[00:16] <Teranet> ok ruty ruty here how could I check the Juju syslog again on the command line ?
[00:26] <lazyPower> Teranet juju debug-log
[00:27] <Teranet> thx
[01:12] <bdx> lazyPower: yea
[07:14] <anrah> is there a way to stop agent executing charm upgrade process?
[07:14] <anrah> I think i managed to create infinite loop for my charm and I now it is just processing the upgrade and I would like to fix that :)
[07:17] <anrah> Apparently by killing the juju agent process which is handling the charm-upgrade
[07:25] <kjackal> Good morning Juju world
[08:20] <stub> huh. Nobody has written a passwordless ssh layer yet. I thought this would be required more often?
[08:40] <anrah> what do you mean?
[11:22] <Zic> hi, I'm using canonical-kubernetes bundle charms and I noticed that the default Grafana/InfluxDB packaged in it does not seem to erase graphs from deleted Pods.. do you know where can I do some cleaning?
[11:22] <Zic> automatic-cleaning, I mean, if that's possible :)
[11:31] <rick_h> Zic: sounds like an action feature request. I can see the desire to keep some data around for historical context, but definitely also see the desire to clean stuff out.
[11:32] <anrah> is there a way to react (set state) when metric value is <> something?
[11:32] <rick_h> Zic: https://github.com/juju-solutions/bundle-canonical-kubernetes/issues please file an issue here
[11:40] <Zic> rick_h: thanks, I will
[11:40] <Zic> rick_h: I also notice a strange behaviour, don't know if it's a bug or is it normal: I don't see my new created namespaces in Grafana list of namespace (dashboard: Pods), but if I enter the name of my namespace manually, it works and displayed proper data
[11:41] <Zic> is it up to me to add namespace in this drop-down list? or it should be auto-completed?
[11:43] <Zic> for Pods drop-down list, it's auto-filled from what is running in the k8s cluster
[11:43] <Zic> but the namespace list only contain default and kube-system namespaces :o
[11:52] <marcoceppi_> Zic: the grafana container is the one run from upstream gcr.io, we don't do much munging for that, that I'm aware of, but most of the k8s team is US based so it's early there
[11:55] <Zic> ok, if the charms does not manage this area, I will try to poke them at their Slack :) thanks anyway
[12:27] <rick_h> marcoceppi_: what's the best place to get the kubectl for the bundle?
[12:27] <rick_h> marcoceppi_: have the core bundle on my maas and wanting to tinker around with it
[12:29] <marcoceppi_> rick_h: read the readme ;)
[12:30] <marcoceppi_> rick_h: https://jujucharms.com/kubernetes-core/#yui_3_17_1_2_1485260992490_80
[12:30] <rick_h> marcoceppi_: oh....I was looking at the readme and it had me get the config, i missed it had me get the binary as well
[12:31] <rick_h> marcoceppi_: my bad, I'm reading the readme I swear :P
[12:31] <marcoceppi_> rick_h: yeah, conjure-up makes it nice because it does that automatically, but for manual deploys we don't really have a way to `juju download` or fetch something
[12:31] <marcoceppi_> rick_h: in the very near future you'll just snap install kubectl
[12:31] <rick_h> marcoceppi_: yea all good. I thought it was a snap but wasn't sure where/etc
[12:32] <rick_h> marcoceppi_: ty for the poke on looking harder
[12:32] <rick_h> bwuhahaha Kubernetes master is running at https://<IP_ADDRESS>:6443
[12:33] <marcoceppi_> \o/
[13:35] <magicaltrout> hellooooo from bluefin... bit weird sat at a desk in this place
[14:07] <marcoceppi_> magicaltrout: oi, what are you up to in bluefin?
[14:15] <magicaltrout> marcoceppi_: went to talk to Tom Calaway about join marketing stuff for Spicule & Juju in 2017
[14:15] <marcoceppi_> magicaltrout: awesome
[14:15] <magicaltrout> have a few hours to kill before DC/OS meetup
[14:15] <magicaltrout> so sitting around taking up space
[14:16] <marcoceppi_> well, enjoy o/
[14:40] <magicaltrout> marcoceppi_: can you dig out that big half pull request thing that existed for getting Centos support in Reactive?
[14:41] <magicaltrout> I want to improve on the DC/OS stuff charms, but I also want them to run on Centos because thats what they support and not my half bodged Ubuntu support
[14:42] <magicaltrout> i'm doing their office hours in a couple of weeks and it'd be a nice thing to discuss alongside generic Juju support
[14:44] <lazyPower> Oh yeah, bogdan sent that in didn't he?
[14:44] <magicaltrout> dunno :)
[14:45] <lazyPower> i think it withered on the vine, we left some feedback and it wasn't circled back.
[14:45] <magicaltrout> clearly i could write old school charms, but the hooks make me so sad :)
[14:45] <lazyPower> but thats from memory so its likely incorrect
[14:45] <lazyPower> i dont blame you magicaltrout, not one bit
[14:45] <magicaltrout> no its likely correct, marco showed me the PR ages ago and I said I'd take a look
[14:45] <magicaltrout> then didn't
[14:45] <magicaltrout> but i didn't really have a use case 6 months ago
[14:46] <marcoceppi_> magicaltrout: it landed a while ago
[14:51] <magicaltrout> landed as in merged or landed as in got pushed as a PR a while ago and is now very stale? marcoceppi_
[14:52] <magicaltrout> i suspect the latter, which is fine, I was just going to take the spirit of the commit and figure out what needs changing, refactoring and implementing
[15:22] <marcoceppi_> magicaltrout: it's landed and released
[15:24] <marcoceppi_> magicaltrout: we don't have centos base layers, or anything there, but charm-helpers is present with basic centos support: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~charm-helpers/charm-helpers/devel/files/head:/charmhelpers/core/host_factory/
[15:25] <lazyPower> oh nice
[15:25] <magicaltrout> interesting!
[15:25] <lazyPower> magicaltrout - see? I told ya my brain was probably incorrect
[15:25]  * lazyPower mutters something about scumbag brain
[15:27] <magicaltrout> alright then
[15:27] <magicaltrout> so i can take a stab at creating a centos base layer
[15:31] <magicaltrout> that would make the Mesos guys and the NASA guys happy
[15:31]  * magicaltrout greps around in the code to see whats going on
[15:41] <marcoceppi_> magicaltrout: yeah, I think we need to rename basic to ubuntu, tbh. Having a centos layer adds complexity, cory_fu and I chatted breifly about having the notion of a special "base" layer where layer:ubuntu and layer:centos wouldn't be compatible
[15:41] <marcoceppi_> magicaltrout: then again, snaps will basically save us from ever needing to worry about distros again
[15:45] <magicaltrout> true that
[15:45] <magicaltrout> looking forward to snap integration
[15:46] <magicaltrout> i've cloned layer-basic locally, i'll create a layer-basic-centos to prevent clases
[15:46] <magicaltrout> clashes
[15:46] <marcoceppi_> we have a snap layer that stub wrote, I know ryebot and Cynerva have taken a run at it a few times for kuberentes stuff
[15:46] <magicaltrout> i'll have to check that out when i get time... i'd still get the "does it run on centos" question though ;)
[15:47] <magicaltrout> SA's are a picky bunch... why can't they just get on with it?
[15:47] <magicaltrout> I don't care if it doesn't fit their nagios templates ;)
[16:33] <magicaltrout> marcoceppi_: to save me digging all over the place
[16:33] <magicaltrout> do you know where you define stuff that ubuntu needs to install when creating a new machine to run the charms, python3 etc
[16:35] <magicaltrout> bootstrap_charm_deps
[16:35] <magicaltrout> think i found it
[16:49] <marcoceppi_> magicaltrout: yeah, it's in lib/layer/basic.py of the basic layer IIRC
[16:51] <magicaltrout> aye boos
[16:51] <magicaltrout> boss
[17:10] <jcastro> http://askubuntu.com/questions/875716/juju-localhost-lxd
[17:11] <jcastro> any ideas on this one?
[17:14] <magicaltrout> well
[17:14] <magicaltrout> you don't do intermodel relations yet
[17:14] <magicaltrout> so thats not going to fly very far currently
[17:39] <lazyPower> magicaltrout - sounds like they want 2 controllers, so two completely isolated juju planes on a single host
[17:39] <lazyPower> i'm not sure if we've even piloted that use case as a POC, as multi-model controllers removed a lot of the concerns here
[17:42] <magicaltrout> lazyPower: dustin swung by and asked about the DC/OS stuff, said he'd be happy to do some collaboration and pitch some talks at Mesoscon and stuff, now I'm off up to the Mesos meetup in London to go talk to the Mesosphere guys, maybe one day someone will offer to write the code as well! ;)
[17:42] <lazyPower> magicaltrout - i'd love to do that integration work *with* you
[17:42] <magicaltrout> anyway the LXD poc is coming along slowly
[17:42] <lazyPower> i think there's a good overlap in changes in k8s and mesos charms that will make it simple
[17:42] <magicaltrout> once we have something that semi works i'll get you guys and the mesosphere guys looped in to fill in the gaps
[17:43] <lazyPower> you're just plugging in api ip's and what not, i think theya re both rest based no?
[17:43] <lazyPower> and some dinky config flags to replace the scheduler too, dont let me forget those important nuggets
[17:43] <lazyPower> as a complete oversimplification of the problem domain ^
[17:44] <magicaltrout> you've lost me now
[17:44] <magicaltrout> what are you asking?
[17:44] <lazyPower> oh were you not talking about k8s/mesosphere integration?
[17:45] <magicaltrout> lxd -> Mesos <-juju
[17:45] <magicaltrout>       ^
[17:45] <magicaltrout>       -
[17:45] <magicaltrout>      k8s
[17:45] <lazyPower> oic
[17:46] <lazyPower> yeah i missed the mark there
[17:46] <magicaltrout> well the DCOS chaps are certainly interested in getting LXD into Mesos which would be a win because then juju can bootstrap against mesos
[17:46] <magicaltrout> you could run K8S on Juju within Mesos ;)
[17:47] <magicaltrout> and on your side Dustin says he's interested in getting Juju and DC/OS playing nicely which includes the LXD stuff
[17:48] <magicaltrout> but! when that starts coming together
[17:48] <magicaltrout> i shall be stealing your flannel network and stuff
[17:50] <magicaltrout> not that i have a clue how to monetize such a platform, but in my head juju managed mesos and juju bootstrapped mesos sounds pretty sweet
[17:52] <lazyPower> i concur
[17:52] <lazyPower> maybe the monetization is the support of such a platform and not the tech itself
[17:52] <lazyPower> not that anybody we know does that *whistles*
[18:34] <arosales> kwmonroe: if you have a sec I am seeing some curious behavior with spark via the hadoop-spark bundle + zeppelin
[18:34] <arosales> kwmonroe: doesn't seem like sparkpi is running successfully per the action output http://paste.ubuntu.com/23859116/  I also don't see the job in the spark job history server @ http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8080/
[18:39] <arosales> I do see "2017-01-24 17:28:22 INFO sparkpi calculating pi" in the /var/log/spark-unit logs though .  . .
[18:44] <kwmonroe> arosales: i'm not surprised at the lack of spark info in the spark job history server.. you're probably in yarn-client mode, which means the job will log to the resourcemanger (expose and check http://rm-ip:8088 to be sure)
[18:45] <kwmonroe> arosales: in your pastebin, search for "3.14", you'll see it.
[18:45] <kwmonroe> granted, that action output needs some love.. no sense in having all the yarn junk in there
[18:47] <arosales> kwmonroe: I do see jobs @ http://<IP_ADDRESS>:18080/ through
[18:47] <arosales> and it looks like pagerank ran ok, just issues with sparkpi
[18:49] <kwmonroe> arosales: i see 3 sparkpi jobs at your link... did you run some after the pagerank that are no longer showing up?
[18:49] <arosales> I did
[18:50] <arosales> kwmonroe: resourcemanger = http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster
[18:52] <kwmonroe> arosales: spark 8080 is the cluster view which (i think) will only show jobs when spark is running in spark mode (that is, not yarn-* mode).  spark 18080 is the history server that will show jobs that ran in yarn mode -- yarn 8088 also shows these.
[18:52] <arosales> kwmonroe: so looks like it ~is~ running just the raw output for the sparkpi action may be a little tuning?
[18:53] <arosales> kwmonroe: sorry, and to your previous question if I am _not_ seeing jobs I submitted --- I think I am seeing all the jobs @ http://<IP_ADDRESS>:18080/ and http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster
[18:55] <kwmonroe> yeah arosales, from those URLs, it looks like you're seeing all the spark jobs (sparkpi + pagerank) on the spark history server (18080), and all the spark *and* yarn jobs (sparkpi + pagerank + tera*) on the RM (8088)
[18:56] <arosales> kwmonroe: was http://paste.ubuntu.com/23859116/ the output you were expecting for sparkpi ?
[18:56] <arosales> to your point "3.14" is in there just amongst a lot of other data
[18:57] <kwmonroe> so arosales, i mispoke in my 1st reply.  to be clear, you should see all spark jobs in the spark history server (18080) and resourcemanager job history (8088).  you will *not* see  job history in the spark cluster view (8080) while in yarn mode.
