) I have three timezone clocks in my panel
[19:45] <pleia2> You can check out some more screenshots from the default Xubuntu here: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/xubuntu/natty/
[19:45] <pleia2> And a screenshot of my desktop on Thursday night: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/xubuntu/natty/xubuntu_092211.png (when I was prepping for this class :))
[19:46] <pleia2> Most of what you'll find app-wise is that Xubuntu takes apps from elsewhere, you can even run the Gnome and KDE services in the background so things launch more quickly even on Xfce
[19:47] <pleia2> for me, configurability and simplicity are what I love about it, before Xfce I used Enlightenment and fluxbox, both of which were also simple but could be tricky to configure (a lot of manual editing of config files)
[19:47] <pleia2> Xfce gives me simple + pretty configuration dialogs http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/xubuntu/natty/n-xubuntu-settings.png
[19:48] <pleia2> any more questions?
[19:50] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[19:52] <DarkwingDuck> anyone have any more questions on XFCE or KDE?
[19:54] <ClassBot> charlie-tca asked: Ubuntu has switched over to a non-standard interface with Unity. Are there any plans for either KDE or Xfce to follow that pattern?
[19:55] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[19:55] <pleia2> fortunately there are no plans for Xfce to follow this pattern
[19:55] <DarkwingDuck> KDE already did (In a way). When we changed from KDE3 to KDE4 it introduced Plasma. It was our unified system if you will.
[19:56] <DarkwingDuck> There are no plans for us to change what works :)
[20:00] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[20:01] <philipballew> [20:01] <philipballew> Thanks for coming everybody
[20:02] <philipballew> we will be talking about software you normally might be used to using in Windows or OSX and what Software that does the same purpose can be found in Ubuntu
[20:02] <philipballew> As many of you are used to certain software available in Windows and OSX and might not be aware of ones in Linux  systems, you are curious as to what there is.
[20:03] <philipballew> I will List all the main Pieces of software here first and then Answer all questions in the time we have. It is a first come, first serve basis
[20:03] <philipballew> If any questions are technical based, I will be available after the session to provide support if people in #ubuntu-classroom-chat are unable to.
[20:03] <philipballew> ^ for help installing
[20:04] <philipballew> If you need to contact me personally, feel free to pm me or email me<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[20:04] <philipballew> So everybody knows who I am Let me send a link to my Ubuntu Wiki. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/philipballew
[20:04] <philipballew> Here We go!
[20:04] <philipballew> Office
[20:05] <philipballew> Where in OSX and Windows computers, The average users user Microsoft Office, the Average Ubuntu user uses one of these office suites
[20:06] <philipballew> the Main program was open office
[20:06] <philipballew> but now starting with 1104 it is Libre office
[20:07] <philipballew> this software provides the ability to type documents make spreadsheets and slide shows
[20:07] <philipballew> this is the default software
[20:07] <philipballew> other's might be Open Office Koffice Abi-Word Gnumeric
[20:08] <philipballew> Open office is like L O as its whats L.O. is bassed off of
[20:08] <philipballew> koffice is for KDE
[20:08] <philipballew> the other 2 are good for any computer, but usually used on lowed end computers
[20:09] <philipballew> lubuntu and xubuntu have used them
[20:10] <philipballew> With L.E the one most all ubuntu users are using it has the ability to save in a doc format if needed. but this is not the default
[20:10] <philipballew> next type of app
[20:10] <philipballew> Multimedia
[20:10] <philipballew> Multimedia and Ubuntu can go hand in hand. If you plan to use your computer for mainly media/multimedia I recommend installing Ubuntu Studio. http://ubuntustudio.org/
[20:11] <philipballew> but all apps can be installed on ubuntu or any type as were mentioned in the previous session
[20:12] <philipballew> in many computer users groups and sectors when people think of graphical editing one word comes to mind
[20:12] <philipballew> photoshop
[20:12] <philipballew> ubuntu has a great photoshop program in Gimp
[20:13] <philipballew> it can do wonders to any photo. it is similar to Adobe Photoshop
[20:14] <philipballew> if anyone needs to edit photos in Ubuntu they should use Gimp
[20:15] <philipballew> for users who have used Adobe Illastrator there is Inkscape
[20:15] <philipballew> it is a very powerful editing program
[20:16] <philipballew> Audio
[20:16] <philipballew> Itunes is really set the standard for a music playing application in the past several years, And Ubuntu had great software for you to enjoy.