[18:57] <arosales> kwmonroe: ack
[18:57] <kwmonroe> yup arosales, as long as it says "pi is roughly 3.1", we promulgate ;)
[18:57] <kwmonroe> because ovals are basically circles
[18:58] <arosales> kwmonroe: I was just concerned about the 153 lines of output to tell me a circle is like a oval
[18:58] <kwmonroe> :)  ack arosales, i'll see if we can clean up that raw output without hiding the meat.
[18:59]  * arosales will submit a feature on the spark charm ;-)
[18:59] <arosales> Just glad its working as expected
[18:59] <arosales> kwmonroe: thanks for the help
[19:01] <kwmonroe> np arosales - thanks for the action feedback!  if it ever returns "Pi is roughly a squircle", let me know asap.
[19:02] <arosales> kwmonroe: I'll not that for the failure scenerio
[19:04] <CoderEurope> marcoceppi_: You ready in about an hour ? (#Discourse)
[19:12] <kwmonroe> arosales: one more thing.. if you've still got the env, would you mind queueing multiple sparkpi/pagerank/whatever actions in a row?  i noticed sometimes the yarn nodemanagers would go away if memory pressure got too high, and yarn would report multipel "lost nodes" at http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster.   so if you don't mind, kick off a teragen, sparkpi, and pagerank action at the same time so i can watch.
[19:13] <kwmonroe> iirc, sometimes the RM would wait for resources before firing off those jobs, but sometimes not.  curious if that's easily recreatable.
[19:23] <arosales> kwmonroe: gah, missed this message before I tore down :-/
[19:23] <arosales> kwmonroe: easily reproducible though
[19:25] <kwmonroe> np arosales -- i've been meaning to get to the bottom of that.  i'm like 25% sure we fixed it when we disabled the vmem pressure setting.  i've got a deployment in my near future, so i'll check it out.  just one of those things i keep meaning to try but keep forgetting until someone like you comes along.
[19:25] <arosales> kwmonroe: np, spinning back up. I'll let you know what I find
[19:26] <kwmonroe> thanks!
[19:26] <marcoceppi_> CoderEurope: yup!
[19:27] <CoderEurope> marcoceppi_: On here ? or do you want me to keep PM'ing you ?
[19:28] <CoderEurope> Back in ten mins
[19:46] <CoderEurope> marcoceppi_: 15 to go ....... :)
[19:50] <rick_h> CoderEurope: heh, you're on a mission eh?
[19:54] <CoderEurope> rick_h: The weather is with us tonight ! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3TNGDVOMA4&feature=youtu.be
[19:54] <rick_h> CoderEurope: oh man, did not see that coming
[19:55] <CoderEurope> rick_h: I have ordered one of these in my budget: http://amzn.eu/e93uNrY
[20:02] <arosales> kwmonroe: ok got 20+ actions running @ http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster  from resourcemanager and spark
[20:04] <CoderEurope> marcoceppi_: you ready ?
[20:04] <arosales> kwmonroe: ref of actions running = http://paste.ubuntu.com/23859496/
[20:07] <CoderEurope> I have a nose bleed - hangon marcoceppi_
[20:08] <rick_h> whoa holy actions arosales
[20:09] <arosales> kwmonroe: wanted some mem pressure
[20:09] <arosales> :-)
[20:09] <CoderEurope> marcoceppi_: Okay at the ready :D
[20:12] <marcoceppi_> CoderEurope: yo, lets do this!
[20:14] <arosales> kwmonroe: also in ref to spark sparkpi action  https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/BIGTOP-2677  (low priority)
[20:28] <kwmonroe> +100 arosales!  thanks for opening the jira.
[20:29] <kwmonroe> ugh, i missed an opportunity to +3.14
[20:29] <lazyPower> kwmonroe fun fact, my apartment number is pi
[20:29] <kwmonroe> you must have a very long apt number lazyPower
[20:29] <lazyPower> its a subset of pi, but pi all the same
[20:30] <kwmonroe> 3?  close enough.  r square it.
[20:30] <lazyPower> :P
[20:36] <arosales> kwmonroe: let me know if you need me to run any more tests on this hadoop/spark cluster
[20:37] <kwmonroe> so arosales, you've hit it.  see your cluster UI http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster.. 3 "lost nodes".
[20:38]  * arosales looks
[20:38] <kwmonroe> arosales: what i'm waiting to see now is whether or not yarn will recover and process the last running job if/when the nodemgrs come bak.
[20:38] <arosales> ah http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster/nodes/lost  -- kind of hidden
[20:38] <arosales> kwmonroe: ack, I"ll let it run
[20:38] <CoderEuropeLenov> marcoceppi_: Just to keep you in the loop - my chromebook just crashed - 2 mins till re-surface on meet.jit.si
[20:47] <kwmonroe> arosales: what has happened here is that each of your nodemgrs is only capably of allocating 8gb of physical ram.  when yarn schedules mappers or reducers (which take min 1gb) on a nodemgr that already has a few running, it can "lose" those nodes.  i don't know the diff between an "unhealthy" node and a "lost" node, but i think the latter can come back once jobs complete.  what's interesting to me is that you got through 19
[20:47] <kwmonroe>  of the 20+ jobs.  surely that's not a coincidence.
[20:48] <arosales> at 8gb per nodemgr and 3 nodemgr wee should expect to see around 24 jobs at least allocated, correct?
[20:50] <kwmonroe> arosales: i would expect 24 jobs *possible* because the min allocation to each nodemgr is 1gb.  but jobs may specify mem constraints that differ from the min.  at any rate, 73 of your 74 jobs have completed, which makes me think those nodes get lost and come back once they're freed up -- like "i'm busy, don't allocate to me anymore".
[20:51] <kwmonroe> arosales: and now i see 82 jobs.  you're not giving this thing a break, are you :)
[20:52] <kwmonroe> i mean, "big data" is usually just a handful of word count jobs.. #amirite lazyPower?
[20:52] <arosales> kwmonroe: just for my education once a node is marked as lost does it return?  Seems the three @ http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster/nodes/lost haven't been "returned"
[20:52] <lazyPower> trufacts
[20:53] <lazyPower> but you were probably looking for the reaction: (ﾉ´･ω･)ﾉ ﾐ ┸━┸
[20:53] <arosales> kwmonroe: I stopped submitting a bit ago, but the submitted jobs are at http://paste.ubuntu.com/23859496/
[20:53] <CoderEurope> marcoceppi_: Awesome and valuable work there ... high five o/
[20:53] <marcoceppi_> \o
[20:55]  * CoderEurope leaves till tomorrow - bye y'all.
[20:55] <kwmonroe> arosales: i don't know for sure (if lost nodes return).  i think they do once they have > min phys mem available.  i have hope.  when we started this convo, you had 73 of 74 jobs completed with 3 nodes lost.  now you have 89 of 90 jobs complete.  i think that means that your job completion rate has lengthened, but they do appear to be completing eventually.. i suspect that's because a lost node comes back to grab another
[20:55] <kwmonroe> task.
[20:56] <kwmonroe> yeah arosales, for sure that's what's happening.  the terasort job that was running with 3 lost nodes has completed.  now 3 are still lost, but a new app (nnbench) is going.
[20:56] <kwmonroe> so all is well.  your cluster is just kinda small for 90+ concurrent jobs :)
[20:58] <arosales> kwmonroe: thanks for the info, and here with the hadoop-spark bundle e hae 3 separate units hosting the slave (datenode and node manager) correct?
[20:58] <kwmonroe> correct
[20:59] <arosales> and how do we map those units to the lost nodes (http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster/nodes/lost)
[21:01] <kwmonroe> arosales: they are the same.  your 3 lost nodes are the 3 slave units.
[21:02] <kwmonroe> so, what makes a node lost?  a failed health check, or a violation of constraints (like < min memory available).  the former means the nodemanager slave unit hasn't told the RM that it's available for jobs; the latter means it can't take jobs because it doesn't have enough resources available.
[21:02] <arosales> that was what I thought, but then I was wondering where were the 3 lost nodes (http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8088/cluster/nodes/lost) at in reference to units
[21:03] <arosales> logically the 3 lost have different node addresses than the 3 active nodes
[21:03] <kwmonroe> negative arosales - the node address is the ip of the slave unit.
[21:04] <arosales> yes, you are correct. Same address different ports
[21:04] <arosales> which makes me think we start a new process on the unit for a new node
[21:05] <arosales> _if_ we started with 3
[21:05] <kwmonroe> yup arosales -- when the RM has a new task, it farms it out to the slaves / nodes and they spawn a new java (hi mbruzek), which opens a new port.
[21:05] <mbruzek> yes Kevin?
[21:06] <kwmonroe> just java buddy
[21:06] <mbruzek> OK
[21:06] <arosales> kwmonroe: gotcha -- cool thanks for the lesson here
[21:07] <arosales> kwmonroe: no pending actions on the juju side -- all have completed
[21:08] <kwmonroe> ack arosales... now let's watch and see if the nodes come back in the cluster view now that the jobs are done.
[21:08] <kwmonroe> health checks happen every 10ish minutes
[21:08] <kwmonroe> which should bring them back if there are no jobs
[21:09]  * arosales will eagerly await kwmonroe
[21:31] <kwmonroe> arosales: your cluster ui (:8088) shows 3 active and 3 lost nodes.  i'm not sure how to reset the lost count without restarting yarn, or even if the 'lost' count is all that important given the expected nodes are 'active' now.  i'll google around to try and learn more about 'lost'.
[21:35] <arosales> kwmonroe: given we started with 3 and we have 3 active. I am not sure lost are recliamable
[21:37] <arosales> kwmonroe: it seems the cluster did try to keep the 3 "active" albeit starting a new "node" process on the 3 given units
[21:49] <kwmonroe> yeah arosales, it seems restarting yarn (sudo service hadoop-yarn-resourcemanager restart) resets the lost node count.  maybe the lost node count is supposed to be indicative of how many times the yarn cluster was starved for resources.  i really don't know.  i wish you never asked me this on a public forum because now people know i'm ignorant (on this one thing).
[21:51] <kwmonroe> but thanks for running this with me -- like i said earlier, i had been meaning to get to the bottom of lost nodes.  it's good to know the cluster can still do jobs (evinced by your 90+ jobs) even if nodes get reported as lost.
[21:51] <Teranet> with which command is : juju set been replaced with in juju 2.x ?
[21:52] <kwmonroe> Teranet: juju config
[21:52] <Teranet> so syntax I hope right ?
[21:53] <kwmonroe> juju config <app> <key>=<value>.  pretty sure it's the same, just s/config/set
[21:53] <kwmonroe> er, s/set/config
[21:59] <arosales> kwmonroe: np, thanks for the info and keeping with my odd questions :-)
[22:00] <arosales> I could have tried to look it up, but it I was lazy and just pinged you
[22:05] <lazyPower> ooo someone said my name, but not directed at me :D
[22:11] <arosales> lazyPower: :-)
[22:59] <magicaltrout> he was balding... he was pink... they called him kevin....keeevin. He had a swimming pool, with questionable filtration... they called him Kevin Keeeeeevin or just kwmonroe
[23:00] <magicaltrout> kwmonroe: if i punt you chaps some big data chapters from my little book over the next couple of weeks can you give them the once over?
[23:08] <arosales> magicaltrout: I was going to catch you in gent, but would love to look over your chapters. Would like to see what you have lined up for testing and layer creation
[23:10] <magicaltrout> not a great deal yet arosales :) I have some stuff sketched out for layer creation. I didn't do testing yet because a) kjackal_ suggested he might help out there and also I wanted to review what went down in the office hours the other day with the python stuff from bdx
[23:10] <magicaltrout> to try and aggregate examples
[23:11] <magicaltrout> i'll be certain to punt stuff your direction though to help suggest gaps
[23:11] <magicaltrout> i'm crowdsourcing knowledge ;)
[23:12] <bdx> magicaltrout: tvansteenburghhttps://gist.github.com/jamesbeedy/dad808872e5488b43cf3fa5d5f2db87c
[23:12] <arosales> magicaltrout: would be good to catch you up on charm-ci in gent if not sooner
[23:13] <bdx> errrg, tvansteenburghhttps was just giving me some pointers on that jenkins script I've been working on
[23:15] <arosales> magicaltrout: but yes kjackal is also an excellent guy to help out with the charm ci bits as well
[23:15] <magicaltrout> bdx: someone on the book feedback stuff specifically asked for CI and testing examples
[23:16] <magicaltrout> so I figure we should probably solve that conundrum ;)
[23:27] <Teranet> Hey do we have anyone here who knows rabbitmq-server setup for a cluster ? I got 3 nodes but somehow they won't peer right.
[23:32] <Teranet> Log output and OpenSTACK overview : http://paste.ubuntu.com/23860574/
[23:35] <arosales> Teranet: not sure what folks are around atm, but you also may have some luck posting in #openstack-charms
[23:36] <Teranet> thx will do
[23:36] <balloons> wallyworld, the osx bug is on us indeed. You're free :-)
[23:37] <wallyworld> yay, ty


[00:00] <awilkins> lifeless: CAn you BAN announcer? Pretty please?
[00:04] <announcer> Rev 3273: (jam) Fix moving directories to root nodes. john@arbash
[00:05] <announcer> Rev 3274: (Neil Martinsen-Burrell) Explain version-info --custom in the User<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[00:05] <lifeless> its saying channel not synced
[00:05] <lifeless> when I try to ban
[00:05]  * awilkins is not familiar enough with IRC to know what this means
[00:05] <lifeless> neither am I
[00:05] <lifeless> I am hoping someone else where will be ;)
[00:06] <elmo> lifeless: op me
[00:06] <frsk> It's because there's a netsplit going on, I think
[00:06]  * awilkins has a cunning plan.... /ignore announcer
[00:08] <lifeless> elmo: what was the issue ?
[00:08] <elmo> lifeless: no idea; it was a WAG that it'd work for me
[00:08] <elmo> I'm spethial ;-)
[00:08] <lifeless> heh. thanks
[00:09] <announcer> Rev 3273: (jam) Fix moving directories to root nodes. john@arbash
[00:10] <announcer> Rev 3274: (Neil Martinsen-Burrell) Explain version-info --custom in the User<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[00:10] <lifeless> elmo: it would be nice if it had worked for you :)
[00:12] <mwhudson> i knew the ban syntax was funky, but that's really strange
[00:13] <jelmer> awilkins: I don't see anything there about allowing c variables as arguments to extension type constructors
[00:13] <awilkins> jelmer: The bit that caught my eye was "So you can use extension types to wrap arbitrary C data structures and provide a Python-like interface to them."
[00:14] <awilkins> I was thinking that meant you could pass a c-struct to a parameter that demanded an extension type based on that c-struct ?
[00:15] <jelmer> awilkins: probably, but I'm trying to work out how :-)
[00:15] <awilkins> What are the types?
[00:15] <jelmer> not really relevant, but svn_ra_reporter2_t, apr_pool_t, void *
[00:16] <awilkins> void *? One of the dreaded "batons"?
[00:16] <jelmer> yup
[00:16] <jelmer> that's not really relevant here though
[00:16] <jelmer> I just need to pass pointers, no need for interpretation
[00:16] <jelmer> by pyrex
[00:17] <lifeless> anyone know who is running announcer?
[00:17] <awilkins> Well, a pointer is a platform-sized integer
[00:18] <lifeless> jelmer: you can't allow C ariables directly because extension types are constructable by python
[00:18] <lifeless> jelmer: the constructor has to follow python ABI, which means getting python objects and unpacking appropriately
[00:19] <jelmer> lifeless: statik is running announcer apparently
[00:19] <awilkins> jelmer: Is this relevant? http://www.obviousobscurity.org/?page_id=13
[00:19] <jelmer> lifeless: Ah, crap
[00:19] <lifeless> statik: ping
[00:19] <awilkins> Just under "Example 1" "wherever you can pass a void * you can pass a python object"
[00:19] <lifeless> jelmer: care to give me a quick snapshot on your problem
[00:19] <jelmer> lifeless: It's possible in SWIG, it just makes the class impossible to construct from python itself
[00:20] <lifeless> jelmer: that means it has no constructor :)
[00:20] <jelmer> it has a constructor, but no python users can ever construct the arguments to call that constructor properly :-)
[00:20] <lifeless> jelmer: one way you could meaningfully do this is to have a no-args constructor, then a C initialisation interface
[00:21] <lifeless> jelmer: swig has issues though ;)
[00:21] <jelmer> lifeless: Basically, I have a pyrex function which calls out to a C function that returns 2 pointers
[00:21] <jelmer> I would like to return a Python object from my pyrex function that uses those two pointers
[00:22] <lifeless> lol searching for 'pyrex wrap' on google is not sfw
[00:23]  * awilkins isn't at work *click*
[00:23] <jelmer> :-)
[00:24] <jelmer> lifeless: yeah, pyrex owns swig big time if you only need Python bindings
[00:24] <jelmer> The next release of bzr-svn will likely no longer use python-subversion but its own pyrex code
[00:25] <lifeless> jelmer: you can define __new__ with C args I think
[00:26] <lifeless> http://ldots.org/pyrex-guide/5-python-wrapper.html#class
[00:26] <lifeless> e.g. def __new__(self, reporter, pool)
[00:27] <lifeless> oh hmm
[00:27] <lifeless> no
[00:27] <lifeless> jelmer: the easiest and cleanest way
[00:27] <jelmer> it'll complain that it's not possible to use cdef for special methods
[00:27] <lifeless> would be a trivial type wrap (e.g. an incomplete type definition)
[00:27] <jelmer> and without cdef it's not possible to have c type arguments
[00:27] <lifeless> what are the types of the two pointers
[00:28] <jelmer> one is a typedeffed struct and the other is a void pointer
[00:28] <lifeless> so
[00:28] <lifeless> ctypedef typedeffedstruct
[00:29] <lifeless> ctypedef ctypedef baton void *
[00:29] <lifeless> cdef class foo:
[00:30] <lifeless>     def __init__(self, struct, baton):
[00:30] <lifeless>         self.struct = struct
[00:30] <lifeless>         self.baton = baton
[00:30] <lifeless>     cdef typedeffedstruct struct
[00:31] <lifeless>     cdef baton baton
[00:31] <lifeless> obviously reorder but roughly that should work I think
[00:31] <jelmer> that breaks
[00:32] <lifeless> pastebin it?
[00:32] <jelmer> because it complains in the __init__ that struct is being converted from a Python object to a ctypedeffedstruct
[00:32] <lifeless> thunk it
[00:32] <lifeless> def __init__..
[00:33] <jelmer> thunk it?
[00:33] <lifeless>     cdef typedeffedstruct c_struct
[00:33] <lifeless>     self.struct = c_struct
[00:33] <lifeless> emr
[00:33] <lifeless>         c_struct = passed_in_struct
[00:34] <lifeless> totally unclear I know. 3 lines; a typed variable, assignment to that
[00:34] <lifeless> then local assignment
[00:34] <lifeless> if that doesn't work, give me a second
[00:35]  * awilkins thinks 00:21 < jelmer> lifeless: Basically, I have a pyrex function which calls out to a C function that returns 2 pointers
[00:35] <awilkins> 00:21 < jelmer> I would like to return a Python object from my pyrex function that uses those two pointers
[00:35] <awilkins> oops
[00:35] <awilkins> sorry
[00:38] <jelmer> lifeless: nope, I don't seem to be able to fool it that way either :-(
[00:38] <jml> jelmer: hi
[00:38] <jelmer> jml: Hey
[00:39] <awilkins> Did you look at http://www.obviousobscurity.org/?page_id=13 , because I thought that looked promising
[00:39] <jml> jelmer: I was looking at your subunit patches: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/subunit/+bug/178362 and https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/subunit/+bug/178361
[00:39] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 178361 in subunit "[MERGE] Split by newline rather than by any whitespace character." [Low,Fix committed]
[00:39] <jml> jelmer: but I couldn't find the actual patches.
[00:41] <jelmer> I think I originally sent them to robert and later forwarded them to launchpad before it had support for attachments
[00:41] <jelmer> I'll see if I still have them somewhere
[00:43] <lifeless> jelmer: can you pastebin your experiment ?
[00:44] <awilkins> Or just post a branch of it :-)
[00:44] <lifeless> well
[00:44] <lifeless> right now, fastest to pastebin ;)
[00:45] <awilkins> I presume it's svn_ra_do_diff ?
[00:46] <jml> jelmer: anyway, if you post them on LP, I'll try to review them
[00:47] <awilkins> Poor jelmer, being pulled three ways
[00:48] <jelmer> lifeless: The branch is at http://people.samba.org/bzr/jelmer/bzr-svn/pyrex
[00:48] <lifeless> meh
[00:48] <lifeless> ok
[00:48] <jelmer> I'll see if I can trim it down to something that's easier to test and play with
[00:49] <jelmer> jml: sure, I'll have a look
[00:50] <jelmer> jml: Hmm, it's not possible yet to create a branch in launchpad yet using "bzr push lp:..." ?
[00:51] <jelmer> ah, only if I specify a homedir explicitly
[00:52] <awilkins> Yup, no squiggless
[00:52] <jml> jelmer: huh what?
[00:53] <jelmer> "bzr push lp:subunit/cparent" complains about "invalid series"
[00:53] <jelmer> but "bzr push lp:~jelmer/subunit/cparent" works ok
[00:53] <jml> oh
[00:53] <jml> what would you rather it do?
[00:54] <jelmer> Tell me new branches can only be created if I specify an explicit owner, perhaps
[00:54] <jelmer> it's a minor thing though
[00:54] <jelmer> I tend to only use launchpad for mirrorring my branches rather than hosting them
[00:55] <milian> hey is it somehow possible to ignore a file which is under version control? let me explain why I need this:
[00:55] <jml> jelmer: error messages are pretty important
[00:55] <milian> whe have a website in bzr, a forum - its in its untouched status so everybody can install it
[00:56] <milian> but the changes that occur by installing it dont neccessarily need to be submitted
[00:56] <milian> thus I'd like to ignore some of those files - is this possible?
[00:56] <lifeless> jelmer: please file a bug
[00:57] <lifeless> jelmer: also, bzr register-branch --product subunit, now uses the public location so just-works
[00:57] <jelmer> lifeless: yes, but this is really a minor thing compared to "bzr register-branch" which gives a traceback for pretty much everything
[00:58] <jelmer> (branch already registered, invalid product, authentication, ..)
[00:58] <awilkins> milian: bzr help ignore
[00:58] <lifeless> jelmer: file bugs on all of those :)
[00:58] <lifeless> jelmer: feedback -> improvements
[00:58] <lifeless> awilkins: I don't htink that will do what milian wants
[00:58] <lifeless> milian: you basically want a file which noone can edit
[00:59] <awilkins> lifeless: I'm not sure what milian wants
[00:59] <lifeless> milian: I don't see how you could edit it yourself subsequent to doing this
[00:59] <lifeless> milian: what I suggest you do, is have the file called something like 'filename.example'
[00:59] <jelmer> lifeless: I know :-) I've already filed bugs on some of them earlier
[00:59] <lifeless> milian: then folk can copy it to filename, to get an unversioned local copy
[00:59] <awilkins> milian: How about template files which you copy to "install" the thing?
[01:00] <awilkins> milian: You could even write a small script that does the copying
[01:00] <awilkins> Darn, lifeless got there first
[01:00] <milian> hmmm complicated
[01:00] <milian> but well, lets see what I can come up with
[01:00] <milian> thank you guys
[01:02] <lifeless> milian: or you could just 'bzr revert filename' after merging from someone to ignore any changes they made
[01:03] <awilkins> The template idea coupled with an ignore list for the real config files has the advantage of not requiring constant vigilance
[01:06] <milian> ah blast it - now I've accidently commited some files I dont want - how do I revert that commit without losing my changes? backing up my files and reverting?
[01:06] <milian> I haven't pushed yet - so the commit should be local
[01:07] <milian> or is bzr revert --forget-merges what I want?
[01:07] <lifeless> bzr uncommit
[01:07] <awilkins> bzr uncommit
[01:07] <milian> oh darn - so simple :D great
[01:07] <milian> thank you again
[01:08] <poolie> hello again
[01:09] <lifeless> poolie: hi
[01:09] <lifeless> poolie: did you see leslies 'register now urgent urgent' mail ?
[01:10] <lifeless> just checking my gmail now so just saw it
[01:13] <lifeless> statik: ping, announcer banned, it wouldn't shutup
[01:17] <poolie> lifeless: not yet, will look
[01:17] <poolie> lifeless: i just saw that hardy went into beta freeze
[01:17] <poolie> i would really like to get the baz rename done before it's too late
[01:17] <poolie> was it beuno looking after it?
[01:18] <lifeless> yes, was getting the patch up
[01:18] <lifeless> some serious headache though
[01:18] <lifeless> baz fails to build
[01:18] <lifeless> api changes in libneon
[01:18] <lifeless> poolie: oh, so unless you applied for bzr to be an organisation, we've missed soc.
[01:18] <lifeless> I didn't put us in.
[01:19] <poolie> i have not
[01:19] <lifeless> right, that makes deciding on soc projects easy
[01:19] <poolie> right
[01:19] <poolie> tbh i don't think it gives a good return on the amount of time it requires, compared to helping people in the project directly
[01:20] <poolie> we can sponsor people directly if they'd like to do similar things
[01:20] <lifeless> I don't htink there is much soc specific overhead myself
[01:20] <beuno> poolie, baz doesn't build in either lenny or feisty >
[01:20] <lifeless> the questionaires etc are pretty quick to do
[01:20] <beuno> so the work is done for the transition
[01:20] <beuno> but since we can't get it to build, we can't upload
[01:22] <poolie> beuno: so the old binary can stay in the archive? how is that allowed?
[01:23] <poolie> lifeless: there's time in applying, dealing with student applications, reporting to them
[01:23] <poolie> it's non-trivial
[01:23] <beuno> poolie, it won't in Debian, and, in Ubuntu, it's been passed on in binary. I have _no_ idea how/why
[01:23] <jelmer> jml: Still there?
[01:24] <jml> jelmer: always
[01:24] <beuno> it will get removed from Debian if it's not fixed, as it's a release critical bug
[01:24] <jelmer> jml: The changes for those bugs are in the branches I just registed on launchpad
[01:24] <jml> jelmer: ok.