[20:16] <philipballew> the default in ubuntu is going to be Banshee
[20:17] <philipballew> it plays many audio formats as it uses gstreamer as a back-end
[20:17] <philipballew> the older default of Rhythmbox is a great player and will play anything you need
[20:18] <philipballew> with Linux and ubuntu it is all about choice
[20:18] <philipballew> just because you might see Banshee as a app when you install you can trash it and try something else
[20:18] <philipballew> there is also Amrok
[20:19] <philipballew> a very nice player made for the kde ui but will play on gnome as well if you are not a Kubuntu user
[20:19] <philipballew> now if you want to play music in the shell
[20:19] <philipballew> or the terminal for instance
[20:20] <philipballew> i recomend either Cmus/mp3blaster
[20:20] <philipballew> all these are great software that will work
[20:20] <philipballew> if you have an Ipod you can use that on Ubuntu as welll
[20:20] <philipballew> *well
[20:21] <philipballew> these apps will support them. I dont think Cmus or mp3blaster does.
[20:21] <philipballew> there are also apps that there only purpose is for updating or managing your ipod
[20:22] <philipballew> gtkpod is one of them
[20:22] <philipballew> Video Editing
[20:22] <philipballew> OSX,Windows Software Might be something like windows Movie Maker or After -Effects
[20:23] <philipballew> in Ubuntu there is some good options such as kdenlive and openshot
[20:23] <philipballew> kdenlive has been around for a while
[20:23] <philipballew> openshot is good. and can add 3d effects with blender
[20:24] <philipballew> Audio Editing
[20:25] <philipballew> Gauge band is a pretty popular audio editing software application for computers these days. In Ubuntu there are several pieces of software you can use
[20:25] <philipballew> Audacity is a good one
[20:25] <philipballew> it can edit all your audio files
[20:25] <philipballew> Ardour can also
[20:26] <philipballew> once you get used to a piece of software you'll know its ends and outs. It may be different at first. but can become like the back of your hand soon
[20:27] <philipballew> Internet Browsers
[20:27] <philipballew> Ubuntu comes by default with Firefox
[20:27] <philipballew> however,
[20:27] <philipballew> there are many browsers you can use in its place
[20:27] <philipballew> one is Google Chrome
[20:28] <philipballew> Google Chrome is a popular browser on all platforms just like FF
[20:29] <philipballew> with google chrome you need to download a repository off their website
[20:29] <philipballew> let me post the link here
[20:30] <philipballew> https://www.google.com/support/chrome/bin/answer.py?answer=95346
[20:30] <philipballew> here is instructions on that
[20:31] <philipballew> but you can, Like lots of ubuntu users, including myself use Chromium
[20:31] <philipballew> its free and open unlike parts of G.C.
[20:31] <philipballew> if you need a text based browser you should try E-links
[20:32] <philipballew> its great to run in the terminal
[20:32] <philipballew> Instant messaging
[20:32] <philipballew> Ubuntu has a great default software in Empathy
[20:32] <philipballew> it can handle all your im needs
[20:33] <philipballew> there is also Pidgin and kopete
[20:33] <philipballew> they can do the same thing
[20:33] <philipballew> it is all about preference with Ubuntu. you have choice
[20:34] <philipballew> Social Networking
[20:34] <philipballew> Gwibber is the default client.
[20:35] <philipballew> It can do Both Twitter and Facebook. The big names in social networking today
[20:35] <philipballew> there is also a new app called Polly
[20:35] <philipballew> it can be downloaded fromhttps://launchpad.net/polly
[20:35] <philipballew> https://launchpad.net/polly
[20:36] <philipballew> remove the s if your browser does not support https
[20:36] <philipballew> Games
[20:36] <philipballew> for Ubuntu there are many games in the software center
[20:36] <philipballew> ill list some notable ones here
[20:37] <philipballew> though we all may dislike them because games can be a personal thing
[20:37] <philipballew> Open Arena Torcs Urban Terror Minecraft Battle of Wesnoth Nexuiz
[20:38] <philipballew> all of these except minecraft can be downloaded through the software center
[20:39] <philipballew> for other places to get games you can use ppa's
[20:39] <philipballew> they can allow you to try new apps. bleeding edge versions and apps just not in the software center
[20:40] <philipballew> there is such things as get deb and play deb
[20:40] <philipballew> they will add more games to your system
[20:40] <philipballew> also I will give two websites for Linux games
[20:41] <philipballew> www.tuxgames.com www.linuxgames.com
[20:41] <philipballew> if there are any apps i did not mention here you need an alternative for you can use http://linuxappfinder.com/
[20:42] <philipballew> feel free to contact me as well anytime
[20:42] <philipballew> Question Time!
[20:43] <philipballew>  /msg classbot !y
[20:43] <ClassBot> TheEvilPhoenix asked: I know Adobe Dreamweaver is built for windows.  Is there any equivalent WYSIWYG/code/splitscreen web development program for Ubuntu/Linux ?