[01:24] <jelmer> jml: My trunk branch contains the SubunitTestRunner change
[01:24] <jelmer> and the "jelmer" branch contains a bunch of other changes
[01:24] <lifeless> poolie: there is, I'm comparing that time to the time to get contributions directly; we still have to decide whats good, work with folk contributing code, assess how they are going if we are doing a bounty
[01:24] <lifeless> poolie: I don't think the /incremental/ overhead is significant
[01:25] <lifeless> poolie: anyhow, its all moot
[01:25] <poolie> it is moot
[01:25] <poolie> approximately zero of the students last year committed long-term improvements
[01:26] <poolie> that doesn't mean there's no prospect of doing better
[01:27] <poolie> the main advantage i think is if it brings people in who would not previously have thought of working on it, and who do actually get right into it
[01:27] <poolie> the potential is there...
[01:28] <jelmer> phanatic got into bazaar through the SoC
[01:28] <jelmer> Samba got one committer because of the SoC
[01:29] <jelmer> I know wine has similar results
[01:29] <jelmer> all 1 in 6 students actually staying around
[01:29] <lifeless> poolie: I think we should do bounties for the folk that were interested from the sprint
[01:29] <lifeless> poolie: if we can get funding for that
[01:30] <poolie> that's true
[01:30] <poolie> we can
[01:30] <beuno> poolie, and you already have the topics to choose from organized in: http://bazaar-vcs.org/SprintLondonMarch08/Brainstorms   :)
[01:30] <poolie> so we can fund jelmer, phanatik, guillermo,
[01:33] <lifeless> cool
[01:35] <beuno> so, poolie, lifeless, what do you want to do about baz?
[01:36] <poolie> excuse my ignorance, but if it ftbfs how can it go into a new distribution release?
[01:36] <beuno> well, I don't know how Ubuntu is doing it. They seem to just pass on the binary
[01:36] <poolie> beuno: you're still in london?+
[01:37] <beuno> Debian will remove it before relase
[01:37] <beuno> poolie, no, Madrid. My flight was cheaper if I returned the 20th, so I'm waiting here until then
[01:37] <poolie> beuno: i want to not have hardy release with 'install bazaar' not giving you baz
[01:37] <poolie> i mean, bzr
[01:38] <beuno> poolie, even at the expense of removing baz?
[01:38] <beuno> neither me or james_w could get it to build in debian or ubuntu, so we can't upload the changed binary name for transitioning
[01:41] <jelmer> is there any reasoning as to what options are retrieved using their own function on BranchConfig or using get_user_option() ?
[01:41] <lifeless> http://weblog.latte.ca/blake/tech/bzr/Looms - nice :)
[01:42] <lifeless> jelmer: get_user_option has a basic lookup
[01:42] <lifeless> jelmer: custom methods are used for things that don't fit into that
[01:42] <james_w> lifeless: nice.
[01:43] <james_w> lifeless: also http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.package-management.vcs-pkg/11
[01:44] <jelmer> lifeless: thanks
[01:44] <lifeless> james_w: great post'
[01:44] <lifeless> james_w: now how about a patch to make merge actually merge the looms :)
[01:45] <james_w> lifeless: erm, yeah...
[01:45] <james_w> I might do some looms tomorrow.
[01:46] <james_w> I've got my own little bzr sprint going on.
[01:46] <james_w> Going to work is for people who never want to get anything done :)
[01:49] <lifeless> james_w: :>
[01:50]  * beuno points to http://blog.orebokech.com/2008/03/emacs-in-bzr-initial-impressions.html
[01:58] <poolie> hello yacc
[02:00] <yacc> poolie: hi.
[02:10] <poolie> beuno: so it really looks like log in the main problem atm; mwh has a patch to speed it up for very long history
[02:10] <mwhudson> (when he's not busy killing x)
[02:11] <beuno> poolie, ah, cool. We should really make an effort to make sure "bzr is painfully slow" doesn't get stuck in people's heads
[02:15] <poolie> indeed
[02:17] <poolie> jml: could you followup about that, if you haven't done so already?
[02:17]  * beuno is off to bed
[02:21] <james_w> anyone know how to stop vim from forcing you to the first column when you type # to start a comment?
[02:22] <poolie> james_w: hm, yes, somehow
[02:22] <jelmer> poolie/lifeless: Any chance one of you could set "child_submit_to =<EMAIL_ADDRESS>in bzr.dev's .bzr/branch/branch.conf ?
[02:22]  * poolie looks
[02:22] <poolie> jelmer: i think only lifeless can write there
[02:24] <poolie> james_w: i remember hitting that myself
[02:24] <poolie> maybe 'filetype indent on' ?
[02:25] <piedoggie> I screwed up a merge.  commit from one machine is the mainline is at rev 40.  changes from second are recorded as rev 38.1.1.  how do I merge rev 40 and 38.1.1 into a new revsion?
[02:25] <poolie> or set nosmartindent nocindent, probably in an autocmd for python files
[02:26] <poolie> piedoggie: are those numbers from the same branch?
[02:26] <piedoggie> y
[02:26] <poolie> hm
[02:26] <poolie> actually, can you explain more? it sounds like you've already merged them
[02:26] <poolie> you don't like the way you merged it?
[02:27] <piedoggie> all the changes (38.1.1)  have not made it to head.
[02:27] <poolie> because they conflicted and you rejected them?
[02:27] <piedoggie> it is like I created a branch
[02:28] <piedoggie> the changes should have been in conflict but I never got the merge message
[02:28] <james_w> poolie: it seems like :set cindent might be it.
[02:28] <poolie> rather nocin
[02:28] <piedoggie> er.. conflict message
[02:29] <poolie> piedoggie:
[02:29] <lifeless> poolie: hmm, permissions
[02:29] <poolie> possibly easiest is to do 'merge -c 38.1.1', which will redo all those changes, then you can pick what you want
[02:29] <poolie> lifeless: ?
[02:29] <poolie> on that branch
[02:29] <piedoggie> k let me try that
[02:30] <piedoggie> -c not -r?
[02:30] <poolie> yes
[02:30] <lifeless> poolie: rsync/bzr/bzr.dev$ chmod g+w .bzr/branch/*
[02:30] <lifeless> poolie: you should be able to edit
[02:30] <lifeless> poolie: sorry about wrong permissions
[02:30] <poolie> if the changes you want are not in that particular revision, but rather something it merged, then you might need to pick out the particular one and use -c on that
[02:30] <james_w> poolie: thanks for the pointers.
[02:31] <poolie> you're welcome
[02:31] <lifeless> *yawn*
[02:31] <lifeless> 5am is the wrong time to wake
[02:31] <piedoggie> how can I show all the diffs?  diff -c 38.1.1??
[02:32] <poolie> yes
[02:33] <lifeless> bbiab
[02:33] <piedoggie> this may not be a good thing :-) but bzr works in a way that feels natural to my mind
[02:33] <poolie> :)
[02:44]  * yacc wonders if bzr is not a better client for svn repos than svn even now, ...
[02:45]  * RAOF has found it to be so.
[02:46] <RAOF> But that's because I don't use svn properly (ie: I try to do branch-merge, which is almost exactly half supported by svn :P)
[03:54] <Potato-[CE]> i have a question: can i use bzr for multiple projects which are in multiple directories (not all under one obvious parent directory)?
[03:55] <gotgenes> Potato-[CE]: Sure, you could but you have to examine whether there's advantage in keeping each project under the same repository.
[03:56] <gotgenes> As long as you house all projects within some central directory, though, then yes, you can keep all of them in a single repository.
[03:57] <Potato-[CE]> well, i think i need to start over with my directory layout. I have one project just started, i don't mind erasing the data...what's the best way to change the repository directory?
[03:58] <Potato-[CE]> just delete .bzr?
[04:00] <gotgenes> Potato-[CE]: That would do it.
[04:02] <Potato-[CE]> okay, i see that here too "If you accidently put the wrong tree under version control, simply delete the .bzr directory."
[04:02] <Potato-[CE]> thanks for the information, i appreciate it. :-)
[04:11] <NfNitLoop> So I'm trying to check out a svn repo with bzr-svn, and I can't tell if it's in a loop or not.
[04:11] <NfNitLoop> I've got the message:
[04:11] <NfNitLoop> using experimental bzr-svn mappings; output may change between revisions
[04:12] <jml> So, I think I've mentioned this before, but did you know that the ssh process started by Bazaar hangs around doing things if the Bazaar process is SIGINTed?
[04:12] <NfNitLoop> and a progress bar keeps filling up.
[04:13] <NfNitLoop> oops, nevermind, there it goes.
[04:13] <NfNitLoop> I guess it just had tons of branches to check out.
[04:13] <NfNitLoop> *heart* bzr-svn.
[05:03] <jml> jam; ping
[05:30] <ubotu> New bug: #202063 in bzr-gtk "gannotate display of uncommitted lines is unobvious" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202063
[05:49] <jml> does Bazaar use Twisted Conch as its ssh client in Windows?
[06:41] <lifeless> jml: not as far as I Know
[06:43] <jml> lifeless: it's just that there's some things that say "Twisted" on the Bazaar / Launchpad showmedo video
[06:50] <lifeless> interesting
[07:06] <poolie> lifeless: hi, want a brief call?
[08:07] <Peng> ubotu: ping?
[08:07] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about ping? - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[08:07] <Peng> Well, that's a good enough response.
[08:20] <ubotu> New bug: #202079 in trac-bzr ""Invalid url supplied to transport" in sub directories" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202079
[08:31] <RAOF> I've got some strange behaviour with Hardy's bzr:  I'm branching Do (with lp:do, so bzr+ssh), and when I do this into a directory which *isn't* a shared repository, "bzr info" in the branch directory gives Standalone tree (format: dirstate).
[08:32] <RAOF> When I branch it into a directory under a default-format (pack-0.92) repository, and then run bzr info in the branch directory I get: Repository tree (format: unnamed)
[08:33] <Peng_> Yeah.
[08:33] <Peng_> The name like "pack-0.92" refers to the repository type, branch type, and working tree type.
[08:33] <RAOF> When I branch it into a repository with rich-root format, the branch errors out with: http://www.paste2.org/p/15882
[08:34] <Peng_> When you branch it into the repo, it's using pack-0.92's repo type but dirstate's branch type, so bzr doesn't know what to call it.
[08:34] <RAOF> Right.  So that should probably be handled by printing both repo & branch type.
[08:34] <Peng_> Indeed.
[08:35] <Peng_> info -v will show all of them.
[08:35] <RAOF> Ah, right.
[08:36] <RAOF> Is there already a bug for this?
[08:37] <Peng_> Shrug.
[08:37] <Peng_> Wait, a bug about what?
[08:38] <Peng_> That information or the error you pasted?
[08:38] <RAOF> That information.
[08:38] <Peng_> Oh.
[08:38] <Peng_> Shrug.
[08:38] <RAOF> Heh.  It's a small problem, but it'd be nice if it displayed both :)
[08:38] <RAOF> Any ideas about the error?+
[08:39] <RAOF> Eh
[08:39] <Peng> I dunno.
[08:39] <RAOF> Heh
[08:39] <Peng> But, rich-roots and non-rich-roots don't really go together.
[08:39] <Peng> Huh.
[08:39] <Peng> I'm surprised you didn't get a compatibility error. Maybe bzr's smarter than that.
[08:47] <awilkins> jml: plink appears to be the best choice for bzr+ssh:// on windows
[08:47] <Peng> What's wrong with paramiko?
[08:47] <awilkins> Had a chap in here a couple of days ago that couldn't get it to work, but plink worked fine for him
[08:48] <awilkins> I suppose I could upload a key to LP and try both
[08:48] <Peng> What problem was he having?
[08:48] <Peng> Password prompt?
[08:48] <awilkins> I thin it was dropping the stream in the middle of establishment
[08:49] <awilkins> He was using an agent
[08:51]  * awilkins uploads a key
[08:51] <Peng> Oh, huh.
[08:54] <awilkins> DId you buy your network card from the same guy that sold jelmer his :-)
[08:55] <Peng_> Hahaha.
[08:55] <Peng_> Actually, the Ethernet port on my 2-year-old motherboard failed, so I'm using my 5-year-old NIC...
[08:55] <Peng_> But I'm tinkering with a new IRC client.
[08:56] <awilkins> I'm quite happy with irssi running on my router atm.
[08:56] <Peng_> Goodbye Konversation.
[08:56] <fullermd> I'm due for another bout of screwing with irssi to try and resolve annoyances...
[08:57] <Peng_> Heh.
[08:57] <Peng_> I've used irssi a little, but I'll stick with my GUI clients..
[08:57] <fullermd> The part where it (sometimes) eats part of wrapped lines is especially bothersome.
[08:58] <awilkins> Running irssi on the router has the advantage that my office IT services can't block it.
[08:58] <asabil> Peng_: weechat
[08:58] <fullermd> The big problem with GUI clients is that they don't work well inside screen   :p
[08:58] <Peng_> asabil: ?
[08:58] <asabil> weechat is a quite nice client
[08:58] <Peng_> Ah.
[08:59] <Peng> Oh, non-GUI.
[08:59] <asabil> still very usable
[08:59] <Peng_> Connection reset by peer?  I hit the quit button!
[08:59] <awilkins> Well that's a pile of crap then
[09:01] <ubotu> New bug: #202083 in bzr "bzr info confusing when branch format does not match repository format" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202083
[09:43] <awilkins> So once you upload an SSH key to launchpad, is there a way to test it's working without creating branches?
[09:44] <Peng> If you have to create one, there's staging and junk.
[09:44] <awilkins> Meh?
[09:45] <Peng> Branches pushed to lp://staging/ or something are deleted daily. You can also register random branches to the +junk project.
[09:45] <awilkins> Aha
[09:45] <Peng> Wait, if you're using bzr+ssh, any operation would require a password or SSH key.. You could just "bzr info" something.
[09:46] <awilkins> Mmkay
[09:46] <awilkins> So, just replace the http with bzr+ssh ?
[09:46] <Peng> Yeah.
[09:46] <Peng> And add your username
[09:47] <Peng> After running bzr launchpad-login, lp: URLs will automatically use bzr+ssh too.
[09:48] <awilkins> so my username would be adrian-wilkins (that's what it says in my key edit window after the "~")
[09:52] <awilkins> Ooh, doesn't work well from powershell
[09:53] <awilkins> Ok, does the same thing from cmd.exe tooo
[09:53] <awilkins> THe SSH stuff works with plink though.. now for paramiko
[09:55] <awilkins> bzr: ERROR: Unrecognised value for BZR_SSH environment variable: paramiko
[10:06] <awilkins> Dumb-ass question : do you need to install pycrypto and paramiko for python 2.5 on windows?
[10:06]  * awilkins is finding it hard to locate a pycrypto binary for py2.5 on win32
[10:06] <Peng> They're both still necessary with 2.5, but they're likely provided with the bzr installer.
[10:07] <awilkins> THe standalone one or the python one?
[10:07]  * awilkins is using the python one
[10:07] <awilkins> Aha
[10:08]  * awilkins intalls the damn dependencies
[10:08] <Peng> http://bazaar-vcs.org/BzrWin32Installer#bzr-dependencies ?
[10:08] <awilkins> Yeees
[10:08] <Peng> That might not be the Python-based installer.
[10:08] <Peng> I have no idea how it all works.
[10:08] <awilkins> I've always used putty/plink
[10:09] <awilkins> THe Python flavoured one has none of the extra deps in it
[10:09] <Peng> Ah.
[10:12] <awilkins> Paramiko seems to work better than plink
[10:13] <awilkins> Plink gives you this "unable to read from standard input" error after it finishes
[10:14] <awilkins> It's happy enough using Pageant for keys though (puttys ssh-agent)
[10:14] <awilkins> Yay
[10:42] <fullermd> Man, progress bars have gotten unprogressive with packs   :|
[10:53] <awilkins> I always just _love_ seeing progress bars that clearly have no idea of how long things take :-|
[10:53] <LeoNerd> Even better are the ones that go backwards
[10:53] <awilkins> I'd much rather see a spinner, or an "estimate bar"
[10:53] <awilkins> Maybe make the progress bar out of "?" instead of "="
[10:53] <awilkins> Or "~"
[10:53] <awilkins> "Approximate progress bar"
[10:57] <fullermd> Don't even much see the spinner spinning; it spends so much time blocking in downloads that it's halfway done before it starts spinning.
[11:32] <Odd_Bloke> Morning.
[11:32] <Odd_Bloke> (And it actually is!)
[12:24] <awilkins> Odd_Bloke: Afternoon
[13:09] <awilkins> Gah, MinGW can't find files on other drives.... nice one, that should be at the top of the sodding install page for it
[13:09] <awilkins> "Oh by the way, windows path support is fundamentally broken in"
[13:10]  * awilkins rubs sore patch from beating head on wall
[13:14] <luris> If you've uncommited and reverted, are the changes lost, or is there a trick to it?
[13:14] <luris> :)
[13:15] <awilkins> luris: revert will backup changes to ~1~ files
[13:15] <Peng> luris: Also, the revision is still in the repo. You can find it if you wrote down the revid or with the "bzr heads" plugin.
[13:15]  * awilkins didn't know that
[13:16] <Peng> Not sure how you'd get it back into the branch though.. Maybe pull would do it?
[13:17] <fullermd> It will.
[13:17] <luris> Peng: pull like how?
[13:17] <fullermd> pull -rwhatever .
[13:17] <luris> bzr pull -r 1423?
[13:17] <awilkins> bzr pull . -r revid:mytrashedrevid  ?
[13:18] <luris> thanks :)
[13:50] <statik> lifeless: sorry about that
[13:52] <statik> everyone, sorry about the announcer malfunction yesterday
[13:52] <statik> won't happen again
[13:53] <fullermd> "Those responsible have been sacked."
[13:53] <Peng> Announcer malfunction?
[13:54] <fullermd> It wasn't a _malfunction_ per se...   it was just sorta "enthusiastic"...
[13:55] <xif> does bzr have anything similar to SVN:externals?
[13:55] <lamont> so... if I have a branch, and I want to make it an orphan (by forgetting all about it's parent), is it sufficient to just thwack .bzr/branch/branch.conf?
[13:57] <fullermd> lamont: I guess so...   depends on what you're trying to accomplish by "orphaning" it.
[13:57] <Peng> lamont: branch.conf includes the push location and other things too. I'd say edit it, don't just blindly delete it.
[13:57] <lamont> fullermd: I'm trying to make the branch of the cvsps-import-created bzr tree forget that it had a former life as a cvs tree.
[13:58] <lamont> Only in .bzr: checkout
[13:58] <lamont> Only in .bzr: repository
[13:58] <lamont> is the only diff other than the parent_location in branch.conf
[13:58] <fullermd> Oh, you're out of luck on that.  Once you've been in CVS, you NEVER forget.
[13:59] <lamont> ROTFL
[13:59] <fullermd> It's like Vietnam for source code.
[13:59] <lamont> Peng: this the new root-of-all-branches for the item in question
[13:59] <lamont> fullermd: and RCS is what?  WW I?
[14:00] <fullermd> I was thinking "Battle of Carthage".
[14:00] <lamont> or the Korean Conflict, since that wasn't even worthy to be called a war
[14:03] <lamont> so for the stupid question of the day (just to make sure I'm not a total idiot)... if I have a branch that I created with bzr branch $SOURCE, I bring it current with 'bzr up'?
[14:03] <lamont> as in bzr preserves that bit of cvs insanity?
[14:04] <Peng> lamont: Use "bzr pull". up is for checkouts.
[14:04] <Peng> lamont: (pull automatically updates the working tree too.)
[14:05] <lamont> ah.  which means I really want that to be a checkout - it's not a branch
[14:07] <Peng> Meh.
[14:07] <Peng> I always use branches even when I could really just use a checkout.
[14:07] <Peng> That way I don't have to learn how checkouts work.
[14:07] <lamont> (this is the "gimme a copy of _that_ branch so I can work on it locally and compile it" automatic processing thing)
[14:08] <lamont> where "work on it locally" == "compile it"
[14:12] <james_w> lamont: a lightweight checkout may be sufficient for you then, if all you want is the working tree.
[14:14] <lamont> james_w: that is all I want.
[14:14] <lamont> so yeah.
[14:14] <lamont> thanks
[14:33] <fullermd> Yeah, y'know, I was just thinking, "Gee, it's neat that some project is trying out bzr.  We should totally take that opportunity to rererehash a bunch of bzr-vs-git emails."
[14:37] <Odd_Bloke> james_w: GJ on the Emacs thread BTW. :)
[14:38] <james_w> Odd_Bloke: thanks.
[14:38] <james_w> fullermd: me too. :)
[15:05] <awilkins> Oh *spit*
[15:06] <awilkins> Anyone know how to get "ld" to look in other folders on MinGW ?
[15:06] <awilkins> (anyone who says "Add -L arguments" will be shot)
[15:07] <LeoNerd> Is -R in that category also?
[15:07] <fullermd> Hack the code?   :>
[15:07] <awilkins> I'm trying to build things in Pyre
[15:07] <awilkins> x
[15:15] <awilkins> Nnnnnyuurg, this is horrible
[15:35] <Odd_Bloke> Is there a test convenience function to create a branch that uses a shared repository if it finds one?  make_branch creates its own repo.
[15:42] <chadmiller> Hi abentley.  I submitted a patch to the list under the wrong address, and then followed it with the same thing from the correct address.  The correct address' patch got one level of approval.  Then the list moderator approved the second posting, which 1) clobbered the prev status and 2) has the wrong address on it.  Can you roll the latest one back, or should I spam the list again?
[15:43] <abentley> I think I can fix it.
[15:43] <chadmiller> 'Kay.
[15:47] <abentley> chadmiller: don
[15:47] <abentley> done
[15:47] <chadmiller> Thank you, sir.
[15:47] <abentley> You're welcome.
[15:50]  * awilkins is suffering PAIN
[15:51] <awilkins> Getting the build kit for Python is a real pain unless you have an MSDN sub
[15:55] <james_w> heh, I like the way gmane doesn't have emacs.devel under gmane.comp.editors, it's just gmane.emacs.devel
[15:56] <awilkins> The group was probably founded before there were any other editors except vi
[15:57] <awilkins> Or poking-the-motherboard-with-a-paperclip-wired-to-ground
[15:57] <fullermd> I'm pretty sure emacs pre-dates vi...
[15:57] <fullermd> (dunno if GNU-emacs does, but...)
[15:57] <awilkins> emacs is clearly OUTMODED compared to vi :-P
[15:58]  * awilkins raises shields
[15:58] <fullermd> Well, vi is certainly enmoded, so...
[16:40] <blueyed> Is there a shortcut to "bzr diff -r ancestor:FULLURL" (leaving FULLURL out and using the parent branch instead)?
[17:23] <awilkins> blueyed: Since your branch contains all the revisions from the parnet branch, just determine the tip revision of the parent branch and diff against that
[17:24] <awilkins> blueyed: Of course, to get the revno of the parent branch you need it's url :-(
[17:25] <fullermd> ancestor: doesn't use the tip, it uses the ancestor...
[17:26] <james_w> blueyed: does -r ancestor:submit: do it?
[17:28] <blueyed> james_w: -r submit:..ancestor: does it. Thanks. didn't know about "submit:" yet.
[17:29] <james_w> blueyed: I think it's quite new.
[17:29] <james_w> blueyed: I don't really understand it yet, but it was worth a shot.
[17:29] <blueyed> james_w: at least for my use case "-r submit:" is enough even.
[17:30]  * awilkins requires tea
[17:35] <ubotu> New bug: #202222 in bzr-loom "up-thread interacts poorly with remerge" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202222
[18:39] <mxpxpod> is bzr-svn able to get subversion tags?
[18:39] <jelmer> mxpxpod: it can fetch subversion tags as branches in bzr; it won't set bzr tags yet
[18:39] <LeoNerd> There's no "easy" way to tell a subversion tag as a tag
[18:40] <LeoNerd> In bzr, a tag is really a tag... it's a symbolic name for "just some point in history"...
[18:40] <LeoNerd> (same as CVS)
[18:40] <mxpxpod> I'm trying to check out openwrt's kamikaze 7.09 and I'm getting this:
[18:40] <LeoNerd> Whereas svn doesn't really have such a concept. All it has is a cheap copy, that happens to live in a directory called "tags"
[18:40] <mxpxpod> bzr branch https://svn.openwrt.org/openwrt/tags/kamikaze_7.09/ openwrt
[18:40] <mxpxpod> bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: "https://svn.openwrt.org/openwrt/tags/kamikaze_7.09/".
[18:42] <jelmer> mxpxpod: Do you have a subversion library that has been built with https support?
[18:42] <jelmer> mxpxpod: Try "svn ls https://svn.openwrt.org/openwrt/tags/kamikaze_7.09"
[18:42] <mxpxpod> jelmer: works fine
[18:43] <mxpxpod> ah, I see
[18:43] <mxpxpod> once I did that and accepted the certificate permanently, I'm able to branch
[18:45] <Odd_Bloke> Could someone reject<EMAIL_ADDRESS>for me?  It's been superseded, but by a divergent branch.
[18:47] <beuno> james_w, your post about bzr revno's rocks!  I suspect it's going to be widely pointed at  :)
[18:49] <trondn_> hi... I am probably doing something seriously wrong.. I downloaded and installed the development tree of bazaar on my test system, and tried just a simple command such as bzr log -v on the source tree.. it used 13 _minutes_ to complete and used 94% of the cpu.. This is on Solaris with python 2.5... any ideas what I should do differently?
[18:49] <asabil> jelmer: is there a way to handle google code svn with bzr-svn and launchpad ?
[18:50] <jelmer> asabil: Not sure what you mean - it is certainly possible to pull code fomr google code svn and upload it to launchpad
[18:50] <Peng> trondn_: Does your repo perhaps include the entire history of the universe?
[18:50] <asabil> jelmer: last time I tried It was broken, and launchpad fails to import google code sometimes
[18:51] <Peng> trondn_: You should install Pyrex and run "make". Bzr has some optional C bits to speed things up.
[18:52] <trondn_> Peng: I used the command listed on the "installation" web-page to branch the repository...