[20:44] <philipballew> good question TheEvilPhoenix
[20:44] <philipballew> in the Ubuntu software center there is KompoZer
[20:45] <philipballew> a what you see is what you get type
[20:45] <philipballew> also iff all you need is html gedit can do that
[20:45] <philipballew> there is also bluefish
[20:47] <ClassBot> lunzie asked:  can you say anything about Google Docs equivalents like the proposed Unhosting of LibreOffice? http://vimeo.com/21387223
[20:48] <philipballew> You can still access google docs from ubuntu if you want, However I hear l.b. plans to
[20:48] <philipballew> I read it somewhere
[20:50] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[20:55] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[21:00] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[21:00] <charlie-tca> Okay, Hello everyone!
[21:00] <charlie-tca> I'm Charlie Kravetz, known as charlie-tca on irc and the mailing lists. I am Xubuntu Quality Assurance Lead, a member of ubuntu-bugsquad, bug-control, and a bugsquad mentor.
[21:00] <charlie-tca> I test the latest development images, and am using Oneiric Ocelot on my daily machine. This gives me considerable experience in testing, filing bugs, and using Ubuntu.
[21:01] <charlie-tca> I am going to talk about Accessibility in Ubuntu.
[21:01] <charlie-tca> Each release cycle, when the discussions are held about what should be in the next release, we do discuss accessibility also.
[21:02] <charlie-tca> This is considered very important by all the developers, but is very difficult to insure it is working for all the users.
[21:02] <charlie-tca> The leaders of the Ubuntu Accessibility Team are Penelope Stowe (pendulum) and Luke Yelavich (TheMuso).
[21:03] <charlie-tca> I do triage accessibility bugs, and am very involved with Accessibility Team.
[21:03] <charlie-tca> Accessibility focuses on the Ubuntu desktop, because Gnome has good accessibility features. Would we like to see that expanded? Of course we would! The expansion is coming along nicely. Kubuntu is working on integrating a screen-reader installation, Xubuntu will be adding several features with Xfce 4.10. Lubuntu is very interested in adding accessbility also.
[21:03] <charlie-tca> The Accessibility Team has conducted a survey and created personas under the guidance of Penelope. This greatly aids the team in determining the direction it needs to head as well as what is needed.
[21:04] <charlie-tca> This session isn't a how-to guide and won't go into a huge amount of detail into any one program.
[21:04] <charlie-tca> I will attempt to answer your questions, when I can. I will also give you some resources for further help and information.
[21:04] <charlie-tca> Please use the following format for all questions -- QUESTION: How do I start mousekeys? All questions should be asked in #ubuntu-classroom-chat and I'll use classbot to post them into #ubuntu-classroom.
[21:06] <charlie-tca> So, to answer this question, you would open the dash, by clicking the Ubuntu logo in the launchers, and type "universal access"
[21:06] <charlie-tca> That has replaced the 'Accessibility' menus
[21:08] <charlie-tca> Since one of the biggest issues we have had with accessibility is how to start a screen-reader installation, what with guessing when to hit keys, knowing which keys to hit, etc, we are doing something positive about it.
[21:08] <charlie-tca> Ubuntu 11.10 will have a feature we are very pleased about. This is the ability for the visually impaired to start an installation without having to hit a bunch of keypresses and try to guess when to start hitting keys. We will instead boot the desktop cd, wait until it stops and the drum beat sounds, which will be at the "Try Ubuntu" and "Install Ubuntu" screen. Now just hit Ctrl+s to
[21:08] <charlie-tca> start the screen-reader installation with Orca.
[21:10] <charlie-tca> This should make installing *so much* simpler for those with visual impairments!
[21:10] <charlie-tca> Before I talk about specific programs, I want to talk about the Assistive Technologies menu, which can be found in Universal Access.
[21:10] <charlie-tca> This menu is where you can select your preferred accessibility programs and enable assistive technologies.
[21:11] <charlie-tca> You can use this menu to specify things such as how long to accept as a keypress, how to prevent accidental double clicking, and how quickly to respond to key presses.
[21:11] <charlie-tca> It's also useful for turning off and on sticky keys or specifying keystrokes to stand in for things you'd normally do with a mouse.
[21:11] <charlie-tca> This is also the menu you use to specify which programs you want for an alternate keyboard or as a screen reader.
[21:12] <charlie-tca> Okay, before I start talking about programs, are there any questions on the Universal Access menu?
[21:14] <charlie-tca> I should say at this point, if you need accessibility programs and use either Ubuntu 11.04 or decide to go with Oneiric Ocelot, soon to be released as Ubuntu 11.10, you will find Unity3d sessions difficult to use.
[21:15] <charlie-tca> We automatically use the fallback sessions when you install using the screen-reader. In Ubuntu 11.04, this is called "classic session" and in Oneiric it is called Unity2d.
[21:16] <charlie-tca> The first set of programs I'm talking about are the text-to-speech programs.
[21:17] <charlie-tca> The most popular of these is the Orca, although it isn't strictly a screen reader, as it has other capabilities
[21:17] <charlie-tca> Orca includes a screen reader, magnification capabilities, and braille capabilities, so it is more than text-to-speech, however most people when you say Orca think of it as a screen reader.