[18:52] <trondn_> Peng: I will try :)
[18:52] <jelmer> asabil: bzr-svn and launchpad imports are a completely different thing
[18:53] <asabil> yes I know, anyway I will wait for a new bzr-svn to test (one that is 1.2 compatible)
[18:55] <jelmer> asabil: what exactly was broken then ?
[18:56] <asabil> not able to find some special/inexistant files/properties containing a !
[18:56] <asabil> I am not really sure about the exact problem
[18:57] <asabil> I am unable to use bzr-svn (using bzr 1.2), but basically http://waf.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/ fails
[18:57] <asabil> last time I tried
[18:59] <james_w> beuno: thanks :)
[19:00] <james_w> trondn_: that is far too long. I've not heard of anyone running on solaris before, maybe there is something that bzr is doing wrong on that platform.
[19:01] <trondn_> james_w: i don't think there is anything wrong with the python-intepreter, because I did a quick test with mercurial, and that used just 2 secs to dump the history.. I will install the pyrex-library as suggested and retry the operation :)
[19:05] <asabil> trondn_: truss  -a  -e  -f  -rall  -wall bzr log ?
[19:05] <fullermd> Well, it's "too long", but I dunno if it's really unexpectedly long...
[19:05] <asabil> (never used solaris, but truss seems to be the equivalent of strace)
[19:06] <asabil> because 13 minutes is really very long
[19:07] <Peng> Huh. I just got 14 seconds on Linux. I didn't expect it would be that fast.
[19:07] <trondn_> asabil: it is using 98% CPU and all in user-space....
[19:07] <fullermd> Yes, but log -v is slower than a dead snail tied to a 3 meter cube of depleted uranium.
[19:07] <fullermd> I'm over 6 minutes of CPU time on running it here so far.
[19:07]  * Peng wanders off.
[19:07] <Peng> Wait, that's right.
[19:07] <Peng> I can't read time.
[19:07] <Peng> 14 *minutes*.
[19:07] <Peng> So Slowlaris is faster!
[19:07] <asabil> lol
[19:08]  * Peng wanders off.
[19:08] <asabil> fullermd: running it on the bzr sources itself ?
[19:09] <fullermd> Yeah.
[19:09] <fullermd> Over 8 minutes now...
[19:09] <asabil> :/ maybe bzr log really needs some love
[19:09] <fullermd> Well, yeah.  log -v and log $FILE have needed love since, like, ever.
[19:10] <james_w> ah, I missed the -v
[19:10] <trondn_> but why on earth is it so slow?
[19:11] <fullermd> log isn't bad.  But as soon as it gets within whiffing distance of the inventory, it might as well be running on an 8086.
[19:13] <trondn_> so there is nothing I can do to make it faster?
[19:13] <trondn_> (without hacking the source...)
[19:13] <fullermd> Heck, that's half the base complaint in the emacs thread; log $FILE.  That's not "slow with packs", that's always been *SLOW*.
[19:13] <fullermd> Crud.  I'm over 12 minutes.  Hurry up and finish!  My ego couldn't take being behind Solaris...   :(
[19:14] <fullermd> Well, either "hack the source", or "don't use log -v".
[19:15] <beuno> fullermd, just pop in 3 more CPUs, and 4 gigs of ram
[19:15] <beuno> that should put solaris in it's place
[19:15] <LarstiQ> heh
[19:15] <beuno> maybe a 15.000 rpm disk
[19:15]  * LarstiQ is actually get a Sun machine RSN
[19:15] <beuno> but that maybe abuse
[19:15] <fullermd> Well, I certainly needs new disks.  And they will be 15k'ers.   Canonical will have to put sown some hard cash to beat that  :p
[19:16] <beuno> we should finally open a bug for "bzr is too slow, send ram and CPUs to users on request"
[19:16] <Odd_Bloke> +
[19:16] <Odd_Bloke> Ack, +1
[19:17] <Peng> Sign me up!
[19:17]  * LarstiQ sends Peng a spare 6510
[19:18] <Peng> Back in my day, a 2-core, 2 GHz CPU with 2 GB of RAM was good...
[19:18] <fullermd> New drives will probably speed bzr up more on common ops for me than CPU upgrade...
[19:18] <Peng> Well, the CPU is nice, but I keep chewing all my RAM with Firefox and whatnot.
[19:18] <fullermd> My drives have done real nice by me, but they're getting a little long in the tooth.
[19:19] <trondn_> fullermd: so what was the result of your command?
[19:19] <fullermd> Dunno.  It's over 18 minutes now.
[19:19] <trondn_> :O
[19:20] <fullermd> Sad.  It took less than 9 to branch the whole history down across the network, more than twice that (and still running) to look at the logs.
[19:20] <LarstiQ> fullermd: what branch would that be?
[19:20] <fullermd> bzr.dev
[19:20] <beuno> I suppose some noise should be made in bug 172975
[19:20] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 172975 in bzr "bzr log slower with packs" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/172975
[19:21] <fullermd> I doubt that bug has much relation to this issue.
[19:22] <trondn_> there must be something seriously wrong with the algorithm, because 98% of the time is spent in the userspace, and when I try to use truss to look at the the process it use extremely few system calls.....
[19:22] <beuno> than a new one should be opened
[19:22] <trondn_> (none in 30 secs..)
[19:22] <fullermd> What's wrong with it is "building inventories is motherfarking expensive".
[19:23] <beuno> fullermd, sounds like a good bug title
[19:24] <AfC> I like it
[19:25] <LarstiQ> on a plane?
[19:26] <fullermd> Well, there's nothing particularly newsworthy about it.  It's been a known issue since...  I dunno.  0.6.2 at least.
[19:28] <scode> What is the intended method of applying a merge directive with a minimum of fuss?
[19:29] <scode> (one generated with bzr send)
[19:29] <fullermd> Ah!  It finished.
[19:29] <fullermd> scode: `bzr merge $FILE`
[19:29] <fullermd> % time dbzr log -v >> /dev/null
[19:29] <fullermd> 1592.597u 4.563s 27:09.30 98.0% 106+137k 912+0io 0pf+0w
[19:29] <scode> fullermd: Thanks!
[19:30] <fullermd> Less than a half hour at least.
[19:30] <scode> Am I blind or should I submit a patch to have this documented? I don't see it mentioned in the merge cmd help, nor mentioned in the send help.
[19:30] <LarstiQ> $HOME/bin/bzr log > alog  16.79s user 1.14s system 69% cpu 25.974 total
[19:31] <Peng> 13 minutes 43 seconds! My computer rox!
[19:31] <LarstiQ> fullermd: and mine is a puny laptop
[19:31] <fullermd> I thought it was mentioned in an article in the main docs somewhere, but I'm not sure.  IF it's not, it certainly should be.
[19:31] <fullermd> LarstiQ: Now try it with -v   :P
[19:31] <Peng> LarstiQ: Not only log, but log -v.
[19:31] <LarstiQ> oh oh :)
[19:32] <Odd_Bloke> real	11m55.461s
[19:32]  * LarstiQ started it and goes out for a bit
[19:32] <fullermd> % time dbzr log >> /dev/null
[19:32] <fullermd> 18.459u 0.321s 0:19.03 98.6%    103+133k 0+0io 0pf+0w
[19:32] <Peng> Odd_Bloke: Damn.
[19:32] <fullermd> And it didn't even break 130 meg of core that time.
[19:32] <Odd_Bloke> Mine's a laptop too. :)
[19:32] <Odd_Bloke> Anyhow, party tiem! :)
[19:32] <Peng> Odd_Bloke: Running log isn't a party?!
[19:32] <spiv> Heh, I'm in a talk  at PyCon that mentions bloom filters.
[19:33] <fullermd> log -v is more like the hangover...
[19:33] <trondn_> well, I started a bzr log -v on a pretty big repository earlier today, and guess for how long its been running ;)
[19:33] <trondn_> 8:21:00 ;)
[19:33] <trondn_> and still not done ;)
[19:35] <LarstiQ> spiv: hihi
[19:36] <spiv> LarstiQ: hello
[19:36] <spiv> LarstiQ: if I go quiet, it's probably because the network here hates me.
[19:40] <LarstiQ> spiv: I know that feeling. I got my wifi card yesterday, tried to use it in the office, and then realized it doesn't support WPA.
[19:41] <spiv> LarstiQ: ouch.
[19:41] <spiv> LarstiQ: the problem here isn't so much my hardware as the other 900 people trying to use the network at the same time.
[19:43] <LarstiQ> spiv: ah yes
[19:43] <LarstiQ> spiv: how is PyCon going so far?
[19:47] <spiv> Good.  Busy!
[19:57] <LarstiQ> spiv: have you met Mark Hammond yet?
[19:57] <spiv> I have!
[20:00] <LarstiQ> yay!
[20:10] <Stavros> how can i see a list of the versioned files?
[20:11] <spiv> Stavros: bzr inventory
[20:11] <fullermd> Stavros: Check 'bzr ls' and its options.
[20:12] <Stavros> oh right, thanks
[20:51] <salgado> hey guys, why should I "bzr record" in a loomified branch? and what happens if I don't?
[20:53] <salgado> lifeless, you awake already? (^)
[20:54] <spiv> salgado: it records teh state of the lom
[20:54] <spiv> er, loom
[20:54] <spiv> salgado: as in, what the current revision of each thread is.
[20:55] <spiv> salgado: so if you want someone else to be able to branch your loom and have all the current revisions and see all the threads you've added and what your current thread is, you should use "bzr record"
[20:55] <fullermd> From skimming the docs, I think of it as sorta a 'meta-tag'.
[20:56] <salgado> spiv, right, that's what I imagined, but nobody can see the threads of my loomified branches once I push them to devpad. is that expected?
[20:58] <salgado> (I did record them)
[21:02] <fullermd> I think that's a different problem, that push doesn't push looms right...
[21:03] <salgado> could be
[21:03] <spiv> salgado: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr-loom/+bug/201613 and https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr-loom/+bug/201409 might be affecting you
[21:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 201409 in bzr-loom "pulling a loom resets to last-recorded state" [Undecided,New]
[21:05] <salgado> a ha. /me subscribes
[21:05] <salgado> thanks spiv!
[21:13] <awilkins> jelmer: Any luck with those pyrex bindings?
[21:14] <awilkins> jelmer: I'm having _lots_ of fun trying to get them to build on win32
[21:52] <scode> I know I read somewhere about a setting that would allow me to have a branch of an upstream repo, which I in turn branch (down to my workstation for making actual modifications), yet have 'bzr send' and such use the original upstream as the target branch rather than the intermediare staging branch. Rings a bell?
[21:53] <blueyed> scode: rebase?
[21:53] <beuno> scode, you can just do bzr push parent_repo_location
[21:53] <beuno> don't need to jump through the branched branch
[21:54] <fullermd> Er.  Send, not push.
[21:54] <fullermd> And you can specify the target branch on the 'send' commandline.
[21:54] <beuno> send?
[21:55] <fullermd> And use --remember to mark it permanently.
[21:56] <scode> beuno: I am branching the bzr.dev upstream repo to which I have no access.
[21:56] <scode> beuno: This branc I keep on my central server. But then I want to branch *that* to work on.
[21:57] <scode> But I want "bzr send" to generate bundles as if I had had the bzr.dev as the direct upstream.
[21:57] <beuno> aaah, right
[21:57] <beuno> well, I have that exact workflow
[21:57] <LarstiQ> fullermd: $HOME/bin/bzr log -v > vlog  988.73s user 36.39s system 90% cpu 18:52.94 total
[21:58] <beuno> and send works fine when specifying upstream (and add --remember, as fullermd said)
[21:58] <scode> Yeah, just looking into that. Thanks!
[21:59] <fullermd> LarstiQ: Pfft.  You losers and your up-to-date systems   :p
[21:59] <beuno> scode, welcome
[22:01] <LarstiQ> fullermd: well, sort of :)
[22:02] <fullermd> I've got a spare drive somewhere I could toss in the PPro, and see how long that runs...    I remember those 45 minute 2-rev 'bzr pull's...
[22:15] <ubotu> New bug: #202331 in bzr "log should be able to show diffs as well" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202331
[22:56] <benzo> hi
[23:13] <jelmer> awilkins: Hi
[23:14] <jelmer> awilkins, still there?
[23:16] <benzo> yes - again
[23:16] <benzo> you too?
[23:17] <Odd_Bloke> Evening.
[23:17] <benzo> i've some basic questions
[23:17] <Odd_Bloke> benzo: Don't ask to ask. :)
[23:17] <benzo> always
[23:18] <benzo> as far I understand is bazaar a distr. scm
[23:18] <benzo> but there are also centralized scenarios
[23:18] <Odd_Bloke> benzo: Yep.
[23:18] <benzo> so you have basically:
[23:19] <benzo> - a server and - a client
[23:19] <benzo> could someone explain me how to start in such a scenario?
[23:20] <Odd_Bloke> benzo: You don't need a client/server in a distributed SCM.
[23:21] <Odd_Bloke> benzo: You _can_ do it that way, but it's not the only way. :)
[23:21] <fullermd> I think terminologically "server" and "client" are misleading in this connection...
[23:22] <benzo> there is a term "lock-step"
[23:22] <fullermd> It's really best viewed as a continuum.
[23:23] <benzo> yeah but I like to stick with client/server model for a moment - ok?
[23:23]  * fullermd shrugs.
[23:23] <fullermd> I don't think it's helpful.  Distributed work is all client-server too.
[23:23] <fullermd> The distinguishing feature is branch relations, not "client" or "server".
[23:24] <LarstiQ> benzo: often, the 'server' is just another client you decide to think differently of.
[23:24] <huslu> is there something that can track owndership and permission info of files in bzr?
[23:24] <benzo> ok here is what I mean: server=mainline
[23:24] <LarstiQ> huslu: unix permissions? Not in the core
[23:25] <LarstiQ> benzo: ok
[23:25] <huslu> LarstiQ: anywhere else? i'm trying to track /etc
[23:25]  * fullermd should write something up someday.
[23:25] <benzo> how do I have to setup that?
[23:26] <benzo> how do I start?
[23:27] <benzo> I'd like to have the following scenario for starters:
[23:28] <LarstiQ> huslu: a quick look at BzrPlugins doesn't show any, but I know people use bzr for /etc. You might also want to look at the tool 'etckeeper'
[23:28] <benzo> 1. a central repository on a webserver
[23:28] <LarstiQ> benzo: well, you could just push/pull to one machine
[23:28] <benzo> 2. a client who can checkout/commit
[23:29] <benzo> 3. the possibility the read the sources via web browser
[23:30] <benzo> on the server, i went through the 5-min tut: http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/latest/en/mini-tutorial/index.html
[23:31] <benzo> to the step: Viewing the revision log
[23:31] <benzo> but know I'm not sure if I startet the wrong way
[23:32] <LarstiQ> benzo: http://bazaar-vcs.org/Workflows may be of help
[23:32] <benzo> do I have to start on the 'client' and then push the branch to the server?
[23:33] <LarstiQ> benzo: no, you can make available what you did and go from there
[23:33] <benzo> yes I know these - thanks
[23:34] <benzo> but again - do I have to start on the 'client' and then push the branch to the server?
[23:34] <benzo> in a centralized scenario?
[23:34] <LarstiQ> benzo: no, the server is nothing special, it's a client too
[23:35] <LarstiQ> benzo: so there's nothing really wrong with what you did
[23:35] <benzo> is it ok then when I started on the server (sorry ...)
[23:35] <LarstiQ> benzo: yes, it is.
[23:35] <LarstiQ> no worries :)
[23:36] <benzo> and how can this no requested per url?
[23:36] <benzo> for viewing it in a web browser
[23:36] <LarstiQ> benzo: multiple different ways. For write access you'd either have bzr+ssh:// or sftp:// or possibly bzr:// if you run bzr serve
[23:37] <LarstiQ> benzo: ah, that's a different question
[23:37] <LarstiQ> benzo: do you want the raw content, or something like loggerhead?
[23:38] <benzo> i think i start with raw content
[23:38] <benzo> its easier i guess
[23:38] <LarstiQ> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bzr/bzr/trunk/files is an example of loggerhead btw
[23:39] <benzo> nice! but step-by-step
[23:39] <LarstiQ> benzo: well, then you'd need to have a webserver running, and somewhere under it's docroot you'de have a checkout of the branch you want to browse
[23:39] <benzo> ah ok - thats the mistake ive done
[23:40] <benzo> what if i'm not on the server
[23:40] <LarstiQ> what do you mean?
[23:41] <LarstiQ> Surely you're not physically sitting on it :)
[23:41] <benzo> can the checkout be done remotely
[23:41] <benzo> :-)
[23:42] <LarstiQ> benzo: making a checkout on the server needs to have access to it somehow
[23:42] <benzo> otherwise the content on the web is not updated
[23:42] <benzo> do you know svn
[23:42] <benzo> ?
[23:42] <LarstiQ> I do.
[23:43] <benzo> you can setup apache that he reads the repository
[23:44] <LarstiQ> benzo: yeah, so as an equivalent to that I'd probably suggest running loggerhead.
[23:45] <benzo> but loggerhead is 'just' the webfrontend no
[23:45] <benzo> ?
[23:45] <benzo> sorry i alway miss the ?
[23:45] <LarstiQ> 'a' webfrontend, yes
[23:46] <benzo> but consider the following workflow
[23:47] <benzo> a.) I work on my machine and commit to the central repo
[23:47] <benzo> b.) then I have to make a checkout on the server, so that I can view the changes on the web?
[23:50] <LarstiQ> that doesn't seem like a workflow?
[23:50] <LarstiQ> benzo: what are you trying to accomplish with viewing it on the web?
[23:50] <benzo> viewing the sources
[23:51] <LarstiQ> you can do that by other means of course, but then why not use loggerhead for that purpose?
[23:52] <benzo> c) an other person would checkout then
[23:52] <LarstiQ> making a checkout is no different for them than for you?
[23:52] <benzo> its an example
[23:53] <benzo> and why do I have to checkout?
[23:53] <LarstiQ> maybe it's because it's almost 01:00
[23:53] <LarstiQ> but I don't understand what your problems are
[23:55] <benzo> a picture says more then thousand words: http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/bzr.dev/en/user-guide/images/workflows_centralized.png
[23:55] <LarstiQ> benzo: if you had just a basic httpd, and wanted to show the file contents, you would make use of it's filesystem backed method of showing files. In order to get the files you want to view from a branch, you make a checkout.
[23:55] <LarstiQ> benzo: I understand the picture, I don't see how it explains your questions.
[23:56] <LarstiQ> maybe an example helps
[23:57] <benzo> but you had it almost: "benzo: yeah, so as an equivalent to that I'd probably suggest running loggerhead."
 THIS IS WHAT I WANTED TO KNOW
[23:59] <LarstiQ> note in my command line exaple above, you would only do the 'bzr co /srv..' once
[23:59] <benzo> ;-)
[23:59] <LarstiQ> benzo: you didn't make that clear to me
[23:59] <LarstiQ> and now I'm going to bed
[23:59] <LarstiQ> ciao


[00:06] <PCLine_> I dont know.... I didnt get it this time :)
[00:19] <PCLine_> .....Utopic Unicorn is the calm before the storm...
[00:35] <PCLine_> Just a note:  apt-get dist-upgrade didnt upgrade to 14.10
[15:53] <drkokandy> PCLine - to upgrade from one version of Ubuntu to another, you need to run "sudo do-release-upgrade"
[15:53] <drkokandy> oh, you're not here
[15:53] <drkokandy> apt-get dist-upgrade is for Kernel and other sensitive things
[15:54] <drkokandy> I'll be staying on LTS, though, myself
[15:56] <skellat> drkokandy: I bumped up as calibre won't backport to trusty due to qt5 dependencies
[15:56] <skellat> Tried a couple times to do the backport in a PPA and the PPA builder went kaboom
[15:57] <drkokandy> what version?
[15:57] <drkokandy> of calibre
[15:57] <skellat> 2.5
[16:00] <drkokandy> I used their binary installer to install 2.5 or 2.7 on a machine I'm still running on Precise, and it's worked fine for me
[16:01] <skellat> I try pretty hard to stay with a packaged version to avoid the sorts of situations seen here: http://curlpipesh.tumblr.com
[16:01] <jenni> [ curl | sh ] - https://j.mp/1DbUXgP
[16:04] <drkokandy> lol, that's crazy
[16:04] <drkokandy> that's not what Calibre would have you do
[16:06] <drkokandy> but I guess there would still be room for error. Fortunately you don't have to run their exact command if you'd rather read what you've downloaded before installing it
[16:07] <skellat> Switching gears, are you down in Columbus for OLF?  I'm up in my perch across The Time Line in Ashtabula County this weekend.
[16:09] <drkokandy> No, didn't make it this year. I've had a crazy month, so this is actually the first weekend I don't have a full, busy weekend out of town, and I've had chores piling up
[16:09] <Unit193> To be precise, dist-upgrade will take action that will install and uninstall packages, whereas 'upgrade' will only update existing.
[16:10] <drkokandy> ah, good to know Unit193. I never knew the real difference, just noticed that dist-upgrade was usually for important stuff
[16:10] <Unit193> Right, because you can't update linux-image-generic without pulling in a new package.
[16:10] <Unit193> Or, 'apt full-upgrade' as it is now.
[18:32] <skellat> Hunh: http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2014-10-24/you-can-t-cure-ebola-with-money
[18:32] <jenni> [ You Can't Cure Ebola With Money - Bloomberg View ] - https://j.mp/ZRtRP2
[19:56] <PCLine_> What a great day in Ohio.  Hello everyone.
[20:11] <Unit193> Howdy.  Bit warm now. :P
[20:27] <PCLine_> hi Unit193
[22:58] <thafreak> Anyone at OLF doing dinner?
[23:40]  * skellat is up past The Time Line in Ashtabula County alas


[12:55] <ubuntujenkins> you can follow the quickshot development on facebook or twitter we are www.facebook.com/quickshotteam and www.twitter.com/quickshotteam


[00:01] <Jazzva> asac: Can't reproduce ... but I think I have gnome-mplayer 0.6.2
[00:01] <Jazzva> and gecko-mediaplayer 0.6.2... I think they mentioned some changes to quicktime.
[00:02] <Jazzva> asac: Sorry... It's 0.6.2 in intrepid. I have 0.6.0, and I can't reproduce it
[00:05] <crimsun> asac: for a fresh intrepid install, 1) linux-sound-base should, by default, ship a template alternatives for /etc/asound.conf; this template needs to be unset (for the ALSA case) by default.  For the OSS (dpkg-reconfigure linux-sound-base) case, this template needs to be set to a file containing the contents of `asoundconf set-oss' (see alsa-utils bzr); 2) pulseaudio should Depends (instead of Recommends) libasound2-plugins.  It
[00:06] <crimsun> in this way, we preserve ALSA-only usage, OSSv4 usage, and PulseAudio usage.
[00:07] <crimsun> (I'll be working on the necessary bits in my own branches of alsa-driver, alsa-utils, and pulseaudio.)
[00:08] <asac> crimsun: the long message was cut off here
[00:08] <asac>                  set-oss' (see alsa-utils bzr); 2) pulseaudio should Depends (instead of
[00:08] <asac>                  Recommends) libasound2-plugins.  It
[00:08] <asac> ... then:
[00:08] <asac> 01:06 < crimsun> in this way, we preserve ALSA-only usage, OSSv4 usage, and PulseAudio usage.
[00:08] <asac> in case there was something in between, please paste :)
[00:08] <crimsun> 2) pulseaudio should Depends (instead of Recommends) libasound2-plugins.  It also needs to update the alternatives for /etc/asound.conf (set it to a file containing the contents of `asoundconf set-pulseaudio').
[00:09] <crimsun> (that's all that was missing)
[00:10] <asac> crimsun: in hardy there isnt any /etc/asound.conf at all ... how does it get its defaults?
[00:11] <crimsun> asac: libasound2 ships it in /usr/share/alsa/alsa.conf.
[00:11] <asac> just wonder if the defaults we want cant be put in some other place than that file
[00:11] <crimsun> asac: /etc/asound.conf and ~/.asoundrc are the canonical overrides
[00:13] <crimsun> I'll have to think harder about the dist-upgrade case.  (Probably pop up a notifier bubble on pulseaudio upgrade?)
[00:13] <asac> hmm ... notification isnt really something that works
[00:13] <asac> most users will miss it
[00:13] <asac> or just close it
[00:14] <crimsun> ok, well, either a dist-upgrade automatically migrates them (mv ~/.asoundrc* $somewhere_else), or the dist-upgrade leaves them intact
[00:15] <asac> if i understand you correctly we dont need /etc/asound.conf except for OSS case?
[00:15] <crimsun> no, we would also need it for the PulseAudio case.
[00:16] <asac> ok. so similar - aka content of asoundconf set-pulseaudio?
[00:16] <crimsun> yes
[00:17] <asac> ok. as far as i can see there is a .asoundrc file in $HOME ... that is generated on every startup? or when global config changes?
[00:17] <asac> hmm ... dont have it hear even ;)
[00:18] <crimsun> you shouldn't have an asoundrc at all unless you run Edubuntu
[00:18] <crimsun> (by default, that is)
[00:19] <crimsun> an asoundrc must be explicitly generated, and it takes effect (only once) upon a native ALSA app's invocation.
[00:24] <asac> crimsun: is there any reason to not ship set-pulseaudio config as a general default that users can change by adding their /etc/asound.conf and so on?
[00:25] <asac> (i refer to default ubuntu setups with pulseaudio)
[00:25] <crimsun> asac: no, there is no reason to not ship it as such.  That is, in fact, the precise config I outlined above.  :)
[00:25] <asac> except that flash 9 cant do it ;)
[00:26] <crimsun> e.g., by default, PulseAudio sets the /etc/asound.conf alternatives.
[00:26] <asac> crimsun: thats the only point i dont like
[00:26] <fta> asac, how far is gnash composer/editor from reality ? i remember rob mentioned it at UDS
[00:26] <asac> crimsun: at least for hardy i dont want to introduce new alternatives
[00:26] <asac> (but well we talk about intrepid i know)
[00:27] <crimsun> right, hardy is another mess of cake altogether.