[21:17] <charlie-tca> Orca was developed by the Accessibility department at Sun Microsystems, however, with the aquisition of Sun by Oracle, it has moved to community-development only.
[21:17] <charlie-tca> Orca can work with programs that include the at-spi toolkit including the GNOME desktop, Firefox, LibreOffice, and many others.
[21:18] <charlie-tca> It can also be used with Xfce based applications.
[21:19] <charlie-tca> More information about Orca can be found at http://live.gnome.org/Orca
[21:20] <charlie-tca> And, yes, it is named after the animal in the tradition of screen readers being named after aquatic animals. (The most well known is JAWS for Windows)
[21:20] <charlie-tca> Okay, any questions about Orca?
[21:21] <ClassBot> KB3UI asked: Does Orca work with different voices?
[21:21] <charlie-tca> Excellent question, KB3UI
[21:22] <charlie-tca> Yes, Orca does work with different voices, as well a few languages.
[21:22] <charlie-tca> It also has settings to change the speed of the voice, since some of us are able to listen much faster than the average person.
[21:23] <charlie-tca> Another text-to-speech program is eSpeak. eSpeak is command line based. It supports quite a few different languages.
[21:23] <charlie-tca> There are several different versions of eSpeak including one specific to emacs.
[21:23] <charlie-tca> More information can be found at http://espeak.sourceforge.net/
[21:24] <charlie-tca> These are the two main text-to-speech/screen reader options in the Software Center.
[21:25] <charlie-tca> With QT being added to Unity, we now have the ability to use these applications in Kubuntu, also.
[21:25] <charlie-tca> Are there any questions about espeak or other questions about text-to-speech in Ubuntu?
[21:25] <ClassBot> KB3UI asked: Advantages of Orca vs. eSpeak and vice versa?
[21:26] <charlie-tca> I would say the greatest advantage is in deciding which one works for what you need. Orca is not usable without the Desktop
[21:26] <charlie-tca> eSpeak can be used in any terminal, as long as you have audio capability.
[21:27] <charlie-tca> Many users will decide one has voices they can understand better than the other, but that is only found by trying both.
[21:29] <charlie-tca> At the present time, there are no assistive technologies for people with learning/developmental difficulties specifically. Orca and some of the other programs are used by people with learning/developmental disabilities.
[21:29] <charlie-tca> One thing that happens in the open source world is that other than specific hardware needs (such as integration with braile keyboards or USB switches), things are developed towards what the software needs to do, not why the person needs that software
[21:30] <charlie-tca> okay, moving on from text-to-speech, I'm going to quickly cover magnification software
[21:30] <charlie-tca> The magnification software commonly found in Ubuntu are gnome-mag, the magnification part of Orca and the magnification option of compiz. You will need to install ccsm to use the compiz magnifier, but it is very useful.
[21:30] <charlie-tca> These applications allow you to move the magnification screen around your desktop so as to give the total view.
[21:30] <charlie-tca> For the normal sighted person, they can be cumbersome to use, but for the visually impaired, they allow us to see the entire screen.
[21:32] <charlie-tca> I realize that much of this is for the visually impaired. We have not forgotten the hearing impaired, however. A quick look into Universal Access options in Ubuntu allows the hearing impaired to switch on blinking windows to assist them when the sound alerts play.
[21:32] <charlie-tca> There is still the issue of them not hearing if sounds are played, which can disturb others.
[21:34] <ClassBot> lunzie asked:  charlie-tca: is there a framework or standard being worked out for tts access for pdf documents? esp okular and evince ...
[21:35] <charlie-tca> Unfortunately, open source has a way to go yet on some things. This is one of those areas.
[21:35] <charlie-tca> I do not know of work being done for this at this time.
[21:36] <charlie-tca> Next I want to talk about alternate keyboards.
[21:36] <charlie-tca> Most of the time, alternate keyboards mean switching layouts and languages.
[21:36] <charlie-tca> These are programs which can be used to replace or augment a traditional keyboard. They usually directly interface with the mouse however the mouse may be controlled.
[21:37] <charlie-tca> The default alternate keyboard for Ubuntu is onBoard. It is basically an on-screen keyboard.
[21:38] <charlie-tca> It includes everything including the function keys from a regular keyboard, and, now has colors that match ambiance theme in Unity
[21:38] <charlie-tca> Using your mouse, You click on the key or a sequence of keys and it inputs directly into whatever program you're working on
[21:39] <charlie-tca> Onboard is usable by stick users, as well as mouse/trackball only users.
[21:39] <charlie-tca> Not only useful as assistive technology, it's rather useful for people using Ubuntu on a tablet.
[21:39] <charlie-tca> The other well known option for alternate keyboard capabilities is Dasher