[00:27] <asac> in any case, i dont think we want to ship any /etc/ file as the default. we should choose another location
[00:27] <crimsun> as in modify alsa-lib to look elsewhere?  Well....
[00:27] <asac> is that possible? e.g. we ship alternative somewhere in /usr/share/alsa* and admins can override that in /etc/asound.conf
[00:28] <asac> i prefer to have /etc/asound.conf a place where admin can do global configs
[00:28] <asac> packages should ship their defaults somewhere else if possible
[00:29] <asac> crimsun: you said that /usr/share/alsa/alsa.conf is already used
[00:30] <asac> or does that have a different purpose?
[00:32] <crimsun> that's the default
[00:32] <crimsun> /etc/asound.conf overrides it, and ~/.asoundrc overrides both
[00:33] <crimsun> need to go, wifi spot disappearing :/
[00:33] <asac> crimsun: sure thanks for the input so far
[00:34] <fta> damn keyboard layout. after each reboot, i have to uncheck/recheck the same options
[00:40] <fta> http://dilbert.com/animation/comic/2008-06-05/
[00:44] <Jazzva> Waited an hour for epiphany to finish compiling... And then it produced an error. Oh, joy... oh, joy...
[00:44] <Jazzva> Good thing it's just a missing directory, so, I'm gonna run build from that point :)
[00:57] <fta> asac, you sure you want that: http://paste.ubuntu.com/17760/ ?
[00:58] <asac> fta: to be honest: no :)
[00:58] <fta> then what ? current code is bad
[00:59] <fta> that was your proposal earlier today
[00:59] <asac> yeah ... for now just use --gre-version ... or doesnt that work?
[00:59] <asac> (directly in postinst)
[01:00] <asac> i think you suggested that initially ... but well
[01:00] <asac> i have to look what we really want in the end
[01:00] <asac> .autoreg is somewhat painful ;)
[01:02] <fta> i suggested --gre-version directly in postinst, you said you prefer /usr/sbin/xul19-touch-autoreg
[01:05] <asac> yeah ... it has its benefit ... but i want to think about the final solution a bit before introducing a new binary
[01:05] <asac> executabe
[01:06] <fta> ok, i'll go for my initial idea then.
[01:06] <asac> so if we need a fix now, just fix postinst ... we can go ahead from there ;)
[01:07] <asac> right
[01:07] <asac> ok off ... cant keep eyes open :)
[01:07] <asac> night
[01:08] <fta> night
[01:27] <Jazzva> Yay. Epiphany with Webkit is installed. Now to see if it's usable. "Powered by WebKit"
[01:35] <Jazzva> hmm... some links won't open, and it seems that all links refuse to open in a new window :/
[01:35] <fta> eheh
[01:35] <Jazzva> Guess it's still not so usable
[01:35] <fta> mozilla powa
[01:35] <Jazzva> fta: Agreed ;)
[01:36] <Jazzva> It's just that liferea-webkit seems to work fine, so asac thought to test epiphany-webkit.
[01:37] <Jazzva> Though, he did mention I might need to get latest webkit...
[01:37] <fta> epiphany is supposed to work as upstream announced the shift
[01:38] <Jazzva> the shift? to webkit?
[01:38] <fta> yes
[01:38] <Jazzva> It might be webkit in our archives...
[01:39] <Jazzva> I think I'll build webkit from upstream and then leave epiphany compile with it over-night
[04:32] <gnomefreak> anyone awake?
[04:32] <crimsun> sure.
[04:33] <gnomefreak> have you seen the wiki on what was supposed to be talked about at UDS?
[04:34] <crimsun> no, I'm pretty much out of the loop these days.
[04:34] <crimsun> (sorry)
[04:36] <gnomefreak> thanks ill keep looking
[05:08] <gnomefreak> asac: removing user from subscription didnt work im asking in #launchpad
[05:19] <gnomefreak> i hate wikis :(
[07:45] <gnomefreak> asac: its aout 2:45am -0400 and i think i have handled the bounces this time but im going to work with an LP guy to see what can be done (for all i know its an email bomb or some stupid crap
[10:40] <armin76> bumb rc2!
[11:07] <[reed]> bumb?
[11:18] <armin76> no bumb? :P
[11:45] <fta> hi
[15:44] <Jazzva> asac: ping
[17:13] <fta> i'm out of ideas with flock
[17:13] <fta> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/15023265/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-amd64.flock_2.0~a1~svn20080603r19205-0ubuntu1~fta4_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[17:13] <fta> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/15024875/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-i386.flock_2.0~a1~svn20080603r19205-0ubuntu1~fta4_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
[17:14] <fta> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/15025750/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-lpia.flock_2.0~a1~svn20080603r19205-0ubuntu1~fta4~hardy_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[18:03] <fta> asac, care to help ? ^^
[18:50] <Jazzva> rebuilding epiphany with patches, as it continued to segfault, even with the latest upstream webkit
[19:00] <fta> Jazzva, i thought debian had it working months ago. did i miss something ?
[19:02] <Jazzva> fta: Then it's me that's broken ;). Now I'm compiling latest epiphany with latest webkit. It might have been the thing that I didn't apply patches.
[19:48] <crimsun> asac: (lp:~crimsun/alsa-lib/ubuntu.new and lp:~crimsun/pulseaudio/ubuntu updated as per our discussion)
[19:57] <Jazzva> Do we still hold meetings in #ubuntu-meeting, or we hold them in #ubuntu-mozillateam
[19:57] <Jazzva> ?
[19:59] <fta> this channel is quiet most of the time
[19:59] <Jazzva> fta: Yeah, I was just wondering, cause it says #ubuntu-meeting on wiki MT meetings page. So, I don't know if there is some Ubuntu policy on meetings...
[20:00] <Jazzva> i.e. they should be only held in #ubuntu-meetings... And, if so, where is the schedule for #ubuntu-meeting? :)
[20:11] <armin76> buuuuumb!
[20:17] <Jazzva> armin76: what's a bumb?
[20:17] <Jazzva> a crash? :)
[20:19] <armin76> haha
[20:19] <armin76> a version bump :P
[20:19] <Jazzva> Oh... oke :)
[20:22] <fta> rc2 ?
[20:35] <Jazzva> Hmm... It still won't open in "New window". But no segfault so far.
[21:56] <lyhana8> hi, i want to refresh my addons list due to conflict between Fx2 and Fx3
[22:44] <Jazzva> asac, fta: ping
[22:55] <fta> Jazzva, pong
[22:55] <Jazzva> fta: You have been working on mozilla-devscripts, right?
[22:57] <fta> yes
[22:57] <Jazzva> Is there a support for thunderbird extensions?
[22:58] <Jazzva> *packaging thunderbird extensions?
[22:59] <fta> you mean the xpi.mk ?
[23:00] <Jazzva> Yep...
[23:00] <fta> it's not specific to ff
[23:01] <fta> so it's just a matter of install.rdf
[23:01] <Jazzva> Hmm, I think that imagezoom doesn't show up in thunderbird, and it uses xpi.mk. That's why I asked...
[23:02] <Jazzva> And as far as I can see in xpi.mk (MOZ_XPI_MOZILLA_DIRS ?= firefox-addons firefox) it installs only for firefox. Is it ok if we change that parameter in debian/rules for packages that work in thunderbird?
[23:04] <fta> oh, the addons dir
[23:04] <fta> yes, you can change it
[23:04] <fta> xpi.mk will only set it if it's not already there
[23:04] <fta> that's "?="
[23:05] <Jazzva> Hmm, ok. I'll test with that. Maybe we can mention that in XPI.TEMPLATE, for packagers that work on thunderbird extensions.
[23:05] <Jazzva> I didn't know for that operand. :)
[23:05] <Jazzva> Thanks for the help...
[23:07] <fta> np
[23:41] <Jazzva> fta: It works :)
[23:42] <Jazzva> and, I meant "operator", not "operand"
[23:44] <fta> good
[23:45] <fta> i'm trying to brush up my japanese by watching a movie, it's hard. i'm rusted :P
[23:45] <Jazzva> Good luck ;)
[23:54] <fta> Jazzva, i have a strange problem with liferea
[23:55] <Jazzva> fta: What seems to be the problem?
[23:55] <Jazzva> Introduced by merge *scared*?
[23:55] <fta> if it's open in a workspace and i move to another workspace, i cannot hide it and bring it to the current workspace using the notification icon
[23:56] <fta> (middle click on the icon)
[23:56] <fta> may not be liferea's fault as deluge is showing the same problem
[23:56] <Jazzva> Hmm... say something to me here, so I can test it for xchat
[23:57] <fta> Jazzva, test
[23:57] <Jazzva> Hmm... middle click is not working for me. Only left click, and it moves me automatically to the workspace where xchat is
[23:58] <fta> oops, left click, yes
[23:58] <Jazzva> Not working for Pidgin too... Are you using compiz?
[23:58] <fta> no
[23:58] <fta> metacity
[23:58] <Jazzva> Left click moves me to the active desktop
[23:58] <Jazzva> Hmm... same here
[23:58] <fta> liferea ?
[23:59] <Jazzva> No, metacity
[23:59] <Jazzva> I'll test with liferea
[23:59] <fta> xchat is okay here, but neither liferea nor deluge


[02:29] <persia> ScottK: That's not a class of error I've seen before, unfortunately.
[03:49] <ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
[20:38] <rbelem> rsalveti, ping
[20:38] <rsalveti> rbelem: pong
[20:39] <rbelem> rsalveti, :-)
[20:39] <rbelem> rsalveti, i need your help
[20:39] <rbelem> rsalveti, i ve been trying to boot ubuntu in the pandaboard
[20:40] <rsalveti> rbelem: sure, what's up?
[20:40] <rbelem> rsalveti, but it always end up "ALERT!  /dev/mmcblk0p2 does not exist.  Dropping to a shell!"
[20:40] <rbelem> iniramfs
[20:40] <rsalveti> rbelem: what image are you using?
[20:40] <rbelem> rsalveti, ubuntu 11.04 headless
[20:40] <rsalveti> rbelem: is this happening at your first boot?
[20:41] <rsalveti> first boot should do the disk resize
[20:41] <rbelem> rsalveti, yup
[20:41] <rsalveti> after that it doesn't point the disk as mmcblk0p2
[20:41] <rsalveti> but with the uuid
[20:41] <rsalveti> rbelem: could be your card is corrupted
[20:41] <rbelem> rsalveti, i fscked it
[20:41] <rsalveti> by the way you're writing the file, or even the sd card that's not that compatible with panda
[20:42] <rbelem> rsalveti, i tried one kingmax and one kingstone
[20:42] <rsalveti> rbelem: how are you writing the image file?
[20:42] <rsalveti> rbelem: did you check the md5 from the image file?
[20:43] <rbelem> rsalveti, i did not check
[20:43] <rbelem> i will check it now
[20:44] <rbelem> rsalveti, it matches
[20:44] <rbelem> rsalveti, i tried the bash -c zcat methods
[20:45] <rbelem> rsalveti, but it was gerating corrupted fs
[20:45] <rsalveti> rbelem: try just with dd
[20:45] <rbelem> rsalveti, then i dd
[20:45] <rbelem> failed too
[20:46] <rbelem> rsalveti, i manually created the filesystem and mounted the image partitions
[20:46] <rbelem> rsalveti, but it did not boot
[20:46] <rsalveti> rbelem: try grabbing the 11.06 linaro image
[20:47] <rbelem> i'm downloading it right now
[20:47] <rsalveti> rbelem: https://wiki.linaro.org/Cycles/1106/Release
[20:49] <rbelem> rsalveti, the LEBs?
[20:49] <rsalveti> rbelem: yes
[20:49] <rbelem> nice :-)
[20:49] <rsalveti> https://wiki.linaro.org/Platform/DevPlatform/Ubuntu/ImageInstallation
[20:50] <rsalveti> http://releases.linaro.org/platform/linaro-n/ubuntu/leb-panda/latest/
[21:11] <rbelem> rsalveti, two hours of download
[21:11] <rsalveti> rbelem: ouch
[21:11] <rsalveti> rbelem: you can grab the nano image
[21:11] <rsalveti> hold on
[21:11] <rsalveti> rbelem: http://releases.linaro.org/platform/linaro-n/nano/latest/
[21:12] <rsalveti> with http://releases.linaro.org/platform/linaro-n/nano/latest/hwpack_linaro-panda_20110629-1_armel_supported.tar.gz
[21:12] <rsalveti> it's a very basic image, but at least you can check if your board is working properly
[21:12] <rbelem> rsalveti, thank you very much :-)
[21:13] <rbelem> rsalveti, now it is better. it will take 10 min
[21:13] <rbelem> :-)
[21:13] <rsalveti> :-)
[21:32] <rbelem> rsalveti, do i need to pass a binary image to linaro-media-create?
[21:34] <rbelem> rsalveti, or i just need to pass the hwpack?
[21:36] <rbelem> ah! i got
[21:36]  * rbelem downloads nano-n-tar-20110628-1.tar.gz
[21:53] <rbelem> rsalveti, chroot: failed to run command `linaro-hwpack-install': No such file or directory
[23:37] <rbelem> rsalveti, i found the problem
[23:37] <rbelem> rsalveti, scratchbox :-P